chilledbenz

I was just giving an easy round number for an example. High test runs around the $3.50 - $3.80 mark depending on what day..or time of day I should say. Diesel fuel is at $4.25 - $4.50 where I live, so on any given day diesel fuel is a dollar more per gallon, so its not double the price, but its still going to be about an extra $20 depending on the size of the fuel tank. fuzzy math indeed. That being said, those numbers were for a R320 and R350..the thread for the C220 and the numbers on there are looking like 50 - 60 miles per gallon, now that would be an increase worth having and pay itself off in a short period of time. (fixed numbers below)

RLE

<<the thread for the C220 and the numbers on there are looking like 50 - 60 miles per gallon, now that would be an increase worth having and pay itself off in a short period of time.>>

50-60 MPG? Are you kidding? Even a VW diesel has to stretch to make 50. There is no way in hell a 3500 lb car with a 2.2L engine is going to make those kinds of numbers.

BTW, the W211 Bluetec's hwy mileage is in the low to middle 30s. That's first hand knowledge, not some dreamer on the net. And that's only 7-8 mpg better than my C300. Not that I wouldn't have specified that engine in my C300 had MBUSA "allowed" us to buy it. I just like the idea.

chilledbenz

Heres the correct quote "leisurely driving at 60-75mph on motorway: 45-51mpg" I got a bit confoogered after all the numbers they were throwing around. Still a nice size jump in mpg, but I'm with you..still sounds a bit too good, 7-8 is more like it. And 7-8 is going to take a long time to come out ahead.

amdeutsch

Looking at the lowest gas and the highest diesel pricing is fuzzy math. One could just as well look at highest gas and lowest diesel and come up with $0.45 difference. So, lets settle on $0.75 as an average. Now the R320 is 4-matic per MBUSA. Comparing that to the equivalent R350 and you get the following MPG per MBUSA: 18/24 diesel, 15/19 gas. You are now looking at an ~ 20% mpg improvement as well as an ~ 20% cost increase in fuel. Therefore that is a wash. The $1k difference in MSRP will go down as fuel prices will continue to increase. There are also other issues other members will prefer when comparing. Lots more torque with the diesel at the cost of lower hp. Will that make a difference in real world applications. Some say yes, some say no.

ManchesterMerc

I have read your posts with interest and as always there are people that will always get more mpg's than others due to driving style's and other factors such as correct tyre pressures, tyre sizes etc.
If you take MB's official figures then the differential between the Petrol and Diesel version are quite significant. What I have done below is given a comparison based on MB's official average figures for the different cars and based on prices of cars and fuel in the UK. We don't have the C300 but I think ours is badged the C280.

1, C220 CDI= 170 BHP,400nm torque. 53.4-55.3 mpg. 8.5s 0/62mph
Cost in UK £25,025
2, C320 CDI= 224 BHP,510nm torque. 45.58-48 mpg. 6.9s 0/62
Cost in UK £31,240
3, C280 Petrol= 231 BHP,300nm torque. 30.09-30.7 7.2s 0/62
Cost in UK £27,790
4, C350 Petrol= 272 BHP,350nm torque. 28.3-29.1 6.4s 0/62
Cost in UK £33,385

If you take a comparison between the C350 and C320CDI based on fuel costs here at an average of 12000 miles per annum it equates to a saving of £4255 over the 3 year period.

Example

C350 Purchase Price £33385 + 36000 miles @ 28.3 per gallon = 1272 gallons @ £4.82 a gallon = £39516
C320 CDI Purchase Price £31240 + 36000 miles @ 45.58 per gallon = 790 gallons @ £5.09 a gallon = £35261.


I can't quote on depreciaton as I don't know what it would be like in the US but here a Diesel usually would return 7-12% more than the petrol.

amdeutsch

Do the £ figures you quote above include the fact that both cars are similarly equipped. I do know that if you go up in engine size the euqipment level changes. Also, when comparing the C220 you should pick the equivalent 4-cyl gas/petrol engine and not a six for comparison.

ManchesterMerc

As stated in the example those figures are based on the C320CDI which is the 6 cylinder diesel. I Didn't do the 4 cylinder comparison because I don't know if you get the Kompressor engines over in the States.

amdeutsch

Well, we don't get the C320CDI over here either.

ManchesterMerc

I realise that, I was just trying to show a comparison as a few comments on this thread seem to think that there can't be that much difference between a petrol and a diesel.

amdeutsch

Same argument still goes. When you calculated cost figures did you make sure they are equipped the same. I know that the C350 has a different equipment level than the C320CDI.

ManchesterMerc

Our models are specced the same as far as I can see. If I have missed something Please let me know.

amdeutsch

My bad. Was looking at the german price list where it shows the 7-speed tranny as being std on C350 but optional on C320CDI. All I can see on the UK site is some sort of tax that is lower with the CDI.

st13phil

As my C220CDI was in at the dealer's for some warranty work the other day and they loaned me a C200K - the 1.8 compressor engine - overnight, I had the opportunity to do the comparison using real achieved fuel consumption figures driving with the same driver on the same route (not the "official" numbers) for a C220CDI diesel and a C200K petrol.

In the UK, taking spec-for-spec identical cars the C220CDI costs £1,100 more initially than the C200K, diesel costs approx 8% more than petrol per gallon, and our Vehicle Excise Duty (circa £200) that we have to pay annually is approx £40 cheaper for the diesel car than the petrol car. Other running costs - servicing, etc. - are pretty much identical but my analysis did take the differences into account.

Based on these numbers, there is a cost advantage to running the diesel if I drive more than approx 5,000 miles per year, which I do. At 15k miles per year the advantage is in the region of £400 per year, but that is dependent upon the absolute price of fuel. This is one of the reasons why in the UK diesel engines have become more popular year on year and will account for more than 50% of all new car sales in 2008.

For reference, UK fuel prices are approx £5.25 per imperial gallon for diesel, which is equivalent around US$8.50 per US gallon (imperial gallons are 20% larger than US gallons).

ManchesterMerc

The tax will be the road tax {without checking} which from April this year is £400 for cars with co2 emissions of over 225.

RLE

<<Heres the correct quote "leisurely driving at 60-75mph on motorway: 45-51mpg" I got a bit confoogered after all the numbers they were throwing around. Still a nice size jump in mpg, but I'm with you..still sounds a bit too good, 7-8 is more like it. And 7-8 is going to take a long time to come out ahead.>>

That's a little more informative. The term "motorway" is not used in North America except perhaps by the overly precious. I'm guessing that whoever posted those numbers is someplace where imperial gallons are sold. That could account for some of the difference.

It's too bad that some of the posters on this forum are too lazy or secretive to reveal their home country so that when questions like this arise, the numbers make some sense.

chilledbenz

Lol well it didn't help that my math sucks and it was the middle of the night when I read that and tried to type it up. Lesson learned..get sleep then attempt to look smart Ha ha sorry for the confusion.