gsrjc

wow, i'm impressed that the OEM continental tires managed to be good in the snow that the Mid-Atlantic got this past weekend. i had some issues with the continentals in the rain so i was concerned that they wouldn't be good in the snow. nonetheless, i got snow tires just to be safe.

sosh

My problem with snows is that they are noisy and usually ride harder. In addition I have found them to be not real good on wet roads.

Benzo 003

I cannot rave enough about the Continental Extreme Contact DWS tires...4 inches of snow were absolutely no problem yesterday and today was a road full of slush and sleet (1 inch)....perfect. Road noise on dry pavement was as quiet as the factory Contact 4X4s.

GregW / Oregon

Performance studless Winters do not have those issues. I'm riding on Pirelli Scorpion Ice & Snows and they are very good in just wet conditions, as well as on snow.

sosh

Greg, The comment I posted was from my experience years ago with RWD cars. Since owning 4WD vehicles I have never had to use snows at all in our part of the country even with the 22 inch storm we had several weeks ago. Both my ML550 and my E320 4M performed very well. Studded snow tires are not legal here and have not been for years.

GregW / Oregon

Since the agencies around here are not equipped very well to handle our infrequent snow storms, I make the switch every fall. Winter tires or chains are sometimes required when going to the mountains, as well, and I've never had to put chains on. Of course, my regular tires are high-performance summer tires which are not designed for snow.

C-rod

l see you have your 06 ML350..l remember you were one of the first to purchase the W164....Are you considering another one in the future ???? or will you wait to see the new 2012 model ??????

GregW / Oregon

I tend to keep my cars a full model run, so yeah, in a couple years I will need to make a move. I've been pretty happy with the '06. It suits our needs as my wife's DD and our hauling/trip/bad weather vehicle well. I'll probably start thinking about its replacement next year. Partly depends on the economy, too, as my wife is in sales and that's really down.

In the meantime, I'm playing wiith the other love of my life (besides my wife and ML):

MB Dave

I am so happy with my blizzak lm-25 I just gun and if feels like the diffs are going to rip apart!! They are quiet comfortable handling is great too. I got the same pair for my CLK500 and they have impressed me even more the traction is amazing!!

u001elg

There have been quite a few replies, but none have really discussed the tread depth issue that plays such an important part of the equation.

My opinion is that dedicated winter tires are not 'necessary' on a ML350 with 4matic, IF the all-season tires have at least 6/32" of tread. All but the most sever winter conditions should be passable.

With that said, nothing beats a new set of winter tires when the conditions are really challenging... I have lived/driven in the NE (Maine through Pennsylvania) for over 30 years and approx. 800,000 miles under me and my personal experience has been that the car/tire with the greatest tread depth is the one I will use in really ugly weather. I.E. the new all-season radial with 11/32" outperforms the dedicated winter tire with 3/32" tread depth.

I currently have dedicated winter tires for all of my frequently used vehicles (C230 Kompressor, ML350 and Malibu) the toy cars (AMG & Corvair) never see bad weather. I do that because the limited study I have done appears to save me overall tire cost by using the all-season/summer tires most of the time and 8-10 weeks winter conditions utilize the 'snows' keeps both sets of tire lasting longer. The winter tires wear out faster, but I don't have them on that long, and I don't have to buy new all-season tires during the winter when tread falls below 6/32" (to keep adequate traction) and run them to end of life (usually around 3/32") when rain performance drastically falls off.

I know that some members will say, but U001elg, the legal limit is 2/32". That is true enough, but a tire loses its' ability to grip the road way before that depth is reached. I.E. the difference between a state mandated legal minimum and where the 'laws of physics' apply to diminish tire usefulness. I have pulled/winched out of the ditch many a SUV owner who didn't understand that their "favorite winter tire" doesn't help once the tread gets low. That is the reason that a true winter tire has two wear bars - one for snow ability (usually around 5 to 6/32") and one for legal depth (2/32").

For the record; yes, I do scrap the winter tires at 6/32" and buy new ones for the season.

Sorry for being so long winded, but I edited this response down as much as I could. Hope this helps.

sosh

I too reside in Pa. With a 4WD vehicle I have never found it necessary to have dedicated snows. That statement is applicable to both moving along and stopping. With my last ML500 I had 4/32 left at the onset of last winter and with some fairly significant snow storms had absolutly no issues. Same goes for all the ML's I have owned and I am now on my 4th since 1998. Same also goes for my E Class and I am now on my 3rd sice 2001.All of course were 4Matic. The Corvette stays in the garage from about Oct thru April so that does not count. What you said about dedicated snows and tread depth is OK but I believe overkill and totally unnecessary. I also believe that I have more years and more miles than you driving in the conditions in PA. The only vehicle I would consider putting snows on would be a RWD vehicle if I ever own one again for winter use.

u001elg

Wow, I see that what I was trying to get across was missed...

The second sentence states that dedicated winter tires are not 'necessary'.

The two points that I wanted to make are:

1) tread depth/condition is just as important as tire type

2) really challenging conditions are the time that dedicated winter tires shine.

I understand that you have had a positive experience with the ML500 and limited tread. I, unfortunately, am not comfortable going into a winter season on tires with less than 1/2 their original tread. That's a personal thing for me, not a condemnation of your choice.

We really have not had a serious snow this winter in eastern PA. The winter tires are overkill for 99.9% of the time but the do make a difference, mostly on the C239 Kompressor RWD, but have helped all my vehicles (yes even the ML - but it was during a 20+" snowfall in NH while on a ski trip in the White mountains). Of course, I didn't have the M&S's with me for a comparison - so that may have been more of a perception than a reality.

sosh

No significant snow in eastern Pa. This year??? What do you call 21 inches?? What Pennsylvania do you reside in, certainly not the same one that I do.

roadrutz

There is more to a winter tire than tread. They are made with a higher hysteresis rubber than all-seasons or summer tires, which gives better grip in cold conditions as well as on packed snow and ice. They also have tread patterns that are not just blockier but also designed to sipe away water more efficiently.

As u001eld says, whether or not winter tires are "necessary" is a matter of personal choice. sosh gets by with all-seasons. Good for him. But for some of us, "getting by" isn't enough. The only thing that holds my vehicle to the road is four patches of rubber, each about the size of a man's hand. I want that patch to be as good as technology allows. 99.9% of the time I will never notice the difference. But when that 0.1% occurs...

u001elg

sosh, we live in the same PA.

The more correct statement would have been that I have not had to drive through a serious winter storm this year. As a power plant shift worker (either 6AM to 6 PM or vice-versa) I missed the bulk of that storm. I drove through maybe 8" on the way in and 12 hours later it was mostly cleared.

I truly was thinking of several years ago when route 78/81 and the PA turnpike (different storms) had sections that were closed due to both snow and ice (and really horrendous road clearing or lack there-of). That is more the meaning of challenging - the times when the guys with the Unimog's and Hummer H1's are getting antsy and thinking that tire chains might be good to take along...

The previous post, by roadrutz, does make a good point that I did not touch upon. The rubber compound used in dedicated winter tires is more 'tacky' and flexible below 40 deg F than the typical all-season tire. This does help adhesion during cold weather, but the trade off is faster wear. Excellent point on the sipes & tread design for water removal too.

For a tire to be designated as an 'all-season tire, it has to meet certain industry/federal tread guidelines for area/tread pattern and is not tested for specifically for snow or ice traction. However for a tire to meet 'winter tire' crtieria (snowflake symbol molded on the sidewall) the tire must show proficency under winter snow/ice conditions.

As stated before, winter tires are not 'necessary' for the ML; but under really challenging conditions, they do assist an already excellent 4matic system.

sosh

Agree with you and Roadrutz that the rubber compound and siping is quite important. I am not very familiar with the fed regs re the design but the important thing is that the tire performs safely and provides adequate traction. My take thru experience with the ML is that my method of operation for the area in which I live is very good. This will vary in other areas. The same goes for my E Classes. To get back to the original topic I suggest to the OP that if he plans to purchase the ML he stated that if it does not have all seasons tires on it he negotiate with the dealer to swap out the ones that are there for all seasons. I am quite pleased with the Continentals and they have served me well.

CDNROCKIES

+1 Agreed!

We picked up our new X5 last week and just got our winter rubber in. The difference between our ML with proper winter tires vs. our X5 with all seasons is night and day. They run the exact same 19" wheels/tires and the difference couldn't be any more pronounced.

At this point, the X5 has limited grip and instills no confidence at all. Our ML on the other hand is incredibly sure footed and stable even in slippery/icy/snowy conditions.

u001elg

As sosh can attest, eastern PA received significant snow and drifting conditions on 2/10 through 2/11.

I had my chance to compare the all seasons against the winter tires straight up.

The conditions were even snow depth of 18 to 22" across the entire road and no plowing done. Had to get to work night of 2/10 (people seem to want electric 24/7) as essential personnel.

Used the stock size 17" Goodyear Ultra Grip Ice/Snows on the way in and had difficulty pushing snow - after 2 - 3 miles put on the diamond pattern tire chains and still had to use the entire road at times until I made it to the first plowed road. Tire chains off and made it to work (normal drive approx 1 hour this took almost 2 hr 15 min). Had to clear grill several time of packed snow which choked off air flow to radiator.

Wed morning the major roads easily passable... approx 7 mile out from home none of the roads were touched and the chains went back on again. More for my comfort and to prevent me from putting them on on the side of the road as opposed to a nicely plowed private parking area.

At home, took off chains/Ultra Grips (11/32" tread) and put on all- seasons (7/32" tread). The community I live in has a road that circles the entire area and is just short of 1 mile length. On untouched snow the all seasons made it 330 yards (measured with optical transit since odometer indicated I went over 1 mile) and was stuck. Dug out and put the Ultra Grips back on, made it around the entire circle and back to home.

Goes back to the post that 99.9% of the time all-season tires are adequate, but that 0.1% of the time...

As a side note:

The vehicles that made it to work when I arrived for night of 2/10 consisted of: 1 ML350 (mine), 3 Hummer H1's, 1 UniMog, 5 Jeep Wranglers (all with lift kits and 35" tires), 2 Ford F250's 4x4 Powerstroke Diesels, 2 Silverado 2500HD's 4x4 Duramax diesels and 5 Dodge Rams 4x4 Cummings Diesels.

The UniMog guy and the Hummer contingent stated they had absolutely "no problems" with driving through 20" of virgin snow and the UniMog guy said broke through drifts of 40" or more, but I think that was more bravado than anything else.

NONE of the vehicles had their stock all season tires - all had either off road knobbies or winter tires or winter tires with chains.

gsrjc

Washington DC area got hit with 30 inches of snow recently and then a couple of days later, we got hit with another 10 inches. I took the 2010 ML350 out with 17" Pirelli Snow and Ice. I tested it out in 18-24 inches of snow. no problems at all. i even came to a complete stop and then started driving again and still no problems. never got stuck at all. the only time that i didn't like it was when the car slid a little on a patch of ice on a frozen bridge.

Ruaraidh

With the continuing snow here in the UK, I can definitely recommend the Vredestein Wintrac 4 Extremes. Just the job for a cross Europe ski trip! Worked fine even in very deep snow in the Alps. Ran these on 19" rims rather than the stock 20s.

Would have been struggling on the stock 20" contis Summer tyres.... not to mention illegal on most European roads at this time of year!

Cheers,

Ruaraidh

roadrutz

I had Vredesteins years ago. They were great tires, but they are not at all common in North America. You can get them, but only through specialty tire stores.

I love the tread pattern on their SUV summer tires!

Messerchmidt

I use a set of nexen winguard suv winters on some 17 ml rims from the previous gen. pimp tires and def a bang for buck.

i gopt them for 160$ cdn + tax installed and balanced at a little tire place up in Brampton, Ontario. Nexen makes good winter tires for 1/2 the price of others - quality is on par...