A quick code question
02-27-2019, 04:09 PM
#1
Junior Member
Thread Starter
A quick code question
Hey guys,
2014 Stage 1 Tuned e63, car had new plugs put in by Mercedes 6 months ago, then car was tuned roughly 600 miles ago. Exclusively run Shell fuel (CA).
Today when rolling in second I accelerated at around 85% throttle, cart stuttered, check engine started flashing, idle went lumpy - never stalled.
Shut it down, restarted it, car runs, boosts, and idles fine now.
Ran the codes - P0300, P0306 (#6), P0307 (#7).
As it is only two cylinders, no other codes came up, and the car is running fine now, is it safe to assume it's just time to go colder plugs? Or do these codes represent anything else I should consider?
Thanks!
R
2014 Stage 1 Tuned e63, car had new plugs put in by Mercedes 6 months ago, then car was tuned roughly 600 miles ago. Exclusively run Shell fuel (CA).
Today when rolling in second I accelerated at around 85% throttle, cart stuttered, check engine started flashing, idle went lumpy - never stalled.
Shut it down, restarted it, car runs, boosts, and idles fine now.
Ran the codes - P0300, P0306 (#6), P0307 (#7).
As it is only two cylinders, no other codes came up, and the car is running fine now, is it safe to assume it's just time to go colder plugs? Or do these codes represent anything else I should consider?
Thanks!
R
02-27-2019, 04:56 PM
#2
Banned
Hey guys,
2014 Stage 1 Tuned e63, car had new plugs put in by Mercedes 6 months ago, then car was tuned roughly 600 miles ago. Exclusively run Shell fuel (CA).
Today when rolling in second I accelerated at around 85% throttle, cart stuttered, check engine started flashing, idle went lumpy - never stalled.
Shut it down, restarted it, car runs, boosts, and idles fine now.
Ran the codes - P0300, P0306 (#6), P0307 (#7).
As it is only two cylinders, no other codes came up, and the car is running fine now, is it safe to assume it's just time to go colder plugs? Or do these codes represent anything else I should consider?
Thanks!
R
2014 Stage 1 Tuned e63, car had new plugs put in by Mercedes 6 months ago, then car was tuned roughly 600 miles ago. Exclusively run Shell fuel (CA).
Today when rolling in second I accelerated at around 85% throttle, cart stuttered, check engine started flashing, idle went lumpy - never stalled.
Shut it down, restarted it, car runs, boosts, and idles fine now.
Ran the codes - P0300, P0306 (#6), P0307 (#7).
As it is only two cylinders, no other codes came up, and the car is running fine now, is it safe to assume it's just time to go colder plugs? Or do these codes represent anything else I should consider?
Thanks!
R
02-27-2019, 05:02 PM
#4
MBWorld Fanatic!
Hey guys,
2014 Stage 1 Tuned e63, car had new plugs put in by Mercedes 6 months ago, then car was tuned roughly 600 miles ago. Exclusively run Shell fuel (CA).
Today when rolling in second I accelerated at around 85% throttle, cart stuttered, check engine started flashing, idle went lumpy - never stalled.
Shut it down, restarted it, car runs, boosts, and idles fine now.
Ran the codes - P0300, P0306 (#6), P0307 (#7).
As it is only two cylinders, no other codes came up, and the car is running fine now, is it safe to assume it's just time to go colder plugs? Or do these codes represent anything else I should consider?
Thanks!
R
2014 Stage 1 Tuned e63, car had new plugs put in by Mercedes 6 months ago, then car was tuned roughly 600 miles ago. Exclusively run Shell fuel (CA).
Today when rolling in second I accelerated at around 85% throttle, cart stuttered, check engine started flashing, idle went lumpy - never stalled.
Shut it down, restarted it, car runs, boosts, and idles fine now.
Ran the codes - P0300, P0306 (#6), P0307 (#7).
As it is only two cylinders, no other codes came up, and the car is running fine now, is it safe to assume it's just time to go colder plugs? Or do these codes represent anything else I should consider?
Thanks!
R
Lastly, if you drive the car for any length of time with the cylinders shut down and everything out of balance, you will likely cause engine damage. So like I said, pull it over right away and shut her down and get home nice and easy for a full reset.
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R5169 (02-27-2019)
02-27-2019, 05:13 PM
#5
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Your issue is with the tune. I have lived it. Your ECU adaptation process tried advancing your timing too far and you likely got knock. When ECU senses predetination, it automatically shuts down the cylinder(s) involved. That was what you felt when it got really rough and that is why you got the CEL. It will reset to a point by shutting it down and and restarting as you experienced. But mark my words you will have this happen again. BTW, when it happens you need to pull over right away and shut it down and then proceed home easily in C mode. At that time you then need to disconnect your ECU or the neg terminal on the main battery for 20 minutes minimum. But even this will not save it from happening again. Assuming you were running 91 octane here in Cali and your tuner knows you can't run higher than 91, you will need to report back this issue to the tuner and have them tweak your ECU accordingly. I had to have AMS tweak my ECU 3 times for things like this.
Lastly, if you drive the car for any length of time with the cylinders shut down and everything out of balance, you will likely cause engine damage. So like I said, pull it over right away and shut her down and get home nice and easy for a full reset.
Lastly, if you drive the car for any length of time with the cylinders shut down and everything out of balance, you will likely cause engine damage. So like I said, pull it over right away and shut her down and get home nice and easy for a full reset.
My tuner is in CA and tunes almost exclusively CA cars, I spoke with them as soon as it happened and they suggested cooler spark plugs. I've done some significant WOT driving with no issue on the tune to date, what would cause change in the tune to all of a sudden do it now? Especially as this wasn't even a full 100% pull.
02-27-2019, 05:38 PM
#6
MBWorld Fanatic!
Good info, cheers. I pulled over (and shut down) about 5-10 seconds after the misfire, so hopefully be ok there.
My tuner is in CA and tunes almost exclusively CA cars, I spoke with them as soon as it happened and they suggested cooler spark plugs. I've done some significant WOT driving with no issue on the tune to date, what would cause change in the tune to all of a sudden do it now? Especially as this wasn't even a full 100% pull.
My tuner is in CA and tunes almost exclusively CA cars, I spoke with them as soon as it happened and they suggested cooler spark plugs. I've done some significant WOT driving with no issue on the tune to date, what would cause change in the tune to all of a sudden do it now? Especially as this wasn't even a full 100% pull.
Who is the name of your tuner?
In case you are not aware, AMS is one of the 2 best tuners in the US. The other being Eurocharged.
02-27-2019, 05:40 PM
#7
MBWorld Fanatic!
Good info, cheers. I pulled over (and shut down) about 5-10 seconds after the misfire, so hopefully be ok there.
My tuner is in CA and tunes almost exclusively CA cars, I spoke with them as soon as it happened and they suggested cooler spark plugs. I've done some significant WOT driving with no issue on the tune to date, what would cause change in the tune to all of a sudden do it now? Especially as this wasn't even a full 100% pull.
My tuner is in CA and tunes almost exclusively CA cars, I spoke with them as soon as it happened and they suggested cooler spark plugs. I've done some significant WOT driving with no issue on the tune to date, what would cause change in the tune to all of a sudden do it now? Especially as this wasn't even a full 100% pull.
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02-27-2019, 05:42 PM
#8
MBWorld Fanatic!
One last thought,
every time I had a cyl shutdown, it was at around 75% throttle in higher gears on the freeway. It wasn't WOT. Is this when yours did it?
every time I had a cyl shutdown, it was at around 75% throttle in higher gears on the freeway. It wasn't WOT. Is this when yours did it?
02-27-2019, 06:09 PM
#9
Junior Member
Thread Starter
02-27-2019, 08:15 PM
#10
Senior Member
Your issue is with the tune. I have lived it. Your ECU adaptation process tried advancing your timing too far and you likely got knock. When ECU senses predetination, it automatically shuts down the cylinder(s) involved. That was what you felt when it got really rough and that is why you got the CEL. It will reset to a point by shutting it down and and restarting as you experienced. But mark my words you will have this happen again. BTW, when it happens you need to pull over right away and shut it down and then proceed home easily in C mode. At that time you then need to disconnect your ECU or the neg terminal on the main battery for 20 minutes minimum. But even this will not save it from happening again. Assuming you were running 91 octane here in Cali and your tuner knows you can't run higher than 91, you will need to report back this issue to the tuner and have them tweak your ECU accordingly. I had to have AMS tweak my ECU 3 times for things like this.
Lastly, if you drive the car for any length of time with the cylinders shut down and everything out of balance, you will likely cause engine damage. So like I said, pull it over right away and shut her down and get home nice and easy for a full reset.
Lastly, if you drive the car for any length of time with the cylinders shut down and everything out of balance, you will likely cause engine damage. So like I said, pull it over right away and shut her down and get home nice and easy for a full reset.
ECU has set timing targets, it doesnt keep advancing timing to infinity of course..
ECU has knock retard which will pull timing to stop knock... When too much knock retard is occurring and consistently, the ecu will shut the cylinder down for safety.
Sounds like this is a tuning issue of asking for too much timing.
These corrections happen hundreds of times a minute to adjust, watch and correct.
Datalogging will solve all of this easily via a HP tuners datalogging kit for $300.. Will showing timing and knock retard for each cylinder. This will of course show your plug health, and tuning strategy.
Here is a datalog of my stock car on 93 octane. No timing drops, no knock retarding on any cylinder what so ever.
Same should go for any tuned car not running aggressive tuning... I maxed out at about 11-12 psi here since its winter and our cars run boost by load of course, not more boost during winter but less. I think some tuners might be trying to run too much boost and targeting too much timing at certain rpms and loads.
I pre selected WOT, timing and knock retard for cyl 1. Feel free to click any datalog channel below to graph to see on the graph.
https://datazap.me/u/5soko/e63-0?log=0&data=9-11-18-22&trim=9&tmin=2364.28&tmax=6044.00
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R5169 (02-27-2019)
02-27-2019, 10:04 PM
#11
MBWorld Fanatic!
this is mostly incorrect..
ECU has set timing targets, it doesnt keep advancing timing to infinity of course..
ECU has knock retard which will pull timing to stop knock... When too much knock retard is occurring and consistently, the ecu will shut the cylinder down for safety.
Sounds like this is a tuning issue of asking for too much timing.
These corrections happen hundreds of times a minute to adjust, watch and correct.
Datalogging will solve all of this easily via a HP tuners datalogging kit for $300.. Will showing timing and knock retard for each cylinder. This will of course show your plug health, and tuning strategy.
Here is a datalog of my stock car on 93 octane. No timing drops, no knock retarding on any cylinder what so ever.
Same should go for any tuned car not running aggressive tuning... I maxed out at about 11-12 psi here since its winter and our cars run boost by load of course, not more boost during winter but less. I think some tuners might be trying to run too much boost and targeting too much timing at certain rpms and loads.
I pre selected WOT, timing and knock retard for cyl 1. Feel free to click any datalog channel below to graph to see on the graph.
https://datazap.me/u/5soko/e63-0?log...8&tmax=6044.00
ECU has set timing targets, it doesnt keep advancing timing to infinity of course..
ECU has knock retard which will pull timing to stop knock... When too much knock retard is occurring and consistently, the ecu will shut the cylinder down for safety.
Sounds like this is a tuning issue of asking for too much timing.
These corrections happen hundreds of times a minute to adjust, watch and correct.
Datalogging will solve all of this easily via a HP tuners datalogging kit for $300.. Will showing timing and knock retard for each cylinder. This will of course show your plug health, and tuning strategy.
Here is a datalog of my stock car on 93 octane. No timing drops, no knock retarding on any cylinder what so ever.
Same should go for any tuned car not running aggressive tuning... I maxed out at about 11-12 psi here since its winter and our cars run boost by load of course, not more boost during winter but less. I think some tuners might be trying to run too much boost and targeting too much timing at certain rpms and loads.
I pre selected WOT, timing and knock retard for cyl 1. Feel free to click any datalog channel below to graph to see on the graph.
https://datazap.me/u/5soko/e63-0?log...8&tmax=6044.00
You seem to consistently like to correct people. “Mostly incorrect”? So you know better than all the reputable tuners like AMS, EC, etc. You keep claiming this on various threads.
So when you say my take is “mostly incorrect”, you are stating that some of the top tuners in the country are wrong also As this is exactly what they state. I didnt pull this sh*t out of my *** man. I lived it and was involved in every step along with extensive communications with the tuner himself.
You picked out one thing I wrote and misinterpreted or mis reported it and then claim my points are “mostly incorrect”. My points were correct. You are not doing anyone any favors by recklessly dismissing them.
But you go ahead and feel free to tell me and us more of what you “know”.
You can even have the last word. You are not worth my time. If people want to accept you as the omnipotent car guru you think you are, then thats for them then to learn the hard way.
02-27-2019, 10:12 PM
#12
MBWorld Fanatic!
Furthermore, after reading your post one last time, it seems you are almost entirely agreeing with what I wrote. ???? And, I never wrote timing will advance to infinity. Please. I said it will to factory established safe limits that get modified by tuners.
if you mistakenly wrote “mostly incorrect” by mistake and meant to write “mostly correct” then it was a simple misunderstanding. But if you meant incorrect, I am at a loss to understand you.
if you mistakenly wrote “mostly incorrect” by mistake and meant to write “mostly correct” then it was a simple misunderstanding. But if you meant incorrect, I am at a loss to understand you.
02-28-2019, 03:46 PM
#13
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2014 E63S; AMS 100 octane ecu tune; edok tcu tune; BB intakes; dyno tuned
this is mostly incorrect..
ECU has set timing targets, it doesnt keep advancing timing to infinity of course..
ECU has knock retard which will pull timing to stop knock... When too much knock retard is occurring and consistently, the ecu will shut the cylinder down for safety.
Sounds like this is a tuning issue of asking for too much timing.
These corrections happen hundreds of times a minute to adjust, watch and correct.
Datalogging will solve all of this easily via a HP tuners datalogging kit for $300.. Will showing timing and knock retard for each cylinder. This will of course show your plug health, and tuning strategy.
Here is a datalog of my stock car on 93 octane. No timing drops, no knock retarding on any cylinder what so ever.
Same should go for any tuned car not running aggressive tuning... I maxed out at about 11-12 psi here since its winter and our cars run boost by load of course, not more boost during winter but less. I think some tuners might be trying to run too much boost and targeting too much timing at certain rpms and loads.
I pre selected WOT, timing and knock retard for cyl 1. Feel free to click any datalog channel below to graph to see on the graph.
https://datazap.me/u/5soko/e63-0?log...8&tmax=6044.00
ECU has set timing targets, it doesnt keep advancing timing to infinity of course..
ECU has knock retard which will pull timing to stop knock... When too much knock retard is occurring and consistently, the ecu will shut the cylinder down for safety.
Sounds like this is a tuning issue of asking for too much timing.
These corrections happen hundreds of times a minute to adjust, watch and correct.
Datalogging will solve all of this easily via a HP tuners datalogging kit for $300.. Will showing timing and knock retard for each cylinder. This will of course show your plug health, and tuning strategy.
Here is a datalog of my stock car on 93 octane. No timing drops, no knock retarding on any cylinder what so ever.
Same should go for any tuned car not running aggressive tuning... I maxed out at about 11-12 psi here since its winter and our cars run boost by load of course, not more boost during winter but less. I think some tuners might be trying to run too much boost and targeting too much timing at certain rpms and loads.
I pre selected WOT, timing and knock retard for cyl 1. Feel free to click any datalog channel below to graph to see on the graph.
https://datazap.me/u/5soko/e63-0?log...8&tmax=6044.00
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Vrodman (02-28-2019)
02-28-2019, 03:47 PM
#14
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2014 E63S; AMS 100 octane ecu tune; edok tcu tune; BB intakes; dyno tuned
OP -- new plugs yet? Agree that coilpacks are weak on this car.... if your tune has been good for 10,000+ miles it may be a simple plug change +/- coilpacks.
Also have you been using different fuel lately?
Also have you been using different fuel lately?
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amgboy916 (02-28-2019)
02-28-2019, 04:57 PM
#15
Not gonna lie this definitely sounds like a spark plug issue or coil pack issue especially if it just arose now. I've had similar happen and it was completely resolved with new plugs.
What plugs are you running and what are they gapped at?
What plugs are you running and what are they gapped at?
02-28-2019, 05:07 PM
#16
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Hey guys - went and got it sorted today....
One coil pack was completely split in two, another was cracked and ready to do the same. Then replaced all spark plugs with 1 step colder options, and topped up with some fresh fuel just in case.
Car seems to be perfect now, feels like it's running better than before the issue.
Had to run to the office so I'll test more this weekend but fingers crossed we're sorted.
One coil pack was completely split in two, another was cracked and ready to do the same. Then replaced all spark plugs with 1 step colder options, and topped up with some fresh fuel just in case.
Car seems to be perfect now, feels like it's running better than before the issue.
Had to run to the office so I'll test more this weekend but fingers crossed we're sorted.
02-28-2019, 06:08 PM
#17
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That's awesome!!! Nice work
02-28-2019, 06:45 PM
#18
MBWorld Fanatic!
Hey guys - went and got it sorted today....
One coil pack was completely split in two, another was cracked and ready to do the same. Then replaced all spark plugs with 1 step colder options, and topped up with some fresh fuel just in case.
Car seems to be perfect now, feels like it's running better than before the issue.
Had to run to the office so I'll test more this weekend but fingers crossed we're sorted.
One coil pack was completely split in two, another was cracked and ready to do the same. Then replaced all spark plugs with 1 step colder options, and topped up with some fresh fuel just in case.
Car seems to be perfect now, feels like it's running better than before the issue.
Had to run to the office so I'll test more this weekend but fingers crossed we're sorted.
The way you initially reported all of this sounded almost exactly like what I experienced after about 500 miles on my tune from the 2nd tweak where they blocked out (for lack of better terminology) look up tables that allowed for the timing to pull back as far. Other guys with tunes, without naming names, went through the same timing over-shoot issues with cyl shutdowns as well. That is why I thought you might want to look there first. If you get the coils fixed and new plugs and you still have these episodes, you will need to look at your tune for sure. Good luck and hopefully that's not the case.
02-28-2019, 07:04 PM
#19
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Glad to hear. The coil packs make sense. I still say, and I believe many others on the site will agree, that the colder plugs are really not needed. Many of the tuners also say they are not necessary. Some suggest it though. I haven't heard it causing any issues to make the move, so why not if you want to do it and pay for it.
The way you initially reported all of this sounded almost exactly like what I experienced after about 500 miles on my tune from the 2nd tweak where they blocked out (for lack of better terminology) look up tables that allowed for the timing to pull back as far. Other guys with tunes, without naming names, went through the same timing over-shoot issues with cyl shutdowns as well. That is why I thought you might want to look there first. If you get the coils fixed and new plugs and you still have these episodes, you will need to look at your tune for sure. Good luck and hopefully that's not the case.
The way you initially reported all of this sounded almost exactly like what I experienced after about 500 miles on my tune from the 2nd tweak where they blocked out (for lack of better terminology) look up tables that allowed for the timing to pull back as far. Other guys with tunes, without naming names, went through the same timing over-shoot issues with cyl shutdowns as well. That is why I thought you might want to look there first. If you get the coils fixed and new plugs and you still have these episodes, you will need to look at your tune for sure. Good luck and hopefully that's not the case.
02-28-2019, 07:35 PM
#20
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Vrod has guided me through a lot of issues re tuning so I always appreciate his advice
02-28-2019, 07:37 PM
#21
i definitely agree with this colder plugs are not needed and can cause issues it’s best to use oem plugs unless they’re giving you issues. I use plugs from a 2015+ e63 since they’re better but still oem
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jvakos (03-01-2019)
03-01-2019, 12:32 AM
#23
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2014 E63S; AMS 100 octane ecu tune; edok tcu tune; BB intakes; dyno tuned
