Opinions needed. Which tune (M157) - OE or EuroCharged?
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2002
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From: Ontario, Canada
E 320
The car did pick up some mid range HP and TQ! Top end is similar.
Did a dyno run right after the cat delete and re-flash!
I've been told that the car need to re-adapt/relearn after the tune?
Iron Sheik
Senior Member
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 336
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From: Chicago
M3, E55, cls63
I have the Eurocharged stage 2 tune, I had turbo back downpipes, 2 step colder plugs, and filters installed at the same time. Hands down the best mod for these cars is a tune I own a couple of other pretty fast cars and my CLS63 really surprised me after doing these mods. I also had the burble tune initially but it got a bit obnoxious so I got rid of it. I went with Eurocharged because I have their tune on my E55 which has 160k trouble free miles on it has been tuned most its life. I would skip the Stage 1 and go straight to the Stage 2 tune and do some downpipes its crazy how good the m157 sounds with a set of downpipes.
Member
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 126
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2012 CLS63 AMG stock (For now)
I got everything done at Eurocharged and they just reflashed the ECU after wards.
The car did pick up some mid range HP and TQ! Top end is similar.
Did a dyno run right after the cat delete and re-flash!
I've been told that the car need to re-adapt/relearn after the tune?
Iron Sheik
The car did pick up some mid range HP and TQ! Top end is similar.
Did a dyno run right after the cat delete and re-flash!
I've been told that the car need to re-adapt/relearn after the tune?
Iron Sheik
I got a question for you guys. If you remove the cats, wouldn't you fail inspection and consequently not be able to drive on the road without inspection? Or do you put the cats back up and then pass inspection, then remove it again? Also, is it worth it to decat my cls63 if I get only little hp gains? Also, you guys must be addicted to very loud noise because stock (especially during cold start) the car makes a good amount of noise which is music to my ears lol
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 445
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From: ATL
CLS 63 and M4
Hello,
I got a question for you guys. If you remove the cats, wouldn't you fail inspection and consequently not be able to drive on the road without inspection? Or do you put the cats back up and then pass inspection, then remove it again? Also, is it worth it to decat my cls63 if I get only little hp gains? Also, you guys must be addicted to very loud noise because stock (especially during cold start) the car makes a good amount of noise which is music to my ears lol
I got a question for you guys. If you remove the cats, wouldn't you fail inspection and consequently not be able to drive on the road without inspection? Or do you put the cats back up and then pass inspection, then remove it again? Also, is it worth it to decat my cls63 if I get only little hp gains? Also, you guys must be addicted to very loud noise because stock (especially during cold start) the car makes a good amount of noise which is music to my ears lol
Member
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 126
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2012 CLS63 AMG stock (For now)
We can actually tune your car from the comfort of home and give you a handheld to keep that allows ya to swap between file whenever ya want
we also have a motor protection warranty, have done over 25,000 cars, and have locations all over the world to better serve our clients!
we also have a motor protection warranty, have done over 25,000 cars, and have locations all over the world to better serve our clients!
Ironsheik has raised an important issue. He believes that once you start getting into the 700hp plus mark, the transmission may start slipping (Which was also part of my concern). Does the EC tune have an additional transmission tune software that controls how the transmission will perform with these drastic increase in HP and torque or is the transmission controlled by the ECU and your tune files are able to control the transmission for massive amounts of torque?
Member
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 126
Likes: 17
2012 CLS63 AMG stock (For now)
I see. I believe you can fool the ECU to believe there is a cat. But I believe during inspection, they do an emission test which checks the exhaust for smoke and unburnt fuel (to see how rich it is) and not just the ECU? I could be wrong though.
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 445
Likes: 157
From: ATL
CLS 63 and M4
we dont have sniff tests in Ga. they you plug into the OBD port. i think most states have stopped using those since OBD's came on the scene in 1996.
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MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,399
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From: Bay Area, California
2015 E63s AMG, 2020 GLC 43 AMG
Out Of Control!!
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 13,799
Likes: 3,229
2014 E63S; AMS 100 octane ECU dyno tune; EDOK TCU tune; BB intakes; sprintbooster
AMS man! PM MBmastertech with his thoughts on Eurocharged. Not certain he is correct. However, he seems to know what he is talking about. Also, remember that you only need to be local if you are getting other work done by the tuner besides an ECU tune. Yes, being local means they can dyno tune it and works out wrinkles earlier on. But AMS for example certainly can remote tune your ECU. Also, you should invest $350 to $600 on a second ECU if you go the remote route. This way, if you need to send it back for a tweak, you are not without your car.
As far as discounts/sales and such, trust me that AMS will match pricing from any of these other guys. Not that I have ever had a tuned ECU or plan on getting one.
Good Luck
As far as discounts/sales and such, trust me that AMS will match pricing from any of these other guys. Not that I have ever had a tuned ECU or plan on getting one.
Good Luck
+1000 on ams
Newbie
Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 7
Likes: 0
From: Toronto
2014 E63 S
$880. 8 hours of labour? I was told that from other members before I got it done.
And AMGboy, definitely delete your cats if you have the burble feature. You are not getting the full performance of your car.
My car woke up after the cat delete. It was breathing better.
Iron Sheik
And AMGboy, definitely delete your cats if you have the burble feature. You are not getting the full performance of your car.
My car woke up after the cat delete. It was breathing better.
Iron Sheik
Senior Member
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 336
Likes: 100
From: Chicago
M3, E55, cls63
I had the Stage 2 tune done and have been thinking about getting the cats removed (I don't think I have the "burble" option since it wasn't mentioned to me). My concern is how much louder the car gets without the cats. Is it that much louder under normal driving condition? I don't have an issue with the car being loud under WOT but I'd like things the way they are right now when I'm just cruising around.
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2016
Posts: 282
Likes: 26
2012 CLS 63
i live in Cali as of right now they are only doing OBD testing and checking the monitors
ive been having problems with my catalyst monitor due to not getting enough airflow and I have a burble tune so my cats are probably clogged. I am ready to get rid of them
as far as visual inspection, you would need to put your cats back in but to workaround all of this I am probably going to gut my OEM cats and get a retune. It will pass visual inpspection and obd2
i have no interest In paying $1500+ for metal pipes with 02 bungs just to get a 25-35hp gain that can be had for much cheaper. Also downpipes would require swapping back to stock for smog, in my opinion that’s too much work. Rather gut the cats they do no good for our engines
Unfortunately a problem I’m dealing with in CA is all my usual exhaust shops are refusing to touch or remove my cats because the law has been cracking down on these shops. I’m probably gonna end up doing the job myself (gutting then) but if anyone is good friends with exhaust shops just have them fabricate downpipes for you and it’ll be a fraction of the price
ive been having problems with my catalyst monitor due to not getting enough airflow and I have a burble tune so my cats are probably clogged. I am ready to get rid of them
as far as visual inspection, you would need to put your cats back in but to workaround all of this I am probably going to gut my OEM cats and get a retune. It will pass visual inpspection and obd2
i have no interest In paying $1500+ for metal pipes with 02 bungs just to get a 25-35hp gain that can be had for much cheaper. Also downpipes would require swapping back to stock for smog, in my opinion that’s too much work. Rather gut the cats they do no good for our engines
Unfortunately a problem I’m dealing with in CA is all my usual exhaust shops are refusing to touch or remove my cats because the law has been cracking down on these shops. I’m probably gonna end up doing the job myself (gutting then) but if anyone is good friends with exhaust shops just have them fabricate downpipes for you and it’ll be a fraction of the price
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,399
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From: Bay Area, California
2015 E63s AMG, 2020 GLC 43 AMG
i live in Cali as of right now they are only doing OBD testing and checking the monitors
ive been having problems with my catalyst monitor due to not getting enough airflow and I have a burble tune so my cats are probably clogged. I am ready to get rid of them
as far as visual inspection, you would need to put your cats back in but to workaround all of this I am probably going to gut my OEM cats and get a retune. It will pass visual inpspection and obd2
i have no interest In paying $1500+ for metal pipes with 02 bungs just to get a 25-35hp gain that can be had for much cheaper. Also downpipes would require swapping back to stock for smog, in my opinion that’s too much work. Rather gut the cats they do no good for our engines
Unfortunately a problem I’m dealing with in CA is all my usual exhaust shops are refusing to touch or remove my cats because the law has been cracking down on these shops. I’m probably gonna end up doing the job myself (gutting then) but if anyone is good friends with exhaust shops just have them fabricate downpipes for you and it’ll be a fraction of the price
And now my 2015 is clear until 2019. So I guess they changed the process. But like you say, you still need to pass visual and they only way to do that is 2 exhaust systems or gutted cats.
Banned
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 159
Likes: 28
From: USA
E63 AMG S
Catless on these cars is pretty useless TBH..
Minimal power to be had, the smell, and the cost to re-tune ( shut off secondary 02 monitoring), labor for install and catless pipes. For some more noise?
No body really knows what tune is good or not as all there is a bunch of accounts of dynos and butt dyno reviews. There is no real data on this forum and what is what. So the one that throws CEL is least is the winner haha
Minimal power to be had, the smell, and the cost to re-tune ( shut off secondary 02 monitoring), labor for install and catless pipes. For some more noise?
No body really knows what tune is good or not as all there is a bunch of accounts of dynos and butt dyno reviews. There is no real data on this forum and what is what. So the one that throws CEL is least is the winner haha
Member
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 126
Likes: 17
2012 CLS63 AMG stock (For now)
Catless on these cars is pretty useless TBH..
Minimal power to be had, the smell, and the cost to re-tune ( shut off secondary 02 monitoring), labor for install and catless pipes. For some more noise?
No body really knows what tune is good or not as all there is a bunch of accounts of dynos and butt dyno reviews. There is no real data on this forum and what is what. So the one that throws CEL is least is the winner haha
Minimal power to be had, the smell, and the cost to re-tune ( shut off secondary 02 monitoring), labor for install and catless pipes. For some more noise?
No body really knows what tune is good or not as all there is a bunch of accounts of dynos and butt dyno reviews. There is no real data on this forum and what is what. So the one that throws CEL is least is the winner haha
Plus who will want to spend $800 plus dollars for some 20hp and lots of noise (but going nowhere fast) or actually spend $1000 on a tune and get 120hp + and burn almost any car on the road?
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2016
Posts: 282
Likes: 26
2012 CLS 63
Catless on these cars is pretty useless TBH..
Minimal power to be had, the smell, and the cost to re-tune ( shut off secondary 02 monitoring), labor for install and catless pipes. For some more noise?
No body really knows what tune is good or not as all there is a bunch of accounts of dynos and butt dyno reviews. There is no real data on this forum and what is what. So the one that throws CEL is least is the winner haha
Minimal power to be had, the smell, and the cost to re-tune ( shut off secondary 02 monitoring), labor for install and catless pipes. For some more noise?
No body really knows what tune is good or not as all there is a bunch of accounts of dynos and butt dyno reviews. There is no real data on this forum and what is what. So the one that throws CEL is least is the winner haha
Out Of Control!!
Joined: Jun 2004
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2014 E63S; AMS 100 octane ECU dyno tune; EDOK TCU tune; BB intakes; sprintbooster
catless on any turbo car adds power and improves throttle response. Granted it’s not substantial, it yields benefits for sure and helps overall longevity of the car. The sound is a bonus. If you keep the cats in they will go bad eventually and those will cost you a lot to replace. That’d be a good time to delete them. But seriously removing cats on any turbo platform undoubtedly yields gains and it’s a mod almost anyone whose serious power does. It’s not a huge amount of power so it won’t make or break your build if you don’t but you shouldn’t overlook the benefits. Also 02 monitoring is literally only for emissions and has no effect on the engines life or power
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2016
Posts: 282
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2012 CLS 63
there’s people with over 1000hp that aren’t doing much better in 1/4 miles due to other limiting factors.
but the increase in turbo spool, throttle response, and power is noticeable to the driver and as mentioned above proven on the dyno but 20-30 whp is probably not gonna translate into a significant difference in track times that’s a given. Also there cars aren’t necessarily made to be 1/4 mile cars
Senior Member
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 336
Likes: 100
From: Chicago
M3, E55, cls63
It's not always about peak power numbers its been shown on this forum plenty of times that downpipes increase midrange power and also increase throttle response. Also these cars run the same 1/4 mile with 650whp and 850whp so I wouldn't rely too heavily on those. I guarantee if you do a roll race with a tune only car vs tune + downpipes the tune and downpipes car will win every time. Whether they're worth the price and labor is up to you. For me the sound alone was worth the price.
Banned
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 159
Likes: 28
From: USA
E63 AMG S
catless on any turbo car adds power and improves throttle response. Granted it’s not substantial, it yields benefits for sure and helps overall longevity of the car. The sound is a bonus. If you keep the cats in they will go bad eventually and those will cost you a lot to replace. That’d be a good time to delete them. But seriously removing cats on any turbo platform undoubtedly yields gains and it’s a mod almost anyone whose serious power does. It’s not a huge amount of power so it won’t make or break your build if you don’t but you shouldn’t overlook the benefits. Also 02 monitoring is literally only for emissions and has no effect on the engines life or power
Cat should last for a very long time, i dont think that is a major PLUS to do a cat delete lol.
I have seen a catless vs catted race and the difference being almost nothing to talk about from a 40-130.
I also remember back in the day the cats use to limit the amount of boost you can run on stock turbos and to run high you had to be decatted. This platform, you can outrun the turbo psi before the cats become a restriction it seems.
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 445
Likes: 157
From: ATL
CLS 63 and M4
true but track gain is subjective
there’s people with over 1000hp that aren’t doing much better in 1/4 miles due to other limiting factors.
but the increase in turbo spool, throttle response, and power is noticeable to the driver and as mentioned above proven on the dyno but 20-30 whp is probably not gonna translate into a significant difference in track times that’s a given. Also there cars aren’t necessarily made to be 1/4 mile cars
Senior Member
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 336
Likes: 100
From: Chicago
M3, E55, cls63
Cat technology has gotten very aggressive and good over the past decade, even more so that last few years. I think this is playing a big role in power that is being made from people going catless being not what they expect.
Cat should last for a very long time, i dont think that is a major PLUS to do a cat delete lol.
I have seen a catless vs catted race and the difference being almost nothing to talk about from a 40-130.
I also remember back in the day the cats use to limit the amount of boost you can run on stock turbos and to run high you had to be decatted. This platform, you can outrun the turbo psi before the cats become a restriction it seems.
Cat should last for a very long time, i dont think that is a major PLUS to do a cat delete lol.
I have seen a catless vs catted race and the difference being almost nothing to talk about from a 40-130.
I also remember back in the day the cats use to limit the amount of boost you can run on stock turbos and to run high you had to be decatted. This platform, you can outrun the turbo psi before the cats become a restriction it seems.
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2016
Posts: 282
Likes: 26
2012 CLS 63
Cat technology has gotten very aggressive and good over the past decade, even more so that last few years. I think this is playing a big role in power that is being made from people going catless being not what they expect.
Cat should last for a very long time, i dont think that is a major PLUS to do a cat delete lol.
I have seen a catless vs catted race and the difference being almost nothing to talk about from a 40-130.
I also remember back in the day the cats use to limit the amount of boost you can run on stock turbos and to run high you had to be decatted. This platform, you can outrun the turbo psi before the cats become a restriction it seems.
Cat should last for a very long time, i dont think that is a major PLUS to do a cat delete lol.
I have seen a catless vs catted race and the difference being almost nothing to talk about from a 40-130.
I also remember back in the day the cats use to limit the amount of boost you can run on stock turbos and to run high you had to be decatted. This platform, you can outrun the turbo psi before the cats become a restriction it seems.
Smog/emission components are covered up to 80k miles on these cars because they’re prone to early failure. So must not be super advanced technology. Whether or not to delete cats, that’s up to you but it makes a lot of sense why a lot of people do. I saw someone above say it’s obnoxious lol when it’s really not I’m sure he either A) never heard one with a simple cat delete or B) likes performance cars that are silent
most likely A
