i think that i have been the less lucky person in this forum!! i had two car wrecks... i bought a body kit and they send me the wrong one... my supercharger was damaged... they replaced it....and now i installed my H&R cup kit and know the car shuts down when running and doesnt starts!! i took the car to the dealer and they change the whole ignition system including the keys and i went to get the car and it lasted 8 min before the car went back to the same!!!right now the car is at the dealer and they cant figure out what its the problem! i noticed that when the car shuts down when running the computer show an ESP problem.. something about the stability.. if anyones know here what the problem could be please help me!! ill apprecciate it and the dealer too....

ps.. I have my car since august.... between services.. the car has benn more than 2 months in the dealer.....can i get them to replace my car??? im really dissapointed with my car.....i loce it but i cant use it!!! Thanks....

 

Mercedes are very tempermental cars. People like them, I like them but they are not the most reliable cars. If you want reliabilty get a Lexus or Jaguar. I bought mine in August and it's been in 6 times for 2 different problems but that's way better than past MBs I've owned that were in 12 times in one year, so they are getting better. I just don't understand why anyone in Germany would use them as taxicabs when they are so unreliable.

Best of luck getting it repaired and enjoy that loaner car.

 

haha... a Jaguar has reliability?...my dad's 96 XJ12 have always got the engine idle problem, over heat because the intercooler is too small, and now there is a clunking sound coming from the middle pipe even after we have the whole pipe from head to tail replaced by the dealer.

but still my dad loves that Jag with the V-12. he can do some serious *** whooping in that car against most of the cars.
sadly my dad think its time to replace the Jag with a S-class or 7-series because of the clunking sound from the pipe.

the Jag has been inside the garage for quite some time now. my dad's daily driver becomes a ML430 when he bought it last August

BTW my dad had own both S-class from 86 till 96 when we sold it and 7-series from 86 till when he traded it in for the S-class.

 

I think this one is getting close to qualifiying as a lemon (although I assume that part of the lost two months was for body-work from the accidents, which won't count towards lemonization). Research the laws for your particular state (territory) and call a lawyer if you think you have a case.



BT

 

thats the sad part ... im not counting the extra 3 weeks for the body work....and i have already installed H&R cup kit, cd changer, sub woofer and AMG wheels.. its really dissapointing... i just cant enjoy the car.. i just hope that someone over here knows something about my particular problem...im guessing that its got to be something with the car computer .. but thats just me.. im a computer programmer and i dont know much about cars.....so ill keep just hoping for some knowledge from any forum member... Thanks... God Bless!

PS.... i have already gave the car the LEMON title!!! lol!!

 

I agree with trench. See if you can qualify as a lemon.. 2 months in the dealer is pushing it a little. Sorry to hear that. Good luck.

 

i think that people have problem understanding just what is "unreliable"

for a car being unreliable doesn't mean it has a lot of small problem. unreliable should be major mechanical problem to the engine and transmission.

just ask your self how often do you see a MB or BMW or Audi or VW waiting by the road for help? how often do you see a japanese brand or domestic brand waiting by the road for help?

when people talk about how reliable a japanese car is that is true this few years. and BMW and MB have been reliable cars for over 50 years.

if MB and BMW are unreliable why would there be so many older S, E, 7, 5, 3 ,and 190E running around and where are those reliable japanese cars after a few year.

people like japanese cars not because they are really reliable but because it is less expensive to buy parts to fix the car.

people don't like MB or BMW because their parts are more expensive, so they think MB and BMW are unreliable.

i rather be in a so called "unreliable" MB or BMW than in a reliable toyota or honda because in serious accident MB or BMW are most likely won't get you killed.

 

to me, unreliable means that something's broken. if the moonroof doesn't work, the smart key doesn't work, the alarm goes off, the seat belt won't release - these are all things that i would classify as unreliable b/c i have to get it fixed - spend time doing it. most of the complaints are covered under warranty so i don't think it is a cost issue.

i was reading the merc mag and it talks about the taxi drivers in germany and the mercs they drive.

<b>"I know plenty of Taxi operators who would still buy the old W124 model if they could," he says. "the new one is better in many ways, of course, but it just isn't as strong in everyday cut and thrust of taxi life. After 200,000 km the automatic gearbox is dying and there were electrical problems with the earlier ones, too. You didn't have that with the old car." To underline his point Said, gestures toward a sea of beige Mercedes in his lot. "Among the cars for sale there is an old W124 Estate from 1987 with over one million kilometers and still original."</b>

i think some of this is the "the good old days" syndrome (aka selective memory) but a part of me says that some of the older models were better made than today's mercs. it could also be b/c of the lack of sophisticated electronics, doohickeys, and whizbang thingamajigs. nevertheless, many comparably complex cars like lexus seem to be less prone to these problems.

the other thing that exacerbates the perception of unreliability is of course, the investment made. just the way people are. you spend a dollar on something and it breaks, no big loss. you spend $40,000 and it breaks, you're not happy. it may not be rational, but it is human nature (i'd still rather be capt. kirk than spock... )

 

My guess is this is probably why the older ones were much more reliable. Pretty much the worse environment for electronics and computers is one that's subject to moisture, vibration and extremes in temperature - kind of hard to avoid these in a car.

Cheers, BT

 

thats another thing... i paid 45k on this car and im not that wealthy.. i got a good life but not a life that i can spend 45k plus mods on a car that is going to be on the dealer 25 - 30% of the time, and besides that the own mb dealer mechanics cant figure out the prob! so what can i do???
do i have to call germany?? i think thats their job.. while they are guessing about the prob im loosing 850$ per month without using the car.. its my first mb (my mom have had about 8) and im really dissapointed.. i thought that MB was equal to quality..know i know what a "cheap" new mb means.....

 

MY Jaguar XK8 Convetible has had exelent reliablilty i have had it a year and its never had one problem the only time i bring it to the dealer is for an oil change. maybe the old jags had bad reliablilty but the new ones really turned around.

 

Old Jag and reliability are mutually exclusive terms.

I guess the trade off with today's Jaguar is new Fordish designs for better reliability.

Cheers, BT

 

If you're so concerned about having a daily driver, how about not modding it? It seems like you're only creating problems for yourself, especially if you're getting close to screwing up your warranty. Mods sometimes don't work out for the best, and you have to allow for that. If you can't risk it, then don't.

You do have to admit that the bodykit was a big stretch and that there was a chance of being burned, but hopefully you've learned your lesson and have moved on.

God bless...

 

I had one of the standard bearers for MB reliability- a 123 style Diesel. Despite the possibility of getting 300,000+ miles, there were plenty of things that had to be repaired. Besides, in 1985, the Diesel wagon had a MSRP of $36,000--quite a bit more in inflation adjusted dollars than the $25K 230C. That was the bottom line MB-with PTex seats. There were plenty of things to be taken care of on that car: oil changes every 3000 mi, suspension leveling pump that got replace twice, the rear hatch locking mechanism that was replaced 5 times.

One little Mercedes bonus is the 24/7 phone and road service support. Ten years ago, at 10pm on a very wet stormy night, 200 miles from home, the arm on the driver side wiper came loose, and started to slip. A call to MB help, and the tech told me what to tighten and had me back on the road in minutes.

I expect gliches with electronics and gimmicks, but overall the cars today are more reliable than their predecessors.

 

Big daddy - first of all ..condolences, no body should have to put up with this kind of cr*p for a car this expensive. You deserve much better from Mercedes and i wouldnt let up on them until you get satisfaction. I have a new Mercedes and i am hoping that it turns out to be as reliable as the toyota's and honda's i have driven in the past. There are some who bad mouth japanese car's maybe out of defensiveness of the price/value ratio of their own Mercedes but they are absolutely the standard for reliability not only in not breaking down but in quality of assembly, and fit and finish. If i were stuck in a jam and needed one car that absolutely had to be reliable i would grab the keys for a Toyota or honda first - i would save the mercedes for occasons when others were around

 

OK,

let me try to add some value here. You need to research the lemon law, find yourself a lawyer and get your money back. This is your answer, it will save you headaches.

I have spend tons of time trying to educating people on the the lemon law. Instead of writing everything again, read this thread.

https://mbworld.org/forums/showthrea...eferrerid=1474

Hang in there!

Good luck!

Beth

 

I really get irritated by those first time Mercedes owners who buy the least expensive Mercedes and ***** about the poor quality. I have owned 5 Mercedes and let me tell you there are no problems here. The ML needs some improvements but the E and the CLK are wonderful cars. The problem is people expect $100K car out of there $30-40 Benzs. Eventhough $30-40K is not cheap but it is no S or CL-class. For those who monkey around( modifying) with their cars then accept the consequences. Don't expect Mercedes to solve the problems and the mess you created by f**king around with your car. I get disgusted when I see people turn their Mercedes into a "Pimp" mobile.

JohnAMG

 

Way off... Read E-, ML-, CLK- etc. forums for problems with those. Inoperable smart keys, faulty fuel sensors and seat heaters burning holes through leather are just a few I remember off the top of my head...

What, do you really think that MB intentionally builds unreliable low quality C class cars to encourage people to buy more expensive models instead? Excellent marketing trick to turn first-time byuers into repeat customers! Great logic!

And you obviously missed the point: people DO expect their C Class to be at least as reliable as ~$20K Japanese cars - no less.

 

I agree that JohnAMG is way wrong on the quality issue, and the way the message is delivered is rather boorish, to say the least

In fact, simpler (usually meaning cheaper) cars are FAR more reliable than more expensive and complicated ones. Yes, this is true for Mercedes-Benz too.

Check out the ADAC Pannenstatistik thread from last weekend to see what I mean. As it turns out, the C and E have exactly the same (good) reliability rating in the 2001 ADAC breakdown stats.

Guess what? The C is more reliable than the S. The BMW 3er is WAY more reliable than the 7er. And so on...

I do have some sympathy with part of what he writes though - to modify a car heavily (be it engine systems or even stereo systems) and be upset at Mercedes if there are some problems - that may be related to the modification - is hard to understand.

 

the only mod that i have made to the car perse is the cup kit!! i havnt touched the engine and my supercharger messed up in 4 months!! they had to replace it! ( i post here before about that! my car didnt went past 100mph) and i just cant see why a suspension can mess up the engine or ignition... and besides that we only have one authorized mercedes dealer here and they cant fix the car!! so... again.. what am i suppose to do??

Please anyone here that knows something about the ESP (something about the stability could be related to the suspension) message that the car displays when it shutsdown please reply!

Thanks everyone for your help!

 

First of all.. yes is my first mercedes.. im only 27 and i bought it myself...secondly im not "monkeying" with my car.. i had bought quality aftermarket stuff only... i bought H&R springs and shocks... i bought the shocks cause here members told me that it was the best to do.. i bought AMG wheels...brand authorized by mercedes benz... and remember im young...the c230 its a car targeted for young people.. so its going to be modified....so define pimp mobile... and ill love to see what youre driving...old man!

ps. right now my mom drives an s-500 i can post some pics if you want so....dont talk if you dont know..

 

My experience shows new MBs are much more reliable than past models. My car has only been in 6 times in 9 months compared to a 190 I had that was in 12 times in 12 months. That's a big improvement. As for the previous E class, my parents 1987 caught on fire while driving it on the freeway. Anything short of a fire in the new ones would be an improvement. All I know is I have never owned a reliable MB and that's OK because of loaners, lemon laws and free car washes.

As for the ML, that car was rated the least reliable car by JD Powers the year it came out. MB came out #10 in the JD Powers 5 yr. reliability survey (Jag was #3) and I think the reason it faired as well as it did was because of the loaners and service that must of made people forget about stuff when they did the survey. I can't imagine that MB can be more reliable than a Ford or Honda. And yes, if anything malfunctions in the car and I have to come in late to work to drop the car off then it's a problem. Not little cosmetic problems but check engine lights, radios not working, cruise control not working, tranmission not shifting into reverse, a/c not working and other problems I just don't see in my Honda or Mustang.

One nice thing about MBs is resale value so when you get totally fed up you don't lose your shirt.

 

I've had my 2002 C240 since last August and, not to jinx myself, it has not seen the service department even once. I've had absolutely no problems with it. It's the best car I've ever owned, and I've owned many. It's my first Mercedes, but it meets all my expectations of the M-B marque. For the price, I see very little skimping from the big brother Benz's for features, comfort, quality, etc. So there! :p . And no, nobody paid me for my comments.

Cars are complex machines. Something will invariably go wrong, hopefully, nothing major. Those who complain about tiny inconsequential problems are being unrealistic, IMO.

That's all I have to say, for now

 

Has the dealer actually contacted you and said they can't fix it? MB, like any other car maker, has a standard process for repair escalation. If they can't figure it out and it is under warranty and relatively new, they will most likely offer a replacement. If they don't, this is where lemon law is on your side. A new car that can't be fixed under warranty definitely qualifies as a lemon.

 

i have had many many cars like a porsche, Land rover, Ford, jaguar, lexus and lots of mercedes like 2 E320's and 1 E430, SL500, ML430, and and older 500SL, The cars i have currently are a Jaguar Xk8 Convertible, Ford Mutang GT, and a C230 coupe, i have to say the C230 coupe has been my most reliable car besides my Jaguar i have never had one problem since i had it
which was since october, it has never even been to the dealer once not even for an oil change yet. so i obviously cant complain and who ever said since its the lease expensive mercedes what do u expect thats B.S. If you buy a mercedes it should have the same reliability as any. every single one of my old mercedes had lots of problems the main ones were the windows broke which they did not go up and down in every single one i had except the c coupe not to mention alot of other different problems i had with them all.