Can't trust MB service I'm done
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Joined: Feb 2017
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From: Baltimore County, MD
'13 s212 63 p30. '06 LX470
I had the Fidelity warranty thread which is for oil control solenoid harness, false heater control valve at back of engine, and rear axle seal. I needed to take it in for the two leaks, but the week before last that coolant coupler broke. Pretty sure you had recently done that coupler as well? Depending on how they do these repairs, it would be engine out, or subframe and intake out and this Benz dealer does not do intake cleaning unfortunately :-(. I know we wouldn’t pull the intake doing it at home, but that is how the book writes it up, who knows what they’ll actually do. I’m still waiting for the repairs to be completed and will likely share the invoice. Happily all under warranty and the only reason it went to Benz.
Last edited by Baltistyle; Jun 20, 2025 at 08:36 AM.
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From: Colorado
'21 AMG53 wDPP & ARC, 19 GLC300 - Former-03 C240,2 ML BlueTecs,20 GLE450 E-ABC,15 Cayenne D,17 Macan
I had the Fidelity warranty thread which is for oil control solenoid harness, false heater control valve at back of engine, and rear axle seal. I needed to take it in for the two leaks, but the week before last that coolant coupler broke. Pretty sure you had recently done that coupler as well? Depending on how they do these repairs, it would be engine out, or subframe and intake out and this Benz dealer does not do intake cleaning unfortunately :-(. I know we wouldn’t pull the intake doing it at home, but that is how the book writes it up, who knows what they’ll actually do. I’m still waiting for the repairs to be completed and will likely share the invoice. Happily all under warranty and the only reason it went to Benz.
That's more likely than "too busy."
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From: Fleriduh
W212 E63S Wagon - GSL580 - E63 - E350 - C300
Or, you get what we run into now with MB on some of the newer cars. They have the systems so locked down that ONLY a dealership can work on a car - and not just new cars, cars going on 15 years old. Case in point, I had a new TCU put in last week on one of my E63's. The shop had done many many of these.
So, to program it Xentry talks to the car, and to MB. MB has stopped access for Indies. The very final set of "teach in" was blocked. A number of mechanics nationally tried to do this (even BenzNinja said they are locking these things from consumers). Finally we got a mechanic from Europe to log into the system and thus program my car. So, the "right to repair" is more and more of a joke. I guess I could understand it if it was a warranty concern. It is just the MFG's trying to stop the Indies from taking work from the dealership (MB Gainesville said they would not program the car of the part did not come from them....funny as hell, it DID come from them!!!! They are such idiots).
Super Member
Joined: Jul 2021
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From: SWFL
2024 GLE 450, 2009 SLK 300
Some people get bad dealership service because that is what they expect to get. I knew a guy that was so convinced he was going to be ripped off by the dealer that he gouged a big X on what he thought was the oil filter so he could prove they didn't change the filter. I explained to him how a canister oil filter worked and that all he did was damage the canister cover. He was still convinced they were ripping him off.
MBWorld Fanatic!
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From: Baltimore County, MD
'13 s212 63 p30. '06 LX470
The guys I’m referring to are busy with work all day every day so a long job taking up a lift for multiple days when they haven’t actually dealt with Fidelity is a risk they don’t need. They do plenty of engines and one has been a track tech mechanic for more than twenty years, doing all builds top to bottom. I’m sure if in with cash vs a warranty it might different, but that’s for when the warranty expires..They are maximizing the value of their limited lift space, vs a dealer with twenty lifts who got me in right away and has lots of workspace for all different depths of repair.
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From: Colorado
'21 AMG53 wDPP & ARC, 19 GLC300 - Former-03 C240,2 ML BlueTecs,20 GLE450 E-ABC,15 Cayenne D,17 Macan
Or, you get what we run into now with MB on some of the newer cars. They have the systems so locked down that ONLY a dealership can work on a car - and not just new cars, cars going on 15 years old. Case in point, I had a new TCU put in last week on one of my E63's. The shop had done many many of these.
So, to program it Xentry talks to the car, and to MB. MB has stopped access for Indies. The very final set of "teach in" was blocked. A number of mechanics nationally tried to do this (even BenzNinja said they are locking these things from consumers). Finally we got a mechanic from Europe to log into the system and thus program my car. So, the "right to repair" is more and more of a joke. I guess I could understand it if it was a warranty concern. It is just the MFG's trying to stop the Indies from taking work from the dealership (MB Gainesville said they would not program the car of the part did not come from them....funny as hell, it DID come from them!!!! They are such idiots).
So, to program it Xentry talks to the car, and to MB. MB has stopped access for Indies. The very final set of "teach in" was blocked. A number of mechanics nationally tried to do this (even BenzNinja said they are locking these things from consumers). Finally we got a mechanic from Europe to log into the system and thus program my car. So, the "right to repair" is more and more of a joke. I guess I could understand it if it was a warranty concern. It is just the MFG's trying to stop the Indies from taking work from the dealership (MB Gainesville said they would not program the car of the part did not come from them....funny as hell, it DID come from them!!!! They are such idiots).
The EU passed a law in 2024 That requires "right to repair" on everything going forward.
Deere just lost a landmark case in the US for farm equipment, 2023.
In the case of the EU, I don't know if it will affect us cars and equipment, but if it does, I doubt it'll be retroactive. Maybe starting in 2025 models, but it may not apply to US cars.
Massachusetts requires right to repair, which is why you see the "release of information" on your Mercedes Me app.
In any case, it seems like there's a movement afoot to broaden right to repair.
But for now it is what it is.
Which is why I continue to say Independents don't have the knowledge or access to work on modern cars on many issues. Or diagnose which is probably more important.
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Joined: Jun 2015
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From: Maryland
2024 S580
cough, I’m the neighbor kid, though I’m 46. My older Korean neighbor sees me working on my vehicles all the time so he hit me up for a brake pad swap a few weeks ago and I figured he would try to throw me 20 bucks but afterwards he said thank you and handed me a thank you envelope and when I opened it later had 200 in it. Totally unexpected and not needed. And in some ways, I think he just wanted to hang out while I did his brakes so he could watch and perhaps help. I’ve helped them out before jumping their vehicles or charging their batteries. I’m happy to help whoever needs or asks around the neighborhood and in this situation, it’s funny because we have to communicate through an app because he speaks very little English and I speak zero Korean
But in twenty years in my neighborhood I’ve seen exactly three kids mow a lawn and zero others do any car maintenance and this is average middle income suburbs.
But in twenty years in my neighborhood I’ve seen exactly three kids mow a lawn and zero others do any car maintenance and this is average middle income suburbs.One of my agents does the same thing for a few people, he loves working on cars and he does brakes for neighbors etc etc.
Yeah, same. This past snowstorm some kids did actually show up at my house to shovel my driveway. I was gobsmacked and happily paid them!
Some people get bad dealership service because that is what they expect to get. I knew a guy that was so convinced he was going to be ripped off by the dealer that he gouged a big X on what he thought was the oil filter so he could prove they didn't change the filter. I explained to him how a canister oil filter worked and that all he did was damage the canister cover. He was still convinced they were ripping him off.
Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2024
Posts: 349
Likes: 138
From: California
2024 EQE Sedan
Dealerships do not make their money selling cars. The profits come from the Parts & Service departments. That is one reason Dealerships hate EVs, they only need minimal service (cabin filter and brake fluid) once every two years instead of more extensive (and profitable) service twice a year. They will recommend many services not needed to pad profits. I have even caught them telling me a tire with 3.95 mm tread has 3 mm of tread and needs to be replaced.
When I bought my EV, they tried to sell me a two year prepaid service contract. For that car the first service at two years is free as it is covered by MB, so I asked them what service the two year prepaid service would actually cover. Turns out there was nothing that contract would actually pay for. It was just padding on the sale.
When I bought my EV, they tried to sell me a two year prepaid service contract. For that car the first service at two years is free as it is covered by MB, so I asked them what service the two year prepaid service would actually cover. Turns out there was nothing that contract would actually pay for. It was just padding on the sale.
Last edited by ehildum; Jun 20, 2025 at 01:14 PM.
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MBWorld Fanatic!
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From: Fleriduh
W212 E63S Wagon - GSL580 - E63 - E350 - C300
MBWorld Fanatic!
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Posts: 6,987
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From: Colorado
'21 AMG53 wDPP & ARC, 19 GLC300 - Former-03 C240,2 ML BlueTecs,20 GLE450 E-ABC,15 Cayenne D,17 Macan
A well-run dealership will make approximately 1/3 each from sales, parts and service, and F&I.
Dealers don't like EVS because nobody wants to buy them. For the most part, early adapters have already made their purchases.
So EVs just sit on the lot, rack up Floor Plan expenses, and become Lot Weary (finishes ruined by repeated washing etc.) Oh, and no more incentives.
Dealers don't like EVS because nobody wants to buy them. For the most part, early adapters have already made their purchases.
So EVs just sit on the lot, rack up Floor Plan expenses, and become Lot Weary (finishes ruined by repeated washing etc.) Oh, and no more incentives.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 9,056
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From: Maryland
2024 S580
A well-run dealership will make approximately 1/3 each from sales, parts and service, and F&I.
Dealers don't like EVS because nobody wants to buy them. For the most part, early adapters have already made their purchases.
So EVs just sit on the lot, rack up Floor Plan expenses, and become Lot Weary (finishes ruined by repeated washing etc.) Oh, and no more incentives.
Dealers don't like EVS because nobody wants to buy them. For the most part, early adapters have already made their purchases.
So EVs just sit on the lot, rack up Floor Plan expenses, and become Lot Weary (finishes ruined by repeated washing etc.) Oh, and no more incentives.
The most senior service writer at the MB dealer here (great guy) retired specifically because of the coming shift to EVs and the impact it was going to have on his income. So yes, dealers dislike EVs because of the reduction in service revenue. They try their best to come up with ridiculous unnecessary service stuff they can charge huge sums of money for though…because they’re trying to get as much money out of their consumers as they can. He was a straight shooter and didn’t want to have to fleece customers for stuff they didn’t need and that was part of his decision too.
Last edited by SW20S; Jun 20, 2025 at 05:29 PM.
Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2024
Posts: 349
Likes: 138
From: California
2024 EQE Sedan
A well-run dealership will make approximately 1/3 each from sales, parts and service, and F&I.
Dealers don't like EVS because nobody wants to buy them. For the most part, early adapters have already made their purchases.
So EVs just sit on the lot, rack up Floor Plan expenses, and become Lot Weary (finishes ruined by repeated washing etc.) Oh, and no more incentives.
Dealers don't like EVS because nobody wants to buy them. For the most part, early adapters have already made their purchases.
So EVs just sit on the lot, rack up Floor Plan expenses, and become Lot Weary (finishes ruined by repeated washing etc.) Oh, and no more incentives.
Most people, once they drive them, will see that they are a better solution to their transportation needs than gas vehicle.
Super Member
Joined: Jul 2021
Posts: 784
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From: SWFL
2024 GLE 450, 2009 SLK 300
Purchase of an EV has become quite political and there is a lot of FUD around them which is slowing adoption, but the writing is on the wall for ICE already. They are not a solution to all transportation needs, and situations such as renters are a convenient straw man argument (no EV charging station for renters, but they don't have gas stations at the apartment either). The fact is that ICE is being phased out in Europe on a faster schedule than even California is trying, and it seems they will hit those goals easily. The sales in the US are way up and increasing despite the opposition of dealerships. The domestic manufacturers are still making an enormous investment because if they don't they will be out of the automobile business altogether in a decade. Not clear they will make it, only Biden's 100% tariff on Chinese EVs has given them a bit of breathing room.
Most people, once they drive them, will see that they are a better solution to their transportation needs than gas vehicle.
Most people, once they drive them, will see that they are a better solution to their transportation needs than gas vehicle.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 6,987
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From: Colorado
'21 AMG53 wDPP & ARC, 19 GLC300 - Former-03 C240,2 ML BlueTecs,20 GLE450 E-ABC,15 Cayenne D,17 Macan
Purchase of an EV has become quite political and there is a lot of FUD around them which is slowing adoption, but the writing is on the wall for ICE already. They are not a solution to all transportation needs, and situations such as renters are a convenient straw man argument (no EV charging station for renters, but they don't have gas stations at the apartment either). The fact is that ICE is being phased out in Europe on a faster schedule than even California is trying, and it seems they will hit those goals easily. The sales in the US are way up and increasing despite the opposition of dealerships. The domestic manufacturers are still making an enormous investment because if they don't they will be out of the automobile business altogether in a decade. Not clear they will make it, only Biden's 100% tariff on Chinese EVs has given them a bit of breathing room.
Most people, once they drive them, will see that they are a better solution to their transportation needs than gas vehicle.
Most people, once they drive them, will see that they are a better solution to their transportation needs than gas vehicle.
Dealers are affected when their buyers are affected.
Plus, dealers remember the EQ series all too well. The cars sat on the lot and had to be heavily discounted. I don't think Mercedes gave any floor plan assistance either.
MB announced that they would be "ready to go electric" by 2029, but at least, unlike other manufacturers, hedged a bit by saying "as conditions allow."
Aside from the aero styling mistake, it was premature.
And a lot of areas such as where I live, it's still premature.
Hybrids or plug-in hybrids are the only ones that make sense. But their price rules out an entire segment of buyers.
Last edited by mikapen; Jun 20, 2025 at 10:48 PM.
MBWorld Fanatic!
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From: Colorado
'21 AMG53 wDPP & ARC, 19 GLC300 - Former-03 C240,2 ML BlueTecs,20 GLE450 E-ABC,15 Cayenne D,17 Macan
EVs are going to be grid-capacity-limited for quite a while.
Combined with AI energy requirements, we're about 8 - 15 years behind the nuclear supply.
It's a good thing Mercedes has pledged to retain internal combustion engines.
Their cars will continue to be profit centers. And they'll sell a lot of tires to EV owners.
They probably make more money selling used cars than new cars anyway. Always have.
Combined with AI energy requirements, we're about 8 - 15 years behind the nuclear supply.
It's a good thing Mercedes has pledged to retain internal combustion engines.
Their cars will continue to be profit centers. And they'll sell a lot of tires to EV owners.
They probably make more money selling used cars than new cars anyway. Always have.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jan 2024
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From: DFW
SL63
Some people get bad dealership service because that is what they expect to get. I knew a guy that was so convinced he was going to be ripped off by the dealer that he gouged a big X on what he thought was the oil filter so he could prove they didn't change the filter. I explained to him how a canister oil filter worked and that all he did was damage the canister cover. He was still convinced they were ripping him off.
pad your invoice, or pencil whip service, maintenance, and or repair. I make a point of asking for the replaced parts afterwards, which is a poor measure of quality control, but unless you can look over their shoulder, you are left to your imagination. Flat rating is another way of limiting abuse, but it also has its limits.
In the end, there are really only 3 options:
DITY do it yourself, you know you did the job, but unless you have done that same job before, you might not be certain you did it right.
Take it to a local shop aka Indy
Take it to a stealership. Not all dealerships are stealerships, but all stealerships are dealerships. That nickname was conceived for a reason.
Senior Member
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 260
Likes: 72
2024 GLE 450e
EVs are going to be grid-capacity-limited for quite a while.
Combined with AI energy requirements, we're about 8 - 15 years behind the nuclear supply.
It's a good thing Mercedes has pledged to retain internal combustion engines.
Their cars will continue to be profit centers. And they'll sell a lot of tires to EV owners.
They probably make more money selling used cars than new cars anyway. Always have.
Combined with AI energy requirements, we're about 8 - 15 years behind the nuclear supply.
It's a good thing Mercedes has pledged to retain internal combustion engines.
Their cars will continue to be profit centers. And they'll sell a lot of tires to EV owners.
They probably make more money selling used cars than new cars anyway. Always have.
I live in a condo and got our underground parking wired for chargers.
Each morning my car is charged and ready to go. In a year and a half I have charged during the day only a handful of times because the GLE 450e has only 1/4 the range of a modern EV.
Senior Member
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 260
Likes: 72
2024 GLE 450e
I am very leery of dealer mechanics. Unless there is a camera recording everything going on when your car is being worked on, there is ample opportunity for mechanics to
pad your invoice, or pencil whip service, maintenance, and or repair. I make a point of asking for the replaced parts afterwards, which is a poor measure of quality control, but unless you can look over their shoulder, you are left to your imagination. Flat rating is another way of limiting abuse, but it also has its limits.
In the end, there are really only 3 options:
DITY do it yourself, you know you did the job, but unless you have done that same job before, you might not be certain you did it right.
Take it to a local shop aka Indy
Take it to a stealership. Not all dealerships are stealerships, but all stealerships are dealerships. That nickname was conceived for a reason.
pad your invoice, or pencil whip service, maintenance, and or repair. I make a point of asking for the replaced parts afterwards, which is a poor measure of quality control, but unless you can look over their shoulder, you are left to your imagination. Flat rating is another way of limiting abuse, but it also has its limits.
In the end, there are really only 3 options:
DITY do it yourself, you know you did the job, but unless you have done that same job before, you might not be certain you did it right.
Take it to a local shop aka Indy
Take it to a stealership. Not all dealerships are stealerships, but all stealerships are dealerships. That nickname was conceived for a reason.
I had a great independent but when I purchased my first hybrid Audi (used)12 years ago he was not ready to deal with the electrical power system, forcing me back to the dealership. Now most independents are able to deal with hybrids.
Teslas is terrible at sharing information with independents.
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From: Colorado
'21 AMG53 wDPP & ARC, 19 GLC300 - Former-03 C240,2 ML BlueTecs,20 GLE450 E-ABC,15 Cayenne D,17 Macan
EV’s are not grid capacity limited. Other than intercity driving over 300 miles, which is a relatively small percentage of use of most passenger cars, EV’s will be mostly charged over night when the grid demand is at its lowest.
I live in a condo and got our underground parking wired for chargers.
Each morning my car is charged and ready to go. In a year and a half I have charged during the day only a handful of times because the GLE 450e has only 1/4 the range of a modern EV.
I live in a condo and got our underground parking wired for chargers.
Each morning my car is charged and ready to go. In a year and a half I have charged during the day only a handful of times because the GLE 450e has only 1/4 the range of a modern EV.
You have a plug-in hybrid which is further indication that full EVs aren't ready for prime time. Their market is smaller.
Plus, the incredible electricity demands for artificial intelligence will be like an ever-increasing surcharge on electricity. California's continuing fumbling of their electrical supply-versus-demand quandary is an example of the uncertainty facing EVs.
I could live with plug-in hybrid, but I'm not sure what advantages it would give me. I'd still have the maintenance of a gasoline engine.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: May 2018
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From: Illinois
2021 c300 Cab. Arrived 7/28/21 . 24 GLE 450e.
I spent months in Florida. Apparently all short trips. Went 1500 miles and used less than a 1/2 tank of gas. And charged at home on a 120 outlet. All depends on your driving habits.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 9,056
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From: Maryland
2024 S580
Same with our PHEV Pacifica. We buy gas maybe every 3 months. Great to drive too, we had two all gas Pacificas and the PHEV is a way better car.
Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2024
Posts: 349
Likes: 138
From: California
2024 EQE Sedan
Having to charge at off-peak hours is an example of grid limitation.
You have a plug-in hybrid which is further indication that full EVs aren't ready for prime time. Their market is smaller.
Plus, the incredible electricity demands for artificial intelligence will be like an ever-increasing surcharge on electricity. California's continuing fumbling of their electrical supply-versus-demand quandary is an example of the uncertainty facing EVs.
I could live with plug-in hybrid, but I'm not sure what advantages it would give me. I'd still have the maintenance of a gasoline engine.
You have a plug-in hybrid which is further indication that full EVs aren't ready for prime time. Their market is smaller.
Plus, the incredible electricity demands for artificial intelligence will be like an ever-increasing surcharge on electricity. California's continuing fumbling of their electrical supply-versus-demand quandary is an example of the uncertainty facing EVs.
I could live with plug-in hybrid, but I'm not sure what advantages it would give me. I'd still have the maintenance of a gasoline engine.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 9,056
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From: Maryland
2024 S580
You can charge whenever you want it’s just cheaper off peak hours.
It’s like saying “you can only buy gas in a crummy part of town” because it’s cheaper there. Makes no sense. You can buy gas in Beverly Hills if you want.
We own a PHEV but we would rather it be an EV. The reason why we don’t have an EV is because of having to charge it when we travel. Driving around town full EV would be much better.
It’s like saying “you can only buy gas in a crummy part of town” because it’s cheaper there. Makes no sense. You can buy gas in Beverly Hills if you want.
We own a PHEV but we would rather it be an EV. The reason why we don’t have an EV is because of having to charge it when we travel. Driving around town full EV would be much better.
Last edited by SW20S; Jun 22, 2025 at 12:33 AM.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 1,432
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From: Illinois
2021 c300 Cab. Arrived 7/28/21 . 24 GLE 450e.
You can charge whenever you want it’s just cheaper off peak hours.
It’s like saying “you can only buy gas in a crummy part of town” because it’s cheaper there. Makes no sense. You can buy gas in Beverly Hills if you want.
We own a PHEV but we would rather it be an EV. The reason why we don’t have an EV is because of having to charge it when we travel. Driving around town full EV would be much better.
It’s like saying “you can only buy gas in a crummy part of town” because it’s cheaper there. Makes no sense. You can buy gas in Beverly Hills if you want.
We own a PHEV but we would rather it be an EV. The reason why we don’t have an EV is because of having to charge it when we travel. Driving around town full EV would be much better.
