When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.
"If I prove my points....would you agree to leave this board forever and troll elsewhere?"
Good to know we agree your assertions are completely unsubstantiated.
Actually....no. It's easy to prove them. I'm just looking for a way to get you to leave....until you have something productive to provide to the forum.
I currently am running 20" Michelin Pilot AS-3's which I loveeee the performance, however I would not recommend this tire for snow conditions. Also on the 20" profile I have already replaced two due to damage from minor potholes, they definitely don't absorb road hazards all that well.
Those tires are probably OK with a very light snowfall....but you'll still have to be extra cautious on them. The low profile certainly doesn't help. My Hankooks are very similar to those AS-3's and I have them on 20" rims. I only use them as a 3 season wheel/tire package. I put dedicated snow tires on my OEM 18" wheels and swap them out in the winter. If you live in an area that receives a decent amount of snow and ice, you can't do better than running dedicated snow tires during the winter. You won't have to worry about white knuckle driving any more after that. Plus the tires stay pliable, even in below zero temps. The all-seasons are pretty hard below 20 degrees, making winter driving difficult, even on dry roads.
I read what you said earlier about only wanting to put "premium" tires on your S....while I don't buy into that premise at least your position is honest.
You know what would be fun is to do some blind testing on these tires and see where things shook out. If you participated in such a test and let's say the four brands were Michelin, Continental, Cooper and Goodyear....and at the end of the blind test Cooper were your top choice -- would you still go pay more (for a lesser tire) simply to have a different name on the side?
I might run them if I was planning on trading the car and it needed tires. You never recoup in that case. My position on S Class tires has evolved over the 10 years and 3 S Class I've owned. On the first one, shell shocked by the cost and unconvinced when the service techs swore there was a difference vs OE. I got a set of Sumitomo HTR's that spec out on paper very similar to the OE and half the price. The rears were gone in six months, and when they were three months old they were already riding rough and noisy.
Next I tried a set of Conti ProContact DW's. Also gone in about six months in the rear (about 6000 miles). Then I tried a set of Bridgestone Potenzas. More of the same. The last time, the tech said "Look, as often as you're changing the less expensive tires, maybe try a set of OE with a 30k tread life warranty."
I remember picking up the car and the moment I was under way it was like holy crap, now THIS is how this thing is SUPPOSED to feel. Just buttery and silky, no grainy feedback coming through the steering wheel. Crazy quiet. 100 mph on the interstate, perfectly stable and silent. That was it for me. All Michelin Pilot Supersports from then on, and they last. I'll bet if you ran through a set of Coopers, or whatever, and then switched to the Michelins you'd never look back.
Now when I try to spec a Zeon for the S Class on TireRack or Discount Tire on line, they don't come up. That usually means that there isn't a Zeon that specs out properly for the S. Your speed and tread life numbers look good, but do they make that tire with an XL load rating?
It would be pretty funny if you guys were going back and forth about a tire that doesn't exist.
Actually....no. It's easy to prove them. I'm just looking for a way to get you to leave....until you have something productive to provide to the forum.
LOL....you got n-o-t-h-i-n-g.
Hey, before you were dissing Cooper for having plants in China and India ("They also manufacture tires in China and India, as well as the US. I know I'd never knowingly put garbage on my car made in either of those countries that could affect its drivability and safety.")...
...so let me ask you this, if a tire company manufactures in either of those countries do they automatically go on Dave's Unapproved List?
Where were your Hankook's manufactured?
From what I can tell this is where the Hankook plants are located:
Geumsan, South Korea
Daejeon, South Korea (and R&D centre)
Jiangsu, China
Jiaxing, China
Chongqing, China
Dunaújváros, Hungary
Bekasi, West Java, Indonesia
Cooper plants are as follows:
Findlay, OH
Texarkana, AR
Tupelo, MS
Melksham, England
Krusevac, Serbia
El Salto, Mexico
Kunshan, China
"Your credibility, maturity, and character are growing by leaps and bounds with every post you make."
LOL...as if a douchebag like yourself is the arbiter of "credibility, maturity and character."
"All I did was post the very first item that came up on a Google search."
A complete, utter, and blatant lie...and you want to cite "credibility"? Google "Cooper Zeon tires review" and your fraudulent source doesn't appear until the middle of the 3rd page. HAHAHAHA...jeez you're making this easy!
"BTW, the reviews on that website are real by real consumers. Whether that site is a pay to play review site or not is meaningless to the argument. There are bad reviews of Coopers all over forums all over the internet."
Bullsheeite. You can't post one legitimate example. Every review of Cooper Zeon's is positive for the first 2.5 pages of a google search until your fraudulent and completely lacking in credibility site appears...LOL.
Here is a Google search of "Cooper tires review". The very first item, after the 3 advertisements, was the review I posted. It didn't drop to 2.5 pages down the list as you claim.
Just because another website says that all of the reviews on that website might not be true doesn't mean that their assertion is valid. You have to ask yourself "what has to be gained by ripping apart another company about the way they do business"....then follow the money trail. An example would be: most people on the internet view "Snopes" as the authority on whether almost anything is true/false based on items posted on the web. What most people don't realize is that "Snopes" is just a husband/wife team that have proclaimed themselves the authority on just about everything. Most folks don't realize that the couple has their own personal liberal agenda and their "facts" seem to perfectly fit their agenda. They have to be the only 2 people in the world who are the go-to people for answers on absolutely everything. And almost everybody believe Snopes to be the authority on everything. LOL!!!!
"The garbage that we had on our Odyssey that started coming apart at 20k miles were the Lifeliners in case you still wanted to know."
Well that's a bummer for you....but doesn't mean the Cooper Zeon's aren't a great tire. Were they OEM or did you buy them yourself? What kind of warranty did they have? How was it handled?
The Zeon's might be a better tire than the Lifeliners...especially if they are made in a different plant. But than doesn't change the fact that they are Coopers, who has a well-deserved reputation of building sub-standard tires. Like I mentioned earlier, most reviews that you see on Tirerack, Pepboys, etc are reviews of the installer or tires when they are brand new. All tires will perform fine when they are new. Our Lifeliners certainly did. But they went down hill quickly....and after just over a year, the tread was separating from the tire. We took it to another installer for Goodyears, who also sold Cooper tires. The manager told me that although they sold Cooper tires, he would never recommend them to anybody to put on their passenger cars. In fact, he said "anything but Coopers". I asked why they still carry them? He said because there is still a demographic of folks who wanted cheap tires and didn't care how long they lasted. Usually folks who were going to keep their cars less than a year. The OEM tires were Michelin's. And I didn't care what kind of warranty those Coopers had (I think it was 60k+) as there was no way in hell I'd ever put another set on any of my cars. My family's safety was more important than a warranty claim.
"Cooper Tires has been sued many times over the years and paid out several $million in damages for wrongful death and accident claims due to their tires."
"They also manufacture tires in China and India, as well as the US. I know I'd never knowingly put garbage on my car made in either of those countries that could affect its drivability and safety."
What a bunch of BS. You are out of your mind.
Here's just a few. There are A LOT more if you want to spend all day on the internet.
"Now when I try to spec a Zeon for the S Class on TireRack or Discount Tire on line, they don't come up. That usually means that there isn't a Zeon that specs out properly for the S. Your speed and tread life numbers look good, but do they make that tire with an XL load rating?"
For the 19" 255/40/19 the load capacity is 1,764 per tire and 7,056 total...is this sufficient? (with a W speed rating, OE is V, and 500 tread wear)
The OP cited 20" tires on a CL 550 4matic but no specific tire sizes. The Zeon all-year tire there would be a 255/45/20 with a load capacity of 1,819 and 7,276.
I don't know if that's the proper tire for their wheels.
I'm certainly not holding out Zeon as the greatest thing there is in tires but my personal experience has been good and I think it's short sighted to categorically lambaste a fine American company like Cooper because some guy had one bad tire experience 5 years ago (and that in their budget line of product, Zeon are the premium product).
NOTE: the "budget line" is no excuse for making a bad tire. But let's be honest, every tire manufacturer is going to have some duds that get out the door and onto cars.
Last edited by NaslundStarmine; 10-19-2015 at 04:20 PM.
"We took it to another installer for Goodyears, who also sold Cooper tires. The manager told me that although they sold Cooper tires, he would never recommend them to anybody to put on their passenger cars. In fact, he said "anything but Coopers". I asked why they still carry them? He said because there is still a demographic of folks who wanted cheap tires and didn't care how long they lasted. Usually folks who were going to keep their cars less than a year."
Your replies are flimsy and based on nothing. I provided you the data that you said didn't exist. You obviously have nothing productive to provide to the forum as you're only obsessed with trying to pick fights with me and others. You've made your point....you like your Coopers.
"Now when I try to spec a Zeon for the S Class on TireRack or Discount Tire on line, they don't come up. That usually means that there isn't a Zeon that specs out properly for the S. Your speed and tread life numbers look good, but do they make that tire with an XL load rating?"
For the 19" 255/40/19 the load capacity is 1,764 per tire and 7,056 total...is this sufficient? (with a W speed rating, OE is V, and 500 tread wear)
The OP cited 20" tires on a CL 550 4matic but no specific tire sizes. The Zeon all-year tire there would be a 255/45/20 with a load capacity of 1,819 and 7,276.
I don't know if that's the proper tire for their wheels.
I'm certainly not holding out Zeon as the greatest thing there is in tires but my personal experience has been good and I think it's short sighted to categorically lambaste a fine American company like Cooper because some guy had one bad tire experience 5 years ago (and that in their budget line of product, Zeon are the premium product).
The load rating has to do with the strength of the internal structure and allows for higher psi. The ratings are Light Load (LL), Standard Load (SL) and XL (Extra Load). The S Class needs XL from a safety standpoint. That spec is non-negotiable.
Most manufacturers make XL tires for small trucks and SUVs. Once you get into passenger tires, especially high performance low profile summer tires, the number of XL offerings narrows considerably. That combo is a lot more challenging and its reflected in the pricing.
Likewise, if the Zeon is not an XL rated tire, all of the other specs are meaningless, since it's relatively easy to build a Standard Load tire that has good tread wear numbers, and a good speed rating, and is inexpensive.
If you spec tires on TireRack etc. vehicle specific, no Cooper tire shows up. That's likely because it's been filtered out for not meeting one or more criteria, and I'm guessing the missing piece is an XL rating. If you can find one and post a link that might be helpful. Note that only Light Load and Extra Load will appear if applicable. Tires are presumed to be SL if no rating is indicated.
"I provided you the data that you said didn't exist."
Nonsense, there's no "data" there.
"You obviously have nothing productive to provide to the forum as you're only obsessed with trying to pick fights with me and others."
More nonsense. I'm sticking up for Cooper Tires and for Mike. Bullies like yourself shouldn't be tolerated.
"You've made your point....you like your Coopers."
Actually I'm discrediting your assertion that all Cooper tires are "garbage".
I appreciate the help, but generally speaking I'm at least as big an a-hole on the forum as Dave. It's just that after my dick went numb I found Jesus. I'm sure once I'm feeling better I'll be back to my old a-hole self.
Hoooray! Some real information here: http://scherrlegate.com/cooper-tire/ In this story Cooper lost a $10 million jury verdict in Texas, happens to every tire company. In fact, the same article references a "historic $54.9 million Los Angeles jury award—believed to be the largest ever in a defective tire case—in favor of a quadriplegic woman who was injured after a Continental AG-made tire on her car blew out." Again, all tire companies are paying out on lost cases related to defective tires (but this is lost on Dave).
Don't think Dave read this one: http://www.tirebusiness.com/article/...vs-cooper-tire Dave, that Cooper at one time had a JV partner from India for a manufacturing facility in China does not constitute "manufacturing tires in India" -- that did not happen.
All that is the definition of flimsy....
Dave, why did you but Cooper tires in the first place?
Last edited by NaslundStarmine; 10-19-2015 at 07:49 PM.
I appreciate the help, but generally speaking I'm at least as big an a-hole on the forum as Dave. It's just that after my dick went numb I found Jesus. I'm sure once I'm feeling better I'll be back to my old a-hole self.
PS....and thanks for the info on the XL issue. I was uncertain about it but your observation that "Tires are presumed to be SL if no rating is indicated" kind of clears it up, couldn't understand why certain models didn't have the designation one way or the other.
Last edited by NaslundStarmine; 10-19-2015 at 07:54 PM.
GUYS GUYS GUYS!! As I was recently reminded by some d-bag in the middle of my pity thread, this is a CAR FORUM. Not a place for people to go off on pointless personal rants.
In order to get this thread back on track I'm going to remind you all why this forum exists: To discuss my back surgery.
Here are pictures of my internal organs. I'll post one every time anyone says anything, good or Dave, about Cooper tires in this thread.
I've just figured out that I've been arguing with a 12 year old forum troll. The name calling and nature of his/her responses proves his/her age and/or level of maturity. Shame on me for taking so long to figure it out and getting baited into a ridiculous argument with this troll.
GUYS GUYS GUYS!! As I was recently reminded by some d-bag in the middle of my pity thread, this is a CAR FORUM. Not a place for people to go off on pointless personal rants.
In order to get this thread back on track I'm going to remind you all why this forum exists: To discuss my back surgery.
Here are pictures of my internal organs. I'll post one every time anyone says anything, good or Dave, about Cooper tires in this thread.
Wait! Twelve???. Nas, disregard that PM. I Don't need the personal photos we discussed. The last thing I need is to have to explain myself to Chris Hansen.
Wait! Twelve???. Nas, disregard that PM. I Don't need the personal photos we discussed. The last thing I need is to have to explain myself to Chris Hansen.
He'd probably be disappointed in your level of performance any way. At his age, he is likely developing a solid personal relationship with his right hand and has become adept at finding his favorite images on the internet. I have a feeling that any photos you send him will ruin his newly discovered talents.
He'd probably be disappointed in your level of performance any way. At his age, he is likely developing a solid personal relationship with his right hand and has become adept at finding his favorite images on the internet. I have a feeling that any photos you send him will ruin his newly discovered talents.
Those sort of thoughts about 12 year old kids aren't normal pal, you really should keep things like that to yourself. And you want to harp on "name calling"....LOL.
OK, here's the deal, I'm going to be the bigger man and no longer respond to your baseless slurs about the fine American tire company known as Cooper Tires.
But not another peep out of you or it's back on.
Not a peep now...
Last edited by NaslundStarmine; 10-21-2015 at 10:45 AM.
Those sort of thoughts about 12 year old kids aren't normal pal, you really should keep things like that to yourself. And you want to harp on "name calling"....LOL.
OK, here's the deal, I'm going to be the bigger man and no longer respond to your baseless slurs about the fine American tire company known as Cooper Tires.
But not another peep out of you or it's back on.
Not a peep now...
I'm not sure why you are defending Cooper Tires so much. They aren't a good tire. I'd never use Cooper. I consider them low - mid grade. I bought an S class because I could afford to maintain it with parts that will last me a long time. Not a temporary solution that will need replacing in a few months to a year.
Its like BMW vs Mercedes... They both do the same job but how long will the BMW last???
Get a life kid. Or perhaps trolling forums, picking fights, and contributing NOTHING is your life. You seem like the kind of person who is unemployed, lives in his parent's dark basement, and picks fights on the internet (because he hasn't got the ***** to do it in person....Likely because you were picked on a lot as a young child), and gets some sort of gratification out if it. I hope that this is bringing a lot of joy to your pathetic life.
Hello folks...new here. I have an ML 350 4-Matic and had a set of low profile Conti's on the 20" rims. The tires looked beautiful and while you could feel more bumps in the road, the "harder" ride I received also handled beautifully.
FFW - I go to get a replacement set. The Manager tells me he has some Pirelli's, great tires, will look , ride and perform like the Conti's I had.
The moment I drive off, the 350 feels like Im riding on a boat. It feels like it sways more and there is a lot more play in the wheel than before. On top of that, the tire/wheel no longer looks as sexy and now looks more like a regular, fuller bodied grandma tire.
The tire sizes are the same...but until this happened, I never even researched tires. Could it be the speed rating? What did I miss when asking for a new set of Low Pro's exactly like the ones I had??
PS - the manager says he will order the same tire I had before, but I don't think he went to look before they were sent to recycle yard.
10-19-2015, 02:31 PM
