Tick Tock
01-21-2013, 04:16 PM
#26
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Well, I can't argue with those figures. My payments for the R350 are around $10k and I had a great deal and a sizable down payment.
01-21-2013, 05:02 PM
#27
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2006 r350 & 2005 clk320
It's very simple. If you're choosing to pay either $10k/year in repairs yearly indefinitely or financing a vehicle indefinitely, obviously you'd be doing a lease not buying. Just off the top of my head a lease on a 7-series BMW brand new is in the $800/month range and from what I remember that was a $75k vehicle. $800 per month x 12 = $9600 per year.
Here are some lease examples.
http://www.bmwoffairfax.com/specials/new.htm
Again, this discussion is relative to the hypothesis of either owning an out of warranty out right yet expecting to pay $10k~ repairs yearly on average for an indefinite period and comparing it to what would the alternative of using that $10k/year indefinitely towards finance of a newer vehicle. If you're going to make indefinite finance payments, you wouldn't be thinking of "buying" outright as opposed to leasing.
Here are some lease examples.
http://www.bmwoffairfax.com/specials/new.htm
Again, this discussion is relative to the hypothesis of either owning an out of warranty out right yet expecting to pay $10k~ repairs yearly on average for an indefinite period and comparing it to what would the alternative of using that $10k/year indefinitely towards finance of a newer vehicle. If you're going to make indefinite finance payments, you wouldn't be thinking of "buying" outright as opposed to leasing.
Last edited by bumpersignal; 01-21-2013 at 05:08 PM.
01-21-2013, 05:15 PM
#28
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R500 + SLK55 AMG
And when you say you got a great deal, did you happen to buy when Mercedes was offering a $10K incentive to clear inventory? They were for a while.
Would any new equivalent for the R350 also come with a $10,000 rebate?
And the R350 was the least expensive R Class. How packed was yours with optional goodies? My R500 MSRP was a few dollars shy of $65,000 with nearly every option. There is no way I could find a new vehicle like the R500 for $10K/year.
01-21-2013, 05:36 PM
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It's very simple. If you're choosing to pay either $10k/year in repairs yearly indefinitely or financing a vehicle indefinitely, obviously you'd be doing a lease not buying. Just off the top of my head a lease on a 7-series BMW brand new is in the $800/month range and from what I remember that was a $75k vehicle. $800 per month x 12 = $9600 per year.
Here are some lease examples.
http://www.bmwoffairfax.com/specials/new.htm
Again, this discussion is relative to the hypothesis of either owning an out of warranty out right yet expecting to pay $10k~ repairs yearly on average for an indefinite period and comparing it to what would the alternative of using that $10k/year indefinitely towards finance of a newer vehicle. If you're going to make indefinite finance payments, you wouldn't be thinking of "buying" outright as opposed to leasing.
Here are some lease examples.
http://www.bmwoffairfax.com/specials/new.htm
Again, this discussion is relative to the hypothesis of either owning an out of warranty out right yet expecting to pay $10k~ repairs yearly on average for an indefinite period and comparing it to what would the alternative of using that $10k/year indefinitely towards finance of a newer vehicle. If you're going to make indefinite finance payments, you wouldn't be thinking of "buying" outright as opposed to leasing.
Also, your lease costs are due every month without fail. Forever. My repair costs may or may not happen in any given year. But I'd be surprised at $10,000 every year for a car between say 30,000 and 150,000 miles. That would be $120,000. Mercedes aren't that bad. If they were, they wouldn't be in business. But they are the leading luxury brand because they're actually pretty reliable overall. And I'm separating repairs from maintenance like tires, brakes, battery, and fluids.
01-21-2013, 06:44 PM
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2006 r350 & 2005 clk320
No, not flawed. You just need to amortize the down payment, it's already in the link I gave you if you had bothered to look at it. Anyway, I don't have any time to go back and forth with you you've made your argument and definitely strayed from the hypothetical situation as discussed but good for you and good luck.
01-21-2013, 07:08 PM
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R500 + SLK55 AMG
No, not flawed. You just need to amortize the down payment, it's already in the link I gave you if you had bothered to look at it. Anyway, I don't have any time to go back and forth with you you've made your argument and definitely strayed from the hypothetical situation as discussed but good for you and good luck.
01-21-2013, 10:19 PM
#32
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It's very simple. If you're choosing to pay either $10k/year in repairs yearly indefinitely or financing a vehicle indefinitely, obviously you'd be doing a lease not buying. Just off the top of my head a lease on a 7-series BMW brand new is in the $800/month range and from what I remember that was a $75k vehicle. $800 per month x 12 = $9600 per year.
Here are some lease examples.
http://www.bmwoffairfax.com/specials/new.htm
Again, this discussion is relative to the hypothesis of either owning an out of warranty out right yet expecting to pay $10k~ repairs yearly on average for an indefinite period and comparing it to what would the alternative of using that $10k/year indefinitely towards finance of a newer vehicle. If you're going to make indefinite finance payments, you wouldn't be thinking of "buying" outright as opposed to leasing.
Here are some lease examples.
http://www.bmwoffairfax.com/specials/new.htm
Again, this discussion is relative to the hypothesis of either owning an out of warranty out right yet expecting to pay $10k~ repairs yearly on average for an indefinite period and comparing it to what would the alternative of using that $10k/year indefinitely towards finance of a newer vehicle. If you're going to make indefinite finance payments, you wouldn't be thinking of "buying" outright as opposed to leasing.
Just because you say you encountered two $5000 repairs in a short time on your BMW does not mean you can extrapolate those figures out over time as typical for all German cars.
01-21-2013, 11:20 PM
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2011 C300 4matic, 2015 Porsche Macan S, 2006 R500 (sold)
supernsx,
Try looking at it this way. I set up a spreadsheet with a buy (my car) and then 3 consecutive 3 year leases and compared the two scenarios over a 9 year period. My R500 had an MSRP of $64,500 so I looked for an equivalent car as a lease comparison. Luckily, Mercedes has a current 3 year lease on a GL450 that has an MSRP of $63,900. Pretty darn close for this purpose.
I laid out the price of my car + tax - residual value of 5% as the total cost ignoring maintenance and repairs. Total cost of ownership = $27,010. Over 9 years (108 months) the cost is rather conveniently $250 per month.
Next, I set up 3 back to back 3 year leases of a GL450 based on todays MB offer of $63,900 and a lease payment of $699 along with up front costs of $6,493 each time you lease. Total cost of ownership = $94,971. Over 9 years (108 months) the cost is $879 per month. That's $629 per month more than my "old" R500. Every single month. Guaranteed. That's $7,500 per year.
So, the lease will cost you almost $68,000 more than hanging onto my used car for 9 years. Every month I go without repairs, I put $629 in my pocket. Every year I build a $7,500 cushion against future repairs.
Upside of lease.....
- New car every 3 years, new style, new technology
- Always covered by warranty for major or minor repairs
Downside of lease.....
- You ARE paying for depreciation in the lease payment
- You ARE spending $68,000 for that warranty coverage
- You have NO residual value
- You MAY have additional expense at lease turn in
Upside of holding onto a car for the long term......
- Far lower outlay of cash unless there are major repairs
- If that car is out of production, you get to hang onto a car you really like.
Downside of holding onto a car for the long term......
- You WILL spend more cash on major and minor repairs
- You're driving an older car, older style, older technology
So, in my case the question becomes, do I think I will spend $68,000 on repairs between mile 36,000 and mile 100,000? Not bloody likely! $25,000? Yeah, maybe with this car. But that's peanuts compared to paying to always be under warranty in a new equivalent car. And I really like this thing. I don't want a GL450 or any other truck like SUV.
And, with a service contract (extended warranty) I can mitigate some of that repair cost for 3 years, or 1/3rd of the 9 year term for a measly $3,200. Personally, I think there's no way I'm not ahead of the game to keep the R500 for 9 or 10 years vs constantly updating an equivalent luxury vehicle.
I didn't create an example for buying a GL450 every 4 years but it would probably be just as bad since you'd be absorbing all of the front end depreciation and paying all of the sales tax each time. New luxury cars that are turned over quickly are not a smart buy. They are status symbols and toys. They are not great economic moves.
EDIT: OK curiosity got the better of me so I ran an analysis for the same GL450 as a buy on two consecutive 4 year deals to match up with the Mercedes warranty period. I assumed the same $63,900 price that Mercedes is currently offering, a 3% borrowing cost, 10% down payment, 90% financed, 48 month term, and 60% depreciation based on what I could find on the web for Mercedes SUV's. Oddly enough, or maybe not so oddly, the buy cost looks pretty much the same as a lease. Total cost of ownership = $83,868 or $874 per month for 96 months. My monthly costs go up to $281 per month since I'm amortizing the same costs over a shorter term (96 vs 108 months). The difference is about the same as the lease scenario at $592 per month or $7,200 per year. At the end of 8 years, I'm $57,000 better off (excluding repairs) by keeping my car rather than worrying about being "under warranty".
All of this leaves me firmly convinced that you are MUCH better off buying a used (4-5 year old) low mileage car in great condition and keeping it for 10 years. As the common wisdom goes, let someone else take the depreciation hit. Let the OEM warranty find and fix all the infant mortality problems on expensive systems. Let the recalls work themselves out. Use an aftermarket warranty or OEM CPO program if you like to mitigate any risk. If you can't afford top own the car out of warranty, then you couldn't afford to own the car in the first place.
Let's say the R500 costs $32K included the extended warranty. I can drive worry free for 6+ years. Since i will sell my car with couple months of warranty left to help my car to be competitive in both offer and price, I can probably get about $14K back. With the $18K in difference + $3K in operation cost, I am "highly confidence" to meet my budget cost of $290 per month.
My scenario works better for me since I can drive newer car and have a total piece of mind that don't need to take any risk on high repair bills. I saw your $250 per month figure but you made an assumption without adding the typical repair costs that we have seen in this forum. Two or three repair bills on R class after your warranty ends can easily bump your TCO up $10K to $15K and about $100 per month or higher.
I have another 20 months left on my warranty. Even though it has been a great vehicle, I really want something new.... I test drove the new 2013 GL and it is really no comparison with our the 2006/7 R500. The interior is night and day and the ride and power are just so much better.
With all these, enjoy your R-class and it has been serving my family well.
Last edited by supernsx; 01-21-2013 at 11:39 PM.
01-22-2013, 07:43 AM
#34
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An excellent strategy. The key is to buy a low mileage car in excellent condition at half (ish) price and let someone else take the massive initial depreciation hit.
The only real difference between us is that I'm willing to take the risk out of warranty.
And yep, I purposely excluded repairs
1.) Since they are a complete unknown and therefore impossible to project.
2.) To demonstrate the pool of cash for repairs available from a longer term hold strategy.
The only real difference between us is that I'm willing to take the risk out of warranty.
And yep, I purposely excluded repairs
1.) Since they are a complete unknown and therefore impossible to project.
2.) To demonstrate the pool of cash for repairs available from a longer term hold strategy.
01-22-2013, 07:45 AM
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R500 + SLK55 AMG
You set up unrealistic figures and expect us to agree that is the argument. That is a false choice. You show lease figures for only 10k miles a year and then claim as accepted fact that repairs on a typical used German car will be $10,000 per year for that 10,000 miles. I drive almost twice that many miles a year and those average repair costs would be insane even after 200k miles.
Just because you say you encountered two $5000 repairs in a short time on your BMW does not mean you can extrapolate those figures out over time as typical for all German cars.
Just because you say you encountered two $5000 repairs in a short time on your BMW does not mean you can extrapolate those figures out over time as typical for all German cars.
01-22-2013, 10:00 AM
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2011 C300 4matic, 2015 Porsche Macan S, 2006 R500 (sold)
An excellent strategy. The key is to buy a low mileage car in excellent condition at half (ish) price and let someone else take the massive initial depreciation hit.
The only real difference between us is that I'm willing to take the risk out of warranty.
And yep, I purposely excluded repairs
1.) Since they are a complete unknown and therefore impossible to project.
2.) To demonstrate the pool of cash for repairs available from a longer term hold strategy.
The only real difference between us is that I'm willing to take the risk out of warranty.
And yep, I purposely excluded repairs
1.) Since they are a complete unknown and therefore impossible to project.
2.) To demonstrate the pool of cash for repairs available from a longer term hold strategy.
01-22-2013, 10:21 AM
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R500 + SLK55 AMG
Yeah, but you know what they say about averages.....it's possible to drown in a body of water with an average depth of 1".
I might have a complete engine failure from a blown head gasket or lose two differentials on this thing or, I might sail through to 100,000 miles completely unscathed. Some owners have had the 3.5L engine self-destruct early on and others have made it past 100,000 miles with no problems. I'm pretty impressed by the average reliability of components across the entire industry today. There's really no brand I'm particularly afraid of. Anyone who gets too far outside the industry reliability standards simply can't survive with today's level of global competition.
Where I've set myself up for surprises is getting a car loaded with all the gizmos. There are just so many more things that can fail on a loaded luxury car than on say a base Corolla. I think mine has every option but the seat memories, rear seat heaters, distronic cruise control, and iPod adapter. But that's OK, I'm going in with my eyes open and I can easily afford the maintenance and repairs.
I might have a complete engine failure from a blown head gasket or lose two differentials on this thing or, I might sail through to 100,000 miles completely unscathed. Some owners have had the 3.5L engine self-destruct early on and others have made it past 100,000 miles with no problems. I'm pretty impressed by the average reliability of components across the entire industry today. There's really no brand I'm particularly afraid of. Anyone who gets too far outside the industry reliability standards simply can't survive with today's level of global competition.
Where I've set myself up for surprises is getting a car loaded with all the gizmos. There are just so many more things that can fail on a loaded luxury car than on say a base Corolla. I think mine has every option but the seat memories, rear seat heaters, distronic cruise control, and iPod adapter. But that's OK, I'm going in with my eyes open and I can easily afford the maintenance and repairs.
01-22-2013, 01:46 PM
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2011 C300 4matic, 2015 Porsche Macan S, 2006 R500 (sold)
Yeah, but you know what they say about averages.....it's possible to drown in a body of water with an average depth of 1".
I might have a complete engine failure from a blown head gasket or lose two differentials on this thing or, I might sail through to 100,000 miles completely unscathed. Some owners have had the 3.5L engine self-destruct early on and others have made it past 100,000 miles with no problems. I'm pretty impressed by the average reliability of components across the entire industry today. There's really no brand I'm particularly afraid of. Anyone who gets too far outside the industry reliability standards simply can't survive with today's level of global competition.
Where I've set myself up for surprises is getting a car loaded with all the gizmos. There are just so many more things that can fail on a loaded luxury car than on say a base Corolla. I think mine has every option but the seat memories, rear seat heaters, distronic cruise control, and iPod adapter. But that's OK, I'm going in with my eyes open and I can easily afford the maintenance and repairs.
I might have a complete engine failure from a blown head gasket or lose two differentials on this thing or, I might sail through to 100,000 miles completely unscathed. Some owners have had the 3.5L engine self-destruct early on and others have made it past 100,000 miles with no problems. I'm pretty impressed by the average reliability of components across the entire industry today. There's really no brand I'm particularly afraid of. Anyone who gets too far outside the industry reliability standards simply can't survive with today's level of global competition.
Where I've set myself up for surprises is getting a car loaded with all the gizmos. There are just so many more things that can fail on a loaded luxury car than on say a base Corolla. I think mine has every option but the seat memories, rear seat heaters, distronic cruise control, and iPod adapter. But that's OK, I'm going in with my eyes open and I can easily afford the maintenance and repairs.
I have been owning European cars for the last twenty years and I know enough about myself. I totally hated two of my cars at the tail end of the ownership after they put me through the "money pit decision" process. My another half wasn't helping my case either by keep asking where the money went....
01-22-2013, 02:20 PM
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R500 + SLK55 AMG
xxGenericSNxx
No, not at all. It's just that a service contract is a total crap shoot. I could pay $3,200 and it would cover me for another 2 years beyond my CPO warranty which will probably get me to about 44,000 miles. So the extended coverage would take over from 44,000 out to about 60,000 miles in my case.
The question I'm wrestling with is whether I'm likely to see any major repairs in that 24 months and 16,000 miles. That's a fairly narrow window partly because I don't put a lot of miles on this car. And keep in mind, my car has had a lot of stuff already fixed under warranty. Two front air struts, air compressor, power steering pump, valve cover gaskets, transmission valve body, rear hatch lock, sunroof, tail light fix.
It seems like most of the common failure modes have been addressed on my car. I've not found any recurring failures related to the W113 E50 engine in the R500 unlike the well documented 3.5L camshaft problem. Nor are there consistent reports of problems with the differentials or suspension or the cooling system or the exhaust system. That leaves the electrical stuff. And again, I'm not seeing any consistent failure patterns except the tail light design issue which has already been corrected. Just random stuff.
Also, my car has new tires, new brakes, new battery, new fluids, new wiper blades.
It's been helpful hearing other people's experience with the car and different levels of risk tolerance. It looks like mine is a bit higher than most, that's all.
I think I'm going to pass on the CPO 2 year extension. I'll reassess near the end of my first year when the CPO 1 year warranty is nearing expiration and look at an aftermarket warranty if it seems prudent.
No, not at all. It's just that a service contract is a total crap shoot. I could pay $3,200 and it would cover me for another 2 years beyond my CPO warranty which will probably get me to about 44,000 miles. So the extended coverage would take over from 44,000 out to about 60,000 miles in my case.
The question I'm wrestling with is whether I'm likely to see any major repairs in that 24 months and 16,000 miles. That's a fairly narrow window partly because I don't put a lot of miles on this car. And keep in mind, my car has had a lot of stuff already fixed under warranty. Two front air struts, air compressor, power steering pump, valve cover gaskets, transmission valve body, rear hatch lock, sunroof, tail light fix.
It seems like most of the common failure modes have been addressed on my car. I've not found any recurring failures related to the W113 E50 engine in the R500 unlike the well documented 3.5L camshaft problem. Nor are there consistent reports of problems with the differentials or suspension or the cooling system or the exhaust system. That leaves the electrical stuff. And again, I'm not seeing any consistent failure patterns except the tail light design issue which has already been corrected. Just random stuff.
Also, my car has new tires, new brakes, new battery, new fluids, new wiper blades.
It's been helpful hearing other people's experience with the car and different levels of risk tolerance. It looks like mine is a bit higher than most, that's all.
I think I'm going to pass on the CPO 2 year extension. I'll reassess near the end of my first year when the CPO 1 year warranty is nearing expiration and look at an aftermarket warranty if it seems prudent.
Last edited by Spud_Racer; 01-22-2013 at 02:22 PM.
01-22-2013, 02:29 PM
#41
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R500 + SLK55 AMG
I think as long as you can stick with your plan after being hit by couple $3K to $6K repair bills without bailing out your 10 years plan, you should be fine.
I have been owning European cars for the last twenty years and I know enough about myself. I totally hated two of my cars at the tail end of the ownership after they put me through the "money pit decision" process. My another half wasn't helping my case either by keep asking where the money went....
I have been owning European cars for the last twenty years and I know enough about myself. I totally hated two of my cars at the tail end of the ownership after they put me through the "money pit decision" process. My another half wasn't helping my case either by keep asking where the money went....
So far, my AMG is 8 years old (40,000 miles) and I haven't dropped a dime on it beyond normal maintenance, a custom tune, and a supercharger pulley. The plan is for that one to be around for 100,000 miles also. And oh yeah, no extended warranty. Flying without a net.
01-22-2013, 02:49 PM
#42
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We have to step back for a second and notice the irony of the discussion.
If we were really all that concerned about the costs vs. depreciation and repairs we would all be driving Toyotas or similar. Like Super, this is not my first rodeo, I've been through the European luxury car long term ownership before. We are all going through this experience in an emotional bases, not strictly dollars and cents.
Two other points. First, I think we could all agree that the extended warranty companies are in business to make money. Unless they miscalculate or mis-estimate the average repairs for a given car model we will not come out ahead unless we have far greater than average repairs.
The other point is that a number of people on these forums (not necessarily people posting in this thread) save up their money and buy a used Mercedes at a great bargain and fail to budget for the much higher maintenance costs and cost of repairs for the car. If something expensive happens they really have a hard time paying for the unexpected costs. I just had my R350 serviced last week and the normal 40k mile service including transmission flush and service was around $800. I had expected that amount and was not surprised.
If we were really all that concerned about the costs vs. depreciation and repairs we would all be driving Toyotas or similar. Like Super, this is not my first rodeo, I've been through the European luxury car long term ownership before. We are all going through this experience in an emotional bases, not strictly dollars and cents.
Two other points. First, I think we could all agree that the extended warranty companies are in business to make money. Unless they miscalculate or mis-estimate the average repairs for a given car model we will not come out ahead unless we have far greater than average repairs.
The other point is that a number of people on these forums (not necessarily people posting in this thread) save up their money and buy a used Mercedes at a great bargain and fail to budget for the much higher maintenance costs and cost of repairs for the car. If something expensive happens they really have a hard time paying for the unexpected costs. I just had my R350 serviced last week and the normal 40k mile service including transmission flush and service was around $800. I had expected that amount and was not surprised.
01-22-2013, 03:03 PM
#43
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I guess I didn't fully finish that last thought. People on a budget might be better buying an extended warranty if a very high but rare cost might be more than they can easily come up with. No one wants to fork over for an unexpected $7000 repair, but some of us can come up with it and some can't.
Last edited by gforaker; 01-22-2013 at 03:06 PM.
01-22-2013, 03:27 PM
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Yeah, I guess it's perspective. I don't consider $800 for a major service milestone any big deal. It's not really far out of line with other manufacturer's service schedules. I have always had all of our vehicles maintained by authorized dealers on the manufacturer's schedule to date. And I've never really felt that I didn't get good value for my service dollars. Our cars (knock on wood) have never given us any real problems.
This may actually be the first car I take to an independent. But that's only because I've only recently found an Indy shop run by a great guy with top notch mechanics. These guys are sharp. If my rear balloons pop outside the CPO warranty, I'll have them replaced with Arnott bags by these guys.
They are the only ones I let touch my tires and wheels. Especially on the AMG.
This may actually be the first car I take to an independent. But that's only because I've only recently found an Indy shop run by a great guy with top notch mechanics. These guys are sharp. If my rear balloons pop outside the CPO warranty, I'll have them replaced with Arnott bags by these guys.
They are the only ones I let touch my tires and wheels. Especially on the AMG.
01-22-2013, 06:14 PM
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xxGenericSNxx
No, not at all. It's just that a service contract is a total crap shoot. I could pay $3,200 and it would cover me for another 2 years beyond my CPO warranty which will probably get me to about 44,000 miles. So the extended coverage would take over from 44,000 out to about 60,000 miles in my case.
The question I'm wrestling with is whether I'm likely to see any major repairs in that 24 months and 16,000 miles. That's a fairly narrow window partly because I don't put a lot of miles on this car. And keep in mind, my car has had a lot of stuff already fixed under warranty. Two front air struts, air compressor, power steering pump, valve cover gaskets, transmission valve body, rear hatch lock, sunroof, tail light fix.
It seems like most of the common failure modes have been addressed on my car. I've not found any recurring failures related to the W113 E50 engine in the R500 unlike the well documented 3.5L camshaft problem. Nor are there consistent reports of problems with the differentials or suspension or the cooling system or the exhaust system. That leaves the electrical stuff. And again, I'm not seeing any consistent failure patterns except the tail light design issue which has already been corrected. Just random stuff.
Also, my car has new tires, new brakes, new battery, new fluids, new wiper blades.
It's been helpful hearing other people's experience with the car and different levels of risk tolerance. It looks like mine is a bit higher than most, that's all.
I think I'm going to pass on the CPO 2 year extension. I'll reassess near the end of my first year when the CPO 1 year warranty is nearing expiration and look at an aftermarket warranty if it seems prudent.
No, not at all. It's just that a service contract is a total crap shoot. I could pay $3,200 and it would cover me for another 2 years beyond my CPO warranty which will probably get me to about 44,000 miles. So the extended coverage would take over from 44,000 out to about 60,000 miles in my case.
The question I'm wrestling with is whether I'm likely to see any major repairs in that 24 months and 16,000 miles. That's a fairly narrow window partly because I don't put a lot of miles on this car. And keep in mind, my car has had a lot of stuff already fixed under warranty. Two front air struts, air compressor, power steering pump, valve cover gaskets, transmission valve body, rear hatch lock, sunroof, tail light fix.
It seems like most of the common failure modes have been addressed on my car. I've not found any recurring failures related to the W113 E50 engine in the R500 unlike the well documented 3.5L camshaft problem. Nor are there consistent reports of problems with the differentials or suspension or the cooling system or the exhaust system. That leaves the electrical stuff. And again, I'm not seeing any consistent failure patterns except the tail light design issue which has already been corrected. Just random stuff.
Also, my car has new tires, new brakes, new battery, new fluids, new wiper blades.
It's been helpful hearing other people's experience with the car and different levels of risk tolerance. It looks like mine is a bit higher than most, that's all.
I think I'm going to pass on the CPO 2 year extension. I'll reassess near the end of my first year when the CPO 1 year warranty is nearing expiration and look at an aftermarket warranty if it seems prudent.
2 front airmatic struts (common)
2 rear airmatic struts (common)
Airmatic compressor (common)
Front differential (common)
Acceleration Padel
Steering Pump Reservoir Leaking (common)
Left Front Axle
Right Front Axle
Transmission Conductor Plate (common)
Engine Gasket Leaking (common)
Left and Right Automatic Folding Mirrors (common)
Rear Light Harness (common)
Crane Sensor
CV Boots (common)
I am pretty sure I am missing some smaller items. The dealer cost is about $15K and they failed between the car at 50K-84K miles. The craziest part of all this is I don't even have experienced one major failure. Engine and transmission are totally intact. These issues are supposed to be small problems but fixing them mean high repair cost.
Last edited by supernsx; 01-22-2013 at 06:23 PM.
01-22-2013, 06:43 PM
#46
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R500 + SLK55 AMG
To lessen your future surprises, here is the list of problems (some of them are common among R-class) that my car had AFTER my factory warranty:
2 front airmatic struts (common)
2 rear airmatic struts (common)
Airmatic compressor (common)
Front differential (common)
Acceleration Padel
Steering Pump Reservoir Leaking (common)
Left Front Axle
Right Front Axle
Transmission Conductor Plate (common)
Engine Gasket Leaking (common)
Left and Right Automatic Folding Mirrors (common)
Rear Light Harness (common)
Crane Sensor
CV Boots (common)
I am pretty sure I am missing some smaller items. The dealer cost is about $15K and they failed between the car at 50K-84K miles. The craziest part of all this is I don't even have experienced one major failure. Engine and transmission are totally intact. These issues are supposed to be small problems but fixing them mean high repair cost.
2 front airmatic struts (common)
2 rear airmatic struts (common)
Airmatic compressor (common)
Front differential (common)
Acceleration Padel
Steering Pump Reservoir Leaking (common)
Left Front Axle
Right Front Axle
Transmission Conductor Plate (common)
Engine Gasket Leaking (common)
Left and Right Automatic Folding Mirrors (common)
Rear Light Harness (common)
Crane Sensor
CV Boots (common)
I am pretty sure I am missing some smaller items. The dealer cost is about $15K and they failed between the car at 50K-84K miles. The craziest part of all this is I don't even have experienced one major failure. Engine and transmission are totally intact. These issues are supposed to be small problems but fixing them mean high repair cost.
As noted earlier............
2 front airmatic struts (common) ALREADY DONE
Airmatic compressor (common) ALREADY DONE
Steering Pump Reservoir Leaking (common) ALREADY DONE
Transmission Conductor Plate (common) [ALREADY DONE + valve body
Engine Gasket Leaking (common) ALREADY DONE valve cover gaskets left + right
Rear Light Harness (common) ALREADY DONE
Not yet encountered..........
2 rear airmatic struts (common) $350 each from Arnott + an hour's labor. Not scared.
Front differential (common) OK, this one would hurt
Acceleration Pedal Probably done during CPO process, dealer didn't mention. But really, replace a bolt, not scared
Left Front Axle Another one that would hurt
Right Front Axle Another one that would hurt
Left and Right Automatic Folding Mirrors (common) Hmm, don't think my car has these. Forgot about those. But N/A
Crane Sensor How much?
CV Boots (common) Meh, maintenance item. I'd replace them before 84,000 anyway.
Not on your list.....
The frame assembly for the panoramic roof was replaced. The service records note corrosion was the reason.
Sealing ring, rear - crankshaft replaced
They replaced the wheel bolts - corrosion / oxidation noted. Ya gotta be kidding me.
They replaced the bloody rubber pads on the pedals
New windshield as part of CPO reconditioning - chip in glass noted
Last edited by Spud_Racer; 01-22-2013 at 07:55 PM.
01-22-2013, 07:45 PM
#47
Super Member
Spud_Racer,
You got a good deal on your R500.
Mine 08 R350 warranty just expired this month and refused to buy the extended warranty 7yrs/100,000 miles for $3200.
I bought it new in 2008 (70 miles on odometer) for low $40,000 with $10000 discount from the list price and the dealer also gave me 5 years /100K miles extended warranty.
I have a few more months to pay it off and currently has less than 25,000 miles on odometer. So far, I have no problem with my vehicle. All the recalls is up to date according to my buddy SA who gets a bottle of wine from me every Xmas. ( Camshaft sensor harnesses done last month)
You got a good deal on your R500.
Mine 08 R350 warranty just expired this month and refused to buy the extended warranty 7yrs/100,000 miles for $3200.
I bought it new in 2008 (70 miles on odometer) for low $40,000 with $10000 discount from the list price and the dealer also gave me 5 years /100K miles extended warranty.
I have a few more months to pay it off and currently has less than 25,000 miles on odometer. So far, I have no problem with my vehicle. All the recalls is up to date according to my buddy SA who gets a bottle of wine from me every Xmas. ( Camshaft sensor harnesses done last month)
Last edited by AsianR350; 01-22-2013 at 07:51 PM.
01-22-2013, 08:10 PM
#48
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R500 + SLK55 AMG
AsianR350
You're more stingy with the miles than me. Sounds like the R350 could be a long term car for you if you want to keep it. That $10,000 incentive was a sweet deal while they offered it! It's good to hear someone with a normal experience with this car. Everyone seems scared to death of it on this forum.
And thanks. I know I probably paid a price in the upper range for the R500 but I liked the fact that it was a CPO 1 owner car being offered from a premium dealer who originally sold it and did all the service. And it has the one year CPO protection for me to sort out any remaining problems.
I'm loving it so far! Two ski trips to date. This thing is the ultimate highway cruiser.
You're more stingy with the miles than me. Sounds like the R350 could be a long term car for you if you want to keep it. That $10,000 incentive was a sweet deal while they offered it! It's good to hear someone with a normal experience with this car. Everyone seems scared to death of it on this forum.
And thanks. I know I probably paid a price in the upper range for the R500 but I liked the fact that it was a CPO 1 owner car being offered from a premium dealer who originally sold it and did all the service. And it has the one year CPO protection for me to sort out any remaining problems.
I'm loving it so far! Two ski trips to date. This thing is the ultimate highway cruiser.
Last edited by Spud_Racer; 01-22-2013 at 08:19 PM.
01-22-2013, 08:40 PM
#49
Super Member
AsianR350
You're more stingy with the miles than me. Sounds like the R350 could be a long term car for you if you want to keep it. That $10,000 incentive was a sweet deal while they offered it! It's good to hear someone with a normal experience with this car. Everyone seems scared to death of it on this forum.
And thanks. I know I probably paid a price in the upper range for the R500 but I liked the fact that it was a CPO 1 owner car being offered from a premium dealer who originally sold it and did all the service. And it has the one year CPO protection for me to sort out any remaining problems.
I'm loving it so far! Two ski trips to date. This thing is the ultimate highway cruiser.
You're more stingy with the miles than me. Sounds like the R350 could be a long term car for you if you want to keep it. That $10,000 incentive was a sweet deal while they offered it! It's good to hear someone with a normal experience with this car. Everyone seems scared to death of it on this forum.
And thanks. I know I probably paid a price in the upper range for the R500 but I liked the fact that it was a CPO 1 owner car being offered from a premium dealer who originally sold it and did all the service. And it has the one year CPO protection for me to sort out any remaining problems.
I'm loving it so far! Two ski trips to date. This thing is the ultimate highway cruiser.
My other 2 cars have around 150,000 +miles and have no problem at all.(not mercedes brand). My fourth car is 07 Acura RL and it has 50,000 miles and just needs basic maintainance only such as oil changes etc...
P.S.: Time will tell how long and how reliable of my 08 R350 that I am going to keep.
Last edited by AsianR350; 01-22-2013 at 08:48 PM.
01-22-2013, 10:27 PM
#50
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2011 C300 4matic, 2015 Porsche Macan S, 2006 R500 (sold)
From your list.....
As noted earlier............
2 front airmatic struts (common) ALREADY DONE
Airmatic compressor (common) ALREADY DONE
Steering Pump Reservoir Leaking (common) ALREADY DONE
Transmission Conductor Plate (common) [ALREADY DONE + valve body
Engine Gasket Leaking (common) ALREADY DONE valve cover gaskets left + right
Rear Light Harness (common) ALREADY DONE
Not yet encountered..........
2 rear airmatic struts (common) $350 each from Arnott + an hour's labor. Not scared.
Front differential (common) OK, this one would hurt
Acceleration Pedal Probably done during CPO process, dealer didn't mention. But really, replace a bolt, not scared
Left Front Axle Another one that would hurt
Right Front Axle Another one that would hurt
Left and Right Automatic Folding Mirrors (common) Hmm, don't think my car has these. Forgot about those. But N/A
Crane Sensor How much?
CV Boots (common) Meh, maintenance item. I'd replace them before 84,000 anyway.
Not on your list.....
The frame assembly for the panoramic roof was replaced. The service records note corrosion was the reason.
Sealing ring, rear - crankshaft replaced
They replaced the wheel bolts - corrosion / oxidation noted. Ya gotta be kidding me.
They replaced the bloody rubber pads on the pedals
New windshield as part of CPO reconditioning - chip in glass noted
As noted earlier............
2 front airmatic struts (common) ALREADY DONE
Airmatic compressor (common) ALREADY DONE
Steering Pump Reservoir Leaking (common) ALREADY DONE
Transmission Conductor Plate (common) [ALREADY DONE + valve body
Engine Gasket Leaking (common) ALREADY DONE valve cover gaskets left + right
Rear Light Harness (common) ALREADY DONE
Not yet encountered..........
2 rear airmatic struts (common) $350 each from Arnott + an hour's labor. Not scared.
Front differential (common) OK, this one would hurt
Acceleration Pedal Probably done during CPO process, dealer didn't mention. But really, replace a bolt, not scared
Left Front Axle Another one that would hurt
Right Front Axle Another one that would hurt
Left and Right Automatic Folding Mirrors (common) Hmm, don't think my car has these. Forgot about those. But N/A
Crane Sensor How much?
CV Boots (common) Meh, maintenance item. I'd replace them before 84,000 anyway.
Not on your list.....
The frame assembly for the panoramic roof was replaced. The service records note corrosion was the reason.
Sealing ring, rear - crankshaft replaced
They replaced the wheel bolts - corrosion / oxidation noted. Ya gotta be kidding me.
They replaced the bloody rubber pads on the pedals
New windshield as part of CPO reconditioning - chip in glass noted
Purely a curve ball and I really don't believe it will be that bad. If I use the logic of your car failing these items before hitting 36K miles, have you thought about all of these items can fail again before your ten years ownership is up. Except the rear light harness, I don't believe MB has made any improvement on those parts.
