Is there an E55 pricing bubble going on?
08-12-2011, 07:34 AM
#26
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Curious on the opinions of the gang - is there a bit of an E55 pricing bubble out there? I'm seeing a bunch of low-ish mileage '06 E55 cars coming out of the woodwork at prices that are, well, kinda stupid.
Allow me to present exhibit 1: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/MB-Ce...item48418d712e This is priced higher than my old car cost in Jan. 2009- a CPO 2006 w/19K miles.
Anyone have recent auction data? How much are dealers paying for these things?
Oh well, with the markets gyrating and the economy in the doldrums, it can't last, prices will come down to earth sooner or later.
Allow me to present exhibit 1: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/MB-Ce...item48418d712e This is priced higher than my old car cost in Jan. 2009- a CPO 2006 w/19K miles.
Anyone have recent auction data? How much are dealers paying for these things?
Oh well, with the markets gyrating and the economy in the doldrums, it can't last, prices will come down to earth sooner or later.
08-12-2011, 10:11 AM
#27
I think everyone is missing the point of the OP... This isn't a discussion about who has better pricing, better options, number of owners (dealer vs. individual), etc...
The point is that these cars are all OVERPRICED. Yes you can say all day that "I'll pay a premium for a nice car" yada yada yada. Having bought and sold many cars, it comes down to what a potential buyer can afford. Let's set aside the fact that they shouldn't buy if they have to finance (affordability etc.) because of expenses and such.
The fact is that supply is high because E55 owners are asking way too much for their cars (no matter how nice). I don't have to go to Ebay and pick the highest one on there - look on this message board and do a search for E55 (I've done it many times) and you will see that these cars sit on here for months with a lot of tire kickers, but no buyers.
The point is that these cars are all OVERPRICED. Yes you can say all day that "I'll pay a premium for a nice car" yada yada yada. Having bought and sold many cars, it comes down to what a potential buyer can afford. Let's set aside the fact that they shouldn't buy if they have to finance (affordability etc.) because of expenses and such.
The fact is that supply is high because E55 owners are asking way too much for their cars (no matter how nice). I don't have to go to Ebay and pick the highest one on there - look on this message board and do a search for E55 (I've done it many times) and you will see that these cars sit on here for months with a lot of tire kickers, but no buyers.
08-12-2011, 10:24 AM
#28
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Alexe55 just picked up a 2005 with 48K miles for $11,500.....
Not in "premium" condition
, but it proves that you can find them cheap if that's your objective.
Realistically, you could just call Bruce M (Becks Imports) and have him watch the weekly Manheim Car auctions for you. He charges a small fee, but I guarantee he will have access to cars at prices you are unlikely to find on your own.
-G
Not in "premium" condition
, but it proves that you can find them cheap if that's your objective.Realistically, you could just call Bruce M (Becks Imports) and have him watch the weekly Manheim Car auctions for you. He charges a small fee, but I guarantee he will have access to cars at prices you are unlikely to find on your own.
-G
08-12-2011, 11:18 AM
#29
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08-12-2011, 11:22 AM
#30
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Thread Starter
I think everyone is missing the point of the OP... This isn't a discussion about who has better pricing, better options, number of owners (dealer vs. individual), etc...
The point is that these cars are all OVERPRICED. Yes you can say all day that "I'll pay a premium for a nice car" yada yada yada. Having bought and sold many cars, it comes down to what a potential buyer can afford. Let's set aside the fact that they shouldn't buy if they have to finance (affordability etc.) because of expenses and such.
The fact is that supply is high because E55 owners are asking way too much for their cars (no matter how nice). I don't have to go to Ebay and pick the highest one on there - look on this message board and do a search for E55 (I've done it many times) and you will see that these cars sit on here for months with a lot of tire kickers, but no buyers.
The point is that these cars are all OVERPRICED. Yes you can say all day that "I'll pay a premium for a nice car" yada yada yada. Having bought and sold many cars, it comes down to what a potential buyer can afford. Let's set aside the fact that they shouldn't buy if they have to finance (affordability etc.) because of expenses and such.
The fact is that supply is high because E55 owners are asking way too much for their cars (no matter how nice). I don't have to go to Ebay and pick the highest one on there - look on this message board and do a search for E55 (I've done it many times) and you will see that these cars sit on here for months with a lot of tire kickers, but no buyers.
08-12-2011, 11:29 AM
#31
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Hmm .. I am tempted to see what they want for trade! I waited a long time to get the options I wanted ... I got tired of waiting cos I wanted to get in one of these cars asap so I let the parktronic and trunk closer go. This car is local too 
... but I am not a big fan of this particular dealership. 
Personally, I think cars on these types of forums are worth more .. people here tend to care more for their cars and pay attention to details like what kinds of oils to use, filters, etc ... Also you can sometimes see the history of a vehicle from the owner's posts. But it depends on what you want. Good luck with your search
... but I am not a big fan of this particular dealership. Personally, I think cars on these types of forums are worth more .. people here tend to care more for their cars and pay attention to details like what kinds of oils to use, filters, etc ... Also you can sometimes see the history of a vehicle from the owner's posts. But it depends on what you want. Good luck with your search
08-12-2011, 11:33 AM
#32
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It's very common for sellers to have a personal attachment to their car, and price it higher than it *should* sell for....either because they are:
1. In denial about the actual market
2. Unaware of the actual market
3. Starting high in anticipation of low-ball offers.
-G
08-12-2011, 11:48 AM
#33
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2007 E63, 2006 C55
RE: Used Car Prices
We are in the midst of a used car price bubble.....only problem is it will go on for a while longer.
USA new car sales fell off a cliff in 2nd half of 2008. 2009 about 10 Mil new cars were sold, 2010 about 11 Mil cars, and we should reach 12 Mil in 2011 although the events over the last 2 weeks won't help this year's number much.
That collectively works out to around 9 Mil fewer new car sales over what would be considered normal over 3 consecutive years. Result is fewer trade ins, i.e. less used supply, and increased demand for used as folks don't want to pay new prices right now.
The supply/demand equation is out of sync, and it is really starting to manifest itself at the auctions this Summer. Not at all uncommon to see used cars costing more than they did 6 or 12 months ago, the net is that one needs to pay up a little to get a good car near term.
I'm sure nice E55s are no exception.
USA new car sales fell off a cliff in 2nd half of 2008. 2009 about 10 Mil new cars were sold, 2010 about 11 Mil cars, and we should reach 12 Mil in 2011 although the events over the last 2 weeks won't help this year's number much.
That collectively works out to around 9 Mil fewer new car sales over what would be considered normal over 3 consecutive years. Result is fewer trade ins, i.e. less used supply, and increased demand for used as folks don't want to pay new prices right now.
The supply/demand equation is out of sync, and it is really starting to manifest itself at the auctions this Summer. Not at all uncommon to see used cars costing more than they did 6 or 12 months ago, the net is that one needs to pay up a little to get a good car near term.
I'm sure nice E55s are no exception.
Last edited by NCE500; 08-12-2011 at 11:51 AM.
08-12-2011, 12:08 PM
#34
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Thread Starter
We are in the midst of a used car price bubble.....only problem is it will go on for a while longer.
USA new car sales fell off a cliff in 2nd half of 2008. 2009 about 10 Mil new cars were sold, 2010 about 11 Mil cars, and we should reach 12 Mil in 2011 although the events over the last 2 weeks won't help this year's number much.
That collectively works out to around 9 Mil fewer new car sales over what would be considered normal over 3 consecutive years. Result is fewer trade ins, i.e. less used supply, and increased demand for used as folks don't want to pay new prices right now.
The supply/demand equation is out of sync, and it is really starting to manifest itself at the auctions this Summer. Not at all uncommon to see used cars costing more than they did 6 or 12 months ago, the net is that one needs to pay up a little to get a good car near term.
I'm sure nice E55s are no exception.
USA new car sales fell off a cliff in 2nd half of 2008. 2009 about 10 Mil new cars were sold, 2010 about 11 Mil cars, and we should reach 12 Mil in 2011 although the events over the last 2 weeks won't help this year's number much.
That collectively works out to around 9 Mil fewer new car sales over what would be considered normal over 3 consecutive years. Result is fewer trade ins, i.e. less used supply, and increased demand for used as folks don't want to pay new prices right now.
The supply/demand equation is out of sync, and it is really starting to manifest itself at the auctions this Summer. Not at all uncommon to see used cars costing more than they did 6 or 12 months ago, the net is that one needs to pay up a little to get a good car near term.
I'm sure nice E55s are no exception.
Yes, I'm aware of the dynamics in the used car market - I've seen articles in the WSJ and such. However, they all focused on 2-4 year old cars. The 211 E55s are now 6-9 years old. To most car buyers, that means they are "old", "high miles", and "unreliable." So I am just surprised the uplift in pricing extends that far back to the E55. Not complaining, mind you - the market sets the fair price, and we can choose to pay it or not.
BTW, I did take a look at completed ebay auctions, and there is some telling information there. About 1 car in 20 actually sold. The most common outcome is zero bids - noone is even willing to offer the opening price, let alone take it to the reserve price. Cars which received bids (but did not sell) are bid up to roughly 75% of the buy-it-now price. So it does seem to me that sellers in general are asking markedly more than the market will bear for these cars.
08-13-2011, 01:07 AM
#35
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2004 E55 AMG
I really didn't expect this much activity in this thread, but hey, it's kinda fun.
Yes, I'm aware of the dynamics in the used car market - I've seen articles in the WSJ and such. However, they all focused on 2-4 year old cars. The 211 E55s are now 6-9 years old. To most car buyers, that means they are "old", "high miles", and "unreliable." So I am just surprised the uplift in pricing extends that far back to the E55. Not complaining, mind you - the market sets the fair price, and we can choose to pay it or not.
BTW, I did take a look at completed ebay auctions, and there is some telling information there. About 1 car in 20 actually sold. The most common outcome is zero bids - noone is even willing to offer the opening price, let alone take it to the reserve price. Cars which received bids (but did not sell) are bid up to roughly 75% of the buy-it-now price. So it does seem to me that sellers in general are asking markedly more than the market will bear for these cars.
Yes, I'm aware of the dynamics in the used car market - I've seen articles in the WSJ and such. However, they all focused on 2-4 year old cars. The 211 E55s are now 6-9 years old. To most car buyers, that means they are "old", "high miles", and "unreliable." So I am just surprised the uplift in pricing extends that far back to the E55. Not complaining, mind you - the market sets the fair price, and we can choose to pay it or not.
BTW, I did take a look at completed ebay auctions, and there is some telling information there. About 1 car in 20 actually sold. The most common outcome is zero bids - noone is even willing to offer the opening price, let alone take it to the reserve price. Cars which received bids (but did not sell) are bid up to roughly 75% of the buy-it-now price. So it does seem to me that sellers in general are asking markedly more than the market will bear for these cars.
Exactly. Furthermore, people shopping for a used E55 are not in the market for anything new, since there is really no new-car you can compare an E55. They're in the market for one car, and I would wager that fewer new-car sales have absolutely nothing to do with buyers and sellers expectations. I could see it for a 2 year old Corolla, but not cars like these.
If you want to see real insanity, go look at the classifieds on any one of the Corvette forums. They're full of nothing but 4-post threads where the car was priced realistically and sold immediately, and 6 page long threads that have been going on for 6 months because the owner thinks their car is special(or the owner is just insane).
I couldn't care less what people ask for their cars, but I know what XX car is worth to me, and that's all I'm willing to pay. When I bought mine I saw it on Ebay, drove down to the dealership, and bought it right there for their asking price, because it was reasonable. When I sell my car I'll price it very reasonably and be out of it in a week. What's an E55 with 110K worth to most people, maybe $17K if you're lucky? That's probably what I'd ask right now, but if the same car were being sold by someone else they might ask $22K and sit on it for months till they come to their senses.
Certain people will pay a good premium for an E55 with exceptionally low miles, 1 owner, clean Carfax, all the options they just have to have, color, not a single rock chip, etc..... that's fantastic, but as these cars get up there in miles and age, some sellers need to be more realistic.
This is how buying and selling cars has been going on for a century, and should be nothing new to any of us. There are fewer and fewer truly "special" E55's out there, and at the price point and age they are at now, many buyers see them as simply a used car. It's certainly a neat car and I love mine, but it's really nothing special anymore.
You really think these things cost $110K? It stickered for maybe 95 and sold at a discount - probably a hefty discount.
Here's an example of a reasonable seller. 2003 CL600 with 33K for $25,000. That's a far cry from the $125K it it likely sold for, and I bet it wil sell quickly.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/CLEAN...hicle-glossary
Last edited by izzyz28; 08-13-2011 at 01:17 AM.
08-13-2011, 07:52 AM
#36
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2013 E63 Bi Turbo PP
In Australia the 2005 2006 e55 sells for anywhere between 80k to 90k and new price is 250k they are very overpriced for what they are here so 40k is cheap in my book I could buy two for that price...lol
09-23-2011, 06:03 PM
#40
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2005 E55
I couldn't agree more! I'm shopping for an E55 myself and everyone (including forum members) are trying to get more than retail for their E55 (with a warranty that is about to expire).
Please don't misunderstand me, I'm all for you guys trying to keep the value of these cars high. However, most banks/CU (at least my credit union) are only willing to loan up to NADA retail. Plus you have to factor in another ~$3,500 for an extended warranty, plus TT&L (Texas tax is 6.25%). This is just not realistic for potential buyers who are financing.
It's not only this board, but Ebay, autotrader, etc...
From what I've seen, the car will sit for sale on this forum for over 3-4 months, go through numerous thousand dollar price drops until someone finally picks it up for 80% of the original asking price.
Maybe I'm just frustrated that there are no good "deals" out there, maybe E55 owners think they can get $28k for a 2004 un-warrantied E55, or maybe these are extremely overpriced.
Please don't misunderstand me, I'm all for you guys trying to keep the value of these cars high. However, most banks/CU (at least my credit union) are only willing to loan up to NADA retail. Plus you have to factor in another ~$3,500 for an extended warranty, plus TT&L (Texas tax is 6.25%). This is just not realistic for potential buyers who are financing.
It's not only this board, but Ebay, autotrader, etc...
From what I've seen, the car will sit for sale on this forum for over 3-4 months, go through numerous thousand dollar price drops until someone finally picks it up for 80% of the original asking price.
Maybe I'm just frustrated that there are no good "deals" out there, maybe E55 owners think they can get $28k for a 2004 un-warrantied E55, or maybe these are extremely overpriced.
I put the car on Craigslist and got a bunch of blind offers, but none that I would consider. If I had wanted to get really serious about selling the car I would have posted it on Autotrader or Cars.com. In the end, I decided to keep the car. As others have said, I don't think I could get another car as nice as mine for what I was selling it for.
Someone stated that they thought a lot of these cars were sold at a discount when new. I know my car fetched full retail, and I'm sure a majority of the others also did. Things were good in 2004-2006, and the MB dealers in my area were not big on discounts....especially on AMG cars.
09-25-2011, 12:51 PM
#41
+1
If I remember correctly, E55 production numbers in the US were around 1,100/yr 03-06. If you own a clean example with no accidents and factory paint I would think you could add 4-6k over current market prices. There is lots of junk out there with multi owners and crash damage. Potential buyers will pay if they want quality. These cars are not growing on trees. Our E has been great other than the gas tank issue but now that everything has been replaced in the tank and the tank it has been fantastic.
For the lowballers...go buy a WRX.
If I remember correctly, E55 production numbers in the US were around 1,100/yr 03-06. If you own a clean example with no accidents and factory paint I would think you could add 4-6k over current market prices. There is lots of junk out there with multi owners and crash damage. Potential buyers will pay if they want quality. These cars are not growing on trees. Our E has been great other than the gas tank issue but now that everything has been replaced in the tank and the tank it has been fantastic.
For the lowballers...go buy a WRX.
While the price of used cars has remained steady (or increased) over the last couple of years, I have to agree with those that think members on this board want people to give away their cars. I had offered my car on this forum for $29k and stated to anyone who PM'd me that I would take $28k. My car is a 2005 with 53k miles, well optioned, with a Chrysler Maxcare good for another 3 years and 50k miles. I was offered $26k by one member and less by several others. 2 members agreed to my price of $28k, but both had trouble getting the money. According to Nada, the clean retail on my car is $31,875.....and that doesn't include the warranty.
I put the car on Craigslist and got a bunch of blind offers, but none that I would consider. If I had wanted to get really serious about selling the car I would have posted it on Autotrader or Cars.com. In the end, I decided to keep the car. As others have said, I don't think I could get another car as nice as mine for what I was selling it for.
Someone stated that they thought a lot of these cars were sold at a discount when new. I know my car fetched full retail, and I'm sure a majority of the others also did. Things were good in 2004-2006, and the MB dealers in my area were not big on discounts....especially on AMG cars.
I put the car on Craigslist and got a bunch of blind offers, but none that I would consider. If I had wanted to get really serious about selling the car I would have posted it on Autotrader or Cars.com. In the end, I decided to keep the car. As others have said, I don't think I could get another car as nice as mine for what I was selling it for.
Someone stated that they thought a lot of these cars were sold at a discount when new. I know my car fetched full retail, and I'm sure a majority of the others also did. Things were good in 2004-2006, and the MB dealers in my area were not big on discounts....especially on AMG cars.
09-26-2011, 01:05 PM
#42
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What do the members think mine is worth? It is almost fully optioned except for distronic. 2003 E55, 47k miles, active/ventilated/massage heated/cooled seats, Panorama sunroof with solar panel powering hvac,Keyless go,Factory HID/xenon,Full European Nav with latest update, Sirius integrated behind ashtray, Escort Passport SR7 with hidden defuser on front and back, Black on Black leather, original motor and clean carfax with no mods ever.Wheels are Zenetti 5 spoke 20x10 and 20x9 staggered with correct offsets. Original wheels included. 285s in the rear with no rubbing ever. Lighted AMG sills, Aluminum AMG logo pedals, AMG door pins, etc...really more to list but this should give an idea.
Last edited by zxlr88; 09-26-2011 at 01:52 PM.
09-26-2011, 03:10 PM
#43
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What do the members think mine is worth? It is almost fully optioned except for distronic. 2003 E55, 47k miles, active/ventilated/massage heated/cooled seats, Panorama sunroof with solar panel powering hvac,Keyless go,Factory HID/xenon,Full European Nav with latest update, Sirius integrated behind ashtray, Escort Passport SR7 with hidden defuser on front and back, etc...
09-26-2011, 04:56 PM
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