chawkins2001

I am not a moron Brooke, you must have read my statement wrong, I know you dont tq down pulleys man , and I did not say that. I said tq down the crank pulley bolt.

The same tech (Donny) that does all the pulleys there actually put on the RTR pulley, with Jason verifying the install job right there after it was done. The pulley keyway lined up perfectly and sat flush on the crank keyway as it should have, when the bolt was torqued down.

It was tq'ed down to factory AMG spec for a stock E55 pulley plus a 90* turn, and that was not enough. The bolt worked it's way out slightly and all hell broke loose on the dyno.

I have spoken to a number of shop owners who are very well known on here, and both agreed with my statement of not knowing the tq specs on these rtr pulleys. Both you and I know the brief history on this design, and my car is not the first car this has happened too. The others have just not been documented on this board.

One thing I was very damn well disappointed in too, is after this happened, the supplier wanted nothing to do with issuing me a refund, as I was not happy with the product. I even had to pay for another hub when this happened, which I think is poor customer support. No one told us what to tq this b***h down too, and it very well nearly destroyed my motor.

I would have kept my mouth shut if I was issued a full refund, and could have sent the rtr pulley kit back to the manufacturer, so they could examine the product, but that was not a option

Lastly, I dont need advice on how BIP should work on my car. If that was questionable, I would ask for opinions, or confront the outfit themselves. This was not installer error, rather this pulley design does not like the same tq spec as welded or stock pulleys, and I am the prime example. I feel RTR should provide the CORRECT spec when selling the kit, which did not happen in my case.

komp55

My time on this board goes back to 2006 and since then I've read about many pulley installation "mishaps." The vast majority of the cases always involve installation error of some sort followed, of course, by the standard installer denial of any fault. I'm not saying this is what happened with your car, but I wouldn't be so certain that's its not a possibility either. We're all capable of having a bad day when working on our cars, and that applies to professional wrenches as well.

I'm no engineer, but it would seem if you're using a correct new factory pulley bolt, then there's no reason to think its torque value specification would change since the same applied torque should result in the same correct stretch of the bolt regardless of the pulley. The pulley itself shouldn't change this result. Anyone more knowledgeable think otherwise?

Here's hoping you get your car back together soon - you're doing pioneering work, so props to you.

Exotic-metal55

Im tryin to help, so why get violent??

If the keyway was flush,,, then that is WRONG!! Keyway is recessed bro! That is why you check it with a tool. Where do you get shi info from? Have you ever installed a pulley or know how the pulley mounts on a crank? I did a DYI for install tricks that show the pictures..

http://www.**************.com/forum/...ad.php?t=19132

No way you could know this for a fact,, unless you did it yourself. Who tells you this? have certifi

Lol, sounds like those shops are to lazy to ask thier supplier questions, so they can do a job right. sorry to hear that!! Again, they TQ a bolt to specs not a puley.

Shardul and I sold you the pulley and you said to disreguard your PM for a refund.. The truth is,, you wanted to return the 190 cuz you needed money a few weeks ago but then bought a mustang. Then you wanted a 185mm cuz you said the 195 was going to be to big,, now you say the pulley needs more Toruqe.. Yes, that has what you said several times now.. Again, pulley does not Torque or have a spec,, just the bolt and it is an AMG bolt. Very easy to install! Tony knows the TQW spec very well!! Don say he doesn`t,, any reputable shop knows the TQ spec on a AMG crank bolt..:_)

Your shop asked for a new hub only at 7:55 AM the same day.. nothing about refund, just send a new hub. That means somone F ed up!! then pics were sent and you can clearly see the keyway was missed at 1oclock on the hub. There is no defect, so why should Shardul and I take it back,, cuz you reaslly never wanted a 195mm anyway. You wanted a 185 and I hear that is what you have..

Dont make up blanket statements and I wont give advice about BIP or answer the advice you PM me about .. Hell, you even have my cell number.. I spoke to Tony numerous times about this and you PM me for a refund and then told me to forget the PM... Shardul said you said the same thing.. There is no defect and you basing a peice of metal on a TQ spec is mechanically in-correct. Again, BHI only asked for a new hub, Shardul and I worked hard behind the scenes with you guys and pointed no fingers,, until I saw all this flat out mis-information. I have known Tony for a long time and this should have been easy but I guess after trying to change your mind three times on ther 195mm,,, you decided to take it live and the hard way.. Your call but we all worked hard to help you..


Again, you told me VIA PM and Shardul to forget what you asked.. I think most MFG and suppliers will not bow down to pay offs and bribary,, as youi suggest would have worked with you..Really? Pay you or give money back cuz you truck blew up, need to buy a new mustang, want a 185mm etc, etc? Again, we all worked hard for you on your build. You and Tony asked my tons of Questions about my E85 build, tuning it, fuel, etc, etc. You bought the pulley from me and Shardul and we continued to work with you but now this????

Exotic-metal55

Damn!!! It sure is nice to see good old common sense around here.. Well said bro!
o

lowprofile

A pic of the back of the pulley showing the keyway would point us in the right direction as for what might have went wrong.

320 dreamer

i have a technical question. replacing the oem pulley uses the front 3 pin crank pulley tool which holds the pulley in place and allows for correct and proper torque on the center bolt. many aftermarket crank pulleys require the flywheel be locked which could allow pulley movement during the critical torque process and cause an incorrect reading. could this be a part of the culprit for so many pulley failures after the install? just food for thought.

chawkins2001

Not sure what you are carrying on about with all this blabber, but to answer some of your questions:

• I am not a mechanic, nor have I installed a pulley before, so forgive me if I use the wrong terminology. I am clear on tq'ing bolts not pulleys, like I said before, so lets drop that. The information I am giving did not get pulled out of my ***, nor did I make it up, so how do I know how it was installed, because the owner of the outfit personally explained it to me when he got back from vacation. Again, their same tech that installs all their pulleys did mine, and Jason checked it afterwards for verification.
• Secondly, you can honestly tell me with a straight face, none of these RTR pulleys have ever dropped off the crank of any other cars like mine did, is that what you are saying? I will wait for you to answer before I say anything further on that.

Here is a pic of the back of the pulley, I dont see any pieces missing anywhere:



The rant I am having here has nothing to do with BIP or Tony, I also really appreciated when Shardul took the time to explain to me what he thought could have caused it, what the possible damage could be, and what he thought could be the possible solution.

I dont have any beef with him or you Brooke, but rather, all I am concerned about it is, the quality of this kit. Sure I am going to give it a try again this week, tq the bolt down per your or RTR's recommendations, and run with it. I am very nervous since we all know the havoc such a bigger front mount pulley can cause should it come loose again. It could tear up the front of the engine, internals of the engine etc. As you know, this pulley is going to be broken in on the dyno, so I can finish my tune out, so all I need peace with is, installed correctly, tq'd bolt down to correct spec, this windmill will be 100% true and run like a top???

Thanks for your input

lowprofile

Photo is small, but I do not see any obvious signs that the alignment was off. The keyway appears a little stretched on the left side which is common with properly installed pulleys.

chawkins2001

That is what I see in this pic to brotha

Mike@Vossen

Good luck Craig, I'm sure B.I.P will get you on the road in no time. This rough patch will only add to the greatness when your car is putting down some sweet numbers!

chawkins2001

Thanks brotha

Breaking personal records, and dropping pantys is where it is at

GT-ER

I would still install a larger key. It's a 30 minute job and makes it indestructible. The oem key is TINY and gets thinner the further out it goes. These problems happen with other vehicle manufacturers as well and they either pin the damper or install larger keys. I think the oem key just doesn't allow for ANY tolerances.

Careful when over tightening the bolt, it gets to the point when it starts to stretch and just doesn't want to tighten any more. You may want to use EC's torque spec which is 275lbft + 90* but it get's scary....lol.

I'm stealing a pic from exotic-metal so forgive me:



Here you can see how tiny the key is and the one I installed in my car goes all the way to the tip of the crank making it 2.5x larger and it's thicker as well.

chawkins2001

Pinning would be the way to go, but I dont think there is enough room down there to do it.

chawkins2001

Yeah, this is your pic brotha, with the larger key:

GT-ER

Exactly, do this!

chawkins2001

I will trouble shoot this design with BIP, and see what they say

YOU DA MANG

chawkins2001

We are going with GT-ER's larger, beefier keyway design on the second go around. Thanks for your help via pm sir

nanayaw6

Wow, seems like I've seen a lot. Sorry to hear Craig but glad you guys always have a plan. can't wait to see the panty dropper doing its job once again.

chawkins2001

This is how small the factory keyway is:



This is what mine looked like:



The snout of the crank was as smooth as a baby's bottom:




Lastly, I thought I would throw in some panty dropper pics

chawkins2001

JUDGEMENT DAY is Upon us

jmb614

Good luck Chawkins. What did you ultimately end up doing to resolve the pulley issue?

chawkins2001

We cleaned the snout and keyway, installed a new woodruff key for alignment, and had two tools made to pin the crank while it is still in the motor.

The drilling to insert the pins is taking place today, so I am keeping my fingers crossed that all goes well.

adianaty

It's going to work and looking forward to hearing about it.

ajm55

Good luck boet. Breathe life into that beast and unleash it

chawkins2001

Thanks boetie, did you see that Eurpcharged is coming to South Africa