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Sorry, they saved almost nothing in CD versus the ICE S class and that car is somewhere between awkward and butt ugly by nearly universal agreement. This is not the same thing as liking or not liking strawberries or black shoes. I don't love either but I also don't find them hideous, they're just not to my taste. The EQS goes way past not being someones cup of tea.
Agree on the politics though, I get enough idiots who get their news from Facebook in the real world, I don't need stupid in my car forums.
1. Who said it was an electrified "S-class"?? It is an electrified "CLS". If you think about it EQS has all the features that resemble the CLS such as frameless doors. Also EV counterparts tend to cost more than the gas counterparts but EQS is slightly cheaper than the S-class. However, if you think EQS is a CLS EV then it makes total sense.
2. Its the norm of MB these days. Not limited to the EQS.
3. Rattles and creaks. I have 6500 miles on mine and bought it with 15 miles on it. No rattles or creaks yet. It depends on the build. At 100k the cars should be perfect.
4. Brake feel is one downside of this car. You get used to it though.... If you get used to it then it's fine. Also on the plus side thanks to regen the pads should last almost 100k miles or more.
5. My next car will be a W223 but the ride quality is worse than the EQS??... hmm I think W222 F/L that I had before my EQS is about par on ride quality with the EQS.
The EQS is definitely not considered to be an electrified CLS by any stretch of the imagination - no matter how you think about it. Mercedes promotes it as the electrified S class and one search on Youtube has every auto outlet referring to it as such.
The EQS is definitely not considered to be an electrified CLS by any stretch of the imagination - no matter how you think about it. Mercedes promotes it as the electrified S class and one search on Youtube has every auto outlet referring to it as such.
Mercedes promotes it as such, but that’s not what they actually built. All you have to do is sit in an EQS and sit in a W223 and that’s obvious. The finishes in the EQS are much more in line with an E Class or a CLS.
Mercedes promotes the GLS as the “SUV S Class” too, but it’s not finished like an S Class inside either.
The EQS is definitely not considered to be an electrified CLS by any stretch of the imagination - no matter how you think about it. Mercedes promotes it as the electrified S class and one search on Youtube has every auto outlet referring to it as such.
You said it… it is a promotion. Using the name and reputation of the S-class line to “promote” the EQS. Beside the options on a piece of paper, I don’t see any common features between the EQS and W223. I would get an electrified W223 literally tomorrow; but I wouldn’t yet even consider the EQS today. They are just at a different level. The W223 itself is not that refined in my view, and knowing that the EQS is even less refined, that by itself tells you how far EQS is from a true S-class level. I would agree with the assessment that EQS would have been received better by Mbenz fans if it was “promoted” as the electrified CLS which is a fair assessment, but again, satisfying opinions of some fans is not as important as promoting it as an S-class. Still, it is not an S-class and not even close. If that’s what they truly wanted, they should have done the same thing that BMW did with the 7-series… same car, different drivetrains. I really doubt that the cost of making the EQS (minus the drivetrain) is the same as making the W223 (minus the drivetrain). I like both equally, but the EQS is not an S-class in my view, not even close. That is not meant to take anything away from the EQS as I myself switches from an S-class to a lower built quality Tesla EV and am still super happy, but; dare I say that my car is as refined as an S-class.. Of course it is not. I think it is better for my needs; BUT it is not even close to the refinement of an S-class and that is also true about the EQS.
After-all, this is all subjective. There is no right or wrong opinion here; it’s just how I feel about the EQS. Good car but not an S-class.
You said it… it is a promotion. Using the name and reputation of the S-class line to “promote” the EQS. Beside the options on a piece of paper, I don’t see any common features between the EQS and W223. I would get an electrified W223 literally tomorrow; but I wouldn’t yet even consider the EQS today. They are just at a different level. The W223 itself is not that refined in my view, and knowing that the EQS is even less refined, that by itself tells you how far EQS is from a true S-class level. I would agree with the assessment that EQS would have been received better by Mbenz fans if it was “promoted” as the electrified CLS which is a fair assessment, but again, satisfying opinions of some fans is not as important as promoting it as an S-class. Still, it is not an S-class and not even close. If that’s what they truly wanted, they should have done the same thing that BMW did with the 7-series… same car, different drivetrains. I really doubt that the cost of making the EQS (minus the drivetrain) is the same as making the W223 (minus the drivetrain). I like both equally, but the EQS is not an S-class in my view, not even close. That is not meant to take anything away from the EQS as I myself switches from an S-class to a lower built quality Tesla EV and am still super happy, but; dare I say that my car is as refined as an S-class.. Of course it is not. I think it is better for my needs; BUT it is not even close to the refinement of an S-class and that is also true about the EQS.
After-all, this is all subjective. There is no right or wrong opinion here; it’s just how I feel about the EQS. Good car but not an S-class.
Well, everything is in the eye of the beholder. The only reason that the Model S sells even in the small numbers that they do is that they dropped the price by 40%. I remember Tesla quoting me $165k for a MS P100D in 2017. These kind of price drops are something unheard of with any other make/model. Great car for the money IMO, but this car has never been anything like a S-Class level, as you stated.
I think the biggest issue with the EQS was one of expectations. MB showed off the Vision EQS which was an absolutely stunning design (https://www.mercedes-benz.com/en/inn...rs/vision-eqs/) and if the production car would have looked anything like it these cars would have sold like hotcakes. The i7 looks hideous compared to that, all of its qualities aside.
To me, the current EQS is a Gen.1 design and one on a budget. We know that MB can build more luxury into cars but I think this model is a balancing act for the company and others that had to heavily invest into EV tech. Given the manufacturing & R&D costs the EQS as-is costs more than the W223 S-Class and provides lower margins. Tesla had the pleasure of losing big money for years on end; Mercedes did not have that luxury so I feel that these cars will get better as it gets cheaper to manufacture and margins increase. I look forward to the next true S-Class (level) EV...
2019 SL450, 2019 E450 Luxury Trim Wagon, 2024 BMW I7 xDrive60
I’m sorry, but the EQS Sedan is a joke, compared to the I7. The two cars are in completely different leagues. About the only things they have in common is that they both come from German companies and are both EV’s, that’s it! The EQS feels like something one might expect from Toyota these days. But, you have to hand it to the marketing people at MB as they have convinced the unknowing masses that this egg shaped, mediocre thing is an S Class. How revolting!
2019 SL450, 2019 E450 Luxury Trim Wagon, 2024 BMW I7 xDrive60
Originally Posted by Wolfman
Well, everything is in the eye of the beholder. The only reason that the Model S sells even in the small numbers that they do is that they dropped the price by 40%. I remember Tesla quoting me $165k for a MS P100D in 2017. These kind of price drops are something unheard of with any other make/model. Great car for the money IMO, but this car has never been anything like a S-Class level, as you stated.
I think the biggest issue with the EQS was one of expectations. MB showed off the Vision EQS which was an absolutely stunning design (https://www.mercedes-benz.com/en/inn...rs/vision-eqs/) and if the production car would have looked anything like it these cars would have sold like hotcakes. The i7 looks hideous compared to that, all of its qualities aside.
To me, the current EQS is a Gen.1 design and one on a budget. We know that MB can build more luxury into cars but I think this model is a balancing act for the company and others that had to heavily invest into EV tech. Given the manufacturing & R&D costs the EQS as-is costs more than the W223 S-Class and provides lower margins. Tesla had the pleasure of losing big money for years on end; Mercedes did not have that luxury so I feel that these cars will get better as it gets cheaper to manufacture and margins increase. I look forward to the next true S-Class (level) EV...
As a very long time MB driver and enthusiastic customer, I feel as though the folks in Stuttgart have really tripped and fallen. I don’t know if some long time employees in key positions have retired, possibly due to the CCP Virus fiasco or whatever, but the passenger vehicles currently being offered by the brand are, without a doubt, “THE” most mediocre, lackluster and least appealing that I can remember. Since my first 350SL in 1972, there have always been new MB’s that I have lusted after, but today, there is not one vehicle in their entire lineup that I find interesting enough to want. The EQS to me, was just such a huge, missed opportunity. That car should have been a moon shot, but instead it opened the door for BMW & others to take the lead in EV’s. MB just CHEAPED OUT when it came to the EQS & other recent designs. I feel the same about the W223, the R232 SL, etc. MB has lost their edge, in my opinion.
I’m sorry, but the EQS Sedan is a joke, compared to the I7. The two cars are in completely different leagues. About the only things they have in common is that they both come from German companies and are both EV’s, that’s it! The EQS feels like something one might expect from Toyota these days. But, you have to hand it to the marketing people at MB as they have convinced the unknowing masses that this egg shaped, mediocre thing is an S Class. How revolting!
I just recently heard this saying about negative people in the workplace and why you should get rid of them. It seemed fitting here. The negative ones always need other people to be negative with so as a result, they bring everyone down. To me it seems like nearly everything you contribute to the W223 forum has such a negative tone.
While I agree that the interiors of the EQ lines are not representative of the best interiors MB has ever done, sorry no, the EQS simply does not compare to Toyota products in any way. That is deluded.
I think MBs interiors of all of their latest generations of cars have a little more cost cutting compared to their predecessors, but they are still some of the nicest and best cars available today.
2019 SL450, 2019 E450 Luxury Trim Wagon, 2024 BMW I7 xDrive60
Originally Posted by QuadBenz
I just recently heard this saying about negative people in the workplace and why you should get rid of them. It seemed fitting here. The negative ones always need other people to be negative with so as a result, they bring everyone down. To me it seems like nearly everything you contribute to the W223 forum has such a negative tone.
While I agree that the interiors of the EQ lines are not representative of the best interiors MB has ever done, sorry no, the EQS simply does not compare to Toyota products in any way. That is deluded.
I think MBs interiors of all of their latest generations of cars have a little more cost cutting compared to their predecessors, but they are still some of the nicest and best cars available today.
Believe me when I say that being negative about current MB offerings brings me NO joy. I’ve had 17 brand new ones and several used. That said, I believe in telling it how it is and it currently STINKS! I can remember when I got my new 2018 S560 and I was so excited and impressed with it that some here posted that they were sick of hearing me gush about the car. Oh well, can’t please all the people all of the time.
As a very long time MB driver and enthusiastic customer, I feel as though the folks in Stuttgart have really tripped and fallen. I don’t know if some long time employees in key positions have retired, possibly due to the CCP Virus fiasco or whatever, but the passenger vehicles currently being offered by the brand are, without a doubt, “THE” most mediocre, lackluster and least appealing that I can remember. Since my first 350SL in 1972, there have always been new MB’s that I have lusted after, but today, there is not one vehicle in their entire lineup that I find interesting enough to want. The EQS to me, was just such a huge, missed opportunity. That car should have been a moon shot, but instead it opened the door for BMW & others to take the lead in EV’s. MB just CHEAPED OUT when it came to the EQS & other recent designs. I feel the same about the W223, the R232 SL, etc. MB has lost their edge, in my opinion.
Well, it is a matter of opinion. I definitely like MB's new ICE designs better. For me, the R232 and the W223 are definite improvements over their predecessors; some individual issues or design choices notwithstanding. Quality-wise, nothing comes close to the quality disasters of 2000-2007. Not by a long shot. Understandably, this is painful and a lot of issues have to be figured out. Luckily a lot of this is just software which is easier to resolve.
Clearly, the supply chain issues have hit MB significantly and likely more than others. To some extend, running a leaner, more efficient inventory model can do that btw. I already posted my rationale on the EQS; I would take purchased the EQS on day 1 if it looked like the Vision EQS, including the current interior and would have been happy. As for the EV lead, it's definitely not BMW but they have some catching up to do.
2019 SL450, 2019 E450 Luxury Trim Wagon, 2024 BMW I7 xDrive60
Originally Posted by Wolfman
..........Luckily a lot of this is just software which is easier to resolve..........
I cannot agree. If it was so easy to fix with software updates, WHY haven't they fixed so many issues already? The transmission issues have persisted for sometime now. They kept saying that "a software patch" was coming when I had my new 2020 S560. I held onto that car waiting to get a 2022 and during that entire time, no software patch was ever offered. Then, when I got the 2022, different--but still very irritating, very sloppy shifting issues with the transmission and during the 18 months I had the car, no software updates were offered. My current 2020 S560, which I recently bought CPO, also has a transmission that is not all that smooth, but I feel the issue is not a severe enough one to complain about. So, it has been years now and MB transmissions--at least in their S Class models--are still not right. No software patch, no nothing. Not good.
I cannot agree. If it was so easy to fix with software updates, WHY haven't they fixed so many issues already? The transmission issues have persisted for sometime now. They kept saying that "a software patch" was coming when I had my new 2020 S560. I held onto that car waiting to get a 2022 and during that entire time, no software patch was ever offered. Then, when I got the 2022, different--but still very irritating, very sloppy shifting issues with the transmission and during the 18 months I had the car, no software updates were offered. My current 2020 S560, which I recently bought CPO, also has a transmission that is not all that smooth, but I feel the issue is not a severe enough one to complain about. So, it has been years now and MB transmissions--at least in their S Class models--are still not right. No software patch, no nothing. Not good.
I said easier to resolve although I have never experienced the issues you have and have definitely the same transmission. I also know that my driving style is very different than yours
But I can say that my favorite transmissions are the 8 speed ZF in the BMW (they do the best software mating it to their engines) and the Getrag DCT.
2019 SL450, 2019 E450 Luxury Trim Wagon, 2024 BMW I7 xDrive60
Originally Posted by Wolfman
I said easier to resolve although I have never experienced the issues you have and have definitely the same transmission. I also know that my driving style is very different than yours
But I can say that my favorite transmissions are the 8 speed ZF in the BMW (they do the best software mating it to their engines) and the Getrag DCT.
With everything MB has on its plate these days, perhaps it is time to contract with ZF and resolve the transmission problem once and for all.
On a side note, the 9-speed units in our 2019 E450 Wagon and 2019 SL450 operate flawlessly. Something happened in 2020 and has festered ever since.
With everything MB has on its plate these days, perhaps it is time to contract with ZF and resolve the transmission problem once and for all.
On a side note, the 9-speed units in our 2019 E450 Wagon and 2019 SL450 operate flawlessly. Something happened in 2020 and has festered ever since.
ZF transmissions are best in class but I am sure that MB sees the design and manufacturing of their own transmissions as a competitive advantage. Our 9 speed is in a 2020 but the software will vary between models...
2019 SL450, 2019 E450 Luxury Trim Wagon, 2024 BMW I7 xDrive60
Originally Posted by Wolfman
ZF transmissions are best in class but I am sure that MB sees the design and manufacturing of their own transmissions as a competitive advantage. Our 9 speed is in a 2020 but the software will vary between models...
Yes, BUT if they can’t get the transmissions to work properly and are turning customers off, it might be time to rethink their position.
Regarding the Vision EQS Concept, of course that's a cool, good looking car, it's a concept. I can't help but see how much influence there is with the production EQS. But yes, I get it, the resulting egg shape and interior fell short, for some way too short. Regarding the transmission, specifically the ZF, yes ZF is the better option. But, why invest in that or improving their own 9 speed when the future requires no transmission?
Regarding the transmission, specifically the ZF, yes ZF is the better option. But, why invest in that or improving their own 9 speed when the future requires no transmission?
Out of respect for people paying $130,000+ for your car now?
As a very long time MB driver and enthusiastic customer, I feel as though the folks in Stuttgart have really tripped and fallen. I don’t know if some long time employees in key positions have retired, possibly due to the CCP Virus fiasco or whatever, but the passenger vehicles currently being offered by the brand are, without a doubt, “THE” most mediocre, lackluster and least appealing that I can remember. Since my first 350SL in 1972, there have always been new MB’s that I have lusted after, but today, there is not one vehicle in their entire lineup that I find interesting enough to want. The EQS to me, was just such a huge, missed opportunity. That car should have been a moon shot, but instead it opened the door for BMW & others to take the lead in EV’s. MB just CHEAPED OUT when it came to the EQS & other recent designs. I feel the same about the W223, the R232 SL, etc. MB has lost their edge, in my opinion.
I have exactly the same cabinet in my garage as well. I thought it was funny.
Of course MB should have designed a better transmission, or put in place an agreement with ZF many years ago. As this topic is about the EQS (admittedly in the 223 section) my point is, and as you know reading your comments about the I7, the problems some have with shifting are gone with EVs. My last car had the 9 speed, it was ok. My other car is a BMW with the ZF 8 speed and it is the best automatic (torque converter variety) I've ever experienced.
Originally Posted by SW20S
Out of respect for people paying $130,000+ for your car now?
Of course MB should have designed a better transmission, or put in place an agreement with ZF many years ago. As this topic is about the EQS (admittedly in the 223 section) my point is, and as you know reading your comments about the I7, the problems some have with shifting are gone with EVs. My last car had the 9 speed, it was ok. My other car is a BMW with the ZF 8 speed and it is the best automatic (torque converter variety) I've ever experienced.
My facelift W222 had no shifting issues at all. Not as smooth as a BMW (reference: X7 and X5) but still really smooth that passenger can't always* tell when the car shifts from one gear to another. I do agree, however, that there were a few isolated issues related to the transmission on some W222 facelift. The transmission on the W222 pre-facelift was a disaster to deal with.
As for EQS, it's smooth being an EV, but now Mbenz is leaving the transmission issue behind and currently not able to solve the whining noise in their electric motors (EQS has excellent range, but really bad motors at least from a noise/whining perspective).
The motor noise is there to a point. All good things for people to consider.
Originally Posted by S_W222
My facelift W222 had no shifting issues at all. Not as smooth as a BMW (reference: X7 and X5) but still really smooth that passenger can't always* tell when the car shifts from one gear to another. I do agree, however, that there were a few isolated issues related to the transmission on some W222 facelift. The transmission on the W222 pre-facelift was a disaster to deal with.
As for EQS, it's smooth being an EV, but now Mbenz is leaving the transmission issue behind and currently not able to solve the whining noise in their electric motors (EQS has excellent range, but really bad motors at least from a noise/whining perspective).
I didn't notice any whining from the EQS motors in the 450 or 580 variants, but maybe my ears just didn't catch it? If anything I mainly just noticed how quiet it was.
I didn't notice any whining from the EQS motors in the 450 or 580 variants, but maybe my ears just didn't catch it? If anything I mainly just noticed how quiet it was.
The EQS is SUPER quite to the fact I loved that aspect of it, but the motor whining noise, I believe, maybe different from one person to another depending on their hearing… My hearing gets me into trouble sometimes with vehicles so don’t take my feedback as a valid baseline, lol. However, the whining noise in the EQS was reported by several people online too, so it may not be just me. Relatively speaking, am sure it’s one of the loudest motors compared to other EVs. It may be still be acceptable to many people though. Hearing and sensitivity to noises in a given Hz range isn’t something we can generalize.
Mercedes SLR McLaren 722 S Is Extremely Rare Example Modified by McLaren
Slideshow: A one-of-one U.S.-spec Mercedes-Benz SLR McLaren Roadster became even rarer after a factory-backed transformation at McLaren's headquarters.
