W223 Owner Surveys: You REALLY want to know???
Junior Member
Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 57
Likes: 28
S500 / Db9 / F360 / Range Sport V8
I had exactly the same feeling, those buttons are pressure sensitive and are 3d patterned in a way that it indeed hurts. W222 are way more pleasant (but probably more expensive too)
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 2,296
Likes: 1,481
23 S580 Executive
In practice, they're probably the worst buttons for the purpose I've ever used. Not that there was anything special about all the rest, those cars had buttons, they worked, that's it. This car has buttons that kinda work after some fiddling. You never really become accustomed to them because there is nothing to become accustomed to; there is no tactile response. You push, nothing, you push harder something, oops too much, you push the other way, oops too much back, push again, nothing, push again, ahh, just right. Next time, same thing.
It's a theme I've touched on before: During the testing phases, exactly how many liked the seat buttons? How many thought they functioned correctly? Very few would be my guess. The thing here is that they are not good, they knew it, and they did it anyway. That's the interesting takeaway to me. There are other similar problems with the car they couldn't possibly have not known were problems, but they did it anyway; the doors, for another example.
It's a theme I've touched on before: During the testing phases, exactly how many liked the seat buttons? How many thought they functioned correctly? Very few would be my guess. The thing here is that they are not good, they knew it, and they did it anyway. That's the interesting takeaway to me. There are other similar problems with the car they couldn't possibly have not known were problems, but they did it anyway; the doors, for another example.
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 8,150
Likes: 4,375
From: Corona Del Mar, CA
2019 SL450, 2019 E450 Luxury Trim Wagon, 2024 BMW I7 xDrive60
In practice, they're probably the worst buttons for the purpose I've ever used. Not that there was anything special about all the rest, those cars had buttons, they worked, that's it. This car has buttons that kinda work after some fiddling. You never really become accustomed to them because there is nothing to become accustomed to; there is no tactile response. You push, nothing, you push harder something, oops too much, you push the other way, oops too much back, push again, nothing, push again, ahh, just right. Next time, same thing.
It's a theme I've touched on before: During the testing phases, exactly how many liked the seat buttons? How many thought they functioned correctly? Very few would be my guess. The thing here is that they are not good, they knew it, and they did it anyway. That's the interesting takeaway to me. There are other similar problems with the car they couldn't possibly have not known were problems, but they did it anyway; the doors, for another example.
It's a theme I've touched on before: During the testing phases, exactly how many liked the seat buttons? How many thought they functioned correctly? Very few would be my guess. The thing here is that they are not good, they knew it, and they did it anyway. That's the interesting takeaway to me. There are other similar problems with the car they couldn't possibly have not known were problems, but they did it anyway; the doors, for another example.
Junior Member
Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 57
Likes: 28
S500 / Db9 / F360 / Range Sport V8
Very well said. I believe, that prior to the various models launched for MY21 & later, MB would have tested & reviewed something like these new buttons & switches to the Nth degree and would have rejected them outright. SOMEONE in Stuttgart would have said “these are unacceptable,” and the engineers would have gone back to the drawing board. Unfortunately, along with this switch gear, several other poorly designed elements made their way into these new models, resulting in the mess MB now has on its hands. And, since we know that these new models have a long lead time, from initial concept & design to production, there must have been issues well black in the 20 teens. How difficult can it be, for an engineering juggernaut like MB to design doors that stay open where you want them or switches that let you feel on and off? Car Building 101 and the Class of 2021 FAILED!
Super Member
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 759
Likes: 258
From: Boston
AMG
Junior Member
Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 57
Likes: 28
S500 / Db9 / F360 / Range Sport V8
Actually they are more expensive. MB was asked that by some German reviewers who also didn't like it why they made it like that thinking it's cheaper, but MB told them it is actually more expensive but most customers prefer it that way. I personally don't feel any discomfort using them.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 2,296
Likes: 1,481
23 S580 Executive
They don't cause me any pain, they're just finicky. I would need to see the data on customers preferring them, I've never met a real world person that likes them better, they were uniformly panned in reviews, and frankly, I'm doubtful. It's also just the kind of thing an executive would trot out when treading water.
This isn't a callout but I'd have to see compelling data that supported the claim to buy in.
This isn't a callout but I'd have to see compelling data that supported the claim to buy in.
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Junior Member
Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 57
Likes: 28
S500 / Db9 / F360 / Range Sport V8
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 2,296
Likes: 1,481
23 S580 Executive
Like I said, it's suspect in the extreme. Corporate executives at that level, and doing those kinds of jobs, bleed company blood and spew the company line. Show me the data, I'll happily change my tune if needed.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 9,135
Likes: 4,625
From: Maryland
2024 S580
With the amount of MB cars we've owned I can honestly say we've been pretty lucky. Nothing chronic other than a squeak in a 2007 S class that drove me crazy enough to trade it in. All other issues if any, were pretty minor and one offs. It's the newer generation vehicles that just don't instill confidence, not to mention styling is underwhelming and reliability is safe to say at a low point historically due to all the tech and battery issues. For the first time in nearly 30 years I can safely say my next car will not be a Mercedes, nothing really excites.
Honestly there really isn't anything out there that excites me at the current time...I like the 223 fine but not enough to upgrade and pay way more than what I have...
And you were never in the market for this car lol
What I find frustrating is the desire to make changes for the sake of making changes which don't improve the design or functionality of the car...which is very un-MB like. Examples of this are the door handles and the seat controls...I can't see any way in which either of those design changes improves the car...
Last edited by SW20S; Jan 2, 2024 at 08:17 PM.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 2,435
Likes: 278
From: Canada
A car
But you're right, I only own a present gen A8 and a Ghost, so what do I know. Also, if you want to tell me what to do with my time you can pay me my hourly rate otherwise I'll just do what I want to, when I want to.
PS - if you genuinely feel that I'm trolling, then maybe listen to the saying: "don't feed the troll". (insert childish emoticon here). Interesting response though. You're one of the few diehard fanboys left on the W223 forum! Just admit it. The gang now is talking about 'painful' seat controls...
My gosh what did I just read now...
Last edited by superangrypenguin; Jan 2, 2024 at 09:08 PM.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 9,135
Likes: 4,625
From: Maryland
2024 S580
Seriously, come on. Just post on the Audi forums, this is sad. You do the same thing at ClubLexus. Oh you own a Ghost now? Right.
Why would you want to troll forums for cars you don't own when you could be out enjoying your Ghost? Go enjoy it. I'm sure they have forums too, you can go talk about how much smarter you are than everybody else with those folks.
And if you think I'm a 223 fanboy you clearly didn't read what I posted lol
Why would you want to troll forums for cars you don't own when you could be out enjoying your Ghost? Go enjoy it. I'm sure they have forums too, you can go talk about how much smarter you are than everybody else with those folks.
And if you think I'm a 223 fanboy you clearly didn't read what I posted lol
Last edited by SW20S; Jan 2, 2024 at 09:24 PM.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 2,435
Likes: 278
From: Canada
A car
Seriously, come on. Just post on the Audi forums, this is sad. You do the same thing at ClubLexus. Oh you own a Ghost now? Right.
Why would you want to troll forums for cars you don't own when you could be out enjoying your Ghost? Go enjoy it. I'm sure they have forums too, you can go talk about how much smarter you are than everybody else with those folks.
And if you think I'm a 223 fanboy you clearly didn't read what I posted lol
Why would you want to troll forums for cars you don't own when you could be out enjoying your Ghost? Go enjoy it. I'm sure they have forums too, you can go talk about how much smarter you are than everybody else with those folks.
And if you think I'm a 223 fanboy you clearly didn't read what I posted lol
Your amazing telepathy skills should be put to good use! That can help you win the lottery next time! In any event, maybe, erm, stick to not attacking someone who hasn't posted in years? Happy 2024. Leave the tape measure at the door - it'll help you live longer my 'friend'.
Last edited by superangrypenguin; Jan 2, 2024 at 09:50 PM.
MBWorld God!
Joined: Dec 2019
Posts: 32,467
Likes: 6,342
Very well said. I believe, that prior to the various models launched for MY21 & later, MB would have tested & reviewed something like these new buttons & switches to the Nth degree and would have rejected them outright. SOMEONE in Stuttgart would have said “these are unacceptable,” and the engineers would have gone back to the drawing board. Unfortunately, along with this switch gear, several other poorly designed elements made their way into these new models, resulting in the mess MB now has on its hands. And, since we know that these new models have a long lead time, from initial concept & design to production, there must have been issues well black in the 20 teens. How difficult can it be, for an engineering juggernaut like MB to design doors that stay open where you want them or switches that let you feel on and off? Car Building 101 and the Class of 2021 FAILED!
Super Member
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 759
Likes: 258
From: Boston
AMG
This is the place to post your comments:
https://www.linkedin.com/posts/dimit...member_desktop
https://www.linkedin.com/posts/dimit...member_desktop
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 2,154
Likes: 952
From: Costco
2023 S500
I like my car, which is a far cry from my other Mercedes I fled from. It’s not perfect, but it’s also not tainted with wretched build quality issues. I actually like the look and aesthetics as well. It’s very subtle and not over-the-top strange like the BMW flagship.
I will probably lease again. I have a few more years on my lease so I’m hoping it will be the refresh. I just hope they redo the options offering more choices, get rid of every single capacitive touch button, normal door handles, no run flats and a ZF transmission.
I will probably lease again. I have a few more years on my lease so I’m hoping it will be the refresh. I just hope they redo the options offering more choices, get rid of every single capacitive touch button, normal door handles, no run flats and a ZF transmission.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 2,296
Likes: 1,481
23 S580 Executive
I like mine too, despite my complaints I don't see anything better to replace it with insofar as a large luxury sedan. BMW had me saying goodbye at hello, I like Audi's general interior aesthetic but it feels dated, and the Panamera isn't really playing this game.
It begs the question, just exactly how bad is something when you can't find anything better?
It begs the question, just exactly how bad is something when you can't find anything better?
Member
Joined: Dec 2023
Posts: 148
Likes: 87
From: South Florida
2023 S580
I think it boils down to "1st World Problems" and I don't mean that to minimize anyone's negative experiences...because, as you know, I am a noob with MB and this car specifically. But, I have been around the block a few times so I have experience, especially with forums. I participate on all sorts of vehicle forums for the many different types of vehicles I have or have owned in the past. I am a current owner of a '21 Honda Goldwing and it is known to be a notoriously solid machine by owners yet you still see complaints. I think that is the nature of most forums - most owners either are not on forums and don't complain and many (not all, of course) who are on forums are the squeaky wheels. I am sure I will get hell-fire rained down on me for that but it is what I have seen and experienced.
I am looking forward to driving my S and I sincerely hope the problems outlined on this forum and this thread in particular are not indicative of all of the ownership experience. I guess time will tell...
I am looking forward to driving my S and I sincerely hope the problems outlined on this forum and this thread in particular are not indicative of all of the ownership experience. I guess time will tell...
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 9,135
Likes: 4,625
From: Maryland
2024 S580
To be fair, there are clearly issues here with this vehicle, I think a lot of the reliability issues though are worked through at this point. Now you're left with design choice issues, and those are subjective.
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 8,150
Likes: 4,375
From: Corona Del Mar, CA
2019 SL450, 2019 E450 Luxury Trim Wagon, 2024 BMW I7 xDrive60
I like mine too, despite my complaints I don't see anything better to replace it with insofar as a large luxury sedan. BMW had me saying goodbye at hello, I like Audi's general interior aesthetic but it feels dated, and the Panamera isn't really playing this game.
It begs the question, just exactly how bad is something when you can't find anything better?
It begs the question, just exactly how bad is something when you can't find anything better?
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 8,150
Likes: 4,375
From: Corona Del Mar, CA
2019 SL450, 2019 E450 Luxury Trim Wagon, 2024 BMW I7 xDrive60
Thats pretty much been the same with me. However, when you need a car & there is nothing else you want and the best option happens to be a CPO, it can be a great way to go.
