Need help with shudder issue and binding when turning
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S500
not a huge fan of aftermarket oils - it was OK back when engines were made properly with cast iron liners and they hadn't invented designed to fail materials - for chains, internal belts, joke pistons, plated con rods etc.
these days they tend to meet manu spec with some interesting interpretation - of its nothing like it - and has zero control for those flaky parts modern mechanical bits the manu now puts inside to evaporate as you drive - but no one understands let alone reads the label any way
as for SP oils- I can't believe Merc still peddle the lie on the oil chart of 229.5, when they have 229.71 and 229.72 I believe to help LSPI and to keep those evaporating components lasting another 5000 miles - but as a closed shop they now make it even harder to understand what’s in there
typical now I find it both SP spec but 0w20 wt
229.72 0w20 https://gms.aftersales.mercedes-benz...iv=0&ShowCLP=1
229.71 0w20 https://gms.aftersales.mercedes-benz...iv=0&ShowCLP=1
the old stuff - designed to fill the CATs with rubbish, score the bores to death and help all those modern joke components (like pistons and cam lobes) evaporate as you drive
229.5 0w40 https://gms.aftersales.mercedes-benz...iv=0&ShowCLP=1
229.51 5w30 https://gms.aftersales.mercedes-benz...iv=0&ShowCLP=1
these days they tend to meet manu spec with some interesting interpretation - of its nothing like it - and has zero control for those flaky parts modern mechanical bits the manu now puts inside to evaporate as you drive - but no one understands let alone reads the label any way
as for SP oils- I can't believe Merc still peddle the lie on the oil chart of 229.5, when they have 229.71 and 229.72 I believe to help LSPI and to keep those evaporating components lasting another 5000 miles - but as a closed shop they now make it even harder to understand what’s in there
typical now I find it both SP spec but 0w20 wt
229.72 0w20 https://gms.aftersales.mercedes-benz...iv=0&ShowCLP=1
229.71 0w20 https://gms.aftersales.mercedes-benz...iv=0&ShowCLP=1
the old stuff - designed to fill the CATs with rubbish, score the bores to death and help all those modern joke components (like pistons and cam lobes) evaporate as you drive
229.5 0w40 https://gms.aftersales.mercedes-benz...iv=0&ShowCLP=1
229.51 5w30 https://gms.aftersales.mercedes-benz...iv=0&ShowCLP=1
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1983 Nissan Shltbox
BOTUS, should I try this?
https://www.blauparts.com/0w20-fully...o-5-liter.html
or this
https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/0w-...i-moly-lm22046
https://www.blauparts.com/0w20-fully...o-5-liter.html
or this
https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/0w-...i-moly-lm22046
Last edited by Senecat; Sep 3, 2025 at 12:20 PM.
MBWorld Fanatic!
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S500
most of the 0w20 is to help start stop spin up quick and fudge emissions - its not really to help the engine last
I'd be happy with a 0w30 - when I run the wrong later spec Castrol to 229.51 - a noisy cam bucket goes 100% silent and stays like that till next oil change 12k down the line, 229.5 0w40 rattles like a pig from 400 mile after the oil changes
I'd be happy with a 0w30 - when I run the wrong later spec Castrol to 229.51 - a noisy cam bucket goes 100% silent and stays like that till next oil change 12k down the line, 229.5 0w40 rattles like a pig from 400 mile after the oil changes
MBWorld Fanatic!
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S500
Merc *** heads seem to have blocked the links I gave - pick what you want e.g. type MB 229.72 MDMS in a search engine - that will pick up MB site and the right oil as the top link, then click top shown on the Merc site - that should get to a bit to download the pdf half explaining the confusion
whilst it all started all as dead dinosaurs, each manu now blends a special cocktail of secret rot, and builds their engines out of chocolate to self destruct if the oil cocktail doesn't exactly match
click first one on the list to download the pdf https://operatingfluids.mercedes-benz.com/sheet/229.72
whilst it all started all as dead dinosaurs, each manu now blends a special cocktail of secret rot, and builds their engines out of chocolate to self destruct if the oil cocktail doesn't exactly match
click first one on the list to download the pdf https://operatingfluids.mercedes-benz.com/sheet/229.72
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S500
its a VERY ugly picture SAE API std is very loose way to talk about engine oil - here ACEA clearly differentiate important differences between what looks like a good suitable oil below which is C2 and the C4 std of the MB 229.5 oil
ACEA C2 oils are low-SAPS (sulfated ash, phosphorus, and sulfur) and suitable for engines requiring lower viscosity, while C4 oils are also low-SAPS but designed for higher performance and can handle more demanding operating conditions
C2 are mid-SAPS oils, where the sulfated ash content is lower than 0.8%. Those are low-friction oils with a minimum HT/HS viscosity of 2.9 mPa⋅s.
C3 are mid-SAPS oils for aftertreatment system compatibility, with HTHS viscosity of minimum 3.5 mPa⋅s.
C4 are stable, stay-in-grade oils similar to C1. They have a minimum HT/HS viscosity of 3.5 mPa⋅s, while there is no lower limit on phosphorus.
https://operatingfluids.mercedes-benz.com/sheet/229.61 here's an oil meeting MB - 229.6 https://www.fuchs.com/us/en/product/...-C2-SAE-0W-30/
https://www.fuchs.com/uk/en/product/...-flex-3-5w-40/ MB - 229.31, 229.51, 229.52
https://www.mobil.eu/en-gb/lubricant...ormula-r-5w-30 MB- 226.51 Mobil Super 3000 Formula R 5W-30 is high-performance C4, low ash engine oil designed to help prolong engine life and maintain the efficiency of the exhaust emission reduction systems in both diesel and gasoline powered passenger cars, light commercial vehicles and vans.
This product is recommended for use in Renault vehicles requiring RN0720, Mercedes Benz vehicles requiring MB-Approval 226.51, and a wide range of European cars and light-duty commercial vehicles which require ACEA C4.
https://www.fuchs.com/us/en/product/...c-4-sae-5w-30/ MB- 226.51
ACEA C2 oils are low-SAPS (sulfated ash, phosphorus, and sulfur) and suitable for engines requiring lower viscosity, while C4 oils are also low-SAPS but designed for higher performance and can handle more demanding operating conditions
C2 are mid-SAPS oils, where the sulfated ash content is lower than 0.8%. Those are low-friction oils with a minimum HT/HS viscosity of 2.9 mPa⋅s.
C3 are mid-SAPS oils for aftertreatment system compatibility, with HTHS viscosity of minimum 3.5 mPa⋅s.
C4 are stable, stay-in-grade oils similar to C1. They have a minimum HT/HS viscosity of 3.5 mPa⋅s, while there is no lower limit on phosphorus.
https://operatingfluids.mercedes-benz.com/sheet/229.61 here's an oil meeting MB - 229.6 https://www.fuchs.com/us/en/product/...-C2-SAE-0W-30/
- Premium Performance engine oil for modern cars and vans. Especially developed for BMW and Mercedes-Benz vehicles with exhaust gas aftertreatment and turbochargers, incl. hybrid vehicles. Excellent Cold-Start properties, low oil consumption and reduced emissions.
- BMW LONGLIFE-12 FE
- MB-APPROVAL 229.61
- ACEA C2
- ACEA A5/B5
- API SP
- API SP RC
- ILSAC GF-6A
- FORD WSSM2C950-A
- Low SPAsh Multigrade Service Engine Oils
https://www.fuchs.com/uk/en/product/...-flex-3-5w-40/ MB - 229.31, 229.51, 229.52
- ACEA C3
- API SN
- BMW LONGLIFE-04
- MB-APPROVAL 226.5
- MB-APPROVAL 229.31
- MB-APPROVAL 229.51
- MB-APPROVAL 229.52
- PORSCHE C40
- RENAULT RN0700 / RN0710
- VW 511 00
https://www.mobil.eu/en-gb/lubricant...ormula-r-5w-30 MB- 226.51 Mobil Super 3000 Formula R 5W-30 is high-performance C4, low ash engine oil designed to help prolong engine life and maintain the efficiency of the exhaust emission reduction systems in both diesel and gasoline powered passenger cars, light commercial vehicles and vans.
This product is recommended for use in Renault vehicles requiring RN0720, Mercedes Benz vehicles requiring MB-Approval 226.51, and a wide range of European cars and light-duty commercial vehicles which require ACEA C4.
https://www.fuchs.com/us/en/product/...c-4-sae-5w-30/ MB- 226.51
- Premium Performance, extreme fuel-economy engine oil for modern passenger cars and light commercial vehicles with or without extended service intervals. Specially for Renault engines with exhaust after treatment and turbocharger. Optimum cold starting, lower oil consumption and minimized exhaust emissions.
- ACEA C4
- MB-APPROVAL 226.51
- RENAULT RN0720
Last edited by BOTUS; Sep 3, 2025 at 02:53 PM.
MBWorld Fanatic!
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1983 Nissan Shltbox
Yeah, oil is oil is oil to me. Stick with the spec, change every 5kmi and call it good. Most of the time, in most cars, it doesn't even matter so much WHAT you use, as long as it GETS changed regularly. Once the tune is on, the exhaust and intake are finished, the solenoid is installed, and all is running well, I'll lower the interval to between 3-5k miles instead of a religious 5k.
Still waiting on the boost controller. I'll report back when it arrives.
Back on topic, however, I have driven the car about 60 miles since messing with the check valve and clearing the vacuum lines, and I do believe the issue is almost gone. I'm at the point where I can't really tell if it's still occurring, or if it's just the obnoxiously loud exhaust and rough ride of the exhaust/engine vibration transmitting through the body being only metal-strapped to the chassis temporarily. When I get the exhaust finished, it'll be rubber isolated, but right now it's just resting on a rigged metal strap hammock Lol
Still waiting on the boost controller. I'll report back when it arrives.
Back on topic, however, I have driven the car about 60 miles since messing with the check valve and clearing the vacuum lines, and I do believe the issue is almost gone. I'm at the point where I can't really tell if it's still occurring, or if it's just the obnoxiously loud exhaust and rough ride of the exhaust/engine vibration transmitting through the body being only metal-strapped to the chassis temporarily. When I get the exhaust finished, it'll be rubber isolated, but right now it's just resting on a rigged metal strap hammock Lol
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 5,322
Likes: 1,678
S500
yes but its all changing with modern engines all built strange and requiring funny oil
Ethanol which wasn't about in Europe when they invented the MB 229.5 std is a very good example of evil filth that gets up to mischief - its destroying anything the runs a wet belt inside
if Only MB had bothered to state they want an acea C4 oil I wouldn't have provided as much info as we have in this thread now - as I'd have known what they wanted !
Ethanol which wasn't about in Europe when they invented the MB 229.5 std is a very good example of evil filth that gets up to mischief - its destroying anything the runs a wet belt inside
if Only MB had bothered to state they want an acea C4 oil I wouldn't have provided as much info as we have in this thread now - as I'd have known what they wanted !
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Aug 2021
Posts: 1,542
Likes: 772
1983 Nissan Shltbox
yes but its all changing with modern engines all built strange and requiring funny oil
Ethanol which wasn't about in Europe when they invented the MB 229.5 std is a very good example of evil filth that gets up to mischief - its destroying anything the runs a wet belt inside
if Only MB had bothered to state they want an acea C4 oil I wouldn't have provided as much info as we have in this thread now - as I'd have known what they wanted !
Ethanol which wasn't about in Europe when they invented the MB 229.5 std is a very good example of evil filth that gets up to mischief - its destroying anything the runs a wet belt inside
if Only MB had bothered to state they want an acea C4 oil I wouldn't have provided as much info as we have in this thread now - as I'd have known what they wanted !
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