Always wear your seatbelt
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From: San Diego, Ca
2003 Citron Green C230KMT
Re: Always wear your seatbelt
Originally posted by Kimberly
This is what happens when a pcik-up truck runs a red light and plows into my baby Benz (this used to be a C240). None of the airbags deployed, but luckily I was wearing my seatbelt. Needless to say, the car is totaled.
This is what happens when a pcik-up truck runs a red light and plows into my baby Benz (this used to be a C240). None of the airbags deployed, but luckily I was wearing my seatbelt. Needless to say, the car is totaled.
you might wanna dump the car off at your dealer and let them know. tell them you wanna know WTF the airbags didnt blow out.
Originally posted by dswildfire
looks a little bit more like the pickup was so high, it ran over the top half of the front end, which would explain why there is so much front end damage with no apparent cabin deformation. might also explain why airbags didnt deploy, computer must have thought since there is no immediate danger to the cabin, there is no need to burn you with oxidizer. (sorry if you hear any cynicism, its not intentional, just been a bad day). but at least you're alright. that's what's most important.
looks a little bit more like the pickup was so high, it ran over the top half of the front end, which would explain why there is so much front end damage with no apparent cabin deformation. might also explain why airbags didnt deploy, computer must have thought since there is no immediate danger to the cabin, there is no need to burn you with oxidizer. (sorry if you hear any cynicism, its not intentional, just been a bad day). but at least you're alright. that's what's most important.
Originally posted by avlis
I disagree. Where there any injuries as a result of the airbag not deploying? No? Then the airbag did it's job (by staying in the steering wheel) and you have no case. The impact was obviously absorbed by the body structure and the seatbelt did it's job by keeping the occupant restrained. What's the problem?
I agree with grn300m. Front airbags only deploy in cases where the occupant is likely to suffer injurys as a result of hitting the wheel/dashboard (accelerometers measure the force and direction of impact to determine this). Airbags should NOT deploy during all impacts or "just because". This may have been the case with early SRS systems but, it's been proven that airbags can sometimes cause injurys by deploying when they are not needed. The seatbelt was in use and I believe the contoller takes that into account. The controller decided, in this case, that airbags were not needed and it was correct if there were no injurys as a result.
FYI: The controller also decides WHICH airbags to deploy, not just WHEN. So don't be suprised if you don't see side curtains in a frontal impact.
I disagree. Where there any injuries as a result of the airbag not deploying? No? Then the airbag did it's job (by staying in the steering wheel) and you have no case. The impact was obviously absorbed by the body structure and the seatbelt did it's job by keeping the occupant restrained. What's the problem?
I agree with grn300m. Front airbags only deploy in cases where the occupant is likely to suffer injurys as a result of hitting the wheel/dashboard (accelerometers measure the force and direction of impact to determine this). Airbags should NOT deploy during all impacts or "just because". This may have been the case with early SRS systems but, it's been proven that airbags can sometimes cause injurys by deploying when they are not needed. The seatbelt was in use and I believe the contoller takes that into account. The controller decided, in this case, that airbags were not needed and it was correct if there were no injurys as a result.
FYI: The controller also decides WHICH airbags to deploy, not just WHEN. So don't be suprised if you don't see side curtains in a frontal impact.
Originally posted by tifosiv122
My mom's '89 300E's airbag did not deploy on a head on collision at 45mph. Mercedes paid for that one. Over 10 years later they are still behind in airbag technology.
Erik
My mom's '89 300E's airbag did not deploy on a head on collision at 45mph. Mercedes paid for that one. Over 10 years later they are still behind in airbag technology.
Erik
Last edited by CitronC230K_03; Nov 6, 2002 at 06:50 PM.
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Re: Re: Always wear your seatbelt
Originally posted by CitronC230K_03
NONE OF THE AIRBAGS DEPLOYED????????? SO MUCH FOR OFFSET FRONTAL COLLISION TESTS!!!
you might wanna dump the car off at your dealer and let them know. tell them you wanna know WTF the airbags didnt blow out.
yet this may explain why they didnt if they didnt hit the sensors and just ripped them out from what it looks like in the pics. must have been a monster truck or something. damn those lifted trucks, damn them!!
i have to disagree with this. are there sensors in the the crumple zones that detect when the accident has reached its threashold and the airbags must deploy. if so you might think that it may be to late. i dont know but it just seems a little unlikely to me. im not saying file a lawsuit, but bring it up with DCX, MB USA, whoever. ask them, they may have the answer. i agree a civil cuit is unlikely as no one was hurt and the rest of the car and restraint systems did their jobs, and since the SRS, suplemental restraint systems didnt deploy, everyone is ok and therefore would most likely have no case!
if i remember right, Daimler-Benz AG, now DaimlerChystler holds the patent for airbag technology from 1984 if i remember right. ill check and make sure.
NONE OF THE AIRBAGS DEPLOYED????????? SO MUCH FOR OFFSET FRONTAL COLLISION TESTS!!!
you might wanna dump the car off at your dealer and let them know. tell them you wanna know WTF the airbags didnt blow out.
yet this may explain why they didnt if they didnt hit the sensors and just ripped them out from what it looks like in the pics. must have been a monster truck or something. damn those lifted trucks, damn them!!
i have to disagree with this. are there sensors in the the crumple zones that detect when the accident has reached its threashold and the airbags must deploy. if so you might think that it may be to late. i dont know but it just seems a little unlikely to me. im not saying file a lawsuit, but bring it up with DCX, MB USA, whoever. ask them, they may have the answer. i agree a civil cuit is unlikely as no one was hurt and the rest of the car and restraint systems did their jobs, and since the SRS, suplemental restraint systems didnt deploy, everyone is ok and therefore would most likely have no case!
if i remember right, Daimler-Benz AG, now DaimlerChystler holds the patent for airbag technology from 1984 if i remember right. ill check and make sure.
Mercedes Benz had airbags in their vehicle (on a mass production) years before the other auto manufactures were forced to install them.
By the way, I just got finished looking at a 2001 C240 that was in a collision in the front drivers tire area. Both side and drivers air bag went off and the damage was less than the one on this forum.
My 2 cents is that we are not an authority on air bag deployment and we cannot say why some go off and some do not however I know for a fact that the auto manufactures will look at a wrecked vehicle and determine why it did not go off and will be honest about it. I have had to make keys to sever vehicles that the auto manufacture rep was going to test and figure out what happened.
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Originally posted by tifosiv122
Thats why MB lost their case to us. Their airbag should have deployed, but was faulty. BTW it costs $1,200 to test the airbag, and its up to you to have done. Basically they try to set it off, but then you need to replace the bags ($1,200).
Erik
Thats why MB lost their case to us. Their airbag should have deployed, but was faulty. BTW it costs $1,200 to test the airbag, and its up to you to have done. Basically they try to set it off, but then you need to replace the bags ($1,200).
Erik
Originally posted by Lockbuster
Mercedes Benz had airbags in their vehicle (on a mass production) years before the other auto manufactures were forced to install them.
By the way, I just got finished looking at a 2001 C240 that was in a collision in the front drivers tire area. Both side and drivers air bag went off and the damage was less than the one on this forum.
My 2 cents is that we are not an authority on air bag deployment and we cannot say why some go off and some do not however I know for a fact that the auto manufactures will look at a wrecked vehicle and determine why it did not go off and will be honest about it. I have had to make keys to sever vehicles that the auto manufacture rep was going to test and figure out what happened.
Mercedes Benz had airbags in their vehicle (on a mass production) years before the other auto manufactures were forced to install them.
By the way, I just got finished looking at a 2001 C240 that was in a collision in the front drivers tire area. Both side and drivers air bag went off and the damage was less than the one on this forum.
My 2 cents is that we are not an authority on air bag deployment and we cannot say why some go off and some do not however I know for a fact that the auto manufactures will look at a wrecked vehicle and determine why it did not go off and will be honest about it. I have had to make keys to sever vehicles that the auto manufacture rep was going to test and figure out what happened.
Last edited by CitronC230K_03; Nov 8, 2002 at 10:10 PM.
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I don't know what happened with the airbags. That's up to my insurance company and MB to figure out. My insurance company totaled the car (it was too expensive to repair). It's a good thing, because I certainly would not feel safe in it anymore. As for my condition, yes I am alive and I guess that's all that really matters to me at this point. I have lots of bruises that will go away, and permanent injuries that will not go away. But again, I'm alive and my kids are OK...
By the way, my heart belongs to the C240, but my new car will be quite a bit larger.
By the way, my heart belongs to the C240, but my new car will be quite a bit larger.
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best of all is that you and your kids especially are alive and that your kids dont have to live with the trauma of being in the accident. im sorry about your injuries and hope for a quick recovery. im sure the insurance company totalled it because it was 1. to expensive to fix and 2. not as safe as it was before. the first being the main reason. hopefully there will be a reasonable explanation as to why your airbags didnt deploy and either your insurance company and/or MB will be able to provide a reasonable explanation. i do agree with the statement that larger does not mean safer and i do agree that larger does mean more room. my VW New Beetle has a 5 star crash rating. i wouldnt want to test this myself and i trust and foremost hope that the National Hwy Institute came to the proper conclusion. i wish you the best of luck and thank you for posting the pictures as a reminder of why we should wear seatbelts. i wear mine not only because its the law, but of an accident i was in. also technology is great, and ESP, ABS, SRS, etc. can help so much. but sometimes it comes down to the basic seatbelt!
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i have to disagree with this. are there sensors in the the crumple zones that detect when the accident has reached its threashold and the airbags must deploy. if so you might think that it may be to late. i dont know but it just seems a little unlikely to me. im not saying file a lawsuit, but bring it up with DCX, MB USA, whoever. ask them, they may have the answer. i agree a civil suit is unlikely as no one was hurt and the rest of the car and restraint systems did their jobs, and since the SRS, suplemental restraint systems didnt deploy, everyone is ok and therefore would most likely have no case!
Avlis and I gave real insight to why the bags didn't deploy instead of pointing fingers at MB or others that might be liable. Airbags have great self test fault detection functionality that will detect 99% of problems.
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I believe Mercedes has designed their air bag system to deploy only when absolutely needed to protect the driver and/or passengers. A few years ago the example given was that they don't want to deploy the air bags when you go through a fence if the collision isn't that serious. The air bags may be needed to protect you from the brick wall that could be in your path after contact with the fence!
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Uh Erik, the first production vehicle to have an airbag was a MB (a 1979 SL in fact). MB is behind in airbag technology? Hardly!
The airbag may have not deployed, but I bet that the seatbelt pretensioners fired. The pretensioners will fire when the forces exceed 3G, and the airbags + pretensioners will both fire when the impact forces exceed 4Gs. With the C, the airbags can fire at various intensities, of course, depending on the severity of the impact.
The angle of the picture was not a particularly good one. It would've been better if there was one from the front and the other side as well.
The airbag may have not deployed, but I bet that the seatbelt pretensioners fired. The pretensioners will fire when the forces exceed 3G, and the airbags + pretensioners will both fire when the impact forces exceed 4Gs. With the C, the airbags can fire at various intensities, of course, depending on the severity of the impact.
The angle of the picture was not a particularly good one. It would've been better if there was one from the front and the other side as well.
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grn300m,
The picture was taken soon after the impact, nothing on the car was moved or adjusted at that point (the police wouldn't allow it). The pick-up hit me on the front right side of the car, going about 55mph.
The picture was taken soon after the impact, nothing on the car was moved or adjusted at that point (the police wouldn't allow it). The pick-up hit me on the front right side of the car, going about 55mph.
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Originally posted by Kimberly
grn300m,
The picture was taken soon after the impact, nothing on the car was moved or adjusted at that point (the police wouldn't allow it). The pick-up hit me on the front right side of the car, going about 55mph.
grn300m,
The picture was taken soon after the impact, nothing on the car was moved or adjusted at that point (the police wouldn't allow it). The pick-up hit me on the front right side of the car, going about 55mph.
just show you how important the seatbelts are. if the airbag had deployed, it wouldn't do any more good than the seatbelt had done because of the way the impact had happened. if you didn't wear the seatbelt, and say if the airbags had deployed, that won't do you much any goods.
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Kimberly, I'm glad to hear you're safe. Hope your minor injuries heal soon. And I especially hope you didn't get too much whiplash, my only accident so far (moderate-speed head-on) gave me neck pains for over 2 months...
My take on the reason the airbags wouldn't deploy is because Kimberly mentioned that the car was struck from the front right (I'm assuming the truck travelling at a 90-degree angle to hers). That would have most likely caused the car to spin around several times, but not cause her body to be thrown around too much, because the center of spin (center of gravity) would be slightly forward of center within the cabin due to the engine weight. That means that if anything, the side airbags would have deployed to prevent her from hitting the window from the centrifugal force, but not the steering wheel. The striking angle would also explain how the hood was ripped off, because the force was directly from the right.
So in short, the C240 was struck in the front by a truck travelling from the C240's right-to-left direction, spinning the car, unlike a direct impact.
Kimberly, if you can verify how your car was hit, or how it was moving immediately after impact, that would help explain how the car's computer would tell the airbags to not deploy.
My take on the reason the airbags wouldn't deploy is because Kimberly mentioned that the car was struck from the front right (I'm assuming the truck travelling at a 90-degree angle to hers). That would have most likely caused the car to spin around several times, but not cause her body to be thrown around too much, because the center of spin (center of gravity) would be slightly forward of center within the cabin due to the engine weight. That means that if anything, the side airbags would have deployed to prevent her from hitting the window from the centrifugal force, but not the steering wheel. The striking angle would also explain how the hood was ripped off, because the force was directly from the right.
So in short, the C240 was struck in the front by a truck travelling from the C240's right-to-left direction, spinning the car, unlike a direct impact.
Kimberly, if you can verify how your car was hit, or how it was moving immediately after impact, that would help explain how the car's computer would tell the airbags to not deploy.
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My father-in-law's '02 Taurus was T-boned at his passenger doors recently by another car running a stopsign. No one was in the passenger seat, but the passenger side side-impact airbag did deploy.
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Originally posted by Jim Banville
My father-in-law's '02 Taurus was T-boned at his passenger doors recently by another car running a stopsign. No one was in the passenger seat, but the passenger side side-impact airbag did deploy.
My father-in-law's '02 Taurus was T-boned at his passenger doors recently by another car running a stopsign. No one was in the passenger seat, but the passenger side side-impact airbag did deploy.
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Originally posted by Jim Banville
My father-in-law's '02 Taurus was T-boned at his passenger doors recently by another car running a stopsign. No one was in the passenger seat, but the passenger side side-impact airbag did deploy.
My father-in-law's '02 Taurus was T-boned at his passenger doors recently by another car running a stopsign. No one was in the passenger seat, but the passenger side side-impact airbag did deploy.
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Preyx, thanks for the info/reply. From what I can remember, after the truck struck me, I spun around a bit (not sure how many times). After the impact, my car was still in the intersection. The firemen that arrived shortly after said that the engine dropped, which was a good thing. Altough substantial, the amount of damage to my legs could have been worse.
From all the replies I've read, sounds like it was a good thing the airbags didn't deploy. Still makes me a little nervous, though... with any car.
From all the replies I've read, sounds like it was a good thing the airbags didn't deploy. Still makes me a little nervous, though... with any car.
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Originally posted by grn300m
CitronC230K_03, you should not make comments on matters you know next to nothing about. I’m an authority with Airbags, on the testing side. There are extensive algorithms written for every application, and every car is different. A number of things impact the deployment process including physical location of sensors, the distributed weight of the vehicle, speed, and impact forces and directional forces. Impacts are very different between hitting a static object and a object in motion. Driver and Passenger airbags are designed to protect the occupants. The ultimate goal is to have the occupants face plant directly to the bag, thus the importance of seat belt use and pretentioners. Many, if not most airbag injuries, are from improperly buckled occupants who miss or nail the sides of the bag. The side airbags are designed to protect the head and shoulders from bouncing off the side glass. In this case the side bags were not needed and no body damage resulted from the crash. The picture does not in anyway lead to reconstruction of the accident. The picture may have been taken after the hood was removed to disconnect the battery. Note the filter out of place over the battery location.
Avlis and I gave real insight to why the bags didn't deploy instead of pointing fingers at MB or others that might be liable. Airbags have great self test fault detection functionality that will detect 99% of problems.
CitronC230K_03, you should not make comments on matters you know next to nothing about. I’m an authority with Airbags, on the testing side. There are extensive algorithms written for every application, and every car is different. A number of things impact the deployment process including physical location of sensors, the distributed weight of the vehicle, speed, and impact forces and directional forces. Impacts are very different between hitting a static object and a object in motion. Driver and Passenger airbags are designed to protect the occupants. The ultimate goal is to have the occupants face plant directly to the bag, thus the importance of seat belt use and pretentioners. Many, if not most airbag injuries, are from improperly buckled occupants who miss or nail the sides of the bag. The side airbags are designed to protect the head and shoulders from bouncing off the side glass. In this case the side bags were not needed and no body damage resulted from the crash. The picture does not in anyway lead to reconstruction of the accident. The picture may have been taken after the hood was removed to disconnect the battery. Note the filter out of place over the battery location.
Avlis and I gave real insight to why the bags didn't deploy instead of pointing fingers at MB or others that might be liable. Airbags have great self test fault detection functionality that will detect 99% of problems.
i did follow up that statement with another post which included "i know im not a crash test expert, a lawyer, or an authority on airbag deployment, thats why i suggested to take the car back to MB and ask them why the airbags didnt deploy. i would be curious." i was stating my opinion. i wasnt saying any person or company is at fault, furthermore giving MB credit for the Airbag, but that i would be curious why they didnt deply because that wasnt a particular subject i have alot of experience and/or know how. im a network engineer. i play with computers, routers, servers, web design, etc. all day long. thats my job, thats what i know. if you need a firewall, i can do that for you, as long as your not referring to the one in the engine bay of a car. im not nick burns, your comany's computer guy, so if someone isnt sure or just doesnt know, i help them and explain it to them. sorry if i came off the wrong way, i was just posting my thoughts, not experience. btw, YOUR WELCOME!!!
sorry i just had to do that!
Last edited by CitronC230K_03; Nov 8, 2002 at 09:47 PM.
