Is this normal for MB service...in Houston, TX???
11-12-2002, 12:45 PM
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2002 C230 Coupe Black/Charcoal C5 C7 Auto
Is this normal for MB service...in Houston, TX??? or anywhere in US??
Okay long story. Over the weekend i went to MB Greenway in Houston, TX to pick up a few parts. The guy at the counter first of called me "dude" and "man" (i'm 22 so not calling me Mr. is okay...whatever). To make it easy I gave him part #s for the SL ebrake cover and cargo net. Took him about 10min to figure what i'm ordering and he came back from the back. The cargo net (which they're charging $45 BTW) was an opened product and was taped all over it (return item i assume). I asked him for a new one and he stated sometime thats how it comes from MBUSA! I was suspicious but he also stated that was the last one. I went out to my car and found that all 4 hooks were broken! I went straight back in and told the guy. He went into the back (inventory i guess) and another guy came out 5min later with a brand new cargo net. I was late for something so didnt bother making a big deal.
Today I went to MB Greenway Service center for a scheduled TSB service apointment (which i made a week in advance and a confirmed a day ahead for loaner). I got there, did paperwork, and the guy then tells me they're out of cars and I have to wait half hour! i was ticked, called office I'd be late, then waited. half hour later i asked again and they said no loaners in sight and dunno when it'll be available AND there are 2 ppl. ahead of me! i got really ticked now and frustrated so i contaced my sales guy (he's pretty cool BTW) and he personally brought me to work in a C320 (nice car) and he stated he will try to arrange to have a loaner dropped of at my work (to be seen). I faxed a letter to their srvc dept and try to send email as well but their online box can only take 50 words. When i call MB Greenway for srvc comment contact they gave me MB USA some 800 number!! ARGHH...coming from MOMENTUM AUDI (which is EXCELLENT by the way that I bring em breakfast and holiday baskets all the time) I expected MB to be as good if not better
Today I went to MB Greenway Service center for a scheduled TSB service apointment (which i made a week in advance and a confirmed a day ahead for loaner). I got there, did paperwork, and the guy then tells me they're out of cars and I have to wait half hour! i was ticked, called office I'd be late, then waited. half hour later i asked again and they said no loaners in sight and dunno when it'll be available AND there are 2 ppl. ahead of me! i got really ticked now and frustrated so i contaced my sales guy (he's pretty cool BTW) and he personally brought me to work in a C320 (nice car) and he stated he will try to arrange to have a loaner dropped of at my work (to be seen). I faxed a letter to their srvc dept and try to send email as well but their online box can only take 50 words. When i call MB Greenway for srvc comment contact they gave me MB USA some 800 number!! ARGHH...coming from MOMENTUM AUDI (which is EXCELLENT by the way that I bring em breakfast and holiday baskets all the time) I expected MB to be as good if not better
Last edited by tberry; 11-12-2002 at 01:00 PM.
11-12-2002, 01:05 PM
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That's fairly consistent with many of my dealership experience - never called me "dude" or "man," but I'm always surprised at how little the parts guys know about parts and the service guys know about service.
In my experience, the loaner car thing sometimes goes relatively smoothly, other times can be a real hassle, but almost always takes at least half an hour. The service writer has to send some paperwork to the loaner car dept - sometimes it makes it, sometimes it doesn't, someone has to do paperwork, yet another person has to go find and bring the car, etc.
Almost always, they say if I bring the car in first thing in the morning, it will be done by the afternoon, and invariably they call at 5 p.m. and say they haven't even looked at it yet. Happened just yesterday.
These generally are not highly skilled, highly paid, or interested individuals, so I don't expect a lot. I also don't waste my efforts with e-mail and letters - it seems those just go ignored.
I'm pretty much happy if I just get the car back 1) actually fixed, and 2) reasonably clean and in once piece (grease marks on the steering wheel are not uncommon, and they scratched it when it was 3 weeks old).
In my experience, the loaner car thing sometimes goes relatively smoothly, other times can be a real hassle, but almost always takes at least half an hour. The service writer has to send some paperwork to the loaner car dept - sometimes it makes it, sometimes it doesn't, someone has to do paperwork, yet another person has to go find and bring the car, etc.
Almost always, they say if I bring the car in first thing in the morning, it will be done by the afternoon, and invariably they call at 5 p.m. and say they haven't even looked at it yet. Happened just yesterday.
These generally are not highly skilled, highly paid, or interested individuals, so I don't expect a lot. I also don't waste my efforts with e-mail and letters - it seems those just go ignored.
I'm pretty much happy if I just get the car back 1) actually fixed, and 2) reasonably clean and in once piece (grease marks on the steering wheel are not uncommon, and they scratched it when it was 3 weeks old).
11-12-2002, 01:13 PM
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Originally posted by SoCal240/6
That's fairly consistent with many of my dealership experience - never called me "dude" or "man," but I'm always surprised at how little the parts guys know about parts and the service guys know about service.
In my experience, the loaner car thing sometimes goes relatively smoothly, other times can be a real hassle, but almost always takes at least half an hour. The service writer has to send some paperwork to the loaner car dept - sometimes it makes it, sometimes it doesn't, someone has to do paperwork, yet another person has to go find and bring the car, etc.
Almost always, they say if I bring the car in first thing in the morning, it will be done by the afternoon, and invariably they call at 5 p.m. and say they haven't even looked at it yet. Happened just yesterday.
These generally are not highly skilled, highly paid, or interested individuals, so I don't expect a lot. I also don't waste my efforts with e-mail and letters - it seems those just go ignored.
I'm pretty much happy if I just get the car back 1) actually fixed, and 2) reasonably clean and in once piece (grease marks on the steering wheel are not uncommon, and they scratched it when it was 3 weeks old).
That's fairly consistent with many of my dealership experience - never called me "dude" or "man," but I'm always surprised at how little the parts guys know about parts and the service guys know about service.
In my experience, the loaner car thing sometimes goes relatively smoothly, other times can be a real hassle, but almost always takes at least half an hour. The service writer has to send some paperwork to the loaner car dept - sometimes it makes it, sometimes it doesn't, someone has to do paperwork, yet another person has to go find and bring the car, etc.
Almost always, they say if I bring the car in first thing in the morning, it will be done by the afternoon, and invariably they call at 5 p.m. and say they haven't even looked at it yet. Happened just yesterday.
These generally are not highly skilled, highly paid, or interested individuals, so I don't expect a lot. I also don't waste my efforts with e-mail and letters - it seems those just go ignored.
I'm pretty much happy if I just get the car back 1) actually fixed, and 2) reasonably clean and in once piece (grease marks on the steering wheel are not uncommon, and they scratched it when it was 3 weeks old).
11-12-2002, 01:27 PM
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Hate to do it, but I have to agree with SoCal (OUCH! that hurt!).
You have a c class MB, not an S; as is clearly explained in the manual, sh*t happens. Can't expect everything to go smoothly every single time that you visit the service dept. As far as the parts guy, is "dude" offensive? Next time, ask the parts guy how much he makes, then think of how much more you'd want to pay for the part to have him call you "Mister". I don't find his lack of giving you your proper title a big deal.
The only real problem that I see here is about them giving you the pre-opened net, which you should have probably rejected at first blush anyway. Other than that, where's the beef? If you don't feel that they're giving you proper respect, then you should probably go to a different dealership, or like you said, switch to another marque that will give you the treatment that you want. My opinion is that I'd prefer to get a good deal, have service fix my car under warranty properly, and I can wipe my own *** well enough on my own.
You have a c class MB, not an S; as is clearly explained in the manual, sh*t happens. Can't expect everything to go smoothly every single time that you visit the service dept. As far as the parts guy, is "dude" offensive? Next time, ask the parts guy how much he makes, then think of how much more you'd want to pay for the part to have him call you "Mister". I don't find his lack of giving you your proper title a big deal.
The only real problem that I see here is about them giving you the pre-opened net, which you should have probably rejected at first blush anyway. Other than that, where's the beef? If you don't feel that they're giving you proper respect, then you should probably go to a different dealership, or like you said, switch to another marque that will give you the treatment that you want. My opinion is that I'd prefer to get a good deal, have service fix my car under warranty properly, and I can wipe my own *** well enough on my own.
11-12-2002, 01:50 PM
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Originally posted by tommy
Hate to do it, but I have to agree with SoCal (OUCH! that hurt!).
You have a c class MB, not an S; as is clearly explained in the manual, sh*t happens. Can't expect everything to go smoothly every single time that you visit the service dept. As far as the parts guy, is "dude" offensive? Next time, ask the parts guy how much he makes, then think of how much more you'd want to pay for the part to have him call you "Mister". I don't find his lack of giving you your proper title a big deal.
The only real problem that I see here is about them giving you the pre-opened net, which you should have probably rejected at first blush anyway. Other than that, where's the beef? If you don't feel that they're giving you proper respect, then you should probably go to a different dealership, or like you said, switch to another marque that will give you the treatment that you want. My opinion is that I'd prefer to get a good deal, have service fix my car under warranty properly, and I can wipe my own *** well enough on my own.
Hate to do it, but I have to agree with SoCal (OUCH! that hurt!).
You have a c class MB, not an S; as is clearly explained in the manual, sh*t happens. Can't expect everything to go smoothly every single time that you visit the service dept. As far as the parts guy, is "dude" offensive? Next time, ask the parts guy how much he makes, then think of how much more you'd want to pay for the part to have him call you "Mister". I don't find his lack of giving you your proper title a big deal.
The only real problem that I see here is about them giving you the pre-opened net, which you should have probably rejected at first blush anyway. Other than that, where's the beef? If you don't feel that they're giving you proper respect, then you should probably go to a different dealership, or like you said, switch to another marque that will give you the treatment that you want. My opinion is that I'd prefer to get a good deal, have service fix my car under warranty properly, and I can wipe my own *** well enough on my own.
BTW, I bought the cargo net for my C240 last year and had to exchange it -- one of the clips pulled right off the elastic and couldn't be fixed...
11-12-2002, 01:54 PM
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'14 GLK250 Diesel
Dealers as independent businesses...
Franchise laws in the US prevent the manufacturers from enforcing real standards on every dealer in the chain. So they are stuck with indirect means [surveys, CSI scores, quota restrictions] when it comes to dealing with the marginal operators.
"Your experience will vary..."
Like some others here, my experience with our local dealer has been mostly positive. They're not perfect, but they try hard to keep you happy and are actually pretty competent most of the time. In fact, in our area, it is the Audi customer who is SOL - neither of the local Audi dealers is worth much in the service dept, and this is pretty widely known.
It's always nice to be in a market where there is real choice - I moved to the Valley from the SF Bay Area, and having only the one dealer within reasonable driving distance is indeed a concern, but so far [3 cars over the past 9 years], I generally give them a B+ for an overall grade. Which is a good thing, because the alternatives are all 35 or more miles one way...
"Your experience will vary..."
Like some others here, my experience with our local dealer has been mostly positive. They're not perfect, but they try hard to keep you happy and are actually pretty competent most of the time. In fact, in our area, it is the Audi customer who is SOL - neither of the local Audi dealers is worth much in the service dept, and this is pretty widely known.
It's always nice to be in a market where there is real choice - I moved to the Valley from the SF Bay Area, and having only the one dealer within reasonable driving distance is indeed a concern, but so far [3 cars over the past 9 years], I generally give them a B+ for an overall grade. Which is a good thing, because the alternatives are all 35 or more miles one way...
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11-12-2002, 02:21 PM
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2002 C230 Coupe Black/Charcoal C5 C7 Auto
Originally posted by tommy
Hate to do it, but I have to agree with SoCal (OUCH! that hurt!).
Hate to do it, but I have to agree with SoCal (OUCH! that hurt!).
11-12-2002, 02:41 PM
#9
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Maybe a little age has given me a different perspective than you. I paid $32k for my car, and I feel that I got better service than that price; I tried out several dealerships, and 4 different salespeople in my dealership, before I settled down to discuss actually purchasing my car. If I were not happy as in your case, I'd go over to another Houston dealership, and talk to them, and try them out. Filling out surveys honestly (which I always do) helps down the line with other customers, but really doesn't generally do much for you.
As far as the different treatment, to be honest, you should expect a different level of service, yes. I'm not saying that you shouldn't be treated well or without respect, but it's hard for me to think that a CL or S buyer shouldn't get more stroking throughout their ownership process. The world ain't fair, and the margins are so much bigger on the upscale cars, that I can't explain away any difference in treatment.
Sorry if I came off as harsh.
As far as the different treatment, to be honest, you should expect a different level of service, yes. I'm not saying that you shouldn't be treated well or without respect, but it's hard for me to think that a CL or S buyer shouldn't get more stroking throughout their ownership process. The world ain't fair, and the margins are so much bigger on the upscale cars, that I can't explain away any difference in treatment.
Sorry if I came off as harsh.
11-12-2002, 02:41 PM
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tberry, I ususally take my car to Greenway plaza, their loaner vehicles run out quick!
Both times i've had vehicles from Enterprise, I pay the insurance, MB pays the rental fee (I choose to get enterprise's insurance because if I get a ding on the winshield they will expect my insurance to pay for it, with their insurance I don't have to worry about anything)
The first time I didn't have to wait, I got a brand new Chevy Tahoe, the second time I had to wait over 1 hour to get this run down honda Accord, there was one person in front of me who did get a Benz and another person behind me who got a Malibu, we all 3 had to wait over an hour to get our loaners, I complained to Service Manager, and other managers about it, but they only apolagize for the inconvinience.
There is a guy on the parts kind of overweight with gotee (how ever it is spelled) he is pretty good, but they are not very helpfull, it almost seems like they want to sell you what they want, until they get to know you better, almost everybody at the dealer knows me by now because I showed them all my 160 mph video, so now they like me. Sorry but that seems to be the way they are, which is wrong BTW.
I have to take my car back for service once it gets fixed from the tire, we'll see how it goes then.
Both times i've had vehicles from Enterprise, I pay the insurance, MB pays the rental fee (I choose to get enterprise's insurance because if I get a ding on the winshield they will expect my insurance to pay for it, with their insurance I don't have to worry about anything)
The first time I didn't have to wait, I got a brand new Chevy Tahoe, the second time I had to wait over 1 hour to get this run down honda Accord, there was one person in front of me who did get a Benz and another person behind me who got a Malibu, we all 3 had to wait over an hour to get our loaners, I complained to Service Manager, and other managers about it, but they only apolagize for the inconvinience.
There is a guy on the parts kind of overweight with gotee (how ever it is spelled) he is pretty good, but they are not very helpfull, it almost seems like they want to sell you what they want, until they get to know you better, almost everybody at the dealer knows me by now because I showed them all my 160 mph video, so now they like me. Sorry but that seems to be the way they are, which is wrong BTW.
I have to take my car back for service once it gets fixed from the tire, we'll see how it goes then.
11-12-2002, 02:51 PM
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Toyota Tacoma & Lexus IS250
I've had 3 loaner cars lined up at the newly re-located MB Houston North and never have had to wait. I always get there about 7am - being that early ALL THE CARS are usually there - I think they have 3 C240's with COMAND as well.
I wish I could swap out one of those COMAND's with my normal stock radio...hehehhehe.
I wish I could swap out one of those COMAND's with my normal stock radio...hehehhehe.
11-12-2002, 02:58 PM
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Originally posted by bagwell
I've had 3 loaner cars lined up at the newly re-located MB Houston North and never have had to wait. I always get there about 7am - being that early ALL THE CARS are usually there - I think they have 3 C240's with COMAND as well.
I wish I could swap out one of those COMAND's with my normal stock radio...hehehhehe.
I've had 3 loaner cars lined up at the newly re-located MB Houston North and never have had to wait. I always get there about 7am - being that early ALL THE CARS are usually there - I think they have 3 C240's with COMAND as well.
I wish I could swap out one of those COMAND's with my normal stock radio...hehehhehe.
Next time I'll schedule to drop my car early in the morning instead of 10:00 am
11-12-2002, 02:59 PM
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2002 C230 Coupe Black/Charcoal C5 C7 Auto
Originally posted by tommy
As far as the different treatment, to be honest, you should expect a different level of service, yes. I'm not saying that you shouldn't be treated well or without respect, but it's hard for me to think that a CL or S buyer shouldn't get more stroking throughout their ownership process. The world ain't fair, and the margins are so much bigger on the upscale cars, that I can't explain away any difference in treatment.
Sorry if I came off as harsh.
As far as the different treatment, to be honest, you should expect a different level of service, yes. I'm not saying that you shouldn't be treated well or without respect, but it's hard for me to think that a CL or S buyer shouldn't get more stroking throughout their ownership process. The world ain't fair, and the margins are so much bigger on the upscale cars, that I can't explain away any difference in treatment.
Sorry if I came off as harsh.
11-12-2002, 03:37 PM
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Originally posted by tberry
I just can't believe that when i made appointment a week ahead, took time to call the day before and confirmed of the apointment, showed up on time, and STILL didnt get a loaner. Its like an episode of Seinfeld "...see i dont think you understand reservation. you know how to take em just dont know how to keep em...and really thats the important part of a reservation...the keeping...anyone can take em..."
I just can't believe that when i made appointment a week ahead, took time to call the day before and confirmed of the apointment, showed up on time, and STILL didnt get a loaner. Its like an episode of Seinfeld "...see i dont think you understand reservation. you know how to take em just dont know how to keep em...and really thats the important part of a reservation...the keeping...anyone can take em..."
11-12-2002, 03:47 PM
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2002 C230 Coupe Black/Charcoal C5 C7 Auto
Originally posted by bagwell
I've had 3 loaner cars lined up at the newly re-located MB Houston North and never have had to wait. I always get there about 7am - being that early ALL THE CARS are usually there - I think they have 3 C240's with COMAND as well.
I wish I could swap out one of those COMAND's with my normal stock radio...hehehhehe.
I've had 3 loaner cars lined up at the newly re-located MB Houston North and never have had to wait. I always get there about 7am - being that early ALL THE CARS are usually there - I think they have 3 C240's with COMAND as well.
I wish I could swap out one of those COMAND's with my normal stock radio...hehehhehe.
11-12-2002, 04:16 PM
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02 C320 S.E., 02 BMW 330XI, 00 4Runner
I've delt with the parts departments at two benz dealers. One in Ohio and one in CT. My experience is that you have dopes working everywhere. In CT, the head service guys are extremely unhelpful, but they have a young spanish guy that works there that will bend over backwards to help you. When I went to the dealership in Ohio several times, there was only one competent person in the parts department. I would usually try and deal with one lady that new her stuff. The two times I got the shmow that was filling in for her, he didn't have any interest in actually helping me, and ordered the wrong part, both times.
The front guys in the service department in CT, are not very friendly, to put it politely, but the mechanics they have working in the back are really great. They have always been more then willing to answer any question I may have, and have even taken the time to look at something on the car. The head mechanic even plugged ran the computer diagnostic for me to try and clear a code, without going through the *****s up front.
On another note, has anyone noticed a price difference between two dealerships when it comes to list price? I've found that CT is about %10 across the board more expensive when it comes to Mercedes parts. I ordered the same part in Ohio as in CT and there was a $20 price difference on a $60 part.
The front guys in the service department in CT, are not very friendly, to put it politely, but the mechanics they have working in the back are really great. They have always been more then willing to answer any question I may have, and have even taken the time to look at something on the car. The head mechanic even plugged ran the computer diagnostic for me to try and clear a code, without going through the *****s up front.
On another note, has anyone noticed a price difference between two dealerships when it comes to list price? I've found that CT is about %10 across the board more expensive when it comes to Mercedes parts. I ordered the same part in Ohio as in CT and there was a $20 price difference on a $60 part.
11-12-2002, 05:36 PM
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2002 C230 Coupe Black/Charcoal C5 C7 Auto
Hey guys...guess what? finally at 4pm MB Greenway brought me a loaner. Yep its a pimpin 2001 Toyota Camry Beige (my fav color :p ). yeah some of u may say "you got a loaner thats good..." but come on its an MB dealer...what does it take?? Oh well, I plan to take this lil sucker outta town this weekend and bring it back next week (serve em right!)....sad thing is it has in-dash CD player....more than i can say for my coupe
11-15-2002, 02:20 AM
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well, i started out pissed the first time i came to the dealer. my car was like 3 days old and one of the doorlocks wont move. they schedule me a week later and along i came. they gave me a 1999 c kompressor cant remember the number. they call in the afternoon saying that my doorlock was defective *duh* and they had to order the part for it. so i got my car and took it home. 1 week comes and i still didnt get a call so i went to my dealer and asked about the part and oh yeah... it is there but the service advisor didnt call me. so i went to the service desk and said that my parts were there and then they couldnt accomodate me till a week later. oh well got so pissed since we got a c320 and a clk320 on the same week. so i expected i little bit more considering that the car was only 3 days old and it showed signs of defect. so i call my sales rep and then he requests the service dept to accomodate me the next day. so they did i got a 2002 E320. well 2 months later we got another 2003 c230 coupe and at the same week my asp/bas message comes on! well at least they have been ok since then. they gave me a loaner silverado with a v8 woohooo! well today, a week after the service, the asp/bas came on again! so i call my service rep at 3:30pm. told me to come in. i requested for a loaner and they said they were out of mercedes benzes so i was to pick one from enterprise 5 minutes later they tell me that they hid one in the back and it was a c240 with 1,000 miles on it! i love my dealership!
. they call in the afternoon saying that my doorlock was defective *duh* and they had to order the part for it. so i got my car and took it home. 1 week comes and i still didnt get a call so i went to my dealer and asked about the part and oh yeah... it is there but the service advisor didnt call me. so i went to the service desk and said that my parts were there and then they couldnt accomodate me till a week later. oh well got so pissed since we got a c320 and a clk320 on the same week. so i expected i little bit more considering that the car was only 3 days old and it showed signs of defect. so i call my sales rep and then he requests the service dept to accomodate me the next day. so they did i got a 2002 E320. well 2 months later we got another 2003 c230 coupe and at the same week my asp/bas message comes on! well at least they have been ok since then. they gave me a loaner silverado with a v8 woohooo! well today, a week after the service, the asp/bas came on again! so i call my service rep at 3:30pm. told me to come in. i requested for a loaner and they said they were out of mercedes benzes so i was to pick one from enterprise 5 minutes later they tell me that they hid one in the back and it was a c240 with 1,000 miles on it! i love my dealership!
11-15-2002, 02:24 AM
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oh yeah! i forgot to mention why we bought 3 mercedes benzes in 2 months. our house burned down along with a 2001 lexus lx470 and a 2000 bmw 325i. were not rich, we just have a reliable insurance!
11-15-2002, 05:32 AM
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Originally posted by dr_feelgood
oh yeah! i forgot to mention why we bought 3 mercedes benzes in 2 months. our house burned down along with a 2001 lexus lx470 and a 2000 bmw 325i. were not rich, we just have a reliable insurance!
oh yeah! i forgot to mention why we bought 3 mercedes benzes in 2 months. our house burned down along with a 2001 lexus lx470 and a 2000 bmw 325i. were not rich, we just have a reliable insurance!
what?!?!? Sorry to hear your house burned down, and glad to hear the lexus burned down with it 
Also glad you have a reliable insurance
, I hope everybody is OK.
11-15-2002, 11:51 AM
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Originally posted by pocholin
what?!?!? Sorry to hear your house burned down, and glad to hear the lexus burned down with it
Also glad you have a reliable insurance , I hope everybody is OK.
what?!?!? Sorry to hear your house burned down, and glad to hear the lexus burned down with it Also glad you have a reliable insurance
, I hope everybody is OK.
we also got brand new cars! hehehehe
01-05-2003, 09:26 PM
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2002 C230 Coupe
Gee whiz. I am planning to call MB Greenway in the next day or two to setup my service A. I hope they do me better loaner car wise because I will have to drive it back to College Station and back.
BTW - where did you get the digital climate controls for your C? I want some. There was one on e-bay a few days ago and the guy cancelled the auction.
-Eric
BTW - where did you get the digital climate controls for your C? I want some. There was one on e-bay a few days ago and the guy cancelled the auction.
-Eric
01-06-2003, 04:24 PM
#25
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Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Texas
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02 c230 kompressor
i dont think Mercedes of Greenway has the best service. last time i went there i was pretty mad as well. I had ordered a part for my interior because it broke and they said they would call me when it came in. 6 weeks later i hadnt received a call or a notice or anything. so i called the dealership to ask what was up and they told me they had no idea what i was talking about. it was so stupid. so i drove all the way to the dealership (which is like 30 miles from where i live) to talk to a manager and see what was up. i get there and then i find the guy i had ordered my part from and he checks the computer and tells me that the part had come in like 4 weeks ago. i sat there thinking "so uh how come now on notified me" and he didnt apologize or anything. the service manager was really nice about everything and apologized for everything but the guy i dealt with...man he was a jerk!
its been a couple months and i still havent had time to take my car in and get the piece installed. partly because im lazy and partly because i dont want to deal with them anymore.
its been a couple months and i still havent had time to take my car in and get the piece installed. partly because im lazy and partly because i dont want to deal with them anymore.
