We're Insane
05-19-2015, 03:20 PM
#1
Super Member
Thread Starter
We're Insane
I just got a 2005 S500 Designo package for my mom.
190k miles. It has the ABC suspension.
I am insane.
Everything works. Still I'm insane.
I don't even know where to begin.
I'm already planning on getting the suspension replaced with regular struts ($1.6k) + labor.
Current issues are: Coolant needs refilling (it's complaining that it has low coolant). TPMS is whining (some dingdong probable broke it). Needs a new engine mount ($150), I plan on doing spark plugs and coils ($300), as well as an oil change ($100). It probably needs a new accessory belt (previous one broke and was replaced with no-name brand, needs new tensioner as well probably).
All other systems on the car amazingly seem to be functioning.
I think the AC acts up if it's not set to low temperature but automatic (suddenly heat starts appearing out of nowhere).
Any advice is for high-mileage w220 owners is realllyy appreciated. What are the must-do services? I'm really really nervous about the ABC suspension, and am thinking about pre-emptively ordering the regular struts, so that when **** --> fan I will be ready. I'm not sure if I should wait for **** --> fan or go ahead and do that, as I would rather not replace the pump (has been replaced before).
It also has a new transmission which has ~100k miles on it. I think it's been babied, and seems to be running fine.
Guys, I'm scared. xD
[edit] Oh and because it will be requested, picture!
190k miles. It has the ABC suspension.
I am insane.
Everything works. Still I'm insane.
I don't even know where to begin.
I'm already planning on getting the suspension replaced with regular struts ($1.6k) + labor.
Current issues are: Coolant needs refilling (it's complaining that it has low coolant). TPMS is whining (some dingdong probable broke it). Needs a new engine mount ($150), I plan on doing spark plugs and coils ($300), as well as an oil change ($100). It probably needs a new accessory belt (previous one broke and was replaced with no-name brand, needs new tensioner as well probably).
All other systems on the car amazingly seem to be functioning.
I think the AC acts up if it's not set to low temperature but automatic (suddenly heat starts appearing out of nowhere).
Any advice is for high-mileage w220 owners is realllyy appreciated. What are the must-do services? I'm really really nervous about the ABC suspension, and am thinking about pre-emptively ordering the regular struts, so that when **** --> fan I will be ready. I'm not sure if I should wait for **** --> fan or go ahead and do that, as I would rather not replace the pump (has been replaced before).
It also has a new transmission which has ~100k miles on it. I think it's been babied, and seems to be running fine.
Guys, I'm scared. xD
[edit] Oh and because it will be requested, picture!
Last edited by Fried Chicken; 05-31-2015 at 09:34 PM.
05-19-2015, 09:31 PM
#2
Member
Congratulations on your purchase! Would like to see interior pics.
First thing I would do would buy one of those i-car $130 fault readers. Read and document all the faults, then clear them, drive a while and see what if any comes back. Hard to understand issues without being able to see the fault logs.
First thing I would do would buy one of those i-car $130 fault readers. Read and document all the faults, then clear them, drive a while and see what if any comes back. Hard to understand issues without being able to see the fault logs.
05-19-2015, 11:12 PM
#3
MBWorld Fanatic!
You don't need to spend a hundred or more dollars for a scanner, just order this baby and if you have an Android smartphone, download the TorquePro app and it will read your fault codes. Will also reset them. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Mini-ELM327-V2-1-OBD2-OBDII-Bluetooth-Adapter-Auto-Scanner-TORQUE-ANDROID-US-BL-/291261648793?hash=item43d08c0f99&item=291261648793&vxp=mtr
If it were me I would do an ABC system flush before going out and replacing the shocks. If you have any problems they will show up after the flush. You'll need about 10.5 quarts of Pentosin Chf11 (in the green can), and a ABC filter. Might as well do the power steering flush at the same time since the ABC and PS pumps are tandem.
I would replace the engine mounts and plugs/wires. All of the above for less than $700 if you DIY.
If it were me I would do an ABC system flush before going out and replacing the shocks. If you have any problems they will show up after the flush. You'll need about 10.5 quarts of Pentosin Chf11 (in the green can), and a ABC filter. Might as well do the power steering flush at the same time since the ABC and PS pumps are tandem.
I would replace the engine mounts and plugs/wires. All of the above for less than $700 if you DIY.
05-20-2015, 01:38 AM
#4
I would check the color of the abc fluid and if its green don't touch it .
You have no problem now and People have been known to create problem doing a flush by loosening some gunk on a high mileage car . Like ibefirreal said problems tend to show up after a flush
For the same reason if it's running perfectly I wouldn't change the plugs or wires . Too many people have created a problem where none exists
You have no problem now and People have been known to create problem doing a flush by loosening some gunk on a high mileage car . Like ibefirreal said problems tend to show up after a flush
For the same reason if it's running perfectly I wouldn't change the plugs or wires . Too many people have created a problem where none exists
05-20-2015, 08:26 AM
#5
MBWorld Fanatic!
Please don't ditch the ABC. There are lots of things you can do to look after it (besides the Mercedes approach of crossing your fingers and hoping for the best). My S600TT with ABC just passed 160k miles and is running better than ever.
ABC is complex but maintainable. Its needs routine inspection and servicing, and failing parts give you advance warning of the need to replace before disaster.
There are many pro-active / preventative measure you can take, like replacing the four accumulators, or fitting the later, improved 3 micron fluid filter.
There's a bit more to it than this, but here's an excellent introduction:
http://mercedes-abc-drive-carefully.blogspot.co.uk/2014/08/overview-abc-system-isthe-key-part-of.html
The other thing you could do is read Howard's seminal, must-read, DIY thread:
https://mbworld.org/forums/s-class-w...2003-s600.html
Nick
ABC is complex but maintainable. Its needs routine inspection and servicing, and failing parts give you advance warning of the need to replace before disaster.
There are many pro-active / preventative measure you can take, like replacing the four accumulators, or fitting the later, improved 3 micron fluid filter.
There's a bit more to it than this, but here's an excellent introduction:
http://mercedes-abc-drive-carefully.blogspot.co.uk/2014/08/overview-abc-system-isthe-key-part-of.html
The other thing you could do is read Howard's seminal, must-read, DIY thread:
https://mbworld.org/forums/s-class-w...2003-s600.html
Nick
05-31-2015, 09:36 PM
#6
Super Member
Thread Starter
Please don't ditch the ABC. There are lots of things you can do to look after it (besides the Mercedes approach of crossing your fingers and hoping for the best). My S600TT with ABC just passed 160k miles and is running better than ever.
ABC is complex but maintainable. Its needs routine inspection and servicing, and failing parts give you advance warning of the need to replace before disaster.
There are many pro-active / preventative measure you can take, like replacing the four accumulators, or fitting the later, improved 3 micron fluid filter.
There's a bit more to it than this, but here's an excellent introduction:
http://mercedes-abc-drive-carefully.blogspot.co.uk/2014/08/overview-abc-system-isthe-key-part-of.html
The other thing you could do is read Howard's seminal, must-read, DIY thread:
https://mbworld.org/forums/s-class-w...2003-s600.html
Nick
ABC is complex but maintainable. Its needs routine inspection and servicing, and failing parts give you advance warning of the need to replace before disaster.
There are many pro-active / preventative measure you can take, like replacing the four accumulators, or fitting the later, improved 3 micron fluid filter.
There's a bit more to it than this, but here's an excellent introduction:
http://mercedes-abc-drive-carefully.blogspot.co.uk/2014/08/overview-abc-system-isthe-key-part-of.html
The other thing you could do is read Howard's seminal, must-read, DIY thread:
https://mbworld.org/forums/s-class-w...2003-s600.html
Nick
I need a new pulsation damper and ABC flush first thing, so I'll be about $400 in. See what happens.
BTW I've uploaded new pictures
06-01-2015, 04:27 PM
#7
MBWorld Fanatic!
That's a rare car you have there; it would be shame to spoil it.
What did you mechanic advise - to fit regular struts or NOT fit regular struts?
There are lots of tales of exhorbitant ABC repair costs, but that isn't necessary (especially if the previous owner replaced the ABC pump). I've written reams on this, and will probalby write more. Here's a succint summary from a recent post:
ABC can be made reliable, but you do have to be proactive. It needs regular inspection and maintenance, and you have to accept that Pentosin synthetic oil and steel-braided rubber hoses don't last the life of the car. The things that are vulnerable include the four nitrogen-pressure accumulator spheres, and all the flexible hoses within the engine compartment. You can't just cross your fingers.
First thing is check the ABC oil level. Clean all around the reservoir first. With a cold, empty car, the level should be at the UPPER dipstick mark. However, with the engine running, it mustn't be below the LOWER mark. If it is, you will need to change one or more of the accumulator spheres. A failing accumulator "caves in" when pressurized - hence the low oil level when the engine is running.
Second thing is remove ALL the plastic covers underneath, and inspect all the ABC flexible hoses. They can be dirty and corroded, but they MUST be dry. The failure mechanism is that high temperatures and pressure cycling degrades the rubber in the crimp joints between the rigid and flexible sections. The advance warning of failure is that fluid seeps out of the joint.
Third, a groaning/whining noise like a worn transmission, only heard from inside, is an indicator of a failed accumulator. Remove the poly-V belt and start the engine. If the noise disappears when heard from inside with the engine running and the doors closed, that points towards the accumulator on the pressure regulator, at the rear of the right hand front wheel arch.
Fourth, the other common ABC problem is slowly sagging suspension at one corner or another. Remove the front or rear valve block, strip and clean it, and replace the O-rings. There's lots of internet info on this.
There are many industrial applications for hydraulics, like construction, farming and automation, and they had to solve the problems long ago. Oil and filters have to be replaced regularly, say every two to three years. Hoses never last forever - the best you can reliably expect them to last is five to six years. If you want to be confident (like me), replace all the flexible ABC hoses in the engine compartment. Don't wait for them to fail.
Nick
What did you mechanic advise - to fit regular struts or NOT fit regular struts?
There are lots of tales of exhorbitant ABC repair costs, but that isn't necessary (especially if the previous owner replaced the ABC pump). I've written reams on this, and will probalby write more. Here's a succint summary from a recent post:
ABC can be made reliable, but you do have to be proactive. It needs regular inspection and maintenance, and you have to accept that Pentosin synthetic oil and steel-braided rubber hoses don't last the life of the car. The things that are vulnerable include the four nitrogen-pressure accumulator spheres, and all the flexible hoses within the engine compartment. You can't just cross your fingers.
First thing is check the ABC oil level. Clean all around the reservoir first. With a cold, empty car, the level should be at the UPPER dipstick mark. However, with the engine running, it mustn't be below the LOWER mark. If it is, you will need to change one or more of the accumulator spheres. A failing accumulator "caves in" when pressurized - hence the low oil level when the engine is running.
Second thing is remove ALL the plastic covers underneath, and inspect all the ABC flexible hoses. They can be dirty and corroded, but they MUST be dry. The failure mechanism is that high temperatures and pressure cycling degrades the rubber in the crimp joints between the rigid and flexible sections. The advance warning of failure is that fluid seeps out of the joint.
Third, a groaning/whining noise like a worn transmission, only heard from inside, is an indicator of a failed accumulator. Remove the poly-V belt and start the engine. If the noise disappears when heard from inside with the engine running and the doors closed, that points towards the accumulator on the pressure regulator, at the rear of the right hand front wheel arch.
Fourth, the other common ABC problem is slowly sagging suspension at one corner or another. Remove the front or rear valve block, strip and clean it, and replace the O-rings. There's lots of internet info on this.
There are many industrial applications for hydraulics, like construction, farming and automation, and they had to solve the problems long ago. Oil and filters have to be replaced regularly, say every two to three years. Hoses never last forever - the best you can reliably expect them to last is five to six years. If you want to be confident (like me), replace all the flexible ABC hoses in the engine compartment. Don't wait for them to fail.
Nick
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06-01-2015, 08:34 PM
#9
Super Member
Thread Starter
That's a rare car you have there; it would be shame to spoil it.
What did you mechanic advise - to fit regular struts or NOT fit regular struts?
There are lots of tales of exhorbitant ABC repair costs, but that isn't necessary (especially if the previous owner replaced the ABC pump). I've written reams on this, and will probalby write more. Here's a succint summary from a recent post:
ABC can be made reliable, but you do have to be proactive. It needs regular inspection and maintenance, and you have to accept that Pentosin synthetic oil and steel-braided rubber hoses don't last the life of the car. The things that are vulnerable include the four nitrogen-pressure accumulator spheres, and all the flexible hoses within the engine compartment. You can't just cross your fingers.
First thing is check the ABC oil level. Clean all around the reservoir first. With a cold, empty car, the level should be at the UPPER dipstick mark. However, with the engine running, it mustn't be below the LOWER mark. If it is, you will need to change one or more of the accumulator spheres. A failing accumulator "caves in" when pressurized - hence the low oil level when the engine is running.
Second thing is remove ALL the plastic covers underneath, and inspect all the ABC flexible hoses. They can be dirty and corroded, but they MUST be dry. The failure mechanism is that high temperatures and pressure cycling degrades the rubber in the crimp joints between the rigid and flexible sections. The advance warning of failure is that fluid seeps out of the joint.
Third, a groaning/whining noise like a worn transmission, only heard from inside, is an indicator of a failed accumulator. Remove the poly-V belt and start the engine. If the noise disappears when heard from inside with the engine running and the doors closed, that points towards the accumulator on the pressure regulator, at the rear of the right hand front wheel arch.
Fourth, the other common ABC problem is slowly sagging suspension at one corner or another. Remove the front or rear valve block, strip and clean it, and replace the O-rings. There's lots of internet info on this.
There are many industrial applications for hydraulics, like construction, farming and automation, and they had to solve the problems long ago. Oil and filters have to be replaced regularly, say every two to three years. Hoses never last forever - the best you can reliably expect them to last is five to six years. If you want to be confident (like me), replace all the flexible ABC hoses in the engine compartment. Don't wait for them to fail.
Nick
What did you mechanic advise - to fit regular struts or NOT fit regular struts?
There are lots of tales of exhorbitant ABC repair costs, but that isn't necessary (especially if the previous owner replaced the ABC pump). I've written reams on this, and will probalby write more. Here's a succint summary from a recent post:
ABC can be made reliable, but you do have to be proactive. It needs regular inspection and maintenance, and you have to accept that Pentosin synthetic oil and steel-braided rubber hoses don't last the life of the car. The things that are vulnerable include the four nitrogen-pressure accumulator spheres, and all the flexible hoses within the engine compartment. You can't just cross your fingers.
First thing is check the ABC oil level. Clean all around the reservoir first. With a cold, empty car, the level should be at the UPPER dipstick mark. However, with the engine running, it mustn't be below the LOWER mark. If it is, you will need to change one or more of the accumulator spheres. A failing accumulator "caves in" when pressurized - hence the low oil level when the engine is running.
Second thing is remove ALL the plastic covers underneath, and inspect all the ABC flexible hoses. They can be dirty and corroded, but they MUST be dry. The failure mechanism is that high temperatures and pressure cycling degrades the rubber in the crimp joints between the rigid and flexible sections. The advance warning of failure is that fluid seeps out of the joint.
Third, a groaning/whining noise like a worn transmission, only heard from inside, is an indicator of a failed accumulator. Remove the poly-V belt and start the engine. If the noise disappears when heard from inside with the engine running and the doors closed, that points towards the accumulator on the pressure regulator, at the rear of the right hand front wheel arch.
Fourth, the other common ABC problem is slowly sagging suspension at one corner or another. Remove the front or rear valve block, strip and clean it, and replace the O-rings. There's lots of internet info on this.
There are many industrial applications for hydraulics, like construction, farming and automation, and they had to solve the problems long ago. Oil and filters have to be replaced regularly, say every two to three years. Hoses never last forever - the best you can reliably expect them to last is five to six years. If you want to be confident (like me), replace all the flexible ABC hoses in the engine compartment. Don't wait for them to fail.
Nick
My mechanic strongly advised against keeping the ABC and instead putting in regular struts. However after thinking about it, I'm starting to realize how special the ABC system is.
I have already performed the following:
1. Lower Control Arms (Torque Struts)
2. Front Brakes
3. Front Pads
I've ordered the valve cover gasket and breather hoses for the engine, 16 (!) sparkplugs and wires, the appropriate lubes and anti-lubes, Radiator (obviously) along with the appropriate hoses, radiator drinky stuff, Pulsation Damper (AKA Accumulator), ABC fluid (10 liters), Transmission Fluid, filter, and gasket, and their appropriate bolts, engine oil (to be done after injector cleaning and spark plug replacement).
I will look into further investing in the remaining 3 accumulators and high pressure hoses. It's currently a mess under the hood. I hope to have a very solid car after this, however I fear it might not be the appropriate car for my dear mother and we may sell it (if we can break even).
My local indy mechanic seems to have issues with the ABC system as it is a daunting piece of technology. I may open a separate thread on the ABC system asking for input. If I choose to keep it, I will do as recommended as I have lots of time, but not infinite money.
06-04-2015, 11:29 AM
#10
MBWorld Fanatic!
Good luck trying to replace the ABC system for normal struts. For airmatic its a cake walk, but for ABC think again.
PS: The flush is easy and cheap, buy both the ABC and power steering filters as was mentioned above.
PS: The flush is easy and cheap, buy both the ABC and power steering filters as was mentioned above.
06-04-2015, 02:45 PM
#11
MBWorld Fanatic!
I was going to mention that the other really good thing you can do with ABC is protect the flexible hoses from heat in the engine compartment. Mercedes already shield some of them, but they ALL need it.
Here's what old hoses look like when they're protected (I cleaned the sleeves, but the hoses are as they came out) :
And here's an unprotected one from the same location:
So now I cover all the ABC hoses in the engine compartment with those metalised fibre-glass sleeves.
Nick
Here's what old hoses look like when they're protected (I cleaned the sleeves, but the hoses are as they came out) :
And here's an unprotected one from the same location:
So now I cover all the ABC hoses in the engine compartment with those metalised fibre-glass sleeves.
Nick
06-08-2015, 11:57 AM
#18
Super Member
Thread Starter
06-09-2015, 11:32 AM
#19
MBWorld Fanatic!
One more thing to consider when changing the plugs and wires. Those little plastic caps that snap on to the ignition coils have a tendency to crack after years of heat from the engine. They can only be bought at a MB dealership. I replaced all of mine when I changed the plugs and wires. Each one has 3 wires running through it. If you do replace them just make sure the 3 wires are in the proper position when you relocate them in the new part. Those little parts are relatively inexpensive.
06-09-2015, 11:51 AM
#20
Super Member
Thread Starter
One more thing to consider when changing the plugs and wires. Those little plastic caps that snap on to the ignition coils have a tendency to crack after years of heat from the engine. They can only be bought at a MB dealership. I replaced all of mine when I changed the plugs and wires. Each one has 3 wires running through it. If you do replace them just make sure the 3 wires are in the proper position when you relocate them in the new part. Those little parts are relatively inexpensive.
06-09-2015, 04:28 PM
#21
MBWorld Fanatic!
The part # for my car is 2035453028. If you are going to replace them all you will need 8. I found out the hard way. Changing my plugs and as soon as I unsnapped the little plastic clips from the ignition coils 3 of them just kind of disintegrated in my hand. Of course it was a Saturday afternoon.
Your's may not be bad. They have plastic clips on either end that hold them in place where they snap into the ignition coils. I think they are called PIN BUSHING HOUSING or something similar to that. Probably around $3 or $4 each.
You might be able to find them on a place like http://www.ecstuning.com or http://www.autohausaz.com
Attached is a picture of how they look.
Your's may not be bad. They have plastic clips on either end that hold them in place where they snap into the ignition coils. I think they are called PIN BUSHING HOUSING or something similar to that. Probably around $3 or $4 each.
You might be able to find them on a place like http://www.ecstuning.com or http://www.autohausaz.com
Attached is a picture of how they look.
07-06-2015, 12:01 AM
#22
Super Member
Thread Starter
Ok guys so I want to post an update. The car is growing on me.
So far I've done front rotors and pads, radiator and hoses and expansion tank, front torque struts, new back tires, valve cover gasket, spark plug + wires*, oil + filter change, pressurized injector cleaning, fuel filter, thermistor re-soldered (A/C is working now), alignment.
Left to do is:
TPMS sensors (coming in)
Re-align (current alignment is off by ~10°)
Pulsation Damper
ABC Flush
Front Seats ticking/rocking
Nav Update (maybe someone can upload a copy for me)
Windshield Wipers clatter really badly
Front Splash Shield
Transmission cooling line
Replace transmission fluid again
Engine mounts
I have to say the car is slowly beginning to grow on me. The engine is fantastic, and the ride is impeccable. I'm really starting to notice the quality of the Mercedes. Many components are rock solid despite 190k miles. Nothing catastrophic seems to be wrong. The handling is also really good. I'm a little nervous about the pneumatic lines and the PSE pump as two of the soft-close doors have already stopped working (I know the pump does this on purpose).
I really hope I'm able to take care of everything that needs to be taken care of, and then have a reliable car for another 100k miles.
*Is there information on which spark plug wire length goes on which spark plugs? I think I mis-guessed as my third coil from the front on the right bank the forward wire seems a bit stretched and tends to pop out.
So far I've done front rotors and pads, radiator and hoses and expansion tank, front torque struts, new back tires, valve cover gasket, spark plug + wires*, oil + filter change, pressurized injector cleaning, fuel filter, thermistor re-soldered (A/C is working now), alignment.
Left to do is:
TPMS sensors (coming in)
Re-align (current alignment is off by ~10°)
Pulsation Damper
ABC Flush
Front Seats ticking/rocking
Nav Update (maybe someone can upload a copy for me
)Windshield Wipers clatter really badly
Front Splash Shield
Transmission cooling line
Replace transmission fluid again
Engine mounts
I have to say the car is slowly beginning to grow on me. The engine is fantastic, and the ride is impeccable. I'm really starting to notice the quality of the Mercedes. Many components are rock solid despite 190k miles. Nothing catastrophic seems to be wrong. The handling is also really good. I'm a little nervous about the pneumatic lines and the PSE pump as two of the soft-close doors have already stopped working (I know the pump does this on purpose).
I really hope I'm able to take care of everything that needs to be taken care of, and then have a reliable car for another 100k miles.
*Is there information on which spark plug wire length goes on which spark plugs? I think I mis-guessed as my third coil from the front on the right bank the forward wire seems a bit stretched and tends to pop out.
Last edited by Fried Chicken; 07-06-2015 at 12:04 AM.
07-06-2015, 10:58 AM
#24
Super Member
Thread Starter
