kknight

That forum seems more like gustavboard.com, rather than something revolving around M5's. I'm amazed they can keep forum members. In one post I read, 2 people were banned (just within one thread!), and someone else here from MBWORLD mentioned they were banned unreasonably. It's really laughable.

M&M

I am 2nd in line at my dealer. Our deliveries start in August.

Bilal, I had hoped for better from you. Is there any reazon why the M5 shouldn't pull the same kind of gap on the E55 in the US. I mean all the Euro mags have found the M5 to be quicker after 2nd gear. 1st & 2nd are very traction limited & I doubr even an SL65 will pull an E55 over the 1st 2 gears.

But from the 3-4 mags that have tested the M5 vs 55, they have found that the M5 is 06-0.7 seconds quicker to 100mph & over a second quicker to 124mph. 1/4 mile the M5 is o.3-0.4 faster & trapping 3mph higher. If those same cars get shipped to the US why should the results the change? Is the air in the US different to the air in the Europe?

Simple physics ditactes that a lighter car with more power on the engine (& the gap gets exaggerated when the power gets to the wheels through a more effcicient drivetrain), shorter gearing, high rpm power will win. The only advantage the E55 has is torque, but in a drag race you live at high revs & I bet with the geraing & torque curve that the M5 makes more torque than the E55 in their respectve racing rev-bands.

W210

krispykrme

You obviously have no experience with BMW M history in US. BMW has always taken the time to develop a M car fully two years after introduction of the regular models. It has always been their strategy. They take their time to maximize the performance on both chassis and power train.

The E46 M3 arrived in 2001 (a full 2 years after E46 introduction).

The E39 M5 was released in 1998 in europe (again 2 years after E39 introduction). The US m5 did not arrive until 4 years into E39 product lift cycle.

BMW is not like AMG that simply put a charger on the engine and run the product onto the market immediately. For example, the E55 would probably handle better with the new steering lifted from CLS. AMG could take the time to better tune the chassis, steering response, and brake pedal response. But it did not. The E55 simply drove like a more powerful E500. In fact it actually has worse feedback than E500.

The difference between E500 and E55 is simply the power. Other than that its just another W211. The M5 and regular 5 series has always been quiet different.

I personally liked BMW's approach much better. Taking the time to match all aspect of performance rather than simply crunch out more power and neglect other aspect like AMG did.

A true driver's car is never aboout the power alone. It's the whole package. This is a fundemental difference between AMG and M. simple as that.

W210

I wish BMW paid less attention to performance but more on ergonomics and looks. The new 7, 6, 5 series all look so cheap and nasty.

First arrogantly removing functional buttons for the 'superficial hi-tech look' and now finally admitting mistake and adding them back. What a joke, treating their customers like fools, patronizing us on how to change radio station and learn what beauty is.

Performance and driving dynamics are important, but for me, a complete car must also have good ergonomics and a comfortable and functional interior. Looks has always been low in my priorities but those new BMWs have acrossed the line.

krispykrme

The problem is that i really did not find the exterior style of E60 to be bad. In fact i like the E60 exterior styling way more than I do of W211. E60 exterior is more interesting to look at, more sharped edge. It's just more modern. I am a young 30 guy. I really am not a fan of mercedes classic shape. It's just tad old for my taste.

However, everyone has different opinion on exterior. That's why I refrain on discussing exterior because exterior design is really a subjective thing.

As far as i drive goes. I am used to pointing mouse and move around on the screen. I really don't perceive that is a problem. I will agree that it is a huge challenge to button user. But again, this is more of a learning issue.

Personally I don't think W211 Ergonomics to be that much better either (being short, I have problem keep eyes on the road using the keypad, and the mercedes navigation input is not friendly either). If you want to talk about ergonomics, japanese does it better than anybody else. There is nothing easier than touch screen.

So both W211 and E60 has ergonomic issues.

Both W211/E60 could use a touch screen.

W210

You're a lucky man not finding the E60 disgusting. To me, those headlights are utterly offensive!

I suppose ergonomics are also personal. I'm very familiar and comfortable with technology yet still prefer push buttons (better tactile feedback) than touchscreen. I much rather use a keypad to dial a number than to use iDrive.

krispykrme

like i said earlier. ergonomics and exterior design is really subjective and varies from person to person. that's why i never question anyone on their opinion on these.

sometime i really wish this board could be more mature and be more open to other side of spectrum.

there is nothing wrong with criticism as long as the poster can state his/her opinion truthfully.

there are things i like about the E55. The torque is excellent. It's a great cruiser. There is nothing wrong with that. Some people perfer a rocket fast vanilla bean. some prefer a spicy red chilli pepper rocket.

People on this board really needs to loosen up. IT'S A CAR FOR GOD SAKE. No need to work yourself over who is faster.

If you want speed, go buy yourself a plane.

enough of my rant. peace and good night.

VelocitE55

HAHAHA! Snickers!

That was great!

W210

I never have this problem as I just mind my own business.

Belmondo

Originally Posted by krispykrme
sometime i really wish this board could be more mature and be more open to other side of spectrum.



I thought that this whole thread is about gustaffs immature behaviour on m5board and his inability to be more open to other side of spectrum.
gus claims to be swedish but behaves like ****. A fking m5board equivalent of soup **** on Seinfeld.

Gustav

Belmondo, your posts shows your knowledge about history and your standards regarding quality of posts.

Have a look at the last 10 threads here and on m5board.com. I think that speaks for itself.

Mardeth

Belmondo, I think your the last guy who can speak about being "more open to other side of spectrum."...

Belmondo

You as a judge of "quality of posts" has got to be some kind of swedish perverted humor. Safe to say that when people around the world say :" Never forget" ---they also mean internet despots like you as well.
I hope that little despots like you will be swept overboard by Mr. Bush's democracy/freedom tsunami all over the world in the not so distant future.


Jean-Paul

FloridaE55

Sure, waiting is always an option, but I doubt that the car will be that great that I have to wait that long...What about the dealer that is able to deliver the car in 6 months? Do you know anything about the available options, the exact pricing? Great, you wait for a car and you don't even know what you might get for being so patient! No, thanks!

No, I won't. As I stated before, they will AT LEAST have the E55 to compete, not nothing like BMW at the moment.



You wrote "I don't understand. There will be a gap of a few months, not years until the new M5 launches..." Nobody knows the exact date of the release of the two cars (M5 and E63), so stating the exact gap between those cars is impossible at the moment. I was referring to the gap between your M5 (very nice car, we had the same model as 528i when we were living next to Munich) and the new one. I thought you were stating that this gap will only be a few months, not two years. The launch of the new M5 might only be a few months away, but the end of production of your car was 2 years ago (or so).

Vomit

Isn't it nice that we can all have a semi-heated, free-speech discussion here without ? Personally, I vastly prefer America over Amerika. I just find it very comikal that Gustav is here spouting the same stuff that he bans people for on the BMW forum.

M5KILLR

no THATS a good one, nice reference bel!

FloridaE55

Well, I actually know that they always "need" two additional years to launch their M-cars in the U.S., I simply have a problem with your explanation:

Please let me know why the M-cars launch 2 years after they launched in Germany? That's right, not after releasing the new bodystyle, 2 years after the launch in Germany. Are the American roads or people so different that they have to "improve" the car for 2 years until they are ready for our soil? This is a great "strategy", maybe you can explain that to me. The M5 and M6 are available in Germany right now, why not in the U.S.? So you think the people in the U.S. need "maximized performance" and the cars available in Germany on the Autobahn aren't fully developed yet?? Once again, great "strategy"!


I doubt that your sources are representative. Why should anybody prefer an E500 over an E55? I don't. Once again, what is BMW doing in this two years between the launch in Germany and the U.S. to improve the car? So if I would follow your argumentation, no E55 or M5 should be launched at all because there is always something new that can be improved (just to let you know, the E55 WILL get the steering of the CLS, even before the M5 will show up). Sorry, but two years just to bring the car from Germany to the U.S. is simply too long

I doubt that you know what you are talking about. The E55 has a different exterior, different interior, different wheels, different brakes etc. I could also say that the M5 is simply another 545i with a different engine and larger wheels, but this kind of argumentation is simply too easy for me.

I respect your taste but you can be sure that I will have much fun in my AMG while others are still waiting and waiting and waiting and waiting....I tell you, due to the fact that the launch in Germany happened two years earlier, you will get an M5 with technical development that is already 2 years OLD. That is an improvement?

That is 100% true!

BMBW

Both fair points. It seems like you're now saying that people do have a choice, it's just that choosing to wait for the M5 won't be worth it. I can't say that I disagree with that since (a) I don't like the new M5 design, and no amount of time is going to cure that, and (b) I haven't driven the new M5.

Looks like we were just on different pages. Putting that aside, I agree with you to the extent that the timing makes it difficult for prospective buyers, but as we inch closer to the actual release it becomes less and less difficult to start thinking about choosing between the two cars. Owner reports are coming in from all over the world about the M5 (most good, some not so good) so almost every day there is more data to review and think about. I would gladly wait a year to make sure that I was making the right choice (even if it turned out to be the E55) rather than just buying the E55 now and wondering if I made the right choice, or worse, regretting it once the M5 is released and driven. But then again, I tend to keep my daily drivers for 5 years, so another year in the scheme of things isn't much for me. If I changed daily drivers every 2 years, then I might see it differently.

BMBW

Perceived performance and driving experience are also highly subjective and vary from person to person. Every person places a different value on different aspects of performance. My mother-in-law thinks my M5 is a "fun" car, but not a real luxury daily driver. A buddy of mine thinks my M5 is a nice fast luxury daily driver, but not really a fun car. Many people on this board think the E55 clearly outperforms my E39 M5. I think the M5 is much more of a performance car than the E55 even though it is less powerful and generally slower. That's why isolated statements about which car is better are not really meaningful to me without knowing the values and priorities of the person making the statement.

M5KILLR

douchtav, nothing here or there is/was questionable PRE-BAN, thats PRE-BAN, comprende PRE-BAN, comprendre PRE-BAN, Verstehen Sie PRE-BAN, capire PRE-BAN, Begrijp PRE-BAN, понять PRE-BAN, 明白吗？PRE-BAN. so stop crying, YOU BROUGHT ALL OF THIS ON YOURSELF. as weve challenged you time and time and time again, post our offensive content here PRE-BAN. plain and simple you dont want to lose your prescious bmw invites by letting ANY mb discussion. you are truely a troll. step up and prove yourself or go way mein furor.

FloridaE55

Now I can finally agree 100%

I am 25 years old and I actually think the new M5 isn't so ugly that it wouldn't be a competitor to the E55. But you are right, the E39 was the nicer one (same as it is with the current E65/66 and the former 7-series that was nicer, too. Currently, the sharpest BMW is the 645i, IMO. I considered ordering this car, too, but unfortunately it only has 2 doors ).

I just had the problem that my current lease contract ends in September and I really want to get rid of my current car. I would have been very happy if I had the opportunity to chose between the M5 and the E55. It is no secret that BMW has always been the more sporty and Mercedes the more comfortable make. The M5 would have been a perfect match for me, too.

I wasn't very happy when Mercedes stopped to offer the free maintenance program. When it comes to customer service, BMW is ahead.

I also read on this board that BMW is considered the cheap solution. I can only advice those people to have a closer look to the prices in Germany. You might compare a cheaper BMW to a more expensive Mercedes in the US just to find out that it's exactly the opposite in Germany. And if BMW is considered cheap, why do they have the highest resale value?

Sure, this is a Mercedes-forum but it has always been a forum that sticked to facts so I respect that, too

medici78

Motor Trend did an E55 vs. M5 comparison test earlier this year. The E55 was faster in a straight line. I'm sure saing this would get me banned from the M5 board...

BMBW

I'm confused - if you're not talking about 2 years after the e60 bodystyle was released, then what are you talking about? The e60 M5 wasn't launched in Germany 2 years ago.

The E55 does differ from the E500 in more than just the motor, but the M5 differs way more mechanically from the 545i than the E55 does from the E500.

Much of the technology that makes the M5 different from the regular 5 series is much less than 2 years old. It's not as if they had the M5 fully designed and tested 2 years ago and have just been sitting on it. Besides - new doesn't necessarily mean improved - one look at the thing is proof enough of that.

AMGfan

...Didn't they have estimated performance #'s on the M5, though? Was it really head to head?