Beginner Tuning
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 147
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From: North Jersey
2007 C230 Sport manual
Beginner Tuning
Please do not trash me for asking a stupid newbie type question....and I did run some searches.....
My questions are:
1. How do you go about finding a good shop? I went to one place that was a listed Kleemann dealer, and they could not be bothered with me. Any thoughts on North NJ, Rockland/Orange county NY would be appreciated.
2. Tuning cars operating in cold climates, like NJ/NY: A guy I know who works at Cadillacs V division in Detroit told me that tunning a car can lead to cold weather problems. Any thoughts on this?
3. Crank Shaft: Some tuning programs offer new crank shafts...to me that sounds a bit too difficult for a tuner to do, but I am know expert on the subject. I know people will say, "if you get a good tuner....." But that begs the question.
4. Should I just stick with suspension and exhaust tuning, as that is fairly straightforward, it seems to me.
Any thoughts on these questions would be greatly appreciated.
My questions are:
1. How do you go about finding a good shop? I went to one place that was a listed Kleemann dealer, and they could not be bothered with me. Any thoughts on North NJ, Rockland/Orange county NY would be appreciated.
2. Tuning cars operating in cold climates, like NJ/NY: A guy I know who works at Cadillacs V division in Detroit told me that tunning a car can lead to cold weather problems. Any thoughts on this?
3. Crank Shaft: Some tuning programs offer new crank shafts...to me that sounds a bit too difficult for a tuner to do, but I am know expert on the subject. I know people will say, "if you get a good tuner....." But that begs the question.
4. Should I just stick with suspension and exhaust tuning, as that is fairly straightforward, it seems to me.
Any thoughts on these questions would be greatly appreciated.
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 147
Likes: 0
From: North Jersey
2007 C230 Sport manual
By the way, the thread below about Shredding Belts and all the unhelpful tooing and froeing is what gets simple guys like me worried that an installation might go bad and no one seems to know why and nothing can be done and now what was a great (yet slightly slow) engine is now causing all sorts of trouble to my daily drive......
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Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,332
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From: Toronto
2006 E320 CDi, 2008 3/4 Ton Suburban, 2007 "rice rickshaw" Accord 5 speed
simple things first
Please do not trash me for asking a stupid newbie type question....and I did run some searches.....
My questions are:
1. How do you go about finding a good shop? I went to one place that was a listed Kleemann dealer, and they could not be bothered with me. Any thoughts on North NJ, Rockland/Orange county NY would be appreciated.
2. Tuning cars operating in cold climates, like NJ/NY: A guy I know who works at Cadillacs V division in Detroit told me that tunning a car can lead to cold weather problems. Any thoughts on this?
3. Crank Shaft: Some tuning programs offer new crank shafts...to me that sounds a bit too difficult for a tuner to do, but I am know expert on the subject. I know people will say, "if you get a good tuner....." But that begs the question.
4. Should I just stick with suspension and exhaust tuning, as that is fairly straightforward, it seems to me.
Any thoughts on these questions would be greatly appreciated.
My questions are:
1. How do you go about finding a good shop? I went to one place that was a listed Kleemann dealer, and they could not be bothered with me. Any thoughts on North NJ, Rockland/Orange county NY would be appreciated.
2. Tuning cars operating in cold climates, like NJ/NY: A guy I know who works at Cadillacs V division in Detroit told me that tunning a car can lead to cold weather problems. Any thoughts on this?
3. Crank Shaft: Some tuning programs offer new crank shafts...to me that sounds a bit too difficult for a tuner to do, but I am know expert on the subject. I know people will say, "if you get a good tuner....." But that begs the question.
4. Should I just stick with suspension and exhaust tuning, as that is fairly straightforward, it seems to me.
Any thoughts on these questions would be greatly appreciated.
Would you let a witch doctor do open heart surgery on your mother?
Junior Member
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 44
Likes: 0
From: Toronto
2013 C63 AMG Coupe
LOL, good way to put it harkgar.
I would think bolt-ons and suspension is the safest and easiest way to go (at least to start off). Like he said, if you really wanna go further, be sure to find someone you can trust and be prepared to dish out the $$...
I would think bolt-ons and suspension is the safest and easiest way to go (at least to start off). Like he said, if you really wanna go further, be sure to find someone you can trust and be prepared to dish out the $$...
Member
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 149
Likes: 0
2000 C230 sport
Is your C supercharged (Kompressor)? If so, it is quite straightforward to bolt on a smaller pulley, a chip, cold air intake and exhaust and off you go. Do not touch the crankshaft, cam or anything which requires opening up the engine. Big bucks. If the tuner does not know what he is doing you are screwed. MB products are good from the factory.
Would you let a witch doctor do open heart surgery on your mother?
Would you let a witch doctor do open heart surgery on your mother?
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,653
Likes: 5
From: Ann Arbor
'03 SL55
Some thoughts. Take them for what they're worth...
There are no completely risk free mods. The more risk averse or budget conscious a person is, the more s/he should keep it simple and take one small step at a time.
Good idea to ask for opinions on shops. While things can go wrong with any shop, a good one will stand by their work and fix whatever problems arise. When you have a candidate shop, visit it to talk to the people and see how they work BEFORE you have them work on your car.
The Caddy engineer must have something very specific in mind because his comments don't make sense in the general case. For example the LS7 engine in a Z06 Corvette IS a tuned LS2 engine but it doesn't have cold weather issues.
Any decent shop should be able to replace a crankshaft, no sweat, but that's a somewhat uncommon tuning mod. Replacing a camshaft to improve intake/exhaust performance would be more common. Any decent shop should also be able to replace a camshaft without breaking a sweat.
Good thinking on suspension and exhaust. Other decent first mods include lighter wheels and grippier tires, which will improve both acceleration and handling. With tires in particular, if you are currently running all weather tires you should see a huge difference if you switch to summer-only and winter-only tires. Also tuning the air intake side of the engine can improve performance: throttle body, air box, cold air intake, etc.
Finally, take your time and enjoy the planning part of the tuning process. It can be a lot of fun in its own right.
Good luck to you!
There are no completely risk free mods. The more risk averse or budget conscious a person is, the more s/he should keep it simple and take one small step at a time.
Good idea to ask for opinions on shops. While things can go wrong with any shop, a good one will stand by their work and fix whatever problems arise. When you have a candidate shop, visit it to talk to the people and see how they work BEFORE you have them work on your car.
The Caddy engineer must have something very specific in mind because his comments don't make sense in the general case. For example the LS7 engine in a Z06 Corvette IS a tuned LS2 engine but it doesn't have cold weather issues.
Any decent shop should be able to replace a crankshaft, no sweat, but that's a somewhat uncommon tuning mod. Replacing a camshaft to improve intake/exhaust performance would be more common. Any decent shop should also be able to replace a camshaft without breaking a sweat.
Good thinking on suspension and exhaust. Other decent first mods include lighter wheels and grippier tires, which will improve both acceleration and handling. With tires in particular, if you are currently running all weather tires you should see a huge difference if you switch to summer-only and winter-only tires. Also tuning the air intake side of the engine can improve performance: throttle body, air box, cold air intake, etc.
Finally, take your time and enjoy the planning part of the tuning process. It can be a lot of fun in its own right.
Good luck to you!
Please do not trash me for asking a stupid newbie type question....and I did run some searches.....
My questions are:
1. How do you go about finding a good shop? I went to one place that was a listed Kleemann dealer, and they could not be bothered with me. Any thoughts on North NJ, Rockland/Orange county NY would be appreciated.
2. Tuning cars operating in cold climates, like NJ/NY: A guy I know who works at Cadillacs V division in Detroit told me that tunning a car can lead to cold weather problems. Any thoughts on this?
3. Crank Shaft: Some tuning programs offer new crank shafts...to me that sounds a bit too difficult for a tuner to do, but I am know expert on the subject. I know people will say, "if you get a good tuner....." But that begs the question.
4. Should I just stick with suspension and exhaust tuning, as that is fairly straightforward, it seems to me.
Any thoughts on these questions would be greatly appreciated.
My questions are:
1. How do you go about finding a good shop? I went to one place that was a listed Kleemann dealer, and they could not be bothered with me. Any thoughts on North NJ, Rockland/Orange county NY would be appreciated.
2. Tuning cars operating in cold climates, like NJ/NY: A guy I know who works at Cadillacs V division in Detroit told me that tunning a car can lead to cold weather problems. Any thoughts on this?
3. Crank Shaft: Some tuning programs offer new crank shafts...to me that sounds a bit too difficult for a tuner to do, but I am know expert on the subject. I know people will say, "if you get a good tuner....." But that begs the question.
4. Should I just stick with suspension and exhaust tuning, as that is fairly straightforward, it seems to me.
Any thoughts on these questions would be greatly appreciated.
Last edited by jmf003; Mar 13, 2007 at 08:47 AM.
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MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,653
Likes: 5
From: Ann Arbor
'03 SL55
I can understand why you might think that because the old 427s were big block engines. Although it's also a 427, the LS7 really is based off the Gen IV LS2.
For a little more info, take a look here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GM_LS_engine. For a lot more info, take a look here: http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=80
As an aside, my son and I had to figure out what engine to run in our project car, the GTM, so we spent quite a bit of time talking over the merits of an LS1/LS6 versus an LS2/LS7. In the end we went with an LS1/LS6 block.
For a little more info, take a look here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GM_LS_engine. For a lot more info, take a look here: http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=80
As an aside, my son and I had to figure out what engine to run in our project car, the GTM, so we spent quite a bit of time talking over the merits of an LS1/LS6 versus an LS2/LS7. In the end we went with an LS1/LS6 block.
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Super Member
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 559
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1973 Yugo
i get what your saying, of course the engine is based on it it but it has a differnt bore,stroke. stroker assembly and everything else that makes it a differnt engine. hell the 396 was loosely based off the 350 but it is not a tuned 350
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,653
Likes: 5
From: Ann Arbor
'03 SL55
If I wanted a 500 hp GM Gen IV engine I could go to GM Parts Direct and purchase part number 17802397, an LS7 crate engine. Or I could purchase part number 12568950, a bare LS2 block, then bore it, stroke it, install an LS7 cam, ported cylinder heads, and a tuned intake manifold.
If you consider the first engine not "tuned" because it was factory-built while the second engine is tuned because it was modified after it left the factory that's fine with me. Personally I consider the LS7 to be a performance tuned engine but no problem if we don't agree on what "tuned" means.
The real point I was trying to communicate is that contrary to what the Caddy engineer seemed to be saying to Scottw, tuning an engine doesn't cause cold weather problems per se. If tuning an engine routinely caused cold weather problems, a factory-built LS7 would experience the same cold weather problems as a shop-built LS2.
The Caddy engineer must have something more specific in mind. That's all.
If you consider the first engine not "tuned" because it was factory-built while the second engine is tuned because it was modified after it left the factory that's fine with me. Personally I consider the LS7 to be a performance tuned engine but no problem if we don't agree on what "tuned" means.
The real point I was trying to communicate is that contrary to what the Caddy engineer seemed to be saying to Scottw, tuning an engine doesn't cause cold weather problems per se. If tuning an engine routinely caused cold weather problems, a factory-built LS7 would experience the same cold weather problems as a shop-built LS2.
The Caddy engineer must have something more specific in mind. That's all.
