BlackHammer

This is likely a wast of time but my car is in the shop, I have all the materials so what the heck I might as well see if this will work. If it doesn't work I am buying Shardul's set-up...

Current - VRP Aluminum Intake (aka "The Microwave"). As these sit next to the S/C and Surge Tanks they have to get to 250-300 degrees which means all this heat goes in the engine. Not good. I want to see if I can provide a layer (or layers) of insulation from the "inside" and "outside" so the air that goes in is as close to "ambient" as possible.

First of all, I am not an engineer so this may be total crazy talk but am anxious to hear what you guys think.

Here is the plan --> Insulate the Intake so it does not get hot (from the "outside in" or "inside out")

Apply materials on the outside AND inside of the intake.

"Material's" = either a single material or combo platter of Titanium Heat Wrap, Reflective Heat Tape, or a ceramic coating (on the inside).

Inside - Cut the intake open and install the correct materials to insure the aluminum intake stays cool. I am thinking on either glueing or taping (preferred) it back together to ensure that there is not a layer that would increase the temp. The other option would be to tac weld it back together on the outside.

So, the Titanium Header wrap is an insulator. It really doesn't matter if it is inside out or outside in it is an insulator.

Inside the Intake - Cut open and install:
Option #1 - The Titanium Header Wrap. This would have to be put on in smaller pieces and taped on with duct tape.
Option #2 - The Titanium Header Wrap AND reflective heat tape. The inner layer would be strips of the Titanium Wrap with the Reflective tape over it.
Option #3 - "Paint" the inside of the intake with a ceramic coating...
Outside the Intake:
Option #1 - Reflective Heat Tape only
Option #2 - Titanium Wrap with the Reflective heat tape over it
Option #3 - Reflective Heat Wrap, Titanium Wrap over it, then Reflective Heat Wrap over the Titanium Wrap. So, a "triple wrap" on the outside as "insulation".

Thanks,
TK

shardul

iTrader: (1)

have your fab guy copy this. we made this about 5 years ago.

BlackHammer

I wish I lived in Houston, TX!

The shop puked on cutting the intake open. They want no liability tied to anything going in the engine. They will wrap the intake 20X if I want.

BlackHammer

Shardul,
PM Sent with a few more questions on your set-up. I don't want to screw around with layering and layering on the aluminum intake.
TK

GorGasm

Sounds like a waste of time unless you can prove a temperature difference between the start of the intake pipes and the plenum under load.

I believe any differences will be negligible.


Use meth or something if you haven't already.

BlackHammer

Thanks. I always like "perspectives" and I ain't no engineer...
Meth is not an option. I am done modding at this point and want to enjoy the car.

With this stated;

1) I ask this with all due respect; what are your "credentials" tied to this topic (for all I know you are a thermo-nuclear engineer and if you are I want to know about it!)?

2) Are you suggesting that my approach above simply would not WORK or there is no value in doing it?

3) If I can "guarantee" there is no increase in the intake unit temp (and the air that goes in the car is "ambient") is this of value and benefit?

I am interested in your response as I am thinking on another option.

Thanks,
TK

C32owner

For starters if you opening and now taping up stuff on the inside of your intake I think that is going to be more detrimental as you now restricting and making your intake tube diameter much smaller? So the slight benefit of lower temp will be outweighed by a smaller diameter intake.

Hammer Down

Stick with the aluminum intake and wrap it as I did and call it a day.

BlackHammer

Thanks. The shop is a "no go" on doing anything in the internals.

How hot does the intake get with the wrap after you drive it?

Hammer Down

the bottom of the wrap above the headers gets hot but you can still touch it and the top side you can rest your hand on it. i'm pretty sure the insulation on the other side wipes out most of that heat and if it doesnt then I have the intake sleeve underneath that and the welders cloth underneath that.

RaceHorse

I think you guys are NUTS trying to keep intake temps down by wrapping it with heat reflecting tape. Nobody seems to understand intake air is not standing air it is constantly a new source of consumed air moving at a high rate of speed to the throttle body. When referring to airflow velocity and volume is what is important here. The heat is generated by the supercharger or turbos. Keeping their temps down will help with IATs. Ambient air will be passing thru the tubing too fast to the intake to absorb heat. I know what works for me and its certainly not heat reflecting tape.

BlackHammer

Appreciate the words. I like the NUTS in all capital letters! Many people say the same thing. I just have a tough time buying that there is no effect on IAT's if air passing through (for example) a 300° surface versus 100° surface even for a split second has no impact. Also, I felt like the combo platter of supercharger, surge tanks, and the newly installed extremely hot additional surface of the aluminum intake simply "fed" off each other and created more heat and ultimately increased the level of heat and soaked the engine bay and engine. I measured the intakes and they are 40 inches each in total length each side and diameter of 10 inches and 16.5 inches at the widest point. This is a significant amount of new additional hot surface that simply didn't exist before they were installed. Add to this my experience was my engine bay was never nearly as hot even after pounding the car after the aluminum intake's were installed.

You may be right on being nuts. However I'm gonna do my best to keep the intake is cool as possible.

BlackHammer

"I felt like the combo platter of supercharger, surge tanks, and the newly installed extremely hot additional surface of the aluminum intake simply "fed" off each other and created more heat and ultimately increased the level of heat and soaked the engine bay and engine."

This may be an all-time first for somebody quoting/responding to their your own post but thanks for helping me get "here"…

I am done with these intakes and all the heat they produce. A basic principle of the military (war), cyber security, and basic engineering is to eliminate the bad (attack or potentially problematic surface). In this case the "problem" is a significant increase of surface area with the aluminum intake.

I am buying Shardul's set up.

Taking "bids" on the aluminum intake. Bids start at $1...

Hammer Down

Did you manage your airflow underneath the hood?

BlackHammer

No and thanks for the advice and suggestions!! I am just done sinking money into the aluminum set-up. I would have ended up spending $300+ on materials alone for what I believe is a lost cause.

RaceHorse

If your setup is drawing air from the engine compartment it will suffer from the extra heat under the hood. If you can make a setup similar to what was pictured drawing air from beyond the radiator you will see huge benefits.

Instead of calculating surface area of the hot surfaces, calculate the intake velocity in feet per minute. Once you have that number think of how you can touch a hot stove for a split second without burning your finger. The exposure time to the heat doesn't allow for any significant heat transfer.

GorGasm

I don't have any fluid dynamics qualifications as such, but as others have said, the flow rate is so high and the surface area so low that the temperature of the intake walls would have to be exceptionally high to impart a significant temperature difference between the start and end of the intake pipe.

You are far better ensuring that the intake air is cool, i.e. drawing air from outside the engine space, and cooling the charged air i.e. meth or super cooling the I/C circuit.

RaceHorse is onto it.