AustinGuy

Hi all,

I just registered! Great site. Wish I knew about this earlier.

I'm interested in a 2008 S550 Iridium Siliver w/black interior. Actually, I also like the Capri Blue w/Savannah Cashmere interior..... can't make up my mind.

The options I want are:

- P2
- AMG Package
- Wood/leather steering
- iPod kit
- Dynamic rearview monitor

Panorama sunroof and Power sunshades located on side windows would be nice.

The MSRP is coming to around 98k. What is a fair price to pay for this car? What should my bargaining tactics be?

trumpet1

I just registed too. Thanks for the info.

RajwanyS550

Dynamic rear view camera is no longer a stand alone option on the S class is available only witj the P3 pkg.
Dealers r dealing now more than ever. check With Ed at Dickdyersonline.com. they r an authorised MB dealer, but their their prices R really low. think they r out of Colorado.

RajwanyS550

LOL

Z356

DickDyer & Associates are based in South Carolina. I have found one of our Forum sponsors, Greg Weiler of Mercedes-Benz of Westminster, very helpful in my search of a MB. They are the ones based in a suburb of Denver, CO but deal nationwide. Greg can be reached at: 303.410.7820 office; 303.618.8764 cellular; 303.465.9208 private fax; <gweiler@mbwestminster.com>.

Because of the state of the economy and the fact these cars have already been in the market for a few years (The S550, S600, S65 since early '06, the CL550 and CL600 since fall of '06, the CL65, CL63 and S63 since early spring of '07), you will find this is now the best time since the intro of the new model S and CL to negotiate your best deal.

In general, educate yourself as best you can. Edmunds will give you approx. info on invoice vs MSRP. Also, do informal check on the model you want and see inventory available nationwide. I find Autotrader will give me best overview on this since most dealer post their inventory on this site. Cars.com is another useful website. Also find out what Mercedes Benz leasing is predicting the residuals of these cars will be two, three and four years down the road. Plus what kind of money factor rates they are associating with each to facilitate leasing. The following posting is how both of these factors influence pricing & deals at your dealership. (I posted this about three weeks ago). "According to Autotrader, it computed 165 as the number of MY08 CL63s for sale in the USA...The number of MY08 CL600s for sale at the same moment in the USA is 51. The number of MY08 CL65s for sale is 67. And at the same time, the number of MY08 CL550s listed is 321. It is not a scientific study (e.g. it doesn't tell you how many have been sold already or how many more are being built), but it tells you something: the approximate US inventory of 08 CL at present time...Equally interesting is how MBUSA instructed MB Financial to calculate its residuals on the MY08 CL63, which have been published nationwide and communicated to us via LeaseCompare (one of our sponsors). It is on par with the CL550 and much higher than for the MY08 CL600 or MY08 CL65. This helps make leasing CL63s 'more' affordable (than say an equally costly CL600) at your MB dealer. MBUSA is intent to move MY08 CL63s in large numbers and they are producing this specific AMG model in large quantities as a result."

Finally, what is fair pricing, anyway? It is best deal you can negotiate at a moment in time. At intro of S63, you might have been considered lucky getting an S63 at MSRP. Now, it might be available at, or near, invoice. And just before the '09 S63 arrive in late summer or early fall, MBUSA might give dealers 'trunk money' incentives to move the left-over '08 63s in stock. Then the the best deal on a S63 would be during this deep discount 'firesale'. That will apply to the S550 as well and any other MB.

My general rule is that the best price from a dealer for a new car is $1K over his invoice cost. It is minimal fair motivation in our capitalist market. The best price from anyone (dealer or private party) will be on a car that is considered a 'used vehicle' or demo, of recent vintage, low mileage, perfect warranty history (routine stuff-no lemon in the making), no accidents and an extended MB warranty. My dos centavos. Z356

WSH

Z356, no one else I know has as detailed and as well-articulated a "read" on the MB mkt....always an intriguing update...

BTW, any updates on your 600? Looking forward to your impressions; hope you're enjoying it (at least btwn our bursts of rain)....

Am strongly considering getting an Apr build SL63 030....or simply getting an '09 CL63 030....one can't go wrong w/any of these great cars....

Z356

WSH: Thanks. Just had shoulder arthroscopic surgery on Friday, a week ago today. Two days before that Intercity delivered the '07 CL600 to my home in Carmel. It is a 'demo' with 8,600 miles. Driven by the corporate CEO of the company that owns, among other things, the MB dealership I bought it from. So, needless to say, I have not had a chance to drive it much (to my garage from truck) or comment on it...other than to say that Black with Cognac exclusive leather interior is a real pretty combination. Will give Forum members a proper report when I get back to driving (hopefully in a few weeks), accompanied by the proper photos and a shot of the bottle of Barolo wine to I will drink to celebrate its purchase. Z356

WSH

Z356, hope recovery is smooth/quicker than predicted.

Am aggravated enough by any >1 day business trip where can't drive my own car....

Recently had to travel to NYC (my torture chamber for a few early yrs in my career)....and was an effort to make sure car svc was an S550 (life's too short to risk those absurd LincTownCars w/those Ferrari-like fuel tanks)....scarily, several drivers would casually refer to their Blkberries/answer their cells while driving....was so relieved to be back in SF region....such a FirstWorld region, along w/BevHills, in terms of daily safe, efficient, comfortable transportation, where one can commute via own new-gen CL, rather than be held hostage to various 3rdWorld conveyances that NYC plutocrats suffer daily (in their enviable weather)....

AustinGuy

AustinGuy

Thanks a lot for taking the time to enlighten me. Quite honestly, I was under the impression that MB dealerships (at least, the one here in Austin) were too "uppity" and not willing to negotiate. I still don't know where to begin. Are you saying that 1k over inv. is good?

trumpet1

Oops! Sorry. I thought you meant you just registered into the "German Car Zone" forum (not this one). My mistake. Someone mentioned it in another thread and I thought I was responding to him. My bad.

CY

I would be happy with about 10k off MSRP. About 8 months ago I negotiated a bare bones S550 to 2k under invoice....should be lower now.

RajwanyS550

DEALERS TO AVOID MB OF AUSTIN, U R RITE THEY R FULL OF

RajwanyS550

just ordered mine for 8000 off msrp. dealer said it was about 1700 under their cost

Z356

Austin: a) What I am saying? We are in early February. '08 S550 will still be current for another six months or so. I would consider today a $1K above a '08 S550 invoice pricing a good deal. Come September '08, same car, and that would probably not be such a good deal. In fact, it get's us into a discussion of how 'wise' is buying near end of model year since the used car market 'depreciates' a year's worth of value from a MY08 once the MY09 arrives. Less important factor if you are leasing and not buying. b) "Uppity" MB dealers. There are all types of dealers. This country has the world largest MB dealer network. Given in that most of our dealers are privately owned and, in the larger multi-dealer markets, also highly aggressive/sales-target oriented, this country has the most competitive MB retail market in the world. Add to this the following: a) our low import tax policies encourage foreign car competition, b) our low sales and registration taxes encourage car ownership/leases of even expensive cars, c) MB counts on the high volume of its US market to provide reliable revenue to its corporate parent, and d) MB uses huge foreign exchange contracts to hedge against our dollar's decreasing 'value' and thus maintain our 'reasonable' dollar prices year-after-year. As a result of all of these factors, our MB models are also the cheapest than for any other consumer in the world. Cheaper than to a German, to a Japanese, to anyone else in the world. So, as a US consumer in the most competitive MB market in the world, I would recommend that you don't WASTE your most valuable advantage - the ability to drive an extremely good deal on an extremely good car. Find out what dealer (nationwide) has the inventory of the cars you want. Autotrader, Cars.com, MB nationwide 'search' will help you pinpoint this. Use the internet or just dial your phone to contact them on these vehicles after you have determined the price you would accept (e.g. $1K over invoice). Know what invoice is before hand and get know all of your car's facts as well. Contact as many dealers as you need to so that you get to your target purchase price on the vehicle you want. If you, on the other hand, just want to deal with the local old-timer MB dealer five minutes from your house, take your chances on how charitable he will feel towards you on the day you approach him. The fact that he knows this is now a highly competitive 'national' market, especially with dedicated internet sales departments & such, will help you have a half-decent chance of a better deal than you probably deserve for doing this purchase the 'old fashion way'. But if you are looking to do the best you can, you need to work hard at it on a nationwide level. It doesn't necessarily take much time to get the right deal. What takes time is knowing what you want to buy, invoice vs msrp costs, MB Financial residuals & money factors, where the inventory or specific car you want is located and what your 'method' will be for getting to talk to the right decision maker at the dealership. Finally, you have to 'work' on your negotiation skills to get them to accept your offer. It is a game of poker, but the odds are mostly in your favor. Good luck. Z356.

AustinGuy

Z356,

Great post again. I can't tell you how much I've learned just from your last 2 posts. Are you in the car business? You definitely seem to have a soldi grip on MB sales issues.

Looks like I should shoot for 1k above inv. at this time.

A few things that I want to clarify:

If I negotiate a good deal through cars.com or the others that you mentioned, then

1) Where does the car get transported to? Where do I pick it up at

2) Who will I be able to turn to if things are not right with the car on arrival or 1,2 or 6 months down the road?

3) Will the local dealership give me the same service given that I did not buy the car through them? Loaners?

FYI: I have contacted a few dealships in Houston, but they did not seem to want to play email tag - they wanted me to come in person (Houston is 150 miles south of Austin). Is that common at first? I figure I probably need to get more acquainted and let then know that I am serious. BTW, this is the car I want (one more pic here)

AustinGuy

Do you have any personal experience with them? Are you from Austin/TX?

Z356

Austin: I have learned myself so much from these Forums that it seems natural to want to share some of my experience with other board members, for what these 'experiences' are worth.

Q: "If I negotiate a good deal through cars.com or the others that you mentioned, then:" Cars.com and Autotraders are just internet sites where seller's post what cars they have for sale. It is the new version of you 'old' local paper car ads. You don' negotiate deals through them, you negotiate deals with the actual sellers, e.g. MB dealers, private parties and third parties (Tony's Luxury Car Sales). Makes a lot of difference with whom you are dealing with. More on this later.

Q: "Where does the car get transported to? Where do I pick it up at". That is negotiable point. You a) pick it up, b) dealer/third party arranges for transport or c) you do the arranging. On most of my last purchases, I have arranged the transport myself via Intercity Lines via a direct 800 number. They can quickly quote you what the cost of the transportation so you can calculate it into your deal.

Q: "Who will I be able to turn to if things are not right with the car on arrival or 1,2 or 6 months down the road?" Best bet is to buy from MB dealers that have a reputation to maintain and agreements with MBUSA to uphold. But, don't be confused about one point. "Buyer Beware" is the Number One rule in this industry. You have the responsibility to verify the condition & history of the car they are trying to sell you. You need to do all your 'due diligence'. First, any newer MB that was sold with a US warranty will have a warranty service record. This is called the Vehicle Master Inquiry. It will tell you anything that MB was contacted by any MB dealer regarding this car and the action dealer or MBUSA took to fix it. Key to this report is correct VIN #. So if selling party claims it doesn't have it or feigns ignorance, you will have to become friendly with a local MB dealer that can access the NetStar computer (MB internal computer network) from where info can be retrieved. This will tell you if service history is normal or excessive returns to dealer for issues not resolved with the car. Get as far away as you can from a problem 'lemon or soon-to-be-lemon' car. They are not generally worth any so-called 'good' deal you could possibly get on them get since you inherit the problems and issues of the car. Plus it will kill you when you try to resell this car. Carfax and Autocheck are also services that will help you determine if accidents, auction sales, and any other 'unusual' history to the car (e.g. salvage title) in question.

Q: "Will the local dealership give me the same service given that I did not buy the car through them? Loaners?". If they are smart business people, they will. Mercedes USA rewards dealers for good service to 'their' car customers under warranty and not just to a particular dealers' customers. Big difference. They or their representatives (e.g. JD Powers) will contact you after service and ask about your experience & satisfaction with the service you received at this particular dealership. If you respond with anything less than 'excellent' or top scores (e.g. 5 of 5), it will be recorded as bad 'mark' on the dealership. Their CSI (Consumer Satisfaction Index) will be down and their year-end $ hold-backs and perks (extra allocation of hot cars) will be reduced by MBUSA. That is how MBUSA is trying to prevent dealers from using any 'excuse' to treat unfairly any of 'their' customers. If a particular experience is really bad, you don't have to wait for the CSI call, just contact MBUSA and complain about the bad service. It will get your dealer's manager or owners attention real fast.

Q:"I have contacted a few dealerships in Houston, but they did not seem to want to play email tag - they wanted me to come in person (Houston is 150 miles south of Austin). Is that common at first? I figure I probably need to get more acquainted and let then know that I am serious." To paraphrase a famous saying from 1 1/2 centuries ago, 'nobody has ever lost money betting on the intelligence of auto dealers'. In a country that has achieved a high reputation for its attempts at excellence in management at every business endeavor (I am product of the University of Pennsylvania's Wharton and Columbia Business School, so I know the theory in principle), it is pathetic to think that so little advances have been made in the actual running the automotive dealerships since the days of Henry Ford. Via a cursory review of MB sales brochures for a few hours, you will probably know more than 90% of any salesman currently employed at any Mercedes dealership. It is truly amazing the level 'help' the industry attracts- you need to prove direct genetic lineage to Neanderthals to get the really 'good' jobs. Imagine the rest. If local dealers are so unsophisticated, you need to train them like wild lions at Barnum and Baileys. Try first to see the best deal you can get in the Southern California MB market, which is the most competitive market near your area. Then send them copies (take out the dealers name & other ID) to show these local Houston 'caveman' what these others dealers are willing to negotiate on purchase price via the internet. If they don't react, buy it where you can get the best deal and compensate for added transport. That is your ultimate leverage...and stick.

Now go out and make us proud. Good luck. Z356.

RajwanyS550

yes i was looking at some used 07S550, and their salespeople did not want to talk about any kinds of deals. on a used S550 he wanted to take off only 500. their attitude was these r hot selling cars and they r doing us a favor. not the case in Dallas where I am from.

ps. even though the particular car was on the lot for more than a month.

RajwanyS550

Shoot for at least 1000 under invoice.....

AustinGuy

RajwanyS550,

The car I want has an MSRP of $98,250 ($91,500 invoice). I asked the manager at Park Place Dallas (6113 Lemmon Avenue) if he could do $91,000 and he said NO! Flat out - didn't even want to negotiate. In fact he more or less told me buzz off!! Here is the email:

"...It is not possible to achieve your requested $91,000 price on this type of model. I’m sorry will be unable to assist you at this time. Thank you for your interest in Park Place , and if can be of any further assistance, remember I am only an email away........... "


Is there a dealer you could recommend in Dallas?

(BTW, my wife drives an 06 GX470 - midnight blue. Real nice.)

RajwanyS550

yes iam dealing with ewing mercedes in plano. try them. also try the park place midcities. the manager at the parkplace motorcars is cocky, he also turned my offer down. where did u get your invoice pricing from, think the invoice might be a little higher.

AustinGuy

Thanks for the info - is there someone at Ewing you could recommend? So, if ParkPlace is cocky, why do you recommend PP midcities? Or is it just the Dallas PP?
Edmunds. Unless, the numbers are plain wrong, that inv. $$ I posted is what it showed.

RajwanyS550

ask for Marty Mullins, very professional guy. Tell him I sent U. yes its is just the PP Dallas, maybe because they have spent millions on this new facility.
Same is the deal with PP grapevine, new expensive dealership, their prices r always higher than the PP lexus in plano.

actually edmunds does not include the advertising cost. invioce is around 6%.
their holdback is around 4%. this is what I found talking to diff sales guys and averaging it out.

PS. My wife also loves her GX470 Blizzard Pearl-Fully Loaded.

syswei

Thanks very much for the info! I tried autotrader and cars.com but I'm not convinced that the keyword search works correctly. Where can I access the "MB nationwide search" please?