bajaiman

Check this one out...

http://g35driver.com/forums/showflat...sed&sb=5&part=

I was just wondering if any of you guys tried this one yet ... will it make any improvement on our W203?

vadim

Goodness gracious! I guess it never occured to the guy that the biggest grounding part of the car is its METALLIC body. He may as well improve "grounding" of his back yard by hammering copper rods in the ground and connecting them with wires...

bajaiman

I'm very skeptic about this but I might think of doing it...I mean its damn cheap to do... for 25 bux I get myself 5 meters of 8 gauge cable with some gold plated lugs. If it works then great if it doesn't work...well it didn't break the bank. I just don't know where to connect all the cables. Will I likely to screw up the car's ECU if I made mistakes?

This thread is a really long thread about grounding cable stuff.
http://g35driver.com/forums/showflat...&sb=5&part=all

mctwin2kman

It will help clean up any erroneouse crap and of course a better ground can not hurt. As for any HP gains, I would think that is a little far fetched. Less loss in the fuel injection signals and other signals maybe, and of course that may help out in not losing any HP due to bad signaling, but it should not gain. This will also help if you have an aftermarket stereo with Subwoofers and a big amp. More ground is always good though, and I have found that in the auto industry they seem to ground just enough and never go beyond that. They use ground cable with less strands in it and thus less surface area. I have found that just by adding or changeing factory ground cable to a nice high performance small strand high strand count wire with more surface area that the battery does not draw down as much on startup as well as lights being a little brighter and things a little smoother. But that was also with the addition of an amp and subs and a need for a better ground. Best place to start is by updating the ground cable from the battery to the frame and then the ground from the block to the frame and also updating the alternator feed lines if possible, some are a pain to get to.

bajaiman

Thanks for the pointer . I'm not looking for extra ponies but any extra ones would be nice.... as long as my lazy auto box shifts slightly faster I'll be more than happy.

rubensans

Wont do any damage and it's no a bad thing.

But I don't think it will make any type of improvment. make the try, not so much money.

Best Regards,

Ruben.

P.D. Will be nice for auto to have the AMG shift program programed to the car.

C-three-twenty

I know a few people that have used these types of kits on hondas and acuras and they said that there was a small improvement. If anyone trys it let us all know.

levelr123g

WASTE OF TIME! you would need to check the resistance between items you wish to ground, if the resistance is 0 the you will gain nothing from adding the wires.

fasteddie

Wouldn't hurt anything.....except your pocket book, your time, and I wouldn't want to buy the car that has been farted around with like this.

What exactly are the improvements your going to see....nothing. If there was any improvements to be had - it would come with this stuff already installed.....especially on a 'Benz. Even minor improvements the entire auto manufacturers industry scrambles to include in the cars. Next thing....someone will be claiming it improves the Fibre Optic signal quality throughout the systems resulting in huge HP gains. Bla...Bla.

I am a B.Sc. E.E. and I am tired of hearing the snake-oil salesmen say "it couldn't hurt".

I think people who sell this crap should be locked up!

mleskovar

"I am tired of hearing the snake-oil salesmen say "it couldn't hurt"."...but I'm only a BA in English.

bajaiman

I'm a skeptic too ... Its hard to believe that putting extra grounding cables will improve anything. I'd like to prove myself wrong tho. If it doesn't work then I can tell other people that it won't work based on my experience. I haven't seen or read anything about anybody doing this mod to their W203 so we'll never know unless somebody tried it. I'll do this maybe in a week or two....but before that I'll use a 2000 civic as a guinea pig

vadim

I have a better idea - get a book on popular electrical engineering. Would definitely cost you less and may save the poor Civic from abuse One more thing - you would actually have to READ the book

bajaiman

This maybe a stupid question...but how can I 'abuse' the civic by only adding afew grounding cables to it, the only 'big' thing I will do to the civic is to drill a single hole in the firewall...maybe not even that cos I can use the grounding points in the strut tower, battery or the front chasis of the car. Its no worse than replacing your stock air filter to aftermarket ones as these can be uninstalled easily...right?

vadim

Hey, mate, read the book first! No drilling will be necessary then.

mctwin2kman

The only true reason to do this would be because you are adding equipment to the vehicle such as an amplifier for the stereo. But you also have to think about how much the alternator can put out as well. If it can not truly supply the power then there is no point. Also bigger grounding will not gain you anything other than better power flow, which is not needed in the stock form of the auto. As for the comments of the body being one big ground, well it is but the body is attached to the engine with the power suppying device on it via runnber mounts. Electricity does not travel well through rubber engine mounts. By improving the engine ground and thus the alternator ground and the ground from the battery to the body as well as the positive line from the alternator to the battery and a bigger alternator will benifit those with large sound systems, or whatever other electronics with a higher current draw. If you are not adding anything to the vehicle that will draw more power then it is a waste of money and time. Oh and I am a BSEE as well, but spent a lot of time working in the car audio install world and improving grounding in vehicles with absurd amount of amplifers that needed it to stop the old lights from dimming.

vadim

Have you looked at THAT picture, at least to get an idea of what all the fuss is about?

mctwin2kman

Vadim, no I did not!!!! WTF is that ****???? If I would have actually looked at the picture I guess I would have responded with a whole diferent line. This is posted on two forums with two diferent discussions and of course I was refering to someone going out and buying something like 4 gauge monster cable with a high strand count to improve upon the factory grounding, I did not see the pics in that link before. I do not think I scrolled down when I clicked it when this all started.....

hanz

having more grounds and placing them in strategic locations will technically help to complete the electrical circuit in the shortest possible paths and therefore time. and this is good. but i do believe the autommakers have done enough. what you guys might like to consider is adding a voltage stabilizer in parallel to the battery terminals. this would help in securing a regular voltage supply to the car's sensistive electronics. cheers, hanz.

vadim

Hey, why stop there - add a parallel ECU! That would kick some ***. BTW, don't forget to place it in a strategic location!

fasteddie

Actually, WRT additional grounds...No it wouldn't help. This stuff will add to your car's performance about as much as a chrome exhaust tip.

All critical signal paths (including the ground circuits) are figured out by a team of engineers during the design of the car. No backyarder with some extra copper is going to improve on this stuff. All of the cars sensitive sensors (such as Oxygen, mass air flow, crank position, vacuum, etc.) are being measured by differential pairs running straight back to the ECU. Other signals (speed, brake signal transmission gear) are of a more digital nature, and thus pretty much unacceptable to ground noise.

Do you no any car (at any price) that contains this stuff - say from Rolls-Royce, Mercedes, Bentley, Jag, Ferrari....anything?

Reason....it's not necessary. Makes no difference.


ed

amdeutsch

I'm amazed that everybody on here takes the attitude that the engineers knew best in this regard. You can make improvements on the bond issue but you will be faced with a tradeoff: weight versus performance versus cost. The minimal gains achieved by increasing the bond, lowering the resistance, do not always coincidence with the other 2. And in the real world the beancounters call most of the shots.

There comes a time when one must shoot the engineer and get on with production.

And yes, I'm an engineer (EE).

fasteddie

What bond issues? Let's get specific. I am shocked that we not even dealing in theory, we are dealing in hypothesis...philosophy stuff.


What bonding are you going to improve that will improve performance?

vadim

Are you really an EE engineer? If you were, you would be able to recognize the bogus nature of this crap just by looking at the picture. And this doesn't even require a degree, really.

amdeutsch

You are correct in that regard. I ignored it on purpose and was just addressing the comments made that engineers know best without regard what everybody else in the product chain contributed.

AmAzing1.8

I'm not an electrical engineer or anything, but I do know that Sport Compact Car magazine installed the Sun Auto hyper ground cables on their project WRX, and that resulted in slightly better throttle response and around 5 hp all through the powerband. This is not much, hardly even noticable, but if your just trying to squeeze out a lil bit for almost no money, why not. I also know that several respected japanese tuners, such as HKS, make grounding kits as well. Also, I don't think its fair to view the MB engineers as automotive gods. They dont just go based on sole performance, they also go on looks. Maybe they thought that about 8 larges cables coming from the battery and attaching to places all over the engine didn't look good.

Meh, thats just my 2 cents. BTW, i'm not an engineer or anything, and i do not claim to have any idea how this could actually work, but the dyno results do not lie.