Glyn M Ruck

Matt - your car has the new head - You should have no problems.

inspecta83

It sounds to me that this problem is obivously due to a design flaw. If you're a car manufacturer, Mercedes Benz no less, you should design your product (the engine) in such a way that it is fit for normal use. Its a concept in the law called the "implied warranty of merchantability".

Google: Implied warranty of merchantability
If the seller is a merchant, such as a car dealership, the implied warranty of merchantability is automatic. In essence it means that the car will do what it is supposed to do. The implied warranty of merchantability is always part of a new car purchase; in addition, all used cars sold by dealers are covered, unless the warranty is disclaimed in writing by such words as "as is" or "with all faults".

I am no attorney, but it seems like Benz might be in violation of this implied warranty b/c they obviously knew or should have known that the gas in the US is of a lesser quality than it is overseas. This should've been taken into consideration during the R&D stages. Engines are not supposed to need new heads @ 68k miles like mine & so many others does. Its not fair that customers should have to foot the bill for their negligence which can be $3100USD (in my case) or more. I'm sure Benz is obviously aware of the M271 shortfalls since they redesigned it and are receiving several complaints.

Its been 2 days now and MBUSA still hasnt gotten back to my local dealer with what they will offer me. I hope they cover everything b/c as far as I'm concerned they sold me (and so many others) a defective product.

Glyn M Ruck

You might want to read post 18 here

https://mbworld.org/forums/c-class-w...er-1-m271.html

With 2003 & early 2004 M271 engines you have my sympathy & I think you are correct.

However, long term the US is going to have to improve it's gasoline (& pay more for it) to European & Japanese standards or you are simply going to be left behind with a bunch of old obsolete engines. 3 way Cats are a must for low emissions but you can't use them with your or our fuel.

SA is updating it's refineries as we speak & Australia have finished their's already. Even China is on board - no surprise!

Benz will probably pay for your head once - They did that with our family car mentioned earlier in this thread but the second & third failures were for our expense so we finally sold the car. Is this right - no I don't think so but I know of nobody that has achieved a successful court action against them.

Seriously though - see my link to the other thread above. Run your car on Techron if you intend keeping it. It helps a lot. Benz might pay once but not twice.

BTW - Toyota is having a similar problem right now. It just has not hit the headlines yet. Fuel quality has to improve!

inspecta83

very informative, and promising. I hope they pay for it at least for the first time. Its been 2 days so far and we still haven't heard anything from them so hopefully this is a good sign. I'm glad I read up on alot of the posts on here to educate myself on the M271's widespread problems on US gasoline. At least now if MBUSA has bad news for me I can have an educated rebuttal.

Glyn M Ruck

Be careful with the on this forum. I'm a South African & used to robust interaction - frankly I could not care less. Some of your American friends might take offense.

samaritrey

since we are on the topic of fuel. curious to know why are fuel sucks over here. I assume the refineries would have to be update to make the higher quality fuels which costs money which raises fuel prices which no one likes lol. I assume there is crap left in the fuel after the refining that is the issue right? or is there another reason why our fuel sucks? Thanks
always want to learn more.

contact148

probably cause we north americans are stupid and can be sold lower grade fuels and not care

as for MB warrenty how you deal with the SA is a MAJOR factor in getting stuff done

I had a big fight with mb breaking my rear hub while changing a bearing I could have told the SA to **** off I wanted to but i told him talk to the service manager and get him to cover it as im not paying in the end he did the sa said thanks for not ripping his head off

2 weeks later the same SA got my front pipes and cats replaced (still under emissions warrenty 8 years 130,km) but he said MB is often very pickey with cat replacement so i got like 3 k worth of stuff done to a 7 year old car for free

LILBENZ230

If it was under emissions warranty then your SA did nothing for you except his job. He should hardly be applauded, though simply doing their jobs is so rare these days.

Glyn M Ruck

Yes Trey - It means upgrading refineries at huge expense. The Europeans & Japanese etc. take a narrower cut out of the barrel of crude which reduces yield as well per barrel but gets rid of nasties like asphaltines which are deposit creating. They also de-sulphurise down to a couple of parts per million residual sulphur so that the latest 3 way Cat converters can be used without doing more harm than good.

US motorists are going to have to pay more for fuel in the long run if they want to reduce emissions to European standards & get the latest technology engines. At European fuel prices which also include a higher element of tax than the US applies you would not have any Chevy Suburbans running around.

inspecta83

well...its been 4 days now since I went to the dealer and spoke to the service manager. he said he would get back to me within 24 hours. i'm guessing he won't get back to me before Monday which will be a total of 6 days. I hope this is b/c MBUSA is going to pay for it and they're just getting all the approvals....or that my dealer already got the approval and is fixing it now so they can surprise me with a call saying its ready and was covered by MBUSA!!!

William C

I had the valve stick at 113000 km here in Canada and they would not even offer the reduced rate for service. I have to flip the whole thing costing $3773.+ to have the heads done with new valves. What a bunch of BS. I bought the car in June of 2010 and was informed that this would not be an issue, well guess what I was not covered and the Extended warranty would not cover it. Watch out guys they are saying that carbon is not covered. I pick up my car Tomorrow. I have been arguing with them for 3 months and did not get anywhere.
Do not get the warranty because you will not be covered for this.

d1no

^ What year is your car?

ambit

Haven't posted my old cylinder head rebuild thread in awhile:
https://mbworld.org/forums/c-class-w...rn-loosen.html
And gallery:
https://mbworld.org/forums/members/a...-teardown.html

2003 C230 coupe, auto

Final explanation from my SA was that the timing chain jumped a tooth on the intake cam, causing those 8 valves to smash into the pistons.
Pulled the head off, replaced the valves, chain, tensioner. Ran fine again after. Cost about $1500 to do myself (with about $300 of that being 'oops' mistakes).

Glyn M Ruck

If you want your valves to stay like this - use Techron. Black deposited area is where the fuel can't get because it is upstream of the injectors but at least you will never suffer a stuck valve.

William C

Sorry Guys
My car is a 2003 c230 coupe
with the M271 engine

LILBENZ230

The 2003s are really bad about this.

Glyn M Ruck

+1

C230 Sport Coup

M272 has a class action lawsuit for the balance shaft.
Why not the M271 for the head?
They certainly knew about it, and took their sweet time to fix it.
http://www.courthousenews.com/2010/10/07/Mercedes.pdf

qat@telkomsa.ne

I have a 2003 C200K with 190 000 km on the clock. A month ago the engine light came on and we took it to a dealer and they reset the light and told us it is the exhaust sensor. It happened again a week later and I got the same reply. A week after this the car started to misfire and they replaced the plugs, but to na avail. I took it back and was then informed the nr 1 valve was burnt and that it was a common problem with the 271 engine. Is this true?

scottisha

Not sure if it was common or not.

When I traded my 2005 C230 6spd manual in on a VW this past year, my car had 204,000 miles on it. Stock clutch, factory battery, and on and on.
Never had an issue, other than the alternator bearing going bad. Replaced the plugs only twice and serpentine belt twice. Did the first coolant flush at 198k miles and the coolant was still "serviceable". I attribute my good luck with setting the cruise at 90mph during my 75 mile commute to work each morning.

My car never ever left me stranded and it never not started. Most reliable car I have ever owned and probably ever will own.
I started having to add a quart of oil between oil changes after I passed the 120k mile mark, but there was never any oil leaking or visible oil burning.

I had replaced the cam timing sensors, because everyone seemed to be having issued with theirs. did this well after 100k miles and there wasn't a drop of oil on them. Went ahead an updated them anyways. pretty cheap, considering.

I just went through a lot of tires while owning that car. 17 sets of rears and 8 sets of fronts. Plus, several sets of pads and a couple sets of rotors.

Scott

LILBENZ230

Scott - good to see you back and get an update. Hate to hear that the C230 is gone, though.

grane

We haven't built a new refinery in 20 years in the USA. In addition two negative forces, science fair experiment energy public funding policy and an aversion to old energy. Solara, electric cars, holding up the pipelines from our friend Canada and a refusal to put the big rigs on LNG even though CA runs their state motor pool Hondas on it, Sunoco closing their PA refinery, it's the perfect storm when it comes to bad gas.

I use Shell 93 and Techron religiously. Glyn is correct as usual.

scottisha

LOL....I'm surprised anyone here recalls my membership. It has been a while....Been very busy on the VW forums lately...
Update:
Bought a New 2009 Hyundai Genesis Sedan V8 w/tech back in 09.
Still had the C230 until June of 2011, but drove it very little. In fact, I put almost 60k miles on my Genesis during that period of time.
June of 2011, traded the C30 in on a 2011 Golf TDI. Great car, but I had also put a deposit down to be first at my dealer for the 2012 Golf R. Once they finally allowed us to pick colors, options, etc, I realized I didn't really care for any of the available colors besides white. Well, my Golf TDI was white and didn't want two white Golfs, so I traded the TDI in on a gray 2012 VW GLI.
BTW, my best tank
My Golf R should be here at the end of January. I'm getting rid of the Genesis to buy the Golf R.

Here's the cars over the past year:
My current 2012 GLI (APR Stage 2, 274hp & 314 ft/lbs)



The 2011 Golf TDI. Traded in on the GLI (TDI had REVO software giving it 170hp & 303 ft/lbs) My best tank was 650 miles @ 46.5 miles per gallon.



And, my current 2009 Genesis V8. BTW, this car has been awesome and flawless over the past 61k miles. Incredible sound system and top notch quality inside.
mods include: Linea Corse LC818's @ 19x8.5 front & 19x10 rear, painted roof black, Magnaflow mufflers with Porsche 996TT exhaust tips.


I think I talked my brother-in-law into getting the new C250.....Any major issues with that 4cyl turbo engine?

Scott

LILBENZ230

Scott the new 250 is the M271EVO engine.. it should be okay, it's way early to tell that though.

Nice collection. The GLI is a good looking sedan!

If you don't mind me asking, how much was a 2005 C230 work on trade with 204k miles?

scottisha

I got $4900.00 for it. Paid 1100.00 below invoice for the TDI, then paid 300.00 below dealer cost for GLI. GLI msrp was 27,765.00 and I paid 24,618.00. GLI is 6spd manual with autobahn and nav.