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just talked to the guy from PKT Filter Inserts. Great guy, super friendly, and seems knowledgeable. For oil changes and oil drain/drip he provided a tip, if the engine/oil is warm you can puncture/pierce the top of the filter with a nail or something, that will release the vacuum and allow the oil from the filter to drain down and prevent most of the dripping/spillage. He also provided some tips like using red loc tite on some of the threads to prevent the adapter from unscrewing when you unscrew the oil filters. Although I'm not sure about that since he also mentioned over time the o rings may become brittle and you may have to change them out, if you used red loc tite then you won't be able to unscrew the adapter to change the o rings. Peter, you've done one change already from the Fram to the Mann in your most recent pic, did you have issues with the adapter loosening when you unscrewed the Fram filter?
He said the tall Cummins size oil filter would fit on my ML350 because he had done that with someone once, so I may give that a try once the adapter arrives and see if it will fit under the hood, either way the engine cover would need to be trimmed. Peter did you give the tall filter a try or just went with the short one right away assuming the tall one won't fit?
He also mentioned for oil filters his recommendation and personal usage was either Napa Gold filters or the stock Cummins filters from the Dodge dealer. I'll have to do a bit more research on those vs the Napa Platinum and the Mann filters to see what would be good to go with. Anyone know anything about those filters and if any should be avoided?
just talked to the guy from PKT Filter Inserts. Great guy, super friendly, and seems knowledgeable. For oil changes and oil drain/drip he provided a tip, if the engine/oil is warm you can puncture/pierce the top of the filter with a nail or something, that will release the vacuum and allow the oil from the filter to drain down and prevent most of the dripping/spillage. Fantastic idea. I only lost 2-3 ounces and I blamed it on the pi$$-poor check valve on the Fram, but his tip makes perfect sense. Will try it on the next oil change
He also provided some tips like using red loctite on some of the threads to prevent the adapter from unscrewing when you unscrew the oil filters. Although I'm not sure about that since he also mentioned over time the o rings may become brittle and you may have to change them out, if you used red loc tite then you won't be able to unscrew the adapter to change the o rings. Peter, you've done one change already from the Fram to the Mann in your most recent pic, did you have issues with the adapter loosening when you unscrewed the Fram filter? No. To be honest, I was expecting to have issues due to this and had decided to clean the threads with alcohol at the first oil change and use blue Loctite. I never use red Loctite unless I'm positive I'll never ever want /need to loosen whatever I just treated with the stuff.
However, much to my surprise, the adapter stayed put. I had tightened the ***** out of it during the install, and I never ever use the oil filter wrench to tighten the new oil filter. I tighten it as much as I possibly can by hand, never had an issue in 40+ yrs.
He said the tall Cummins size oil filter would fit on my ML350 because he had done that with someone once, so I may give that a try once the adapter arrives and see if it will fit under the hood, either way the engine cover would need to be trimmed. Peter did you give the tall filter a try or just went with the short one right away assuming the tall one won't fit? I bought both and did measurements. In my opinion, the bigger filter would definitely touch the under-hood liner, but I don't know for sure if it would crunch up against the hood sheet metal. And I didn't want to find out. I was already increasing filtration by a good bunch. Plus, I'm doing oil changes every 5k km on a motor with all the deletes. Time to give it a rest LOL
He also mentioned for oil filters his recommendation and personal usage was either Napa Gold filters or the stock Cummins filters from the Dodge dealer. I'll have to do a bit more research on those vs the Napa Platinum and the Mann filters to see what would be good to go with. Anyone know anything about those filters and if any should be avoided? I posted a Youtube link either in this sub-forum or in the W166 sub-forum not long ago where a guy tested 5 different oil filters. Fram blew the big one, big time. Mann is an OEM supplier so I trust the brand, but I may be mistaken.
EDIT: That Youtube link is in this thread
placed my order today for the filter insert!
Awesome. If you have any questions, don't hesitate to ask. If you need to, pm me with your #.
Last edited by peter2772000; Jan 23, 2019 at 07:15 PM.
why did you choose that gasoline engine one for winter vs one of the diesel signature series ones Amsoil has? I'm also debating between what viscocity to use for winter, our weather has been crazy in ontario. one week its +10 celsius, the next week were hitting -20 with -32 wind chill :/
I imagine montreal is pretty similar weather wise though, if not even colder at times.
I hope the PKT guy sends both adapters for small and big filter, on the phone he made it sound like he only sends one and will send me the small one for free if i couldnt fit a large filter.
why did you choose that gasoline engine one for winter vs one of the diesel signature series ones Amsoil has? I'm also debating between what viscocity to use for winter, our weather has been crazy in ontario. one week its +10 celsius, the next week were hitting -20 with -32 wind chill :/ Either I linked the wrong product or I ordered the wrong oil. I'll have to check in the garage to see which, but I've got a feeling that I may have ordered the wrong Signature Series. I coulda sworn that there was no "Diesel Signature Series" when I ordered.
I imagine montreal is pretty similar weather wise though, if not even colder at times.
I hope the PKT guy sends both adapters for small and big filter, on the phone he made it sound like he only sends one and will send me the small one for free if i couldnt fit a large filter. He definitely sent me both. Ask him to make sure he sends the small adapter as well. Imagine finding out the large filter is an interference fit and you have drive with your hood partly open 'till you get the small adapter LOL
As well, I was running motorcycle oil before discovering high-zinc diesel oil. A very knowledgeable member down in the diesel sub-forum (Micah) runs used 15W40 synthetic motorcycle oil from the oil changes in his shop. His diesel has hundreds of thousands of miles on it with no wear issues.
Last edited by peter2772000; Jan 24, 2019 at 04:51 AM.
that looks like some pricey oil :O
considering the bigger filters add a bit more oil, i think were looking at anywhere between 8-9 L of oil (iirc 7L was stock). just looking at the amsoil site 3.78L (1 gallon) was 47.85 USD. that would be well over $100 CAD of just oil for one change :O. dam!
now i see why you used something cheaper for a flush before using the good oil.
i just used their filters on the left for diesel and they had a diesel signature series ranging from 0w-40 to 15w-40. 0w-40 looks to be targeted more for the cold temps and would for sure cover me for our canadian winters. If it starts getting colder than that here I’m moving down south!
considering i rarely drive the car i may be able to get away with 1 oil change a year, maybe 2 tops, especially with a bigger filter and better filtration. Probably not good to run the 20w-50 in winter though so that would force me to do at least 2 oil changes in a year.
talked to PKT guy and he said hell send me both adapters just in case, being shipped today!
also the car has been in the shop since yesterday, should be done today with the Buzzken pipe and the malone tunes and deletes!
Find a high-zinc/phosphor oil which will protect your cam chain etc. If it's cheap, great, if it isn't......pull up your girly panties and suck it up.
It's the reason you deleted your DPF, or one of the main reasons. Don't change your oil/filter every 5k km as I do, I know it's overkill.
Find a high-zinc/phosphor oil which will protect your cam chain etc. If it's cheap, great, if it isn't......pull up your girly panties and suck it up.
It's the reason you deleted your DPF, or one of the main reasons. Don't change your oil/filter every 5k km as I do, I know it's overkill.
concerning timing chain, what do you know about the odd noise on cold start ups. I’ve read it could be the tensioner but I’ve also read it’s nothing to worry about.
From what I've read, it's either the tensioner itself, or the lack of a check valve in the hydraulic circuit that feeds the tensioner. Or, if this is a high-mileage engine, the chain itself has stretched quite a bit more than the tensioner can compensate for.
Ive been in touch with www.oildepot.ca since they sell amsoil, initially i got in touch with them to get pricing, but then we got into a whole discussion regarding oils, figured id post some of that info here, reps responses in bold...
If maximum zinc and phosphorus are a must, the Competition 20W-50 certainly fits the bill. The Signature Series Max-Duty products have some constraints on those additives in order to meet the latest specs (but that doesn't mean that they are weak on wear control).
If elevated zinc and phosphorus are the main concerns, then the API CI-4+ products (for pre- 2007 diesels) are worth a look. Here are the candidates.
"AME" Heavy Duty Diesel and Marine 15W-40- 1337 ppm zinc and 1267 ppm phosphorus "HDD" Series 3000 Heavy Duty Diesel 3000- 1379 ppm zinc and 1266 ppm phosphorus
While the Signature Series Max-Duty products must have somewhat lower zinc and phosphorus values to meet today's diesel specs, AMSOIL has to employ much more sophisticated chemistry to provide wear control. AMSOIL Tech Services tells us that the Signature Series Max-Duty products provide superior wear control to the older series that have more zinc and phosphorus content. Unless your engine has been modified with components that require ultra-high zinc and phosphorus, making these additives the sole focus in the oil choice might not necessarily lead to the best choice.
Since he provided some numbers on those oils i inquired more to get numbers on the competition and signature series, here is the response...
Just had a good conversation with AMSOIL Tech Services regarding the your situation. Sorry there was a typo in my last email. The "HDD" Series 3000 product I listed is a 5W-30.
That being said, Tech Services says the despite the fact that the Signature Series Max-Duty products have lower zinc/phosphorus numbers, they actually have superior wear control over the older CI-4+ products. They are saying that the CI-4+ approach is older technology and is not as effective. The Signature Series products would have sub-1000 ppm zinc to meet the latest industry specs. The exact numbers are now considered proprietary, so they don't give them out. But they say that getting hung up on zinc/phosphorus numbers is no longer relevant.
That being said, if you choose HDD, you certainly would not being doing your engine a disservice. They just suggest that the newer oils are superior. Were it my vehicle, I would stick with a 5W-40 or 5W-30 for year-round use. These diesel oils will deliver (more than) enough wear protection for as much horsepower as your engine can possibly put out. The 20W-50 Competition oil is more appropriate for the heavily modified pick-ups putting out 1200 + horsepower in truck pulls etc.
I know a lot of people use Mobil1 for their MB, but now im curious how Mobil1 and Liqui Molly compare to the Amsoil, any thoughts/experience from anyone here? ( I know there are a ton of oil threads already around :/ )
My local MB dealer recommends 5w-30 year round and mb approved 229.52 which im sure is the ESP stuff i dont need anymore. I'd be happy to run the same oil year round though since it would mean fewer oil changes. For a clean/flush does it matter what oil? canadian tire ahs some sales going on now and i saw 5w30 penzoil 5L is like $16, 2 jugs and i would be good, i also have some liqui molly engine flush and was thinking to do something like this...
extract some current oil to send off for oil test
dump liqui molly engine flush
idle 10-15 mins
extract oil, dump filter
install new cheapo filter, dump in cheapo penzoil
idle 10-15 mins
extract oil, dump filter and clean filter housing
install filter adapter and new bigger filter
dump new oil in
before next oil change extract some oil and also send off for oil test
Thanks for posting the comments by the rep, always good to get another opinion.
Your proposed oil-change routine is pretty well carbon-copy of what I did at the last oil change. Except for the double oil-filter change. Your 2nd oil filter can't hurt, just not sure it's worth it.
The OEM 229.51 oil specified in my 2013 manual is now considered the scourge of the earth. 229.52 is now the only oil to use for Bluetecs. Both are garbage. Not MB's fault, but the EPA's. The aforementioned oils boil off 'cause they can't handle the excessive heat off the turbo. But the EPA considers these oils to be superior insofar as the environment is concerned. And I'm confident that they're right. But they won't pay for my worn timing chain etc.
I would personally rather run the Competition Series oil all season 'round if I could. If this oil is great for highly modified engines, how on earth can it not be ok for my stock engine. Costs more? If I'm fine with that, then where's the problem?
I'm going to stick to my 5k km oil change intervals. The wife works minutes from home, so one more reason to stick with the shorter intervals. I've installed a higher cap oil filter, I've scrapped my DPF/DEF/EGR. I lose the cover/belly pan in summer to keep under-hood temps down. I've carved out a precise section on the belly pan to facilitate oil changes. I've done everything I believe I can to extend the life of my engine. Time to sit back, cross my fingers and just enjoy the truck.
Last edited by peter2772000; Feb 7, 2019 at 06:56 PM.
Just got my oil analysis report. First time for me.
PETER: This report holds a surplus of good news for this MB. Metals are mostly low compared to
averages, and that squares with the km on the oil. For the OM642, our averages are based on ~15,600 km
of oil use. If you wanted to go that long between changes, the engine should be more than capable. The oil
held up nicely, based on the normal viscosity and 7.3 TBN. We don't consider the active additive to be used
up until the TBN is 1.0 or less. Harmful contamination was absent and the low insolubles point to effective
oil filtration and good combustion. Nice MB.
Sorry, took time copying/pasting. The report had my telephone number, addy etc displayed. Normally don't care, but Diabolistupid seems to be the type that would drive me nutty armed with that info.
Just got my oil analysis report. First time for me.
PETER: This report holds a surplus of good news for this MB. Metals are mostly low compared to
averages, and that squares with the km on the oil. For the OM642, our averages are based on ~15,600 km
of oil use. If you wanted to go that long between changes, the engine should be more than capable. The oil
held up nicely, based on the normal viscosity and 7.3 TBN. We don't consider the active additive to be used
up until the TBN is 1.0 or less. Harmful contamination was absent and the low insolubles point to effective
oil filtration and good combustion. Nice MB.
I noticed that the averages for the following were way lower/higher than my results.
IRON averages are 69, I'm guessing I'm good on this.
MOLYBDENUM averages are 35
BORON averages are 67
CALCIUM averages are 1848
MAGNESIUM averages are 162
Comments or opinions? Except from Diabolistupid, of course
That is a good looking report! The eye opening number is Iron for sure. Be interesting the see if that is more the oil chemistry, or just due to the short drain interval? With numbers like that, I don't see any reason to change what you are doing. Thanks for sharing.
Just for full clarification, what oil was that report on and exact mileage on oil?
Last edited by johnand; Feb 7, 2019 at 08:23 PM.
Reason: Question about oil brand and mileage.
by the sounds of it your mb is doing great. I also ordered a oil test kit, im a little terrified of what the report will say. I'm almost at my 1 yr mark and i havent done an oil change yet, as originally my plan was to just follow the service indicators on the dash. Clearly now with the work ive had done and the info ive learned here i will be doing my own service on the car and also more frequently than the dash tells me.
it will be nice to compare the oil report from what i send them now that has been in the car almost a year (and that is if MB actually did a B service as they should have and changed the oil and filter before i picked up the car) vs what it will look like the next time i do an oil change using a shorter interval, the higher capacity spin on oil filter, and also different type of oil.
That is a good looking report! The eye opening number is Iron for sure. Be interesting the see if that is more the oil chemistry, or just due to the short drain interval? With numbers like that, I don't see any reason to change what you are doing. Thanks for sharing.
Just for full clarification, what oil was that report on and exact mileage on oil?
Yeah, I also believe that the low iron is due mostly to the 3k mile oil change intervals. I may just stretch the interval to 6k miles just for grins to see if the iron levels rise.
The oil was Amsoil Signature Series 10W30. NOT diesel-recommended oil, I ordered the wrong fall/winter/spring oil. In bulk LOL.
I didn't realize that Amsoil had Signature Series oil on both the gas and diesel platforms. But I was running synthetic motorcycle oil prior to the Amsoil, so I'm not worried.
I run Amsoil Competition Series 20W50 in the summer, btw.
by the sounds of it your mb is doing great. I also ordered a oil test kit, im a little terrified of what the report will say. I'm almost at my 1 yr mark and i havent done an oil change yet, as originally my plan was to just follow the service indicators on the dash. Clearly now with the work ive had done and the info ive learned here i will be doing my own service on the car and also more frequently than the dash tells me.
it will be nice to compare the oil report from what i send them now that has been in the car almost a year (and that is if MB actually did a B service as they should have and changed the oil and filter before i picked up the car) vs what it will look like the next time i do an oil change using a shorter interval, the higher capacity spin on oil filter, and also different type of oil.
Agreed. Oh, and my oil of choice for the flush is the Crappy Tire cheapa$$ diesel oil in a 4 litre red jug. Something like $11...
was it a conventional oil, a synthetic blend, or a full synthetic crappy tire oil? i saw some nice cheap conventional diesel oils on sale now at crappy tire, but I wasn't sure whether I can/should use a conventional oil vs a synthetic oil even for the flush.
im still researching some tools, filters, and oils, then once i order everything i will do the oil change and filter adapter on a weekend. hopefully a warmer weekend too since i have a tiny garage and will be half outside. ideally within the next 2 weeks or so. Today i also received my tube kit from blackstone for the oil analysis
I'm currently looking at using that big honkin filter and reading about some good oil filters for those cummins engines, getting totally sidetracked on some cummins forums now. Looks like Napa gold, a Donaldson filter or some Fleetguard Stratapore style filter. Still have more reading to do since i think i read somewhere that it has to be a fleece filter for our cars, unless that is all changed now due to the deletes and the differnet oil we're using?
then also have to look into those oils and compare the Amsoil, Mobil1, and Liqui Moly, and also decide on the type 5w-30 or 5w-40 or something else.
Too much to read on the internet and not enough time!
At $11 for four litres, I can promise you it isn't synthetic. Doesn't matter the weight either, you're only using it to wash out the flush treatment, and for only 5-10 minutes.
The deletes have nothing to do with the oil filters. Find what you believe to be the best filter and go with that. Also don't forget that you'll have to trim your engine cover afterwards.
weight wasnt for the flush oil, it was for the oil i was going to run year round.
while i was searching for the best cummins oil filter i came across an interesting article where they also did a comparison of filters. If you're interested in the read...
**WARNING LOTS OF PHOTOS COMING**
got it done this past weekend, been keeping a close eye on things and looks like no leaks or problems, ill call it a great success!
when doing the engine flush, the oil i used for the flush also came out pure black after some idle time in the engine, but after pouring in the good oil, even after idling the engine a bit the oil actually looks like new oil. Even today when i checked the oil level it still looked like new oil, had a spot or 2 of black on the dip stick but majority looked nice and clean and that is already after 2 days of driving =
FYI the tall Cummins filter does fit, and I don't believe it is even touching the hood liner because I don't see any indents or feel any resistance when closing the hood. speaking of filters, from all the reading/research i did on Cummins forums it looks like your best options for filters are Donaldson DBL7349 or Fleetguard LF16035. The fleetguard was more money, it was looking like $30 CAD or more for me to get it, but i managed to find the Donaldson filter at a local Kenworth dealer for $12 CAD! here are some specs from the filters i found during my research.
Donaldson DBL7349 20 microns @ 100%, 15 microns @ 98.7%, 7 micron @ 59.97%, flow rate 20 gpm <--- looks like the better option anyways wth higher filtration and flow rate
Fleetguard LF16035 30 microns @ 100%, 25 micron @ 98.7%, 10 microns @ 60%, flow rate 8.72gpm
here is everything i needed to get the install and oil change done:
-10 quarts oil. i used Amsoil Signature Series Max-Duty Synthetic Diesel Oil 5W-30 (due to the bigger filter you will need more oil than stock)
-oil filter
-extra engine oil if you want to do a flush (i did)
-funnel for pouring in oil if you want
-blue thread lock
-red thread lock
-hammer and punch (or just hammer)
-oil filter wrench to remove old filter
-fluid extractor if you want to use the extractor method for the oil change (i got this one
)
-4" or bigger hole saw to trim engine cover
-exacto knife
here is my awesome high tech work area setup. a bungee cord and a super powerful white led work light from costco
had to trim the engine cover. i used a 4" hole saw and did my best to center it around the filter, used the exacto to cut away the felt liner after i cut the hole. looking at the last pic showing the cover over the filter i felt like i did a bang up job and had some nice wiggle room around the filter (i was wrong)
here is my fluid extractor setup after the engine flush. the extractor worked great, but took a little fiddling to get it just right to suck as much oil out. the plastic tubing is very rigid and also tightly coiled to fit in the packaging it was shipped in. once you get the tube all the way down i believe the tube starts to curl inside the case and prevents you from getting the oil at the very bottom. took some playing back and forth up and down but eventuallyi would find a sweet spot and it got tons of oil out. fyi this was all done on a warmed up engine so the oil is a little warm and more fluid
while the oil is draining i took off the stock filter, and then also used the extractor to suck the oil out of the filter housing. then i used shop towels to clean the filter housing up as much as i could. then i even used q tips to reach down to the very bottom and clean that area up of oil because there is a plug that gets installed in there. this is what it looked like after i cleaned everything up. the red circle shows a spot where a hose with a rubber grommet is held, pull it off to have more working room when installing the filter adapter.
put a drop of red thread lock on the plug. the sides of the plug definitely make contact so that is a good spot, i placed it a little near the coned part and mainly on the side
shove in the plug and gently tap it in. i was told to be careful not to hammer at it too hard and break anything, this was the toughest part for me. i wanted to make sure it was in enough, but i also didnt want to try to jam it in too much. i used a hammer and a punch and gently tapped at it until i didn't really feel it moving much more.
wiggle and break off the tube that is used to put in the plug
time to screw in the adapter. make sure to oil the 2 o rings (red arrows), and apply a drop of blue thread lock on the threads (blue arrow). then place it in the housing and screw it in. once you think it is screwed in as far as it will go, screw it in more. the o ring gives quite some resistance, but you will hit a point where it will no longer budge or move because it has bottomed out on the housing. it's an awkward spot and you pretty much have to do this by hand so grip strength plays a role as well, but grab it and turn it till it won't go anymore.
now get your filter adapter and also apply a drop of blue threadlock to the threads before screwing it in (red arrow). same thing with this one, it will bottom out and wont go any further once it is in as far as it will go
make sure to put back the hose with the rubber grommet if you pulled it out
check and make sure everything is seated properly. if you can, let the thread lock cure for 24 hrs before continuing. i poured oil in the engine and left it overnight in the garage. it was just under 24 hrs the next day when i did have the engine idle a bit to get the oil flowing and top it up, but it was just over 24 hrs before i actually drove the car and had the engine get fully up to temp.
before starting all of this i took the car for a good highway drive to get the oil hot, and also extracted some oil that i sent off to blackstone for oil analysis. I'm curious what the results will be like because this is what your oil looks like if you follow the recommended 15000km/1 yr change interval. i was just under 15000 km and about 3-5 days over 1 year exactly. here is what my stock filter looked like.
i put on the new donaldson filter. the filter shows to screw it in until the gasket makes contact, then to do 1 whole turn extra. i did not use the filter wrench for this, i was just going to do it by hand, and i did not manage to get 1 full turn after the gasket made contact. i want to say i got just under 3/4 of a turn. here are 2 photos. 1st one showing position once gasket made contact, second one once i was done screwing it in and felt it had enough.
before starting the engine i poured the oil in until the dip stick showed max (this was done the first day, engine wasnt started till the 2nd day). it took 7 full quarts and almost a whole 8th bottle, pic below, bottle on the left is what i had left in the 8th bottle after hitting that max line (or who knows maybe i even went over by a bit)
i started the engine and let it idle very little while just looking and checking for any leaks. checked the dip stick and it showed 0 oil. the large filter took it all! after 9 quarts total this is what the dip stick showed
slowly was pouring more oil in, then idling the engine and then checking the level. i wasn't adding much at a time and wanted to gradually see the level rise until just under that max line. i stopped at a certain point because the dip stick was confusing me and maybe you guys can provide input. one side of the dip stick would show a dry area indicating a level, but when i would rotate the stick the other side would be fully coated and i panicked that i overfilled. ive been monitoring and checking the levels still and it seems hit or miss when this happens. im fairly confident the level is where the red line is in the first photo, and that at times depending on how long i wait for the engine to cool, or how i pull out the dip stick the other side somehow gets fully coated because it maybe rubs up against something? does this happen to others?
here it is looking good
now exact same level check and stick just rotated around to the other side of the dip stick
in total i poured in about 9.25 quarts, here is what is left from the 10th bottle
all done and what it looks like. due to the angle the filter housing is on my hole in the engine cover wasnt good enough. it fits, but it doesnt slide over/in easily because the filter sits like a leaning tower of pisa. i took the exacto at it again and shaved a bit more plastic off. it doenst look nice and pretty anymore, but maybe another weekend i will sand it down to make it look nicer.
ill extract some oil for another sample maybe in the summer, curious to see how things compare from the analysis.
ordered a case of the 1 quart bottles (12 bottles). i was going to order bigger size bottles next time since it ends up costing a little less, but to be honest, i had the big 5 L jugs for the engine flush oil and it was a pain pouring that stuff and trying not to make a mess as it chugged out of the big bottle. the quart bottles were so nice and easy to pour from that im undecided if i will order larger bottles.
yup no problems with clearance. i was super cautious when closing the hood the first time, and closed the hood gently by hand and tried to see if i could feel any resistance, i felt absolutely nothing in terms of resistance or pushing back when gently trying to lock it in place. worst case it may be just touching the hood liner and barely at that because i see no indents in the hood liner from anything pressing up against it.
i tried to take a photo but it's dark and even with a light if you dont get the right angle its hard to see. the below pic is with the hood latched, but me pulling up on it as much as the latch will allow and shining a light in. you can see the top of the filter, but you only see darkness above because the hood liner isnt even close enough to the filter at this point for the light to illuminate it.
Mercedes SLR McLaren 722 S Is Extremely Rare Example Modified by McLaren
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