How do Mercedes Recalls & TSB's work?
06-07-2002, 03:17 PM
#1
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Thread Starter
How do Mercedes Recalls & TSB's work?
1. There were 2 recalls on W210 for Air Bags. I never received any notice to bring my 98 E430 in for service. How and when do these recalls get fixed?
200104001 APR 01 Recall - Replacement of Side Airbags
200104002 APR 01 Recall - Side Airbag Replacement
2. Also, here is a TSB for all W210. No retrofit was done on my car:
P-88_50-023 FEB 01 Emergency Trunk Release - Retrofit
What is the point of these Recalls and TSB's if the car is never fixed or upgraded? Thanks.
200104001 APR 01 Recall - Replacement of Side Airbags
200104002 APR 01 Recall - Side Airbag Replacement
2. Also, here is a TSB for all W210. No retrofit was done on my car:
P-88_50-023 FEB 01 Emergency Trunk Release - Retrofit
What is the point of these Recalls and TSB's if the car is never fixed or upgraded? Thanks.
06-07-2002, 04:28 PM
#2
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Great questions. I too would like to find info on the TSBs for my 01 clk 430, as MB tech 208 refers to them from time to time. MB TECH 208 how can we get all the TSBs for our respective cars? PS Right now I really need the one on the rough idle
Thanks RJC
Thanks RJC
06-07-2002, 06:15 PM
#3
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Dear RJC, I do not think that there is one about that rough idle for CLK 430 as I mentioned before.
How those TSB's and recalls work is not that simple.
Recalls are often for certain VIN's. You will only receive a letter for a recall when your car is between certain VIN's. It is possible that Mercedes used an other brand of parts outside those VIN numbers and these do not need a recall. Recalls are often for safety-related problems, e.g. brakes, airbags,...
About these TSB's: sometimes it happens that the same piece often fails. Mercedes may bring out a TSB, but this does not necessarily mean that all those pieces will fail. So a recall is not needed, but the dealers are informed about the possibility that a certain piece can fail. This can save time to diagnose.
Mercedes (now DaimlerChrysler AG) can bring out a TSB, but MBUSA can choose not to spread it to the dealers. It can also be that MBUSA has seen certain failures but Mercedes Germany did not let them know anything yet. So MBUSA can choose to make a TSB themselves and spread it to the dealers.
Patrick
How those TSB's and recalls work is not that simple.
Recalls are often for certain VIN's. You will only receive a letter for a recall when your car is between certain VIN's. It is possible that Mercedes used an other brand of parts outside those VIN numbers and these do not need a recall. Recalls are often for safety-related problems, e.g. brakes, airbags,...
About these TSB's: sometimes it happens that the same piece often fails. Mercedes may bring out a TSB, but this does not necessarily mean that all those pieces will fail. So a recall is not needed, but the dealers are informed about the possibility that a certain piece can fail. This can save time to diagnose.
Mercedes (now DaimlerChrysler AG) can bring out a TSB, but MBUSA can choose not to spread it to the dealers. It can also be that MBUSA has seen certain failures but Mercedes Germany did not let them know anything yet. So MBUSA can choose to make a TSB themselves and spread it to the dealers.
Patrick
06-07-2002, 06:54 PM
#5
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Thanks Patrick The only reason I keep asking for the rough idle TSB is MB TECH wrote that there is one but the # he gave me did not show at my dealer. My car just does not idle as smoothly as it should as the engine has a slight shudder while idling that can be felt in the seat and floor. I checked under the hood of another 01 clk 430 and placed my hand on the back of the plastic engine cover and felt the engine shudder from time to time but it could not be felt in the car. My service advisor said that's a characteristic of the 4.3's...I say not so as this is my 3rd 430 and the only one with this problem. There have been no codes recorded. Thoughts??
RJC
RJC
06-08-2002, 12:14 PM
#6
MBWorld Fanatic!
I've read several posts where rough idle was solved by replacing defective motor mounts. That may explain why your motor seems to act like others but cannot be felt inside the other cars.
06-08-2002, 04:05 PM
#7
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Originally posted by mleskovar
I've read several posts where rough idle was solved by replacing defective motor mounts. That may explain why your motor seems to act like others but cannot be felt inside the other cars.
I've read several posts where rough idle was solved by replacing defective motor mounts. That may explain why your motor seems to act like others but cannot be felt inside the other cars.
You can get very basic TSB info at alldata.com but in order to get more they charge.
Thanks
RJC
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06-08-2002, 09:55 PM
#9
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Sorry, don't remember what year/model the motor mounts pertained to but were associated with the current V6 & V8 configurations. Can't even remember what forums they were on. And yes, every MB mechanic should know the effects of defective motor mounts.....among other things. It's like a lot of things, until you experience it you don't know for sure. The TSB information from alldata.com is extremely limited....I have actual MB TSB listings for the W203 but they are a year old and 47 pages long. I would like to get a current listing for the W203.
06-08-2002, 10:22 PM
#10
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[quote]I have actual MB TSB listings for the W203 but they are a year old and 47 pages long.
Wow 47 pages,where did you get them from?
RJC
Wow 47 pages,where did you get them from?
RJC
06-09-2002, 12:45 PM
#11
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Off the web, could have been this forum. They deal with all kinds of things. Some of the entries are repeats and some are for other models. Give me your email address and I'll send them to you. I'm still trying to find the updated tsb's..............
06-09-2002, 01:55 PM
#12
MBWorld Fanatic!
Originally posted by mleskovar
Off the web, could have been this forum. They deal with all kinds of things. Some of the entries are repeats and some are for other models. Give me your email address and I'll send them to you. I'm still trying to find the updated tsb's..............
Off the web, could have been this forum. They deal with all kinds of things. Some of the entries are repeats and some are for other models. Give me your email address and I'll send them to you. I'm still trying to find the updated tsb's..............
Thanks
RJC
06-09-2002, 04:00 PM
#14
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Originally posted by patrick
If you can tell me which model, engine, etc...and what problem you have, than I can tell you if there is a TSB for it and what is in it.
Patrick
If you can tell me which model, engine, etc...and what problem you have, than I can tell you if there is a TSB for it and what is in it.
Patrick
Thanks in advance RJC
06-09-2002, 05:27 PM
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Dear RJC,
As I mentioned before there are no TSB's for your type of car. But I cannot know if MBUSA has made one especially for the US only due to emission laws or whatever.
I would not say that there is nothing wrong because there are no fault codes in memory. Apart from reading fault codes, there are a lot of values that are interesting to examine. The ECU can make mixture leaner or richer just in one cylinder too, just to make the engine run smoother. These sort of corrections are called adaptation values and can also be seen with the Mercedes Star diagnosis computer. Do these values show anything interesting? Are all ignition values the same? Using the Star diagnosis computer you can also change mixture in a cylinder. E.g. you can make cylinder no. 5 richer to see if the engine runs smoother, maybe it is an injector that does not spray that well.
But is the engine mechanical allright? No leaking valves or whatever? If this all is allright, than it must be the motor mounts or something like that, not the engine itself.
Is it really sure that there are no fault codes in memory?
These engines memorise everything that makes the engine not turning so well. From the moment on that the combustion in one of the cylinders takes longer than other cylinders (bad ignition, bad spraying injector, mechanical problems,...) this cylinder will be turned off to prevent catalyst damage. If this has happened, even once and a month ago, a fault code will be in memory.
There are TSB's for these engines, but fault codes should be in memory and/or the engine warning light should be on.
Which gas do you use? Are there any modifications made (do not think this cannot be the reason)? Did the car have any accidents?
Patrick
As I mentioned before there are no TSB's for your type of car. But I cannot know if MBUSA has made one especially for the US only due to emission laws or whatever.
I would not say that there is nothing wrong because there are no fault codes in memory. Apart from reading fault codes, there are a lot of values that are interesting to examine. The ECU can make mixture leaner or richer just in one cylinder too, just to make the engine run smoother. These sort of corrections are called adaptation values and can also be seen with the Mercedes Star diagnosis computer. Do these values show anything interesting? Are all ignition values the same? Using the Star diagnosis computer you can also change mixture in a cylinder. E.g. you can make cylinder no. 5 richer to see if the engine runs smoother, maybe it is an injector that does not spray that well.
But is the engine mechanical allright? No leaking valves or whatever? If this all is allright, than it must be the motor mounts or something like that, not the engine itself.
Is it really sure that there are no fault codes in memory?
These engines memorise everything that makes the engine not turning so well. From the moment on that the combustion in one of the cylinders takes longer than other cylinders (bad ignition, bad spraying injector, mechanical problems,...) this cylinder will be turned off to prevent catalyst damage. If this has happened, even once and a month ago, a fault code will be in memory.
There are TSB's for these engines, but fault codes should be in memory and/or the engine warning light should be on.
Which gas do you use? Are there any modifications made (do not think this cannot be the reason)? Did the car have any accidents?
Patrick
06-09-2002, 08:46 PM
#16
MBWorld Fanatic!
Patrick....sounds like you have access to the TSB's. I'm not looking for trouble but it's nice to know what all the problems are so one can be more aware of subtle things that happen that could by symptomatic. Right now I sometimes hear a solid thud/clunk coming from the rear of the car when braking from above 40 mph. The noise occurs only after the car has been driven a while. The noise comes as the car slows down at around 25 mph (varies). Loudness
varies as well and usually the radio masks it. '01 C320.
varies as well and usually the radio masks it. '01 C320.
06-09-2002, 09:06 PM
#17
MBWorld Fanatic!
Originally posted by patrick
Dear RJC,
As I mentioned before there are no TSB's for your type of car. But I cannot know if MBUSA has made one especially for the US only due to emission laws or whatever.
I would not say that there is nothing wrong because there are no fault codes in memory. Apart from reading fault codes, there are a lot of values that are interesting to examine. The ECU can make mixture leaner or richer just in one cylinder too, just to make the engine run smoother. These sort of corrections are called adaptation values and can also be seen with the Mercedes Star diagnosis computer. Do these values show anything interesting? Are all ignition values the same? Using the Star diagnosis computer you can also change mixture in a cylinder. E.g. you can make cylinder no. 5 richer to see if the engine runs smoother, maybe it is an injector that does not spray that well.
But is the engine mechanical allright? No leaking valves or whatever? If this all is allright, than it must be the motor mounts or something like that, not the engine itself.
Is it really sure that there are no fault codes in memory?
These engines memorise everything that makes the engine not turning so well. From the moment on that the combustion in one of the cylinders takes longer than other cylinders (bad ignition, bad spraying injector, mechanical problems,...) this cylinder will be turned off to prevent catalyst damage. If this has happened, even once and a month ago, a fault code will be in memory.
There are TSB's for these engines, but fault codes should be in memory and/or the engine warning light should be on.
Which gas do you use? Are there any modifications made (do not think this cannot be the reason)? Did the car have any accidents?
Patrick
Dear RJC,
As I mentioned before there are no TSB's for your type of car. But I cannot know if MBUSA has made one especially for the US only due to emission laws or whatever.
I would not say that there is nothing wrong because there are no fault codes in memory. Apart from reading fault codes, there are a lot of values that are interesting to examine. The ECU can make mixture leaner or richer just in one cylinder too, just to make the engine run smoother. These sort of corrections are called adaptation values and can also be seen with the Mercedes Star diagnosis computer. Do these values show anything interesting? Are all ignition values the same? Using the Star diagnosis computer you can also change mixture in a cylinder. E.g. you can make cylinder no. 5 richer to see if the engine runs smoother, maybe it is an injector that does not spray that well.
But is the engine mechanical allright? No leaking valves or whatever? If this all is allright, than it must be the motor mounts or something like that, not the engine itself.
Is it really sure that there are no fault codes in memory?
These engines memorise everything that makes the engine not turning so well. From the moment on that the combustion in one of the cylinders takes longer than other cylinders (bad ignition, bad spraying injector, mechanical problems,...) this cylinder will be turned off to prevent catalyst damage. If this has happened, even once and a month ago, a fault code will be in memory.
There are TSB's for these engines, but fault codes should be in memory and/or the engine warning light should be on.
Which gas do you use? Are there any modifications made (do not think this cannot be the reason)? Did the car have any accidents?
Patrick
Thanks for all the info. I am bringing the car back to the dealer on Fri. They keep insisting nothing is wrong, but this time I'm going to the service mgr and if he is not responsive then the district manager will be called upon. I know that there are way for MBZ to make verify that all is well in my engine (as you mentioned above) if they really wanted to... No warning lights, and they showed me on a lap top plugged into my car that there were no codes. I only use Shell, Mobil or Chevron premium fuel and the dealer put in a can of fuel system cleaner last time I was there, which did nothing The car has 15,000 miles and is 100% stock with no accidents. You mentioned leaking valves, can the computer check for this too?
Thanks Pat
RJC
06-10-2002, 09:00 AM
#18
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Thread Starter
RJC, hear is a source for TSB data on the 2001 CLK430:
www.alldata.com/TSB/35/0135AX98.html
For Recalls and TSB's for all cars go to:
www.alldata.com
www.alldata.com/TSB/35/0135AX98.html
For Recalls and TSB's for all cars go to:
www.alldata.com
06-10-2002, 09:14 AM
#20
MBWorld Fanatic!
Originally posted by E55 KEV
RJC, hear is a source for TSB data on the 2001 CLK430:
www.alldata.com/TSB/35/0135AX98.html
For Recalls and TSB's for all cars go to:
www.alldata.com
RJC, hear is a source for TSB data on the 2001 CLK430:
www.alldata.com/TSB/35/0135AX98.html
For Recalls and TSB's for all cars go to:
www.alldata.com
I've seen this before and i think it is a very limited list as to obtain the full list you may have to subscribe.
RJC
06-10-2002, 12:53 PM
#21
Originally posted by mleskovar
How do I get a recent posting of W203 TSB's? I searched in vain on the web but can't find them.
How do I get a recent posting of W203 TSB's? I searched in vain on the web but can't find them.
06-15-2002, 04:39 AM
#22
Super Moderator
Originally posted by RJC
Great questions. I too would like to find info on the TSBs for my 01 clk 430, as MB tech 208 refers to them from time to time. MB TECH 208 how can we get all the TSBs for our respective cars? PS Right now I really need the one on the rough idle Thanks RJC
Great questions. I too would like to find info on the TSBs for my 01 clk 430, as MB tech 208 refers to them from time to time. MB TECH 208 how can we get all the TSBs for our respective cars? PS Right now I really need the one on the rough idle
Thanks RJC
Bulletins for 2001 Mercedes Benz E 430 (210.070) V8-4266cc 4.3L SOHC (113.940)
Safety Recalls
TSB Number Issue Date TSB Title 200104001 APR 01 Recall - Replacement of Side Airbags
200104002 APR 01 Recall - Side Airbag Replacement
Service Bulletins
TSB Number Issue Date TSB Title 2000100002 AUG 01 Front Longitudinal Members - Subsequent Coating
P-54_10-053 MAY 01 Battery - New `Fleece' Battery Technology
S-00_00-072 MAY 01 Emission/VIN Label - Availability
S-58_091A MAY 01 Special Tool - Universal Valve Spring Tool
S-05_010A MAY 01 Tools - Universal Valve Spring Tool
S-58_20-93B APR 01 Fender/Interior/Fascia Cover - Availability
S-58_00-118 MAR 01 Engine Oil - Approved Evacuation Equipment
P-88_50-023 FEB 01 Emergency Trunk Release - Retrofit
S-00_40-071 FEB 01 Synthetic Oil Recommendations - For FFS Vehicles
S-40_10-036 FEB 01 Tires - Maintenance & Inspection
S-60_004A DEC 00 Body/Frame - Dedicated Straightening Equipment
S-58_094A DEC 00 Chassis/Frame - Dedicated Frame Straightener
S-60_00-012 DEC 00 Special Tool - M20 Resistance Welder
S-58_30-103A DEC 00 Special Tool - Resistance Spot Welder
S-58_30-115 DEC 00 Special Tool - Resistance Welder
S-60_00-008A DEC 00 Special Tool - Spot Welder
S-40_10-034 DEC 00 Tires - High Performance Tire Storage
P-91_60-44 OCT 00 Rear Door Airbag - Deactivation/Activation
P-40_10-033 SEP 00 Tires/Snow Chains - Factory Approved Specifications
P-82_64-135 AUG 00 D2B Fiber Optic Configuration and Version Coding
S-82_70-136 AUG 00 Timeport Portable Telephone Programming
P-82_64-141 AUG 00 Voice Activated Cell Phone/CD Changer Installation
DDAF82_60-U-600JUL 00 Radio Inoperative
DDAF42_10-U-600JUL 00 Selector Lever Blocks
DDAF97_10-U-404JUL 00 Ingress of Water in Luggage Compartment
DDAF82_60-U-110JUL 00 Interference to Radio After Installing Window Screens
DDAF54_65-U-200JUL 00 PTS MIL ON For No Apparent Reason
DDAF42_45-U-810JUN 00 ESP Fault Code C1120
DDAF42_45-U-810JUN 00 Electronic Stability Program Fault Code C1142
DDAF91_00-U-301JUN 00 Electrostatic Charge on Seats
DDAF82_10-U-200JUN 00 Main Beam/Low Beam Not Operating
DDAF54_21-U-600JUN 00 Operational Problem in Upper Control Panel
DDAH54_10-P-000MAR 00 Battery Safety Notes
DDAR54_18-P-010MAR 00 Repairing Wiring Harness Using Soldered Terminal
DDAF98_10-U-200AUG 99 Paint Damage to Trunk Lid in Area of Grip
DDAF42_45-U-800FEB 98 Steering Angle Sensor, DTCs C1140, C1504, 015, 016, 017
06-15-2002, 08:25 AM
#24
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I guess Awiner's list is not complete. E.g. I have not seen a TSB about a hose that should be replaced for making "screaming" sounds while turning the steering wheel,...
Therefore:
Patrick
Therefore:
Originally posted by patrick
If you can tell me which model, engine, etc...and what problem you have, than I can tell you if there is a TSB for it and what is in it.
Patrick
If you can tell me which model, engine, etc...and what problem you have, than I can tell you if there is a TSB for it and what is in it.
Patrick
06-15-2002, 12:00 PM
#25
MBWorld Fanatic!
Thanks Adam for the info.
Patrick there is in fact a TSB for: Engine Shakes Misses and Dies at Idle #DDAF82-10-U-200SEP99 This TSB is listed for Model year 2000 but ALLDATA states that the TSB's for 01 models will not be fully listed by them until mid June and July of 02.
Adam interesting saftey recall info for side air bags...never been contacted by MB and I bought the car new
Thanks again
RJC
Patrick there is in fact a TSB for: Engine Shakes Misses and Dies at Idle #DDAF82-10-U-200SEP99 This TSB is listed for Model year 2000 but ALLDATA states that the TSB's for 01 models will not be fully listed by them until mid June and July of 02.
Adam interesting saftey recall info for side air bags...never been contacted by MB and I bought the car new
Thanks again
RJC
