SL/R230: My hardtop goes up & down "sluggishly"!
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 123
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From: Allentown, Pa
2011 350 4Matic EClass Sport Edition and 2003 500SL & 2010 Range Rover Sport
My hardtop goes up & down "sluggishly"!
All of a sudden, the hardtop on my SL500 goes down very slowly, and sometimes stops. I have to keep pushing the control down. Then, of course, the top comes out slowly too. It used to take about 15 seconds. What can I tell the Dealer to check and correct? I know some of you may have had this problem.
I'm afraid it's going to get stuck halfway up or down in operation.
My '03 SL 500 just turned 10,000 miles.
Stan
I'm afraid it's going to get stuck halfway up or down in operation.
My '03 SL 500 just turned 10,000 miles.
Stan
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From: Atlanta, unfortunately
'09 S600, (2) R129 300SLs, '03 SL500, '03 SL55
According to a service bulletin a possible cause is: "An air bubble is present above the upper intake hole in the expansion reservoir of the hydraulic unit" (picture). The solution is to unbolt the pump, prop it up with the motor end of the unit raised, and then operate the roof. If this does not solve the problem the next step is to check the hydraulic pressure using the Star Diagnosis system.
If you go to the dealer I'm very curious to know what they tell you. I think they may tell you that you need new hydraulics. If that happens the bill will probably be expensive, but a much cheaper alternative would be to do the repairs yourself.
I hope you'll post back with updates of your progress.
If you go to the dealer I'm very curious to know what they tell you. I think they may tell you that you need new hydraulics. If that happens the bill will probably be expensive, but a much cheaper alternative would be to do the repairs yourself.
I hope you'll post back with updates of your progress.
Last edited by bobterry99; Jun 15, 2008 at 01:19 PM.
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 123
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From: Allentown, Pa
2011 350 4Matic EClass Sport Edition and 2003 500SL & 2010 Range Rover Sport
Thank you for your response. I sure will report back to the forum.
Where exactly is this hydraulic pump?
Stan
Where exactly is this hydraulic pump?
Stan
Banned
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,982
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From: Atlanta, unfortunately
'09 S600, (2) R129 300SLs, '03 SL500, '03 SL55
The pump is in the bottom of the trunk to the left of the spare tire. The picture below shows the pump unbolted and propped-up to run and eliminate the air bubble...
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 123
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From: Allentown, Pa
2011 350 4Matic EClass Sport Edition and 2003 500SL & 2010 Range Rover Sport
My dealer looked at mine today...you can see the hydraulic motor control in the trunk on the left side of the spare. My fluid was very low for some reason. It's going in the shop on Thursday. I hope my top is fixed by just the addition of fluid. We'll see. Where it's leaking, I do not know. There certainly are no drippings on my garage floor.
My Sl500 is an 03, but I bought it with only 7800 miles on it. It sat for a while in the former owner's garage. The top worked perfectly when I got it, but I believe that by operating it when I got it, that after so many years not being used, the fluid was quickly used somehow. This is my theory. It's not based on any real knowledge, but I'm trying to figure out why the fluid was so low. The hydraulic cylinder in the trunk is transparent...so you can easily see the level of the fluid. Mine was WAY below where it should be. Perhaps dry seals or something. I'm looking forward to Thursday night when I pick the car up. Hopefully, my slow top problem will have been solved.
Stan
My Sl500 is an 03, but I bought it with only 7800 miles on it. It sat for a while in the former owner's garage. The top worked perfectly when I got it, but I believe that by operating it when I got it, that after so many years not being used, the fluid was quickly used somehow. This is my theory. It's not based on any real knowledge, but I'm trying to figure out why the fluid was so low. The hydraulic cylinder in the trunk is transparent...so you can easily see the level of the fluid. Mine was WAY below where it should be. Perhaps dry seals or something. I'm looking forward to Thursday night when I pick the car up. Hopefully, my slow top problem will have been solved.
Stan
Last edited by spilok; Jun 16, 2008 at 08:01 PM.
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From: Tallahassee, Florida
2006 SL600, 2001 S500, 1996 SL320
I hope so too.
I hope it is a simple fix for your car. As much as we all seem to want the newest out there, nowadays cars, computers, software all seem to have beta versions out on the first try and as consumers we seem to pay for it.
Thread Starter
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 123
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From: Allentown, Pa
2011 350 4Matic EClass Sport Edition and 2003 500SL & 2010 Range Rover Sport
Thanks. I hope so too. Fortunately, I bought an all inclusive warranty when I bought the car. Good for 36,000 miles or 5 years. No deductible. I'm sure that if it is more serious, it will be covered.
All I know is...it's getting warm in in Pennsylvania, and I WANT my SL 500 totally operational.
Stan
All I know is...it's getting warm in in Pennsylvania, and I WANT my SL 500 totally operational.
Stan
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SL500
All of a sudden, the hardtop on my SL500 goes down very slowly, and sometimes stops. I have to keep pushing the control down. Then, of course, the top comes out slowly too. It used to take about 15 seconds. What can I tell the Dealer to check and correct? I know some of you may have had this problem.
I'm afraid it's going to get stuck halfway up or down in operation.
My '03 SL 500 just turned 10,000 miles.
Stan
I'm afraid it's going to get stuck halfway up or down in operation.
My '03 SL 500 just turned 10,000 miles.
Stan
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Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 123
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From: Allentown, Pa
2011 350 4Matic EClass Sport Edition and 2003 500SL & 2010 Range Rover Sport
I think 16 seconds is normal. Yours doesn't sound slow. Mine hardly moves at all. It could take as much as a minute or longer of constanty holding up the lever on the console. You can actually hear the hydraulic pump starving for fluid.
I'm not sure how it's refilled or even where. That's why it's going to the dealer on Thursday. I'm sure hoping that's the real problem.
Stan
I'm not sure how it's refilled or even where. That's why it's going to the dealer on Thursday. I'm sure hoping that's the real problem.
Stan
Thread Starter
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 123
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From: Allentown, Pa
2011 350 4Matic EClass Sport Edition and 2003 500SL & 2010 Range Rover Sport
Well,
The Dealer fixed my top. That's the good news. It supposedly works perfectly after they filled the hydraulic container in the trunk and bled the air out of the system. I have a loaner car, and I will pick up the SL500 tomorrow morning.
The bad news is that they do not know WHERE the hydraulic fluid has gone to. Because it's an oil, it certainly didn't evaporate. My only explanation is that I bought this car last November with 7800 miles on it (an '03) and it did sit in a garage and not driven regularly. When I bought it...it must have been close to the point where the fluid was low and after some use, perhaps the seals were dry, and absorbed the fluid. I don't know. They checked all six of the hydraulic pumps and they were not leaking. They are stumped. But all I can do is take the car, enjoy it, and see if the fluid level goes down again. There are no spots on my garage floor, and they spent the entire day working on it. Because there were no parts involved, I will pay approximately $169.00 for labor. Had a part been replaced, my bill would have been $0 because I have an all inclusive warranty which covers the hydraulic pumps and everything.
Actually, I'm glad to pay the labor fee because this technician worked hard on it. I will also tip my service writer and mechanic at the Dealers as I always do.
I'll report again after I get the car and check it for myself. I WILL check the fluid level regularly to see if it happens again.
I'm up for suggestions.
Any Mercedes technicians out there? I'd love to hear your theories.
Stan
The Dealer fixed my top. That's the good news. It supposedly works perfectly after they filled the hydraulic container in the trunk and bled the air out of the system. I have a loaner car, and I will pick up the SL500 tomorrow morning.
The bad news is that they do not know WHERE the hydraulic fluid has gone to. Because it's an oil, it certainly didn't evaporate. My only explanation is that I bought this car last November with 7800 miles on it (an '03) and it did sit in a garage and not driven regularly. When I bought it...it must have been close to the point where the fluid was low and after some use, perhaps the seals were dry, and absorbed the fluid. I don't know. They checked all six of the hydraulic pumps and they were not leaking. They are stumped. But all I can do is take the car, enjoy it, and see if the fluid level goes down again. There are no spots on my garage floor, and they spent the entire day working on it. Because there were no parts involved, I will pay approximately $169.00 for labor. Had a part been replaced, my bill would have been $0 because I have an all inclusive warranty which covers the hydraulic pumps and everything.
Actually, I'm glad to pay the labor fee because this technician worked hard on it. I will also tip my service writer and mechanic at the Dealers as I always do.
I'll report again after I get the car and check it for myself. I WILL check the fluid level regularly to see if it happens again.
I'm up for suggestions.
Any Mercedes technicians out there? I'd love to hear your theories.
Stan
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 123
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From: Allentown, Pa
2011 350 4Matic EClass Sport Edition and 2003 500SL & 2010 Range Rover Sport
It's been about 2 weeks now since my "sluggish" top was fixed. It's still working great, but the hydraulic fluid level in the trunk canister is INDEED GOING DOWN. It's only a matter of time when the problem starts again. Guaranteed! I put a black mark on the side of the hydraulic fluid canister where you can read the level, and it's down about a quarter of an inch. WHERE CAN IT POSSIBLY BE GOING? The Dealer found no leaks and he bled the system. There are no wet marks on my garage floor, and the car sits for days at a time. I am absolutely at a loss for ideas. When I stand outside the car and operate the top with my key, I do notice that the hydraulic pump in the trunk sounds rather noisy when operating.
I will give it back to the dealer again, but they will be frustrated too when I call....since they worked with the car for a few days.
Hydraulic fluid is in a "closed" system. Any ideas out there?
Stan
I will give it back to the dealer again, but they will be frustrated too when I call....since they worked with the car for a few days.
Hydraulic fluid is in a "closed" system. Any ideas out there?
Stan
Last edited by spilok; Jun 29, 2008 at 10:53 AM.
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From: Memphis
SL500 and A-CLASS
It's been about 2 weeks now since my "sluggish" top was fixed. It's still working great, but the hydraulic fluid level in the trunk canister is INDEED GOING DOWN. It's only a matter of time when the problem starts again. Guaranteed! I put a black mark on the side of the hydraulic fluid canister where you can read the level, and it's down about a quarter of an inch. WHERE CAN IT POSSIBLY BE GOING? The Dealer found no leaks and he bled the system. There are no wet marks on my garage floor, and the car sits for days at a time. I am absolutely at a loss for ideas. When I stand outside the car and operate the top with my key, I do notice that the hydraulic pump in the trunk sounds rather noisy when operating.
I will give it back to the dealer again, but they will be frustrated too when I call....since they worked with the car for a few days.
Hydraulic fluid is in a "closed" system. Any ideas out there?
Stan
I will give it back to the dealer again, but they will be frustrated too when I call....since they worked with the car for a few days.
Hydraulic fluid is in a "closed" system. Any ideas out there?
Stan
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 123
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From: Allentown, Pa
2011 350 4Matic EClass Sport Edition and 2003 500SL & 2010 Range Rover Sport
Thank you for the reply. I will mention this to my Dealer. I plan to call the dealer tomorrow and tell me to get me a "loaner"....and take the time necessary to find the leak. It has to be somewhere, I agree. I will tell him about your "hose" theory.
Stan
Stan
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Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,111
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From: Memphis
SL500 and A-CLASS
One of the hydraulic hoses may have been pinch. I believe there are two hydraulic hose to each hydraulic pump. I think my SLK320 has 3 hydraulic pumps and 6 hydraulic hoses. It should be the same for the SL500.
Last edited by tiggerfink; Jun 30, 2008 at 01:01 AM.
Thread Starter
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 123
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From: Allentown, Pa
2011 350 4Matic EClass Sport Edition and 2003 500SL & 2010 Range Rover Sport
Well....Good news. The Dealer found the culprit. Indeed, the Left vario roof (open/close) hydraulic cylinder showed evidence of leaking. It seems that the piston appeared rusty and the seal was cracked. Using a dental mirror, after exposing this piston in its awkward position, they were able to see the leakage. However, there is no puddle beneath it so somehow the minute amounts of hydraulic fluid somehow escaped this area.
How did this happen? Don't know. This car, though sat unused for quite a long time. I bought it with less than 8000 miles on it last year, and the previous owner had 10 cars in a thermostatically-controlled garage. I'll never know how it happened, but at least I will have a good summer without fear of the top freezing in half-opened position.
Thanks for all your suggestions and help.
Stan
How did this happen? Don't know. This car, though sat unused for quite a long time. I bought it with less than 8000 miles on it last year, and the previous owner had 10 cars in a thermostatically-controlled garage. I'll never know how it happened, but at least I will have a good summer without fear of the top freezing in half-opened position.
Thanks for all your suggestions and help.
Stan
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,111
Likes: 0
From: Memphis
SL500 and A-CLASS
Well....Good news. The Dealer found the culprit. Indeed, the Left vario roof (open/close) hydraulic cylinder showed evidence of leaking. It seems that the piston appeared rusty and the seal was cracked. Using a dental mirror, after exposing this piston in its awkward position, they were able to see the leakage. However, there is no puddle beneath it so somehow the minute amounts of hydraulic fluid somehow escaped this area.
How did this happen? Don't know. This car, though sat unused for quite a long time. I bought it with less than 8000 miles on it last year, and the previous owner had 10 cars in a thermostatically-controlled garage. I'll never know how it happened, but at least I will have a good summer without fear of the top freezing in half-opened position.
Thanks for all your suggestions and help.
Stan
How did this happen? Don't know. This car, though sat unused for quite a long time. I bought it with less than 8000 miles on it last year, and the previous owner had 10 cars in a thermostatically-controlled garage. I'll never know how it happened, but at least I will have a good summer without fear of the top freezing in half-opened position.
Thanks for all your suggestions and help.
Stan
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 123
Likes: 2
From: Allentown, Pa
2011 350 4Matic EClass Sport Edition and 2003 500SL & 2010 Range Rover Sport
That's true. The dealer told me the back end of the car is pretty much tore apart....but not to worry, it goes back together quite well. God, I love German engineering! Thought I'd have the car back today. Seems they got the wrong part fed Xed. My dealer called me and said that the RIGHT hydraulic cylinder was packed in a box labeled LEFT. They should have the correct one tomorrow, but with the Holiday weekend coming up, and the job is a 4 hour job, I'm hoping I get the car by tomorrow evening. They assured me they are going to try to make it happen.
What an "Adventure" this has been.
Stan
What an "Adventure" this has been.
Stan
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 123
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From: Allentown, Pa
2011 350 4Matic EClass Sport Edition and 2003 500SL & 2010 Range Rover Sport
All fixed now,and they gave me the old part. Without the warranty I bought, this was a job that cost over $800. I saw the bill! Fortunately, it didn't cost a cent. Hydraulic fluid now filled, and I look forward to a sunny Summer.
Thanks for all your input.
Stan
Thanks for all your input.
Stan
Junior Member
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 18
Likes: 1
From: Lake Oconee, GA
Firemist Red SL500
You just made me feel REALLY great I purchased (for what I at the time thought was a fortune) a M-B Extended Warranty on my C.P.O. SL500.
And just think ....... From what others have told me, it COULD have a LOT larger total than just $800.00 !
Glad all is good now wih yours. I have to have mine looked at for what I feel are the same symptoms when it goes in for Service B in a month or so. My nearest dealer is about 50 miles away.
Mike Lulejian
Lake Oconee, GA
And just think ....... From what others have told me, it COULD have a LOT larger total than just $800.00 !
Glad all is good now wih yours. I have to have mine looked at for what I feel are the same symptoms when it goes in for Service B in a month or so. My nearest dealer is about 50 miles away.
Mike Lulejian
Lake Oconee, GA
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 123
Likes: 2
From: Allentown, Pa
2011 350 4Matic EClass Sport Edition and 2003 500SL & 2010 Range Rover Sport
Mike,
If you suspect it's a hydraulic leak...it's easy enough to check. Take out the floor mat in the trunk, and then remove the large foam cover to the left. It's covering the hydraulic pump. You can see the level of the fluid on the side of this translucent cylinder. There are 2 marks near the top that are supposed to be where the fluid level is correct. You probably need to use a flashlight to shine on the side of the pump in order to see it sufficiently.
If your fluid is where it's supposed to be, then you probably do not have a hydraulic leak.
Correct me if I'm wrong, forum members. At least that's my understanding of the problem.
Stan
If you suspect it's a hydraulic leak...it's easy enough to check. Take out the floor mat in the trunk, and then remove the large foam cover to the left. It's covering the hydraulic pump. You can see the level of the fluid on the side of this translucent cylinder. There are 2 marks near the top that are supposed to be where the fluid level is correct. You probably need to use a flashlight to shine on the side of the pump in order to see it sufficiently.
If your fluid is where it's supposed to be, then you probably do not have a hydraulic leak.
Correct me if I'm wrong, forum members. At least that's my understanding of the problem.
Stan
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Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 12
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R230 350SL, ML 350 '09
Mike,
If you suspect it's a hydraulic leak...it's easy enough to check. Take out the floor mat in the trunk, and then remove the large foam cover to the left. It's covering the hydraulic pump. You can see the level of the fluid on the side of this translucent cylinder. There are 2 marks near the top that are supposed to be where the fluid level is correct. You probably need to use a flashlight to shine on the side of the pump in order to see it sufficiently.
If your fluid is where it's supposed to be, then you probably do not have a hydraulic leak.
Correct me if I'm wrong, forum members. At least that's my understanding of the problem.
Stan
If you suspect it's a hydraulic leak...it's easy enough to check. Take out the floor mat in the trunk, and then remove the large foam cover to the left. It's covering the hydraulic pump. You can see the level of the fluid on the side of this translucent cylinder. There are 2 marks near the top that are supposed to be where the fluid level is correct. You probably need to use a flashlight to shine on the side of the pump in order to see it sufficiently.
If your fluid is where it's supposed to be, then you probably do not have a hydraulic leak.
Correct me if I'm wrong, forum members. At least that's my understanding of the problem.
Stan
