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Hey,
I'm talking about bi turbo V8 engines that was introduced in 2012 . S Class has an enormous hood but it doesn't offer as much space as American V8 engines
FWIW he has an M176 not a M278. I'm hoping that many of the issues that the M278 had were addressed on the M176's
In the early 2000's I owned an S600 V12. It was an amazing car when it worked, but it truly had problems; suspension, engine control, and oil passages to name a few. I spent close to $15K in repairs and maintenance over my 5 years of ownership, 33K miles when I bought it and 70K when I sold it. Not only did the S600 have problems back then, but all the S-Class cars had problems...real problems. There's more information now and the newer cars are 100% better in terms of reliability and durability. It's alwasy unfortunate to face an expensive repair and there's no way to guarantee that it won't happen. But from what I can tell you can expect great reliability and minimal repairs up to 50K miles, and moderate up to 80K miles. After 100K miles, all bets are off. Keep in mind that how the car is treated will do more to determine problems over the long term.
I love the forums, but sometimes things get blown out of proportion. The word "common" is used to describe something that happens less than 1% of the time, probably more like 1/10th of 1%. I don't think people are intentionally spreading fear, but it seems to happen on car forums.
In the early 2000's I owned an S600 V12. It was an amazing car when it worked, but it truly had problems; suspension, engine control, and oil passages to name a few. I spent close to $15K in repairs and maintenance over my 5 years of ownership, 33K miles when I bought it and 70K when I sold it. Not only did the S600 have problems back then, but all the S-Class cars had problems...real problems. There's more information now and the newer cars are 100% better in terms of reliability and durability. It's alwasy unfortunate to face an expensive repair and there's no way to guarantee that it won't happen. But from what I can tell you can expect great reliability and minimal repairs up to 50K miles, and moderate up to 80K miles. After 100K miles, all bets are off. Keep in mind that how the car is treated will do more to determine problems over the long term.
I love the forums, but sometimes things get blown out of proportion. The word "common" is used to describe something that happens less than 1% of the time, probably more like 1/10th of 1%. I don't think people are intentionally spreading fear, but it seems to happen on car forums.
Well I bought me cat with 59k on the clock so there's no warranty. I'm going to check with my credit union to see what they offer as far as aftermarket warranties. My commute to and from work is 130 miles a day hence the need for a comfortable car. I don't buy cars to park them in the drive way either. I buy used after a minimum of 5 years after the value has already taken it's biggest hit and starts to level out. This is when you can get great deals on luxury sedans. This is the newest model year car I have ever bought mainly because I don't want do any major surgery for at least a few years.
I've stayed with Lexus for a long time since things rarely break unexpectedly. That's been my experience with the LS over the past 20 years. The only unexpected repair were 2 starters. The first one on my 98 LS 400 and on my 2007 LS 460L. I purchased both remanufactured Denso starters from Amazon and had them the next day. I replaced both myself.
Forums do tend to exaggerate the extent of issues that's why I read lots of threads before I ask for opinions. With the 460 it's the control arms which is valid but gets overblown because ppl go to the dealer which is expected when your not a DIY type person, which is a category that most owners of a luxury brand don't fall into.
So I'm more than capable of fixing most things unless it's catastrophic engine or trans failure. There's no guarantee on anything in life so we'll see how things go. I really like this car enough that I can't see myself going back to an LS especially since it doesn't offer a V8 anymore.
Welcome to the Mercedes world! I think you will really like the car. I really don't miss my LSs at all, this car is really on another level.
Mine has been more reliable than my LS460s, although I'm only at 43,000 miles. I have a great independent mechanic and I would recommend you find one too in case you need him. The M176 engine is smaller than the M278, and there is more room to work on it. I would say this car is at least as reliable as the LS460, if not more reliable. Air suspension seems way more robust as an example, you don't have the issues with the control arms or brake actuator either. I think you will find that if you have been comfortable working on the LS460 you will be comfortable working on this...
Welcome to the Mercedes world! I think you will really like the car. I really don't miss my LSs at all, this car is really on another level.
Mine has been more reliable than my LS460s, although I'm only at 43,000 miles. I have a great independent mechanic and I would recommend you find one too in case you need him. The M176 engine is smaller than the M278, and there is more room to work on it. I would say this car is at least as reliable as the LS460, if not more reliable. Air suspension seems way more robust as an example, you don't have the issues with the control arms or brake actuator either. I think you will find that if you have been comfortable working on the LS460 you will be comfortable working on this...
Post some pictures!
I was hoping that you would see and respond to this thread. I know that you are very knowledgeable with whatever vehicle you are driving. It's reassuring that you would say that this car is just as reliable and easy to work on as the 460. You know that would be a big no no if we were in the Lexus forum lol. I've read a couple of your posts in this forum already and also went back and reread your thread in the Lexus forum when you upgraded. This car is an UPGRADE to the 460 in almost every way which I can't deny. The 1 thing that bothers me is that it doesn't feel as stable in highway curves as the 460. I can't tell if it's the Good Year run flats, the 20s or the staggered setup since this is the first cast I have driven with this setup. I plan to most likely switch to the Pirelli all season soon because I read on the Good Year website that these tires should not be used in really cold temps and they are summer tires anyway. First set of summer tires I've ever had. I'll post some pics soon, I have the window stickers but really don't know all the features that's built into this vehicle.
I was hoping that you would see and respond to this thread. I know that you are very knowledgeable with whatever vehicle you are driving. It's reassuring that you would say that this car is just as reliable and easy to work on as the 460. You know that would be a big no no if we were in the Lexus forum lol. I've read a couple of your posts in this forum already and also went back and reread your thread in the Lexus forum when you upgraded. This car is an UPGRADE to the 460 in almost every way which I can't deny. The 1 thing that bothers me is that it doesn't feel as stable in highway curves as the 460. I can't tell if it's the Good Year run flats, the 20s or the staggered setup since this is the first cast I have driven with this setup. I plan to most likely switch to the Pirelli all season soon because I read on the Good Year website that these tires should not be used in really cold temps and they are summer tires anyway. First set of summer tires I've ever had. I'll post some pics soon, I have the window stickers but really don't know all the features that's built into this vehicle.
It really is a special car, to be fair its a much more expensive car than the LS460L was, but its on another level for sure. I have had it 3 years this month and my enthusiasm for it hasn't waned. In fact, my plan was to trade out of it at 3 years like I always do, and I really really shopped for a replacement, looked at the new S580 and the new 7 Series EV and V8, I looked at an Audi S8, and really I am just not ready to part with the car yet, so I'm going to keep it for another year I think.
Thats interesting about the high speed curves because thats the opposite of my excperience, IMO the S Class is more stable on the highway at high speeds and in curves than the LS460. What PSI are you running? Mine also has 19s but I would think the 20s would make it feel more stable. I also have non runflats.
When I am on the highway for a long stretch I actually put the suspension in sport mode, especially on a curvy highway. Try that and see what you think. Did your LS460L have air suspension? I can't remember...
It really is a special car, to be fair its a much more expensive car than the LS460L was, but its on another level for sure. I have had it 3 years this month and my enthusiasm for it hasn't waned. In fact, my plan was to trade out of it at 3 years like I always do, and I really really shopped for a replacement, looked at the new S580 and the new 7 Series EV and V8, I looked at an Audi S8, and really I am just not ready to part with the car yet, so I'm going to keep it for another year I think.
Thats interesting about the high speed curves because thats the opposite of my excperience, IMO the S Class is more stable on the highway at high speeds and in curves than the LS460. What PSI are you running? Mine also has 19s but I would think the 20s would make it feel more stable. I also have non runflats.
When I am on the highway for a long stretch I actually put the suspension in sport mode, especially on a curvy highway. Try that and see what you think. Did your LS460L have air suspension? I can't remember...
The ONLY thing I do miss is the ML Audio.
I'm usually going through those curves at HIGH speeds but the LS on 18s handled them very wheel. It's probably the tires because it feels like the car slides/skips. The car rides smooth but I feel those small bumps much more than I used to and I know the 20s are responsible. I would not dare put an 18 inch rim on this car because it would ruin the look for ME. I've been looking for some 19 inch rims to run all season tires for the winter months. I've read the whole debate about not having a spare and I do have that same tire plug kit that you have but psychologically I need a spare. At least I could wait till I got home to plug a hole instead of on the highway
It’s the tires I bet. I drove them on 20s and there is definitely a ride penalty over the 19s. Personally I think the 19s that I have are a good compromise, and the car rides incredibly well on these and the Pirelli PZero A/S Plus 2 that I have on it.
You can buy space saver spares for them too. They sell a nice one that comes in a bag.
I'll try the sports mode because I'm on the highway 90% of the time. The recommended tire pressure for these tires is 42 front and 43 rear so that's what I have in them. What I don't get and I guess I'm not in the loop about how MB engineers think, but why would they put high performance summer tires in these vehicles and not all season tires? I'm thinking that's a small part of the problem too. The tires just don't grip all that well in cold temps. Someone correct me if my line of thinking is wrong.
If you live somewhere that gets rain on a regular basis that could be the problem. I had summer performance tires on my S63 when I purchased it and the car was downright dangerous in the rain. Swapped to all season Michelins and now it works great in the weather.
I had the Goodyear Run Flats on my S550 when I bought it a year ago. They were by far the worst tires I've had on any car in 15+ years! The ride wasn't smooth, the car got unsettled when hitting bumps in corners, they were loud, and they didn't have much give when hitting bumps and transferred sound and vibrations into the car. Practcally any major brand tire will be an improvement, especially if you go with standard non run flat tires. I'm partial to the Continental DW06+'s, but the Michelins, Pirellis and the Bridgestone Potenza's are all great tires. Your main decision will be run flat or not.
I had the Goodyear Run Flats on my S550 when I bought it a year ago. They were by far the worst tires I've had on any car in 15+ years! The ride wasn't smooth, the car got unsettled when hitting bumps in corners, they were loud, and they didn't have much give when hitting bumps and transferred sound and vibrations into the car. Practcally any major brand tire will be an improvement, especially if you go with standard non run flat tires. I'm partial to the Continental DW06+'s, but the Michelins, Pirellis and the Bridgestone Potenza's are all great tires. Your main decision will be run flat or not.
Ok, that fits my experience EXACTLY. there's always a slight rumble and any little bump at highway speeds unsettled the car momentarily. One train I bought this car is too take advantage of those 463 horses so the good years have to go. I generally don't like run flats because of the expense when it comes time to replace them but I had a puncture 1 week into ownership. You know all the alarms on the dash. I don't usually panic no matter the situation but I was 50 miles from home with no spare and my mind began to race. There was no way I was going to keep going at reduced speeds and going that I would not damage the rim. I found a tire shop that was willing to plug the hole and it's been several days without any pressure loss. Those run flats saved me from tearing the tire up on the way to the shop.
I'll try the sports mode because I'm on the highway 90% of the time. The recommended tire pressure for these tires is 42 front and 43 rear so that's what I have in them. What I don't get and I guess I'm not in the loop about how MB engineers think, but why would they put high performance summer tires in these vehicles and not all season tires? I'm thinking that's a small part of the problem too. The tires just don't grip all that well in cold temps. Someone correct me if my line of thinking is wrong.
Your pressures are WAY too high. You need to go off of the pressures on the fuel cap...for my 19s they are 35/35, I run 32. I will check my fuel door
Your pressures are WAY too high. You need to go off of the pressures on the fuel cap...for my 19s they are 35/35, I run 32. I will check my fuel door
I kind of felt that was too high but in every car I've ever owned the recommended psi is in the door jam. I'll check the fuel cap when I get a chance though.
Changing out the tires will make a massive difference in ride quality. I've had two W221 S550s and currently have a W222 S550. They all were on the staggered 20" AMG wheels. The first setup was with the Goodyear runflats and I had the same complaints. I've ran both the Conti DWS06+ and I'm currently on Michelin Pilot Sport A/S 4. They were both massive upgrades compared to the runflats. Just be sure to bring a fix a flat kit in case you need it.
Realistically the only thing that will be more complicated to work on (I'm talking pure mechanical components) vs your prior LS is going to the be engine given it is turbocharged. On my old CL600 with the V12TT I managed to rebuild the front suspension, replace the ABC tandem pump, and replace the radiator as a lowly youtube mechanic. If you've been doing this a while you'll be perfectly fine.
I'm back to give a small update after a month of ownership. The car is really amazing, the torque is amazing and the car really moves when you punch it. I just did my first oil change after 9k miles and not a drop of oil lost. My LS 460 would need the oil changed after about 4-5k but that was an older car that was known for burning oil. I love the HUD and android auto which is a must even though Waze acts funny at times. The ambient lighting is cool and I like the fragrance bottle in the glove compartment
Now to the not so good. I had to get rid of the run flats and purchased the PS4s at a total cost of $1500 including mount and balance. Today I had to fix all 4 rims that were bent when I bought the car + $575. The check engine light has been on for a couple weeks for the left front speed sensor, cost to be determined. I have not fixed it yet because being a DIYer I ordered and have in my possession the C4 doip but the Star diagnostic ssd they sent me was somehow corrupted and they had to send me another one which should arrive next week Total cost $550. The most annoying thing is that the car only came with 1 key and if I knew how much these keys cost I would have negotiated the price of the car down even further. I'm looking at another $700-$900 which is ridiculous. Most of this is due to not doing enough research but in my defense I've been driving an LS for so long I iniatially planned to get another 460 and changed plans which left me a couple of weeks to read up and decided btw a 15-17 S550 or a 18-20 S560. I believe I made the correct choice so I'm not second guessing the decision but within a month I've already had to spent $2600 and still have to buy a key plus a doughnut spare because I need the piece of mind just in case I don't feel like plugging a hole on the side of the road in the wee hours of the morning.
All that being said, I'm still happy with the purchase. it's just that nothing ever really broke on the LS so I'm kind of spoiled. The cost of the key is the MOST annoying thing but it is what it is at this point.
If it makes you feel better stuff broke on both my LS460s and nothing has broken on my S560. Luck of the draw!
Glad you’re enjoying it! I absolutely love mine.
It's definitely reassuring to hear that from you. I don't feel like anything will break unnecessarily in this car but I do drive a lot of miles so we'll see how it holds up.
11-04-2023, 12:49 PM
