MBE63AMG

This is my first post at MBW. I have posted this at the AMG Private Lounge in hopes that some MB engineer would respond but no luck there.....for what I have seen, there are more people here working on these mods than there....here goes:

This is my first post on Private Lounge. I bought my E63 in May 2012 and at the time thought that I did not need carbon ceramic brakes. After attending the AMG driving academy, the good people of AMG (instructors and engineers) convinced me that it is better and worth the money. Since I already had the car and have been using it with standard steel brakes, the only option would be to upgrade it. I ordered a full set of OEM carbon Ceramic rotors, calipers and pads and started the research on procedures and torque specs to install it (I plan on doing the install myself) and found not just contradictions regarding the advantages of carbon ceramic but also a complete lack of information on installation procedures and torque specs. My concerns are directed to the same engineers at AMG that convinced me to go ahead with the upgrade in the first place. Hope you can help me by giving me your answer / point of view on the following issues:

1- Is the ESP (stability control) and/ or the automatic braking system programmed differently for steel brakes or carbon ceramic brakes?
2- Is the master cylinder different in any way between a car with steel brakes and one with carbon ceramic brakes?
3- Where can I find the installation procedures and torque specs for installing the carbon ceramic rotors and calipers?
4- I read complaints from AMG owners that the carbon ceramic brakes are non responsive in the initial portion of the brake pedal travel and engage abruptly afterwords and that Mercedes responded that this is the nature of the system. I also read that Mercedes is the only cars with this problem. Is this true?
5- I read also that carbon ceramic brakes will be damaged severely if the car is constantly used in dusty / sandy environment. This happens to be my case. Is this true?

It is a long post but this is not a simple upgrade and by no means cheap. I hope someone from the AMG could help me out.

Thanks

lunarx

Did you ever complete this upgrade?

Item 1 - Only an MB Engineer would know.
My guess is it's not a big concern.

Item 2 - You would need to check the MB EPC to see if there is a different MC. Also, any dealer can check that easily.

Item 3 - The calipers would install as any calipers. Torque specs may be in AllData the online service manual company. Make sure you buy extra wheel stud guides to avoid hitting your ceramic rotors when installing wheels. Use 2 guides not just one. There should not be any torque spec for the rotors. That retaining screw does not need to be overtightened or you risk not being able to remove it later.

Item 4 - Not surprising as they are intended for high performance driving. Most track oriented brake components have minimum heat requirements to reach optimum performance.

Item 5 - Not sure on that but if you are in middle east or something that might be a concern. The main thing is not chiping the rotors or catching a pebble between the pad and rotor.

I commend you for doing this upgrade.
I considered it myself, but found it too cost prohibitive.
Please let us know how it goes.

derek

I can't, for the life of me, understand why someone would spend the coin on the carbon brakes unless you plan on spending a lot of time at the track. But if you've got so much coin it doesn't matter...enjoy.

lunarx

If you want an arrive and drive multi-purpose car it's not such a bad way to go.
Since the rotors last longer that helps offset the cost a bit.
The steel 2-piece front rotors are not so cheap either and they wear out quickly.
Plus the carbon front rotors are bigger and look so much cooler.
The rears, however, are very hard to justify.
Front only might be a good play.
But for someone willing to spend that coin, why not go all the way.

derek

It would take a lot of rotors to offset that cost! . I don't know, the e63 is a fat pig on the track, my s2000 is waaaaaay more fun trackside and rotors cost $30 bucks.

I don't know, I just don't really consider my e63 as a dual purpose car, but that's just me. I did spend quite a bit of time at the track in a 2012 c63 I had for a bit, and it was fast and fun and all, but it did chew through rotors and pads and tires and gas and...hence my purchase of the e63 and s2k.

But, if you are ballin where you like the looks kudos to you! Enjoy.

MBE63AMG

Sorry guys, been traveling for the past few weeks. No, I have not yetcompleted the upgrade. Looking back now,maybe I should not have purchased the upgrade but the parts are here now andthere is only one place it can go I almost ordered the option when I orderedthe car....now I get the same for the same price as the original option costplus I get to resell the steel rotors and calipers to offset the price a bit.

Thanks for the comments and replies, I will definitely post some picturesfrom before, during and after.

Ali_E55

please let us know how the replacement is, smooth or not. does it need something special or it is a direct replacement.

thanks for sharing

SVP03

What is the price i US for a full set.
Here in EU there was a new set for 9995 € at ebay.de for 6 month ago.

MBE63AMG

The price is 13.5K. I am in the middle of the install and ran into a little problem. The brake pad wear sensor cables are too short. They must use a different harness for the Carbon Ceramic brakes. Modern Horsepower (the supplier) assured me that the install was a direct replacement with all parts included. That is not the case. My dilemma now is if I should continue with the install and reroute the harness (it would not look stock), try to get a new harness (not sure I can even get one) or just go back to the steel brakes.

lunarx

Seems like a minor problem.
New harness would be the way to go.
If you need help looking it up, let me know and Ill get on the EPC and check it out.

I will probably order a longer harness too.
Im going to at least get the 15.4" steel rotor upgrade.

BTW:

Are the piston sizes different on the new calipers?

Are the rear calipers different?
(Those front calipers look like a completely different design.)

alrasheed1991

Finish the install, and go to dealer let them install the sensor .

MBE63AMG

I agree, the harness is the way to go but I am having a hard time finding the PN for it. The current harness PN is A 212 540 22 05 (printed on the harness) but I look all over the WIS/ASRA and cannot find it. This thing is so complex and has so many documents that it is likely there, I just can't find it.

The front calipers are much larger and so is the rotor. I have done only the front (time issues) and don't know yet if I am going to have the same problem with the rear harness....will let you know in a few hours.

I have given up on dealerships, they could not even get info on how to do the upgrade.

lunarx

You need;
A 212 440 32 13
Electrical Wiring Harness
Brake Wear Indicator and Shock Absorber, Right
Code: 488+B07

FYI - Code B07 is the Ceramic Brake Code

Apparently the Left Harness (A 212 540 25 05) works for all applications.
Was it only the Right harness that was a problem?

If you have any more issues let me know and I'll look parts up for you on the EPC.

I also attached a Parts List for the Front Brakes.
Did you get the new backing plates [Brake Disk Covering Panels] also?

MBE63AMG

Wow, that is incredible . I have been chasing this information for a very long time and nobody, not even the dealership, could come up with this. THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU. No, I did not get the backing plates (did not know I needed them). I will try to get these ASAP along with the cables (any recommendations on best place to purchase these?). Meanwhile I routed the cables differently and it works perfectly without kinks. The wear sensors are only on the right side front and back, therefore the left side was not a problem and the rear rotors are the same size so the wear sensor mounted perfectly on the new caliper . I bled the brakes yesterday and went out for a test run but it will have to go back on the lift...I feel a little spongy feeling which is indication that I still have air in the lines....

Again, thank you for your help.

lunarx

Glad to hear you have the upgrade on and working.
Now get us some pics!

Most dealers are far better on the EPC than me, so I wonder what dealers you dealt with.

I imagine the B07 backing plates would serve better to protect those larger rotors from rock damage.
If you have a 2012 you probably want the 2nd version of the backing plates.
However, check the vin digits to be sure.
My guess is the 2nd version is better either way, besides it costs 2x as much so probably has more surface area and a better design.

Genuine Mercedes Parts or Mercedes Parts Center are good places to buy parts.
Note: When you look up parts on their website dont put the A in (just use the number).

MBE63AMG

You saved me again. I could not find the parts on any site, just dropped the A and they all showed up (parts already on order). Mine is 2012 and for sure is the second version...will definitely get those. It will be a pain to have to remove the hubs to install them though.

Took lots of pics...as soon as I have some time I will upload them.

Thanks again

MBE63AMG

Original equipment...


New caliper and rotor



Car on lift with the new setup


Being very careful installing the wheels with the new rotors...

justthebest

Any updates on this?

I cooked the stock brakes on my SL63, and I'm trying to figure out how intense a project this will be.

What ended up happening with the wiring harness?

And how are the brakes working?

I think there might be a software upgrade issue re: the quick bite?

Thanks to all

MBE63AMG

I bled the brakes again and it was perfect. The feel is much better than the steel setup, it is linearly progressive with an incredible response. Love them. I heard a lot of controversy about CCB and was skeptical but all my skepticism went out the window when I first drove the car (after bleeding the brakes a second time). They are awesome. You do need the additional parts as per previous post (backing plates and wire harness) although they are not necessary if you reroute the harness and don't care about the smaller size back plate that is already there. I like things to be correct so I ordered it and it is already here. I just did not have time to go back in. This time the rotors need to come off as well for the back plates to go in. It takes about a day's work to get it done if you do it yourself with lots of time to spare. I even took the time to wash the wheel wells thoroughly before starting. It is easier if you have a lift. You will need a torque wrench and I do recommend Loctite on the bolts which is not specified on the procedures. BTW, if you need the MB procedures I can send you a copy. Also, make sure you have a plug for the lines (I used a very small conic silicone plug I havefor powder coating), it will give you a lot of time to remove the caliper and hose and reinstall the new calipers without getting fluid all over the place.

justthebest

Thanks so much - I decided to pull the trigger, but I'm having my local shop do the work. I've provided them all the information, so hopefully it will be a flawless install!