CLK500 TWINS

yes, that is the same one that I pulled up according to the Mercedes part number indicated on their parts diagram. Still not certain why based on my vin, they say that part does not apply to my car. It's my understanding that most fuel injected cars have this sensor.

Do you know where this would be located on my car? I was doing some digging, but all I found was the CL55- its attached to the throttle body.

amstel78

Strange. From what I understand, some of our cars have MAF and MAP, or just MAF and no MAP. Wish I could help you out with a location if your car does indeed have a MAP sensor but I don't know anything about the engines in the S55. Maybe send a PM to Plutoe or ItalianJoe who can take your vin and run it through SDS. They might be able to tell you if your car has one and where it's located.

amstel78

BTW, does your car have a supercharger?

Edit: found some resources online that might help you troubleshoot.
1. Wiring harness
2. Mercedes Benz EPC Type W220 220 Information

For link #2, notice there are several different options for the S55. One with kompressor, the other without.

CLK500 TWINS

I'm going to try giving the dealer parts department a call to see if they can assist, because you have sparked my curiosity. Could it have literally been down to a bad or inaccurate parts diagram.

My car does not have a supercharger

amstel78

If no supercharger, then the MAP sensor location should be near the front. It's number 86 in the diagram:
http://mb-teilekatalog.info/view_Sub...=14&subgrp=105

CLK500 TWINS

Mercedes parts department just confirmed, after some coercion- it does go in my car, somewhere on the manifold. He could not confirm where.

CLK500 TWINS

I dont have any better pictures of my engine compartment, but I can personally attest to the fact that there is no map sensor located anywhere near where it is in the image you supplied.

So if this is the case, in what situation would one want to remove this part. Its cheap to replace at $40

amstel78

I can't imagine any scenario for removing a map sensor and just leaving it off. That makes absolutely no sense to me.

Does this look like your engine with the covers off?


If so, then the map sensor should be directly to the lower left of the secondary air injection pump that's highlighted in green and is to the right of the vacuum solenoid.

tusabes

Lift up the front black plastic air cleaner panel on top of your engine , the map sensor should be immediately visible in the left side


I am sure those are factory connectors and I bet this car had an engine swap from a different model/year car , which is why there are unplugged harnesses with no where to go

i seriously doubt they have anything to do with modifications or a tune . Any engine from a 1997 to 2006 e class or s class 430, 500 can fit in this car and run (not well , but it will run) . I'm betting you have an engine swap from an incorrect year car

as I've said numerous times it will be so costly for a shop to put this car back together correctly , and I am assuming you bought this car cheap with problems , you should just try the work around to make it run

CLK500 TWINS

I just saw this with a refresh from earlier. Thank you, this is great! I'm having a hard time pin pointing which plugs may be the ones I am seeing though, as the schematics are a bit complicated. I have the 22.173, running the m113 engine, manufactured in Germany. I do not have the build date, as the car is still in the shop, I cant obtain it right now

CLK500 TWINS

This is exactly what my engine looks like with the air box removed, albeit, a tad dirtier. I heard back from the repair shop this afternoon, mounts are done andI was told that they found a number of vacuum leaks. I've had trained ears listen, and trained eyes look and my untrained ears have listened and I've looked. I always suspected it as a possibility, but there was so much under the hood that cant be seen. They asked for my permission in moving forward to take apart the manifold and replace all the vacuum lines and gaskets, I agreed - obviously. He indicated that they looked original and they were dry rotted and brittle when moved.

I did tell him about the map sensor and he said he would have the tech look into it. I can certainly say, I am missing mine if that is where it should be. Thank good ness it's only a $40 sensor.

Tusabes, your help is always appreciated and your opinion is respected, but I have to disagree with you here. The car was well maintained until recent, 16 years later still having its original documents, fuse charts, spare and tool kit. Along with a card from a German repair shop in NJ. The original owner had it for 10+ years and only let it go after the abc had completely failed. He added the tv's with a very dated (now) set-up. I am aware of the movement after that, as well as the fact that the young guy I bought it from seemed to attempt to do his own work- receipts for filters and such throughout the last year found in the car.

The vin can be checked as it should be on the engine if Im not mistaken, I will ask them tomorrow. The only conclusion I can come to is that he tried to work out whatever issues with limited money and resources, possibly taking the sensor out to take it to go get another one. Maybe he even installed the new one to find it didn't help, given the fact that the MAF was bad, the vacuum lines are apparently disintegrating and the tv's were creating a parasitic draw. He may have pulled it out to return it and just said screw it. Then I bought it.

I got a great deal on the car and I bought it knowing that I'd be in for a ride and prepared to drop some money into some former negligence and/or ignorance. I love these cars, I don't want it to just run, I want it to be the arrogant and unapologetic machine it was meant to be. As frustrated as I get with the brick walls I some times run into, I rather enjoy the challenge and I love to learn.

tusabes

The reason I suspect it's had an engine swap is there is no other reason all those connectors would be disconnected , only when you remove an engine do you disconnect all that stuff

and the fact there is nowhere to plug that stuff back in , It suggests it was not replaced with a matching engine , but rather the cheapest similar engine they could find that would fit - and any 430 or 500 engine will fit

but yes , check the engine serial number - if it's not the right engine you'll know before proceeding further whether it's even possible to bring it all back to original or whether it's always going to be jury-rigged to run

CLK500 TWINS

Okay, car is back in my possession and I am soooo extremely happy that this ordeal is over. I just wish I had of taken it to them 2 months ago. The vacuum lines and gaskets were replaced, mounts replaced and map sensor was installed (Amstel, and you originally said you couldnt help me ). According to them, Tusabes -engine is original. It's dark and I haven't popped the hood yet, but I plan on it to see if these plugs are now connected and what they are connected to.

The car runs so well that things I didnt even know were wrong are better, like the start-up and the running noise. She starts so quietly and quickly, makes absolutely no noise, no vibration in any gear, no surging, acceleration is fun and flawless, gear changing and kick down is no longer felt at all. They did wonderful work and it runs 100 times better than I could have ever imagined it would. Total price was far less then even the 1700 Mercedes wanted for just the mounts.

Thank you gentleman for all your time, education and assistance.

Until we speak again.

amstel78

That's great! I'm very happy that you got everything sorted out. Now go forth and enjoy that awesome car of yours! I know you're gonna have a good weekend.

Personally, I was hoping to do some work on my S65 tomorrow. I was planning on driving up from Manhattan to my house in PA and replacing the IC pump, but there's too much snow and salt on the ground up north now and I've got summer tires on the car. Oh well. I guess I'll play some video games with the kids.

Best,
James

CLK500 TWINS

I most certainly will, although I may not know what to do with myself. I may need a new project . Yes, the weather here has been so fickle, having been 65 degrees yesterday and almost 50 last night. Waking up to snow and lower 30's. That's NY for you. I lived in the Pocono's for a while actually and moved back to good ol' commerce driven NY this winter. I heard PA got hit much harder then we did here.

Well you enjoy your weekend as well, again thank you for your assistance. I would have never resisted the MAP possibility being that my parts diagram had me believing my car didn't have one.

CLK500 TWINS

It was a blissful 36 hours. Started her up this afternoon and the first thing I noticed was that it kind of rocked to the right when it fired. (never had this happen, but chocked it up to the low temperatures). About 20 minutes into my drive the CEL reared its ugly head. Mind you car is still driving beautifully. I went where I was going, hoping it was from the 02 sensor readiness monitors still not being ready but the computer still holding that code. On the drive back, it remained on, and now I have a strange metallic noise when I accelerate from a full stop. It's only when I first tap the gas, it stops as I continue to accelerate or remove my foot. Similar to sound of something being caught or dragging but nothing that I can see.

Stopped and had code read- p0432 Main Catalyst Efficiency Below Threshold Bank 2

Did they screw something up? Something loose? I cant see how I went in for MAF codes and left with Cat codes

amstel78

Well I guess the celebration was short lived. If it's not one thing, it's something else. Murphy's law I suppose.

With a P0432 code, that could mean several things; the worst being the cat has gone bad. Second, perhaps the O2 sensor on that bank decided to throw in the towel. If I'm not mistaken, P0432 is for the left bank. If you have a code reader that can show live data, check the signal coming from both banks. If the left bank O2 sensor isn't reading, or is giving off data that's a lot different than the other, then replace that sensor first. It's probably fouled or failed. Those sensors aren't that expensive and is a relatively easy fix if the car is on a lift.

It's also probable that the shop disconnected the sensor at some point during the repairs, and forgot to plug it back in. I've seen it happen before. Maybe that dragging sound is the O2 sensor flopping around underneath? Have you looked under the car to see if anything is loose?

How many miles on your car?

CLK500 TWINS

Yes, short lived indeed. I am bringing it back to them this morning so they can inspect it or their work. From what I can tell, nothing is hanging low enough to see. There is no getting under it without at least jacking it up.

It has 134 and change. Ive read bad gas, as well as the map sensor can have something to do with this. I wonder if some extra calibration is required with the addition of the missing map.

When they returned it to me they infotmed me that all the monitors were ready except the 02 sensors and that I would need to put more mileage on it for these to reset.

I may be crazy, but I can almost hear what sounds like a hissing beneath the car. Definitely from the under carriage, not the engine. These are all issues I didnt hqve prior though.

Im not hearing the quintessential "marbles in a can," no rotten egg smell, normal exhaust smell, no black soot like residue from the tailpipe.

I certainly hope its not the cat, if infact it turns out to be. Can you provide some insight on how the magnaflow works. Ive done some minor research and found many have used this as an alternative to cat replacement. Some even deleting the cats, but that's illegal here in NY.

amstel78

The car's probably in the shop by now, but as they replaced a whole bunch of things such as vacuum lines and the MAP sensor, I was going to suggest clearing all DTCs and driving it a bit more. If the CEL comes back with the same error, then I'd start looking first at the O2 sensor(s). It would be helpful as I detailed earlier, to see if the O2 sensor on the left bank was giving the same or different readings as the one on the opposite bank. If it is, then I'd start by replacing that first.

With regards to the Magnaflow cat, it functions the same as the OEM one; the difference being the flow restriction. It should flow more than the factory units. Swapping is straight forward and can be done by any competent exhaust technician. Deleting cats is another story. I had them deleted on my 2012 Golf TDI that had a Malone stage II tune and DD turbo downpipe. Tuning was required to tell the ECU not to poll the downstream missing O2 sensor. The same would be required for our cars. That's a moot point however as you'd at the very least fail a visual inspection in NYS.

CLK500 TWINS

Yes, well I did take it back to them and they told me that my left cats were deteriorating inside and the right rear was on it's way out. The noise I was hearing was due to missing bolts between the transmission and exhaust. They claimed the car never had them prior to the transmission mount being done, but I still had to question why they weren't replaced when it was.

They did clear the code and I did go to get a second opinion from my guy, who referred me to an exhaust guy he is friendly with. They were unable to pull any codes, but took the information from my vehicle and told me that if the light came back it likely a valid code. About 45 minutes later, the light came back on. They only do aftermarket, he recommended Catco or Magnaflow, they are going to call me when they get the right prices as he recommends I do both sides now.

The Euro tuning and repair shop's very rude advisor told me that HE wasn't doing Magnaflow on this car. Only OEM, because Magnaflow is too risky- it's 6-7 hours in labor and there's a chance it may not work. He'll only do OEM. I didn't like him at all, he was a tool with a major attitude. The exhaust shop seems to believe that there should be no issue using Magnaflow and it will be about 2 hours labor time.

Are you familiar with how these cars fare with the Magnaflow cats. Id hate to spend the money only to turn around and have to do OEM anyway.

amstel78

That's why I asked how many miles were on the clock. It's probable that the cats were on the way out given that you had 134k+ on the odometer. It could be coincidental that the left cat happened to fail right after you had major repairs done. Then again, maybe not. Who's to say at this point?

Did you happen to get a live readout of the O2 sensors while the engine was at temp and running? Perhaps not based on your last post.

Anyway, if it were the cats... and you decided to go with an aftermarket solution, replacements should be straightforward. As long as the cats/pipes have the same O2 sensor bungs in place, and the sensors themselves are OK, then a simple swap should suffice. You may have to drive the car for a few cycles afterwards for the ECU to adapt but afterwards, should be clear of any DTC codes.

Unfortunately I don't have anything specific to add regarding Magnaflow catalytic converters and W220 vehicles, but a cat is a cat is cat. It's not rocket science as long as the ECU knows its there because the oxygen sensors respond accordingly. Just because it's a Mercedes doesn't mean they made their factory parts out of unobtanium that only their ECUs recognize.

BTW, as for the shop manager refusing to do Magnaflow... most likely because he knows you know the price, and can't mark it up to make a profit. Maybe I'm wrong, but that's how I see it. Magnaflow has been around a long time, and have been making third party OE and factory solutions that have worked for countless people. He shouldn't have been rude to you though. You being a paying customer, there's no excuse for that kind of service.

If I were you, I'd start by just replacing the O2 sensors on the left bank first then clearing DTC codes if they exist. Drive a few cycles. If it returns, then investigate the possibility of replacing the cats. Take it somewhere like Midas muffler because a cat is a cat is a cat. They should be able to weld or clamp new ones in without any issues.

Worst case solution: hollow out the cat bodies you have now and get the ECU tuned to ignore the O2 sensors. You'll pass a visual, but if NYS sticks a probe up the tail pipe, then I dunno. Just saying for the sake of discussion. Don't quote me on that.

P.S. missing bolts between the tranny and exhaust? What bolts? If they were missing, that sound would've been present when you first bought the car. That's why I don't trust mechanics I don't know to work on my ride, and would rather do repairs myself if I can. Just saying...

amstel78

One other thing... there's always Victor. You could get a second diagnosis from him and drop the car off and take the LIRR back up. It's a PITA for sure, but I'm pretty certain he could get you squared away since these cars is all is specializes in.

CLK500 TWINS

Unfortunately I did not get a live read on the 02 sensors, I didn't even ask if they had done them. They were very certain that it was my cat. From what I read about the code, it is almost always the cat, only occasionally will replacing 02 sensors cure the issue and normally if it's an 02 sensor, it will throw a code for the sensor as well.

I will say as much as I would love to believe that it's my sensors, anything but the cat's. I had noticed that sometimes it seemed my car barely put out any exhaust from and other times it seemed like it was excessive. Actually the day I brought it to my guy for the 2nd MAF installation, before I sent it in to the Euro repair and tuning shop. It seemed that anytime I was full throttle, when I'd come to a stop, I had this billow of white smoke behind me. I asked him about it when I got there, but he said it could be a number of things. When I spoke to him today he told me that the car was running rich when I got it, so it's a definite possibility.

Regarding the missing bolts, I've attached a picture I found online of what It is. It is the cross plate with the two bolts in it right before the transmission mount if your coming from the front of the car. I never heard the noise before Sunday, so Im certain my car wasn't missing it before they did the tranny mount. Human error happens, I even said this, just put it back or secure it correctly. However he took personal offense, as if he had done the work himself or they were some mechanical Gods among men whom don't make any mistakes. He insisted that my car didn't have it, he wasn't the advisor I dealt with, nor was he there when I dropped my car off. He told me he had to order the cross plate from Mercedes, he was trying to save me money. I'm looking at him like seriously?

At the end of the day, he brought the car around and told me he had managed to make it work. I'm not certain what that even means, I'm a little nervous to even find out when it's lifted again. They did good work, he was only an advisor. I would have been okay with the situation if they just rectified it rather then arguing their innocence. He may have refused to do Magnaflow simply because he had his panties in a twist with me. He also said it was a 6-7 hour job and the exhaust shop said 2 for both cats, so there is no way I would have them do it.

If they are going to hold up, then I see no reason to go any other way then Magnaflow. I mean putting gem cats on a 16 year old car for 4 grand is like putting breast implants on a 70 year old woman. Why?

As far as hollowing out the cat bodies? How does one go about doing this, who would I take it to? Yes, Victor is definitely an option, but it is a PITA to think of the transit, especially with the kids. I will see what the exhaust shop comes back talking about and if it seems too crazy, I will call him. I feel like they may just be clogged, I'm just not sure if this means total replacement or there is some kind of repair procedure. Perhaps I'm wrong though and they are truly bad, with no visible, audible or olfactible signs other than the occasional lack or excess of exhaust.

Now we have 4 cats in total? What I'm seeing from magnaflow is one front and one rear that both operate (according to site) at OE spec on left or right. So I'm looking at this cost x 4, plus extension pipes and installation? Just as a safe guesstimate?

CLK500 TWINS

Your in NY, are you eager for a project? Well, after this terrible blizzard we are expecting passes. lol. Stay safe.

CLK500 TWINS

I didnt draw these arrows. In this pic there are two thin cross plates with two bolts each. I saw one on my car that was missing, above the top set of arrows