1 in a million system failure
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Joined: Dec 2020
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W220 S500L
1 in a million system failure
Solved!
Hi!
I already have tried my own country mb-forum and didnt solve the problem. Had the problem for two winters.
when its under 0celsius cold my car starts doing weird things untill it warms up well. These problems only occurs when its cold. in summers the car works like a charm.
the problems and malfunctions
-central locking doesnt work. (i need to use the metal key)
-when motor started i can remove the key and car still keeps running until it either warms up or i remove the battery key and give a littlebit gas so ite turns off. (engine sometimes keep running when i take the battery cable off)
-when motor started only functions that work is, climate control `REST` button, gas pedal, brake pedal, gearshifter, steering wheel (not the buttons). everything else is dark.
-it gives about 4 malfunctions. Airmatic,ABS,BAS.
-after littlebit of warming up it starts kind of working but every light that is in buttons is flashing and the buttons only work when the light flashes on. (lights 1second off 1second on)
-when fully warmed up it works normally.
-warming process might take different time depending on the weather condition. -5c about 10min, -10c about 20 to 30 min.
i hope somebody had this same problem and could help me but i dont think so becouse i have never heard of this kind of problem.
Hi!
I already have tried my own country mb-forum and didnt solve the problem. Had the problem for two winters.
when its under 0celsius cold my car starts doing weird things untill it warms up well. These problems only occurs when its cold. in summers the car works like a charm.
the problems and malfunctions
-central locking doesnt work. (i need to use the metal key)
-when motor started i can remove the key and car still keeps running until it either warms up or i remove the battery key and give a littlebit gas so ite turns off. (engine sometimes keep running when i take the battery cable off)
-when motor started only functions that work is, climate control `REST` button, gas pedal, brake pedal, gearshifter, steering wheel (not the buttons). everything else is dark.
-it gives about 4 malfunctions. Airmatic,ABS,BAS.
-after littlebit of warming up it starts kind of working but every light that is in buttons is flashing and the buttons only work when the light flashes on. (lights 1second off 1second on)
-when fully warmed up it works normally.
-warming process might take different time depending on the weather condition. -5c about 10min, -10c about 20 to 30 min.
i hope somebody had this same problem and could help me but i dont think so becouse i have never heard of this kind of problem.
Last edited by M4S7ER; Dec 27, 2020 at 05:48 PM.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 2,473
Likes: 439
From: Ball Ground, GA (N of Atlanta)
2003 S500 2007 GL450
My first guess is that there is an electrical connection that fails when it gets very cold, or an electronic component that fails when it gets very cold.
Trouble-shooting this looks difficult. I think that I would start by doing some maintenance that might or might not help, but probably should be done anyway.
- Disconnect the battery ground (earth) cable, and make sure that it can't slowly creep back into contact.
- Remove the trunk (boot) lining just forward of the battery and find the first main fuse. Disassemble the connection, clean and check, then reassemble.
- Remove the front right carpet, then the aluminum panel, exposing the main power connections. Disassemble and carefully check, clean and reassemble all connections, including the battery.
Wait a day or two, and see if the problem is gone. If not, you might need to do the same sort of disassemble, check and clean on all of the electrical connections in each of the three SAM units. Be certain to disconnect the battery first! Be absolutely certain to take many, many photos before and during the disassembly operations.
Good luck!
Trouble-shooting this looks difficult. I think that I would start by doing some maintenance that might or might not help, but probably should be done anyway.
- Disconnect the battery ground (earth) cable, and make sure that it can't slowly creep back into contact.
- Remove the trunk (boot) lining just forward of the battery and find the first main fuse. Disassemble the connection, clean and check, then reassemble.
- Remove the front right carpet, then the aluminum panel, exposing the main power connections. Disassemble and carefully check, clean and reassemble all connections, including the battery.
Wait a day or two, and see if the problem is gone. If not, you might need to do the same sort of disassemble, check and clean on all of the electrical connections in each of the three SAM units. Be certain to disconnect the battery first! Be absolutely certain to take many, many photos before and during the disassembly operations.
Good luck!
Thread Starter
Newbie
Joined: Dec 2020
Posts: 9
Likes: 4
W220 S500L
Thank you. i will try this and report back here. hope this works. i already changed side mirror to new one becouse it was broken and the heating on it didnt work wich activates when its cold outside.
Member
Joined: Nov 2020
Posts: 129
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From: UK, RHD
Bicycle, 2004 c200k
I've seen a diagnosedan youtube video where it was found that when the ecu got warm, the engine didnt crank. He used a heatgun to prove his diagnosis. Would i myself go around heating the ecu / sam up with a heatgun? probably not because i'd get it too hot and destroy it lol but yeah, a 'trained professional' would have no problem heating things up.
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Mercedes
An electronic component failing when hot is very different than failing when cold
op says everything works perfectly when warm
the only problem is when it’s cold outside
and that’s usually due to a broken solder joint . Finding and tracing it will be the hard part
op says everything works perfectly when warm
the only problem is when it’s cold outside
and that’s usually due to a broken solder joint . Finding and tracing it will be the hard part
Member
Joined: Nov 2020
Posts: 129
Likes: 16
From: UK, RHD
Bicycle, 2004 c200k
I was suggesting something 'crazy' like this:
measure temperature of all the major components when the car is 'warm' and working fine with a temp gun.
- every 'sam'
- ecu
Bring each individual component to the 'working' temperature with a heat gun - and start the car , if your lucky you'll find that heating something up solves the issue - locates the problem
what if , when the cabin is hot, e.g. you put heaters on and some solder is getting warm from the cabin temperature? leave the car running with no heat going into the cabin... does the time that this issue fixes remain the same? longer? shorter? lol
*last suggestion would be to sell the car in the summer or pay for a professional diagnosis
measure temperature of all the major components when the car is 'warm' and working fine with a temp gun.
- every 'sam'
- ecu
Bring each individual component to the 'working' temperature with a heat gun - and start the car , if your lucky you'll find that heating something up solves the issue - locates the problem
what if , when the cabin is hot, e.g. you put heaters on and some solder is getting warm from the cabin temperature? leave the car running with no heat going into the cabin... does the time that this issue fixes remain the same? longer? shorter? lol
*last suggestion would be to sell the car in the summer or pay for a professional diagnosis
Last edited by DjaKRAbb; Dec 12, 2020 at 05:32 PM.
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MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 2,473
Likes: 439
From: Ball Ground, GA (N of Atlanta)
2003 S500 2007 GL450
It's not too rare to have the "cold solder joint" problem in the EIS (Electronic Ignition System - the main box in the dash with the key switch) - but that doesn't have any of the other symptoms that this car is showing, so the poor connection/faulty component is probably somewhere else.
Using a heat gun on the SAM units might be helpful, if going thru the main power points didn't help.
Using a heat gun on the SAM units might be helpful, if going thru the main power points didn't help.
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Member
Joined: Nov 2020
Posts: 129
Likes: 16
From: UK, RHD
Bicycle, 2004 c200k
Ohh EIS.. interesting. It's discussed a bit here https://www.benzworld.org/threads/co...1300215/page-5
which linked to an in-depth diagnosis/replacement of the EIS here https://w220.ee/WIS_80.57_Drive_Auth...ing_EIS_Module
(even has the s500L listed there)
"remove the key and car still keeps running " does indeed sound like a 'drive authorization' failure
The eis + ecu + key kits are available on ebay but.. needs a diagnosis first... try all the above recommended steps first
which linked to an in-depth diagnosis/replacement of the EIS here https://w220.ee/WIS_80.57_Drive_Auth...ing_EIS_Module
(even has the s500L listed there)
"remove the key and car still keeps running " does indeed sound like a 'drive authorization' failure
The eis + ecu + key kits are available on ebay but.. needs a diagnosis first... try all the above recommended steps first
Last edited by DjaKRAbb; Dec 12, 2020 at 08:51 PM.
Member
Joined: Nov 2020
Posts: 129
Likes: 16
From: UK, RHD
Bicycle, 2004 c200k
Could also be the cabin heating things up e.g. warm cabin = problem fixed = eis warmed up . who knows! goodluck!
Others online have taken to heating the eis up to try and solve issues
Others online have taken to heating the eis up to try and solve issues
I left it in the ignition and used a hair dryer on low heat warm-up the back of the key unit (through the fuse panel).
Within 45 seconds the ignition switch recognised the key and clicked and allowed me to turn it on.
Within 45 seconds the ignition switch recognised the key and clicked and allowed me to turn it on.
Last edited by DjaKRAbb; Dec 13, 2020 at 11:10 AM.
Thread Starter
Newbie
Joined: Dec 2020
Posts: 9
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W220 S500L
Today morning i tried heating things up. i opened 3 doors so the cold air gets in the car well. first i tried to heat the rear sam well. no response. i turned the key to off position. then i started to heat the key and the area around it. after about 40 seconds the car started to work normally. so is there moisture in the lock or is there some kind of wire that freezes and doesnt work. need to remember that the car starts but systems dont work.
Thread Starter
Newbie
Joined: Dec 2020
Posts: 9
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W220 S500L
Problem is solved!
EIS module is broken. the car didnt work with EIS module wich was frozen. i got it out and putted it in room temperature for a littlebit. when the module was warm i putted it back in the car and the car worked normally.
Thread Starter
Newbie
Joined: Dec 2020
Posts: 9
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W220 S500L
This microchip is the fault for the whole system. i dont know a lot about these electronic components but is it possible that the joints that connect to the board are bad or is the whole microchip broken. i have a guy who can do this replacement job but i dont know where to find these kind of chips.
