Found this on RoadFly.org
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 125
Likes: 0
Member
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 134
Likes: 0
From: Oakton, VA
I did, but I hope you guys will allow me to continue lurking here, as this is undoubtedly the only civilized message board I know of!
I loved the E55, but I decided that I loved the feel of a 911 even more. I decided that I couldn't justify having two $90K+ vehicles, and opted to trade the E55. I'll have the LX470 to use when I need something bigger, although if I get the itch for speed, I may have to find a way to justify another E55.
For now though, I'm in the market for another sedan for my wife, but haven't decided what as of yet. My thoughts include the S4 or the E320 4Matic.
Any thoughts? My concerns are safety, size (we have two young kids), and fun--in that order.
I loved the E55, but I decided that I loved the feel of a 911 even more. I decided that I couldn't justify having two $90K+ vehicles, and opted to trade the E55. I'll have the LX470 to use when I need something bigger, although if I get the itch for speed, I may have to find a way to justify another E55.
For now though, I'm in the market for another sedan for my wife, but haven't decided what as of yet. My thoughts include the S4 or the E320 4Matic.
Any thoughts? My concerns are safety, size (we have two young kids), and fun--in that order.
Last edited by Vic; Aug 30, 2004 at 10:29 PM.
Trending Topics
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 2,123
Likes: 3
From: Chicago, IL
Real Cars
Vic, if you don't mind my prodding here...
But when you say "feel" are you talking about handling? Feedback? OVerall enjoyment? I gave up an '04 M3 6-spd for my E55 and there isn't any regret what-so-ever. You have, I think, the 2nd slowest 996 available on the market today... does that loss of power not bother you at all? Maybe it's because I live in a big city, but I find myself using brute horsepower more than I use to the edge handling.
I'm actually quite in the same boat in regards to having trouble justifying two high dollar cars like this, with my E55 and my Supra... and I can tell you right now the E55 isn't going up for sale. I have all the intentions of driving this car until it falls apart
This is in no way an inflammatory post, I'm just asking.
-m
But when you say "feel" are you talking about handling? Feedback? OVerall enjoyment? I gave up an '04 M3 6-spd for my E55 and there isn't any regret what-so-ever. You have, I think, the 2nd slowest 996 available on the market today... does that loss of power not bother you at all? Maybe it's because I live in a big city, but I find myself using brute horsepower more than I use to the edge handling.
I'm actually quite in the same boat in regards to having trouble justifying two high dollar cars like this, with my E55 and my Supra... and I can tell you right now the E55 isn't going up for sale. I have all the intentions of driving this car until it falls apart
This is in no way an inflammatory post, I'm just asking.
-m
MB World Stories
The Best of Mercedes & AMG
8 Oddball Mercedes Ideas That Actually Made it to Production
Verdad Gallardo
Dubai Tuner Gives the Mercedes G-Class An Entirely New Look
Verdad Gallardo
Six Gift Ideas Your AMG Loving Dad or Grad Will Cherish
7 Craziest Things AMG Gas Ever Built
Verdad Gallardo
New Electric Mercedes-AMG GT 4-Door Coupe Unveiled: 10 Things You Need to Know
Verdad Gallardo
6 Mercedes Models That Did NOT Age Well (But Are Somehow Still Cool)
Verdad Gallardo
Manual Mercedes? 6 Times Sindelfingen Let Drivers Have All The Fun
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes SLR McLaren 722 S Is Extremely Rare Example Modified by McLaren
Verdad Gallardo
8 Classic Boxy Mercedes Designs That Have Aged Like Fine Wine
Verdad Gallardo
Member
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 134
Likes: 0
From: Oakton, VA
Hi Marcus-
No offense taken. Indeed, just like you, when I purchased my E55, I swore that I'd drive it at least until another AMG came along that struck my fancy. The reason my thoughts changed is that I came to conclude that handling meant more to me than brute force acceleration, and the shine began to come off the E55 due to ineffective responses to my attempts to remedy a few problems. Don't get me wrong though. I still think the E55 is a fabulous vehicle, and if I could afford to own it as well as the 911, I would still do so in a heartbeat.
Given that I had to choose, however, my preference for the 911 involves several points. First of all, the handling and steering. While the E55 handles very well for a sedan, I don't think anyone will seriously argue the point that because of its weight and higher center of gravity, it just doesn't handle as well as a 911. In this regard, I think the 911 has a much more stable feel when cornered hard, in that it exhibits significantly less body roll and much less understeer (BTW, I always kept my E55 in the Sports 2 suspension mode). I'm not basing my impression here on numbers from a magazine or sophisticated test equipment--just the seat of my pants--and my *** tells me that the 911 inspires alot more confidence in corners. With regard to steering feel, I don't even think these vehicles are in the same league. I know people might not want to hear it, but I'd describe the E55's steering feel as almost numb when compared to a 911's. I don't mean this as a knock against the E55--they are very different cars--but I think that MB's engineers have either chosen to compromise on steering feel, or they need to take a tutorial from the steering folks in Weissach or Bavaria. With the 911, you get plenty of feedback through the wheel, the steering rack is quicker, and the car has a much more nimble, point and go feel. Put in simple terms, I feel that it responds to my steering inputs in a faster and more precise manner.
The next issue also involves handling, but I suspect that it is more of a service issue than an inherent flaw in the E55: the pull to the right. My E55 pulled to the right from day one, and despite at least seven visits to the dealer to address the issue, I was told that the alignment was within factory specifications. I am certainly not an alignment specialist, and there are millions of people who know more about this stuff than I do, but whether you call it pulling, drifting, or tramlining, I know my E55 did it in spades. It really was making me f--king crazy. I drive the same roads everyday, and I have been through enough different vehicles in the past few years to know that this problem was not in my imagination. I even swapped tires (Contis to PS2s), and it didn't help. Incidentally, I do not have this issue with the new vehicle, and I am driving the same roads, and they haven't been resurfaced anytime recently. The 911 tracks straight and true.
The next factor was the manual transmission. I missed it. I can't say it more simply than that. I will be the first to agree that automatics, particularly those in AMG vehicles, are faster in the hands of most drivers, myself included. I am definitely not a professional driver, I don't speedshift my cars, and I don't often drop the clutch from high RPMs, but it is just a much more involving and fun experience to shift for yourself. Again, there are days when traffic makes me long for an automatic, but this was a tradeoff that I was willing to make for the increased involvement that a manual requires.
Another consideration was the cabriolet top. Where I live, convertible season runs from early May until late September, although we do get nice days in October and November from time to time also. When I got the E55, I opted for the panorama roof in the hopes that I wouldn't miss the sensation of top down motoring for those few months a year. I was wrong. For what its worth, I felt that the 911 offered the best of both worlds in that I could drive with the top down in the spring and summer, and I can put the hardtop on in the winter.
The final reason was a small consideration, but a consideration nonetheless. I was having issues with the vehicle's electronics systems. First of all, there was the annoying phone echo. I understand that MB has come out with a fix, but why the heck did it take so long? The E class debuted as a 2003 model, and the fix was not found until we were on the cusp of 2005 model deliveries. In addition to that, I would routinely get strange electronic squeals and pops from the car, and not all of them sounded like they were coming from the audio system. The dealer was never able to find a reason for it, although they experienced the same issue.
I know some of you may ask why, if I had service issues, like the right pull, phone, etc., I didn't ask the dealer for a replacement vehicle or consider a lemon law case. The answer is that I'm an attorney, and I did both. The dealer essentially told me that I was being too picky, and MBUSA told me that the problems I was having did not amount to a substantial impairment to the vehicle's safety, value, or useability, and as such they did not feel it was a lemon, even though it spent 35 days in the shop in just 9 months. Having successfully been through a lemon law case with BMW, I decided that the time and effort involved were not worth the aggravation, as I was finding that MBUSA's approach in these types of cases is less customer-friendly than BMW's, even though I have purchased three MBs in four years from the same dealership.
So, in a nutshell, that sums it up. That said, I'd again reiterate that I still loved the E55, and I'd buy another one in a heartbeat. I do miss the acceleration, and there is no doubt that it would smoke my 911 in a straightline race. Of course, many years of driving have led me to the conclusion that most roads tend to have a few curves in them, and I'm pretty sure that I'll still manage to stay close. Of course, I'd also point out that I am speaking only for myself. I know that other people have different opinions, and that while handling may mean more to me than acceleration, it may be different for others--particularly those who own an E55 AND an 833 hp Supra!
Happy motoring!
No offense taken. Indeed, just like you, when I purchased my E55, I swore that I'd drive it at least until another AMG came along that struck my fancy. The reason my thoughts changed is that I came to conclude that handling meant more to me than brute force acceleration, and the shine began to come off the E55 due to ineffective responses to my attempts to remedy a few problems. Don't get me wrong though. I still think the E55 is a fabulous vehicle, and if I could afford to own it as well as the 911, I would still do so in a heartbeat.
Given that I had to choose, however, my preference for the 911 involves several points. First of all, the handling and steering. While the E55 handles very well for a sedan, I don't think anyone will seriously argue the point that because of its weight and higher center of gravity, it just doesn't handle as well as a 911. In this regard, I think the 911 has a much more stable feel when cornered hard, in that it exhibits significantly less body roll and much less understeer (BTW, I always kept my E55 in the Sports 2 suspension mode). I'm not basing my impression here on numbers from a magazine or sophisticated test equipment--just the seat of my pants--and my *** tells me that the 911 inspires alot more confidence in corners. With regard to steering feel, I don't even think these vehicles are in the same league. I know people might not want to hear it, but I'd describe the E55's steering feel as almost numb when compared to a 911's. I don't mean this as a knock against the E55--they are very different cars--but I think that MB's engineers have either chosen to compromise on steering feel, or they need to take a tutorial from the steering folks in Weissach or Bavaria. With the 911, you get plenty of feedback through the wheel, the steering rack is quicker, and the car has a much more nimble, point and go feel. Put in simple terms, I feel that it responds to my steering inputs in a faster and more precise manner.
The next issue also involves handling, but I suspect that it is more of a service issue than an inherent flaw in the E55: the pull to the right. My E55 pulled to the right from day one, and despite at least seven visits to the dealer to address the issue, I was told that the alignment was within factory specifications. I am certainly not an alignment specialist, and there are millions of people who know more about this stuff than I do, but whether you call it pulling, drifting, or tramlining, I know my E55 did it in spades. It really was making me f--king crazy. I drive the same roads everyday, and I have been through enough different vehicles in the past few years to know that this problem was not in my imagination. I even swapped tires (Contis to PS2s), and it didn't help. Incidentally, I do not have this issue with the new vehicle, and I am driving the same roads, and they haven't been resurfaced anytime recently. The 911 tracks straight and true.
The next factor was the manual transmission. I missed it. I can't say it more simply than that. I will be the first to agree that automatics, particularly those in AMG vehicles, are faster in the hands of most drivers, myself included. I am definitely not a professional driver, I don't speedshift my cars, and I don't often drop the clutch from high RPMs, but it is just a much more involving and fun experience to shift for yourself. Again, there are days when traffic makes me long for an automatic, but this was a tradeoff that I was willing to make for the increased involvement that a manual requires.
Another consideration was the cabriolet top. Where I live, convertible season runs from early May until late September, although we do get nice days in October and November from time to time also. When I got the E55, I opted for the panorama roof in the hopes that I wouldn't miss the sensation of top down motoring for those few months a year. I was wrong. For what its worth, I felt that the 911 offered the best of both worlds in that I could drive with the top down in the spring and summer, and I can put the hardtop on in the winter.
The final reason was a small consideration, but a consideration nonetheless. I was having issues with the vehicle's electronics systems. First of all, there was the annoying phone echo. I understand that MB has come out with a fix, but why the heck did it take so long? The E class debuted as a 2003 model, and the fix was not found until we were on the cusp of 2005 model deliveries. In addition to that, I would routinely get strange electronic squeals and pops from the car, and not all of them sounded like they were coming from the audio system. The dealer was never able to find a reason for it, although they experienced the same issue.
I know some of you may ask why, if I had service issues, like the right pull, phone, etc., I didn't ask the dealer for a replacement vehicle or consider a lemon law case. The answer is that I'm an attorney, and I did both. The dealer essentially told me that I was being too picky, and MBUSA told me that the problems I was having did not amount to a substantial impairment to the vehicle's safety, value, or useability, and as such they did not feel it was a lemon, even though it spent 35 days in the shop in just 9 months. Having successfully been through a lemon law case with BMW, I decided that the time and effort involved were not worth the aggravation, as I was finding that MBUSA's approach in these types of cases is less customer-friendly than BMW's, even though I have purchased three MBs in four years from the same dealership.
So, in a nutshell, that sums it up. That said, I'd again reiterate that I still loved the E55, and I'd buy another one in a heartbeat. I do miss the acceleration, and there is no doubt that it would smoke my 911 in a straightline race. Of course, many years of driving have led me to the conclusion that most roads tend to have a few curves in them, and I'm pretty sure that I'll still manage to stay close. Of course, I'd also point out that I am speaking only for myself. I know that other people have different opinions, and that while handling may mean more to me than acceleration, it may be different for others--particularly those who own an E55 AND an 833 hp Supra!
Happy motoring!
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 2,123
Likes: 3
From: Chicago, IL
Real Cars
Vic,
Interesting points. I find it very disheartening that there are dealerships that can so conclusively end a MB owner's love for the brand. It seems like your car had relatively small issues and if only there had been a second opinion, or just some other suggestion on them maybe they could have been solved. I know the alignment thing is something a tuner would know how to fix, rather than the "by the book" mentality most dealerships go by.
The MB's calm and collected feel are, I think, perfectly suited for the type of car it is supposed to be. My M3 handled like a dream, sometimes too well, and I have to say there are those late nights I'm coming home and I don't want to feel every damned bump and crack in the road. I don't think luxury sedans should do that, either. The MB does have a boatlike feel to it, but it does handle fairly well taking everything into consideration. I don't think it has to be said that it'll never handle like a 911, but it isn't supposed to, and I wouldn't want it to. If I wanted 911 handling, I'd get a 911... 4 door midsize luxury sedans should not sacrifice comfort for razor edge handling... they should still handle well, but to a point.
I don't know, given you situation, I probably would have opted to get something cheaper to fullfill my need for a manual car with good handling... like an E36 M3, or a 993, something to that effect. I cannot see myself giving up the things the E55 does so well just for a manual transmission and better handling, not for a car I drive every day on public roads and streets... especially in Chicago. Those two things can become a burden as much as a pleasure. That is basically the dilemma I'm having now, I have this Supra with a lot of money invested into it, which has effectively has a competitor now in terms of shear power. The Supra makes more, but it requires more too - high octane fuel, maintenance, etc. I'm thinking maybe I'll just get something less expensive, something stock, and keep it in the garages for those nice days.
As for the rest of the time... like Monday mornings on the way to the office... 500ft/lbs on this nice 1/8th mile onramp I take to get on the expressway... it never gets old. That, and having 3 passengers with you, after a nice evening on the town, and laying waste to some punk in a Mustang Cobra who thought he was king of the road.
Good luck to you, and I hope to see you in another E55 someday.
-m
Interesting points. I find it very disheartening that there are dealerships that can so conclusively end a MB owner's love for the brand. It seems like your car had relatively small issues and if only there had been a second opinion, or just some other suggestion on them maybe they could have been solved. I know the alignment thing is something a tuner would know how to fix, rather than the "by the book" mentality most dealerships go by.
The MB's calm and collected feel are, I think, perfectly suited for the type of car it is supposed to be. My M3 handled like a dream, sometimes too well, and I have to say there are those late nights I'm coming home and I don't want to feel every damned bump and crack in the road. I don't think luxury sedans should do that, either. The MB does have a boatlike feel to it, but it does handle fairly well taking everything into consideration. I don't think it has to be said that it'll never handle like a 911, but it isn't supposed to, and I wouldn't want it to. If I wanted 911 handling, I'd get a 911... 4 door midsize luxury sedans should not sacrifice comfort for razor edge handling... they should still handle well, but to a point.
I don't know, given you situation, I probably would have opted to get something cheaper to fullfill my need for a manual car with good handling... like an E36 M3, or a 993, something to that effect. I cannot see myself giving up the things the E55 does so well just for a manual transmission and better handling, not for a car I drive every day on public roads and streets... especially in Chicago. Those two things can become a burden as much as a pleasure. That is basically the dilemma I'm having now, I have this Supra with a lot of money invested into it, which has effectively has a competitor now in terms of shear power. The Supra makes more, but it requires more too - high octane fuel, maintenance, etc. I'm thinking maybe I'll just get something less expensive, something stock, and keep it in the garages for those nice days.
As for the rest of the time... like Monday mornings on the way to the office... 500ft/lbs on this nice 1/8th mile onramp I take to get on the expressway... it never gets old
. That, and having 3 passengers with you, after a nice evening on the town, and laying waste to some punk in a Mustang Cobra who thought he was king of the road.Good luck to you, and I hope to see you in another E55 someday
.-m
Member
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 134
Likes: 0
From: Oakton, VA
Marcus-
Thank you for your kind and thoughtful words. People like you are the reason I will continue to hang around this board. As I said before, it's hard to say for sure, but I may end up getting another E55 in the future.
Cheers!
Thank you for your kind and thoughtful words. People like you are the reason I will continue to hang around this board. As I said before, it's hard to say for sure, but I may end up getting another E55 in the future.
Cheers!
