amir1

I ordered the S65 Coupe for European delivery. Scheduled to be picked up in Mid September. Mercedes basically changed my car's configuration without my knowledge or asking and wanted to know if this is normal and what would you do?
I ordered the Wood/leather steering wheel. I got the Leather steering wheel. I ordered the magic sky roof and heated windshield and neither were added to the build. I do have a confirmation listing my build with the wood leather steering wheel, with the magic sky control and with the heated windshield. I can live without the heated windshield, but really wanted the magic sky control and I love wood/leather steering wheels. I can live with a leather only steering wheel if that was the only mishap. Any ideas about recourse? (other than to walk away). This is my first European delivery and first car of this caliber and price point. Its disappointing to say the least and i'm really not sure I want it as configured. (Maybe i'll be more forgiving in a day or two when the disappointment wears off) Anyway, any comments or advice will be greatly appreciated. Uggghh

efathalla

Personally, I wouldn't accept it unless you can let things go when you spend that much money on a car you need it to be exactly what you are looking for!
The heated windshield it's always a plus, but both of the steering wheel and the magic sky control are little small details that make a total driving experience especially if you live in a sunny state.
I would try to get your dealer to allocate another build slot and build it to your specs.

jbattan

The same thing happened to me. See my posting in this forum from a few months ago. It wasn’t clear looking at NetStar who made the change or how it happened. About five things changed on my config. I told the dealer I would consider re-ordering through them if they gave me an additional discount, so they gave me $2000 for my troubles.

MTrauman

First Question—Who made the change? The Euro Delivery Dept at MBUSA or your dealer? The Euro Delivery Dept sometimes have constraints based on time frame you are picking up the car. Did you get an e-mail from MBUSA Euro Delivery people such as a new “Confirmation of Order and Invoice” that shows the change?

I have done Euro Delivery in the past with my most recent being Nov 2018 for my ‘19 S63. So I am very familiar with the process. In my opinion you need to find out why the change was made and if you want the car spec’d as you initially laid out, find out how to make that happen.

ygmn

walk

MTrauman

That’s the easy way out on a Euro Delivery. The first question for OP is—Did OP get a Confirmed Order from MBUSA with a Confirmed delivery date with the car the way he wanted it? If so, this is a contractual relationship. This is different than an order at a dealer. Sounds like there may be some lack of communication between the dealer and MBUSA but I don’t know. Another question for OP—does the dealer have experience with Euro Delivery? Once a confirmation is generated by MBUSA it is very unlikely that changes occur to the extent OP stated—but then again it is not my order so I don’t know. So something sounds fishy to me. Usually when an order is first placed for Euro Delivery, they are attempting to get the customer’s order exactly as they want it. My last Euro Delivery went through a few different reiterations to get all the options ordered. I had to wait almost six months from my order date until delivery to get what I wanted. I ordered every option in my ‘19 S63 sedan except for Carbon Ceramic Brakes and the $5000 color changing Magic Sky Control. So I went through a number of changes in confirmation of order at the beginning to get the car ordered the way I wanted it.

COOPERDB

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For the price of the C217 S65 Coupe you should

be getting the Coupe just the way you ordered it -

I would not have checked the heated windshield

if I lived in L.A....

If the dealer you ordered thru can't correct your order

I would walk - to another dealer and order it the way you want -

- just curious - did you order the CCB's -


Thank-You
D.B.


.

amir1

Thanks for all the comments and suggestions. I ordered the car on Feb/5th. The builds for the S65 Coupes closed on Feb/9th. I cannot order another S65 Coupe since Mercedes does not make the V12s any more. (Feb/9th was the last day to submit a build for a v12). I did get a confirmation from MBZ European delivery department showing the build exactly the way I wanted it. The car was built in May. No one called me to let me know of the changes until earlier this week when the dealer called me to schedule an appointent to come in and pay for the car. At that point the rep realized there was a price difference, which led to him discovering the changes to the build. Talking to a friend who's been working at a MBZ dealer (in another state) for over 20 years, he stated the following: Sometimes they don't have the parts available, so they skip or swap options. If they know way ahead of time, you might get notified and asked what you want to do about it. It also happens while on the assembly line. (They won't hold the assembly line, so they build it with what they have). Since this is the very end of the S65 coupe model run, its possible they are out of some parts and therefore, didn't want to make any more. I can see that regarding the Magic Sky feature, but they should have steering wheels since they are a replaceable part. Bottom line, at this point I will not get the heated windshield nor the magic sky. The heated windshield is no big deal since i'm in California. (I figured i'll add it since it was only $500). I will miss the Magic sky though. I'm not a big fan of the plain leather steering wheel and got a qoute from Brabus to replace the steering wheel to the wood/leather one for $5300.00 (Seems very high). I did not order the CCBs. I have no intention of tracking the car. After talking to our local AMG regional manager and three AMG managers at three different dealers, they all recommended that I do NOT get the CCBs. The primary reason not to get them was that besides the need to break them in, you need to brake agressively on a regular basis to heat them up properly so they get re-coated. Otherwise they squeeke. (Squeeking typically starts after about 5000 miles, once the CCBs got burnished due to not re-coating them on a regular basis) As it turns out, the number one complaint is CCBs squeeking. (Two AMG managers at two separate dealers have had customers trade-in their S-Coupes since they couldn't stand the squeeking of the CCBs any more). My configuration was built around making the car as luxurious as possible. Hence the Magic sky, heated winshield, wood steering, and no CCBs. I searched on-line for new S65 Coupes for sale and I only found 4 in the U.S. and didn't like the configurations of any of them. In addition, I have my European trip all purchased and planned out, so my wife and I really don't want to cancel it at this time. So I informed the dealer that they should expect to extend a substantial discount at this time to make this happen. I would like to swap out the steering wheel though once the car arrives in the U.S. Has any one ever changed steering sheels? Will doing so void the warranty? Any advise?

jbattan

Good call on avoiding CCBs. One of the mysterious changes on my order was the deletion of just the right badge, so it was very unlikely due to a parts shortage.

Keon

Is there a specific reason you chose the V12 model?
Also you should just refuse delivery unless they can give you what you wanted.

amir1

I chose the V12 since Its more luxurious, more exclusive and more special in my opinion than the S63. Nothing against the S63, its just that I prefer what the S65 has to offer. (its not everyone's choice - I get it). I decided not to walk away from the car since its this one, or another one from existing inventory in the U.S. (there are only 4 to chose from and I don't like any of them) or a used one (which I didn't like either) I wish I could simply order another one, but that's no longer possible since the S65 Coupe has reached the end of its run and they aren't making any more. Life is a compromise. I'll live without the Magic Sky and heated windshield and found out that I can change the steering wheel to the wood/leather one I want (for a price). So now all that's left is to renegotiate with the dealer a better price to compensate for the shortcomings. Its still an amazing car and I can't believe how fortunate I am to get one, let alone fuss over whether my car will have this feature or that. (May those be our problems in life...) I do plan to swap out the run flats once the car arrives in the U.A. along with swapping out the steering wheel. So all in all, its still an amazing car. Thanks to all for your comments.

Tirgoman

I think you made the right choice, the heated windshield does impair vision somewhat depending on conditions, I personally turned down a car because of it. Plus you don't need it in CA. The magic roof to me would not be big deal. And the steering wheel can be swapped easily, the controls are all the same and your dealer should be eager to swap it out to make you happy. Allocation or availability of particular options is a problem that always exists, the problem is nobody notified you and this falls directly on the dealer because I'd bet you they were notified especially on a customer order car. Sounds like they screwed up and should be bending over backwards to compensate and make you happy.

Keon

Great, enjoy your car and make sure to post pictures!

Heisenberg

I have iron brakes on my S63 and CCB on my 720S. My thoughts on S63:

I'd actually suggest getting the CCBs if you do not plan on tracking the car, and iron brakes if you do. If you track frequently, the CCBs will be more expensive because of the much higher cost for consumables i.e. replacement pads and rotors. Advantage of CCBs for track cars is primarily resistance to fade, not so much longevity. No brakes are going to last very long on a 4800 lb car driven full ***** on a track. But how many S63/S65 Coupe owners actually track their cars ?!

With street use the CCBs should last 100k miles, steel brakes maybe 33k miles. And dealers won't just replace pads and resurface rotors - they will say you have to buy new rotors. So each set of new F/R iron brakes is about $6000 or 2/3rd cost of the CCB option. So around 50k miles your investment in CCBs will have basically paid for itself. That said, you can absolutely save $ on brake work by going to an independent shop, if you have one that can be trusted.

Another bonus to CCBs is the near complete absence of brake dust, and the little dust that does accumulate isn't nearly as sticky as iron brake dust. A leaf blower will clean your wheels! And when they start squeaking, wash them out good and they become silent.

While it is an expensive option, $8950 is actually quite reasonable for ceramic brakes - parts and labor for retrofit would likely be at least double that. They are also probably the least common option on these cars, and one of the few that might maintain value at time of resale.

COOPERDB

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THIS ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^

For gosh sake"s whoever is in charge please make this a sticky -

You have posted this information before -

I have posted said information a half a dozen times in this sub-forum

as well as the W222 sub-forum -

I have two friends who when ordering their Coupes did not

listen to the math lesson I presented -

20,000 miles later and $6000+ for a full F/R brake job with

new pads and rotors and one of them now says that I

should have made a more forceful argument for the CCB's -

What -

And with the Iron brakes the rear rotors will wear faster

on the Coupe than the fronts -

I firmly believe that the mis-information regarding the alleged

negatives of having CCB's is propagated by those who did not

want to pony up for the CCB's -

I do not know one S Class owner with CCB's who would not

order them again -


Thank-You
D.B.


.

Dan_B

1. The coupe with CCBs is a totally different and awesome car. I will NEVER buy an S Coupe AMG without CCBs. It is foolish on both maintenance cost and driving experience. If you are getting an AMG, get CCBs, and you will not regret it.

2. How do I know? I am one of the people who did not listen to DB to begin with, ended up paying thousands to replace the worn iron breaks, and then an additional many thousands to retrofit CCBs. It's an awesome upgrade and all the BS against them come from people who do not own a coupe with CCBs. Do yourself a favor and listen (or read) DB's post.

This = ME AND MY COUPE ...."I have two friends who when ordering their Coupes did not listen to the math lesson I presented -20,000 miles later and $6000+ for a full F/R brake job with new pads and rotors and one of them now says that I should have made a more forceful argument for the CCB's"

ALSO: There are many valid threads here from DB and Heisenberg as well as one picture thread from me. It takes a lot of time and money to remedy this mistake after the fact. And whomever claims otherwise should get first hand experience before spreading rubbish against them. You can see the bill for retrofitting CCBs on the AMG Private Lounge. It's expensive and worth every penny.



CCBs make a huge difference in driving AND save money if you get them during the original build!

COOPERDB

`


For those who are too lazy to search -





A big thanks to Dan for posting the bill -

When ordering your S Class - the $9K for the CCB's is a bargain -

And for those of you who finance your purchase the cost of the CCB's

will add what to your monthly payment - maybe $100.00 if that -

And they are a plus when selling or trading in your S Class -

Food for thought so eat up -


Thank-You
D.B.

Viper98912

My humble opinion (and I work in the auto industry)

In today's tight auto mfg industry, they don't "make changes on the assembly line" with whatever parts are left. That's nearly impossible in today's day and age.

What most likely happened is someone in the materials planning department noticed that they could not get the right parts from a supplier to get your order complete. There are multiple reasons this can happen, and it appears the proper processes are not setup to inform the customer of the issue.

The surprising thing I see though - contractually, suppliers are required to make service parts for 10-15 years after the end of the model run. So are they deleting the wood wheel and sky roof altogether? Because if they are, there still should be parts available. So to me this all boils down to potentially trying to get your car "out" rather than have it as pending for a long time.

At the end of the day, I do notice that you have a special requirement in your build - the V12. Because of the deletion of the V12, this may have been the requirement to get your car out, because if not, you may have never received your car if it didn't get built before a certain time frame.

So you need to make a decision - is the V12 more important to you than the other features? If so, I'd say take the car as is (I personally think that yes the V12 is most important). Nonetheless, if you think that you can "stick it" to the company by rejecting the car, you're not. They'll just sell it to someone else. So rather than "proving a point", think about yourself first - is the V12 most important? If yes, take the car and enjoy the heck out of it.

haa

My cost for maintaining the brakes on my 2017 S63 Cabriolet (Edition 130) is somewhat different! Of course with the Edition 130 I did not have the option to order CCBs and I drive mostly on the highway and all my maintenance is performed at my dealer so here is the break down of my expenses.

At 27,000 miles dealer recommended replacing rear brake pads and rotors were within specs ($500)
At 50,000 miles dealer recommended replacing front brake pads and rotors were within specs ($590)
At 55,000 miles dealer recommended replacing rear brake pads and rotors were within specs ($500)

Based on that wear rate at 78,000 miles will need to replace rear pads and rotors ($3000) and at 100,000 miles replace front pads and rotors ($3000) plus rear pads at 106,000 Miles ($500)
So my anticipated total cost to maintain the brakes up to 106,000 Miles is: $8090

Assuming the CCB will need to be replaced at 100,000 the cost will be $9000 for the CCB option plus $11,000 for the pads and rotors = $20,000 or more than double the cost of the standard AMG brakes in the 1st 100,000 miles. The difference to maintain the brakes narrows down from 100,000 to 200,000 miles to approx $3000.

amir1

At this level of a car ($180,000 or more) for most, cost is not a big factor. It’s preference. There are advantages and disadvantages to both. I configured my S65 coupe with regular brakes after three Amg service managers told me that the number one complaint with CCBs is squeaking. Since I will never track my car, the regular brakes are therefore the preferred option for me. Cost had nothing to do with my decision, just preference.

Dan_B

It depends on your options (e.g. keeping the breaks dry/ready in rain, lane assist) and how you drive. My rear breaks went at six or seven thousand and pad and rotors, then the fronts - a lot of wasted money. Thus my getting rid of the regular breaks and moving to CCBs. Even better, the driving experience is far better. That said, to each her/his own. My only regret is not going with CCB in the build.

Dan_B

I have had them for a while now, and initially they nearly squeaked very little, and all it takes is one good hard breaking to warm them up. Now, I can't hear then from the moment I start the coupe to wherever I drive. Try it before listening to people who don't drive daily with CCBs -- you don't own a coupe to drive Below the speed limit :-)

Anyway, as the discussion is circular and depends on hear-say, I'll bow out of it, and suggest each owner do what's best for them.

COOPERDB

`


Posted by Heisenberg in this thread -

https://mbworld.org/forums/s63-amg-4...ml#post7824325

" Dealerships make a lot of money on replacing steel brakes on AMGs. That's another dis-incentive to selling CCB-equipped cars o their customers - over the life of a car, there is more profit to be made from service and parts than over the initial sale particularly when they are discounting new cars 5-7% off MSRP for savvy buyers. "


Thank-You
D.B.


.


.

haa

Agree with you and there is a huge profit margin in replacing brake pads and rotors with 40% dealer markup on parts in addition to the labor. Therefore there is tremendous pressure on the service advisors to recommend replacing brake pads and rotors prematurely. My advice is do not replace the brake pads until the brake pad wear light comes on and in general AMG steel rotors will last through 2 sets of pads in the front and 3 sets of pads in the rear unless they are warped and vibrating.

daviper

I wanted to share some info on here that might be useful to others in the future. I bought my S63 Coupe Used, and when I was trying to decide between an S550 Coupe and an S63 Coupe (only about a $10,000-$15,000 difference in the used market for a 2015-2016) - the brakes were a major factor in my decision, as I had done my research and learned that the S63's can need pads/rotors every 20,000 miles and it's a $7,000 job to replace them because of the parts costs. I did ultimately end up going with the S63 Coupe when I learned that my pads/rotors had just been replaced for the CPO process on my car, but I did do some research in the meantime so that when it comes time to replace my rotors I know if there are less expensive options than OEM.

What I found out is that there may be an aftermarket replacement rotor coming to the market soon for these cars from Centric. I noticed that Centric (major rotor manufacturer) has rotors listed for the S63 on their website - but nobody has them listed in stock or with a price. The part #'s are 127.35148 (Front) and 127.35151 (Rear). I contacted Centric and was told "We wait about 5 years to begin producing parts that Mercedes, BMW, Porsche, etc.. usually offer warranty replacements for. As the warranties expire, and the demand for the aftermarket increases, we will begin to develop these parts. Given that your vehicle is around the right age, I presume we might have something available by the end of 2020."

This makes a lot of sense to me, as once the car's value decreases, cheaper parts will need to be available for the subsequent owners to be able to afford to service them. A $7,000 brake job is expensive on a $180,000 car - but imagine someone eventually buying the car for $30,000-$50,000 and having a $7,000 brake service cost....

This isn't a definite solution to the problem - but it may mean a more reasonable Rotor replacement cost in the future (what makes up the majority of the cost when you break it out).

I also wanted to share that I contacted GiroDisc, and they DO say they have rotors for the S63, at a quoted cost of "$1,400 for the front set, and $1,300 for the rear set". I haven't looked into that brand further - but it's good to know at least there are starting to be some cheaper options available for replacing the steel rotors on the S63. I also see the TopEuro rotors on eBay, but I don't know anything about that company and don't think I'd chance trying those on my car....Centric at least is a major rotor manufacturer that makes quality products.