I Ordered an ASP Pully Today!
#51
i]Originally posted by eason [/i]
Just have some questions in my head now. What if I put 94 octane fuel with "base" setting, will it do any good to me with the Pulley? Since higher octane and prevent knocking or pre-ignition.
[/QUOTE]
If the ECU is not sensing the onset of detonation and therefore retarding the timing, 94 octane will not be needed or add any hp. If you are talking about the pre-ignition caused by the lean a/f ratio, 94 octane might help, but it would be better to prevent the situation by going to "Stage 2".
Yes, colder plugs will reduce the the likelyhood of pre-ignition. But, remember that MB is now using plugs that are one range colder than those used in W202 C230k's and early SLK230k's.
Just have some questions in my head now. What if I put 94 octane fuel with "base" setting, will it do any good to me with the Pulley? Since higher octane and prevent knocking or pre-ignition.
[/QUOTE]
If the ECU is not sensing the onset of detonation and therefore retarding the timing, 94 octane will not be needed or add any hp. If you are talking about the pre-ignition caused by the lean a/f ratio, 94 octane might help, but it would be better to prevent the situation by going to "Stage 2".
Second questions is will "Colder" spark plugs prevent pre-ignition as well? Since colder spark plugs can decrease the temp. inside the engine; therefore, the change of pre-ignition will be a lot less. I know the stock plugs have a 6 heat range. I am planning to get some 7 or even 8 heat range plugs. Thx
#52
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Fast Cars!
Originally posted by Lynn
Take a trip to Jacksonville. I bet Brumos will change it.
Take a trip to Jacksonville. I bet Brumos will change it.
#53
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Originally posted by Lynn
i]Originally posted by eason [/i]
Just have some questions in my head now. What if I put 94 octane fuel with "base" setting, will it do any good to me with the Pulley? Since higher octane and prevent knocking or pre-ignition.
i]Originally posted by eason [/i]
Just have some questions in my head now. What if I put 94 octane fuel with "base" setting, will it do any good to me with the Pulley? Since higher octane and prevent knocking or pre-ignition.
If the ECU is not sensing the onset of detonation and therefore retarding the timing, 94 octane will not be needed or add any hp. If you are talking about the pre-ignition caused by the lean a/f ratio, 94 octane might help, but it would be better to prevent the situation by going to "Stage 2".
Yes, colder plugs will reduce the the likelyhood of pre-ignition. But, remember that MB is now using plugs that are one range colder than those used in W202 C230k's and early SLK230k's. [/QUOTE]
after seeing this, and knowing how hard it will be for me to have the settings changed would any of these help me? I always put in 93 octane fuel, and if i went to colder plugs will that have any negitive effect on performance?
And i am sorry for being so stupid but i do not under stand all this stuff about pre-ignition and detonation? whats the difference? and what happens with each? Those things can make the engine blow?
#54
Pre-ignition and detonation are often use interchangably, but they are not exactly the same thing.
The above quotes are from this article: http://www.misterfixit.com/deton.htm
Another excellent article: http://www.streetrodstuff.com/Articl...e_Basics_I.php
One more with drawings: http://www.atlanticjetsports.com/_techtalk/00000007.htm
Detonation (also called "spark knock") is an erratic form of combustion that can cause head gasket failure as well as other engine damage. Detonation occurs when excessive heat and pressure in the combustion chamber cause the air/fuel mixture to autoignite. This produces multiple flame fronts within the combustion chamber instead of a single flame kernel. When these multiple flames collide, they do so with explosive force that produces a sudden rise in cylinder pressure accompanied by a sharp metallic pinging or knocking noise. The hammer-like shock waves created by detonation subject the head gasket, piston, rings, spark plug and rod bearings to severe overloading.
Preignition occurs when a point within the combustion chamber becomes so hot that it becomes a source of ignition and causes the fuel to ignite before the spark plug fires. This, in turn, may contribute to or cause a detonation problem.
Another excellent article: http://www.streetrodstuff.com/Articl...e_Basics_I.php
One more with drawings: http://www.atlanticjetsports.com/_techtalk/00000007.htm
Last edited by Lynn; 11-26-2002 at 03:49 PM.
#55
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Thanks, the links were very helpful.
So me using my regular 93 octane fuel and changing to colder pulgs may help it a little, but it may not prevent it? will the colder plugs have any negitive effect on performance?
And since the stage 2 fuel setting would make things alot easier, is there anything else anyone can reccommend me emailing him back with to make him do it?
Thanks
So me using my regular 93 octane fuel and changing to colder pulgs may help it a little, but it may not prevent it? will the colder plugs have any negitive effect on performance?
And since the stage 2 fuel setting would make things alot easier, is there anything else anyone can reccommend me emailing him back with to make him do it?
Thanks
#56
I run on watered down 91 octane in California and I don't have any detonation problems or the ecu pulling back timing because of it. Also we have a very arid climate, your insane humidity actually lowers your chances of detonation greatly. When I had a Buell motorcycle, they had a tech bulletin for colder plugs on California bikes because of detonation caused by the dry weather.
#58
Originally posted by eason
Our C230K is using NGK R IR6D10(if I remember correctly), it's a Iridium spark plug with 6 heat range and 0.040" gap. I think changing to a 7 heat range plug would help a bit.
Our C230K is using NGK R IR6D10(if I remember correctly), it's a Iridium spark plug with 6 heat range and 0.040" gap. I think changing to a 7 heat range plug would help a bit.
#59
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Originally posted by Buellwinkle
I run on watered down 91 octane in California and I don't have any detonation problems or the ecu pulling back timing because of it. Also we have a very arid climate, your insane humidity actually lowers your chances of detonation greatly. When I had a Buell motorcycle, they had a tech bulletin for colder plugs on California bikes because of detonation caused by the dry weather.
I run on watered down 91 octane in California and I don't have any detonation problems or the ecu pulling back timing because of it. Also we have a very arid climate, your insane humidity actually lowers your chances of detonation greatly. When I had a Buell motorcycle, they had a tech bulletin for colder plugs on California bikes because of detonation caused by the dry weather.
By the way buell, are your fuel settings on base now? and u still dont have any detonation problems?
#60
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the pulley finally came on wednesday, (i did not have time to post then) but i am very impressed with the quality of the pulley. There is not one imperfection visible.
I am planning on having it installed sometime after christmas, so hopefully it will be done before next friday.
I am planning on keeping all my settings on base. (as no dealer in my area will change them)
Also please correct me if i am wrong, on the 2 things i need to remember, 1. toget a 56" 6 rib belt and 2. to have the pulley toqured to 85ft. lbs? should i have it done to 90? or just 85? and is locktite a must?
thanks
heres proof for the pulley.
I am planning on having it installed sometime after christmas, so hopefully it will be done before next friday.
I am planning on keeping all my settings on base. (as no dealer in my area will change them)
Also please correct me if i am wrong, on the 2 things i need to remember, 1. toget a 56" 6 rib belt and 2. to have the pulley toqured to 85ft. lbs? should i have it done to 90? or just 85? and is locktite a must?
thanks
heres proof for the pulley.
#62
mdp c230k
you sure are set on a pulley doing bearing damage, I ASK YOU HOW?
If these engines are internally balanced, which they are then adding a balanced pulley to the end will have no effect. Also if you read back through the posts you will see that I posted an example of engines which have no balancers on them. These engines run at several thousand rpms up to 15000 in some cases and they do not use dampners. Dampners are there to take some shock out of the accesories cycling, that is it. This was a myth with the honda engines and their oil pumps exploding due to lightened crank pullies. Is all I can say is that I ran a pulley for years and not one oil pump failure.
you sure are set on a pulley doing bearing damage, I ASK YOU HOW?
If these engines are internally balanced, which they are then adding a balanced pulley to the end will have no effect. Also if you read back through the posts you will see that I posted an example of engines which have no balancers on them. These engines run at several thousand rpms up to 15000 in some cases and they do not use dampners. Dampners are there to take some shock out of the accesories cycling, that is it. This was a myth with the honda engines and their oil pumps exploding due to lightened crank pullies. Is all I can say is that I ran a pulley for years and not one oil pump failure.
#63
BlackC230Coupe,
How long did it take for you to get your pulley from the time you ordered it until it showed up?
BTW, I would ask ASP what to torque it to. They should definately know since it is their part.
How long did it take for you to get your pulley from the time you ordered it until it showed up?
BTW, I would ask ASP what to torque it to. They should definately know since it is their part.
#64
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Originally posted by speedfrk
BlackC230Coupe,
How long did it take for you to get your pulley from the time you ordered it until it showed up?
BTW, I would ask ASP what to torque it to. They should definately know since it is their part.
BlackC230Coupe,
How long did it take for you to get your pulley from the time you ordered it until it showed up?
BTW, I would ask ASP what to torque it to. They should definately know since it is their part.
i was just wondering even if ASP reccomends 85ft. lbs of toqure will that be enough for it not to come loose? and i am stilll waiting for someone to comment on the locktite.
#65
Originally posted by BlackC230Coupe
i ordered the pulley on 11/5/02 and got it 12/18/02
i was just wondering even if ASP reccomends 85ft. lbs of toqure will that be enough for it not to come loose? and i am stilll waiting for someone to comment on the locktite.
i ordered the pulley on 11/5/02 and got it 12/18/02
i was just wondering even if ASP reccomends 85ft. lbs of toqure will that be enough for it not to come loose? and i am stilll waiting for someone to comment on the locktite.
#66
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Originally posted by vadim
I torqued it to 100 ft*lbs. Locktite is a cheap insurance - vibrations can do wonders in loosening any threaded fastener. Just think of possible consequences if the pulley comes loose spinning at 4000 rpm - it will probably have a few good bounces in the engine compartment before coming to rest.
I torqued it to 100 ft*lbs. Locktite is a cheap insurance - vibrations can do wonders in loosening any threaded fastener. Just think of possible consequences if the pulley comes loose spinning at 4000 rpm - it will probably have a few good bounces in the engine compartment before coming to rest.
#67
Originally posted by BlackC230Coupe
so are you saying i should use locktite? because after hearing you say "vibrations can do wonders in loosening any threaded fastener" it does not make me think it helps to much. And also maybe i should just toqure it to 90ft. lbs to be safer than 80.
so are you saying i should use locktite? because after hearing you say "vibrations can do wonders in loosening any threaded fastener" it does not make me think it helps to much. And also maybe i should just toqure it to 90ft. lbs to be safer than 80.
Last edited by vadim; 12-21-2002 at 11:44 PM.
#68
Even if there is a chance that the locktite will not hold, using it is still better than not using it. And make sure you get the high temperature kind, I think it's red. Plus, once you get the bolt tight, don't mess with it anymore. The locktite will dry and then if you move the bolt more, you will break the locktite loose and have to do it all over again.
#69
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From: The blue white rock, third out.
2002 C230 Coupe(M111)
Originally posted by BlackC230Coupe
so are you saying i should use locktite? because after hearing you say "vibrations can do wonders in loosening any threaded fastener" it does not make me think it helps to much. And also maybe i should just toqure it to 90ft. lbs to be safer than 80.
so are you saying i should use locktite? because after hearing you say "vibrations can do wonders in loosening any threaded fastener" it does not make me think it helps to much. And also maybe i should just toqure it to 90ft. lbs to be safer than 80.
#70
Originally posted by Outland
I'd go with whatever torque the MB manual reccomends for the stock pulley and some locktite.
I'd go with whatever torque the MB manual reccomends for the stock pulley and some locktite.
#71
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Originally posted by Matt230K
Even if there is a chance that the locktite will not hold, using it is still better than not using it. And make sure you get the high temperature kind, I think it's red. Plus, once you get the bolt tight, don't mess with it anymore. The locktite will dry and then if you move the bolt more, you will break the locktite loose and have to do it all over again.
Even if there is a chance that the locktite will not hold, using it is still better than not using it. And make sure you get the high temperature kind, I think it's red. Plus, once you get the bolt tight, don't mess with it anymore. The locktite will dry and then if you move the bolt more, you will break the locktite loose and have to do it all over again.
oh and by the way, i am not 100% sure but i thought that the ASP pulley does have a steel sleeve.
#72
Originally posted by BlackC230Coupe
i am planning on bringing my car to a shop to have the pulley installed, do u think that a shop has locktite? or do i need to buy some and bring it? where do u buy it if i need to get it?
oh and by the way, i am not 100% sure but i thought that the ASP pulley does have a steel sleeve.
i am planning on bringing my car to a shop to have the pulley installed, do u think that a shop has locktite? or do i need to buy some and bring it? where do u buy it if i need to get it?
oh and by the way, i am not 100% sure but i thought that the ASP pulley does have a steel sleeve.
A shop should have locktite, but you might want to take some just incase. Go to any auto parts store, they should have it. It's probably called High-Temp RTV sealant or something like that and should be red.
#73
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Originally posted by Matt230K
My information on the ASP pulley only comes from this forum, and I don't think i've ever heard anything about the steel sleeve, but I could be wrong. I know from talking to someone at Kleemann that there's does.
A shop should have locktite, but you might want to take some just incase. Go to any auto parts store, they should have it. It's probably called High-Temp RTV sealant or something like that and should be red.
My information on the ASP pulley only comes from this forum, and I don't think i've ever heard anything about the steel sleeve, but I could be wrong. I know from talking to someone at Kleemann that there's does.
A shop should have locktite, but you might want to take some just incase. Go to any auto parts store, they should have it. It's probably called High-Temp RTV sealant or something like that and should be red.
i somehow never asked ASP if it had a steel sleeve but i thought i remember buellwinkle saying it did, i know that there is a silver sleeve over the small hole (what ever u call it), although i dont know its its alluminum or steel.
#74
Originally posted by BlackC230Coupe
thanks, i will pick up some locktite just incase.
i somehow never asked ASP if it had a steel sleeve but i thought i remember buellwinkle saying it did, i know that there is a silver sleeve over the small hole (what ever u call it), although i dont know its its alluminum or steel.
thanks, i will pick up some locktite just incase.
i somehow never asked ASP if it had a steel sleeve but i thought i remember buellwinkle saying it did, i know that there is a silver sleeve over the small hole (what ever u call it), although i dont know its its alluminum or steel.
#75
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From: MI
2003 C230K, 6 spd, Brilliant Silver, C-5, C-7, CD changer
Originally posted by BlackC230Coupe
thanks, i will pick up some locktite just incase.
i somehow never asked ASP if it had a steel sleeve but i thought i remember buellwinkle saying it did, i know that there is a silver sleeve over the small hole (what ever u call it), although i dont know its its alluminum or steel.
thanks, i will pick up some locktite just incase.
i somehow never asked ASP if it had a steel sleeve but i thought i remember buellwinkle saying it did, i know that there is a silver sleeve over the small hole (what ever u call it), although i dont know its its alluminum or steel.
Grab a magnet and see if it sticks.