C-Class gone for Lexus ISF
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 1,662
Likes: 1
From: South Florida
STS,FGT,12C,P85D,M4
you can get a used C63 for low 50's, just like the IS-F..... If you don't care for the performance aspect of the cars, the IS-F is great, it's slow though.... and a dead end for performance upgrades....
yes on HP, no on all other you said. 
looks are personal preference. I actually prefer the IS-F instead of the parrot like pointy front of the C63. $70k C63 vs $50k IS-F. The IS-F is hands down clear cut winner if you want to even use "bang for your buck" to describe the car.
and the Lexus will have higher resale value at the end.
looks are personal preference. I actually prefer the IS-F instead of the parrot like pointy front of the C63. $70k C63 vs $50k IS-F. The IS-F is hands down clear cut winner if you want to even use "bang for your buck" to describe the car.
and the Lexus will have higher resale value at the end.
MBworld Guru
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 22,058
Likes: 18
From: Diamond Bar, CA
W206 PHEV AMG
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,029
Likes: 7
From: Orlando, FL
2026 AMG GT63 Pro
out of curiosity, what are you trying to recover from that exhaust?
and where is it linked in, after the resonator, after the cats...?
thx, chris
good luck with the lex, you'll be back soon!
and where is it linked in, after the resonator, after the cats...?
thx, chris
good luck with the lex, you'll be back soon!
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,029
Likes: 7
From: Orlando, FL
2026 AMG GT63 Pro
makes you wonder what else they tacked on
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,029
Likes: 7
From: Orlando, FL
2026 AMG GT63 Pro
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 2,052
Likes: 1
From: Vancouver, BC
2008 Mercedes C300 4Matic
Anyways, at one point the other day I was considering upgrading to the IS-F as well. For the power/fuel consumption ratio it is just fascinating. Plus it looks gorgeous and the quality is superb. Not hating the MB, in fact if the fuel consumption on the C63 was higher I would considerably think about it.
MBworld Guru
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 22,058
Likes: 18
From: Diamond Bar, CA
W206 PHEV AMG
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,029
Likes: 7
From: Orlando, FL
2026 AMG GT63 Pro
I'm sorry, I can't hold myself back...
Irrespective of the fact that Toyota has a quote on quote reliable product, structurally speaking, Toyota and Lexus are junk in comparison to MB.
Throw that thing up on a rack when you buy it, or any Lexus for that matter, and you'll see what I'm talking about...bolts sticking out 2 inches from the sheet-metal, Toyota part stamps everywhere...
I'm sorry but you are buying the Lexus brand name and nothing more...
If I had 50K and I wanted something spirited to drive, not only would it never be a Lexus because it's a Lexus, but I wouldn't choose Lexus because I wouldn't trust it in a serious collision.
That is not to say that a Mercedes is impenetrable, but you sure as hell have a much greater chance of surviving if driving quicker is what you are looking to do. Government mandated tests are for a MAXIMUM closing speed of 40 mph...how often do people get in crashes in a school zone where both vehicles are traveling 20mph?
At the end of the day, physics doesn't care how pretty your vehicle is in a collision - it does despise however, a structure that properly diffuses and diverts energy away from the occupants.
Seems as if the consumer's historical tendency to place emphasis on safety has changed in recent years...
Irrespective of the fact that Toyota has a quote on quote reliable product, structurally speaking, Toyota and Lexus are junk in comparison to MB.
Throw that thing up on a rack when you buy it, or any Lexus for that matter, and you'll see what I'm talking about...bolts sticking out 2 inches from the sheet-metal, Toyota part stamps everywhere...
I'm sorry but you are buying the Lexus brand name and nothing more...
If I had 50K and I wanted something spirited to drive, not only would it never be a Lexus because it's a Lexus, but I wouldn't choose Lexus because I wouldn't trust it in a serious collision.
That is not to say that a Mercedes is impenetrable, but you sure as hell have a much greater chance of surviving if driving quicker is what you are looking to do. Government mandated tests are for a MAXIMUM closing speed of 40 mph...how often do people get in crashes in a school zone where both vehicles are traveling 20mph?
At the end of the day, physics doesn't care how pretty your vehicle is in a collision - it does despise however, a structure that properly diffuses and diverts energy away from the occupants.
Seems as if the consumer's historical tendency to place emphasis on safety has changed in recent years...
MB World Stories
The Best of Mercedes & AMG
6 Mercedes Models That Did NOT Age Well (But Are Somehow Still Cool)
Verdad Gallardo
Manual Mercedes? 6 Times Sindelfingen Let Drivers Have All The Fun
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes SLR McLaren 722 S Is Extremely Rare Example Modified by McLaren
Verdad Gallardo
8 Classic Boxy Mercedes Designs That Have Aged Like Fine Wine
Verdad Gallardo
Flawlessly Restored Mercedes 190E Evo II Heads to Auction
Verdad Gallardo
Electric Mercedes C-Class Unveiled: 11 Things You Need to Know
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes EQS Gets A Major Update: Everything You Need to Know
Verdad Gallardo
5 Underrated Mercedes-Benz Models That Don't Get the Love They Deserve
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes 300D Has Pushed Well Past 1 Million Miles and It Ain't Stopping
Verdad Gallardo
MBworld Guru
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 22,058
Likes: 18
From: Diamond Bar, CA
W206 PHEV AMG
I'm sorry, I can't hold myself back...
Irrespective of the fact that Toyota has a quote on quote reliable product, structurally speaking, Toyota and Lexus are junk in comparison to MB.
Throw that thing up on a rack when you buy it, or any Lexus for that matter, and you'll see what I'm talking about...bolts sticking out 2 inches from the sheet-metal, Toyota part stamps everywhere...
I'm sorry but you are buying the Lexus brand name and nothing more...
If I had 50K and I wanted something spirited to drive, not only would it never be a Lexus because it's a Lexus, but I wouldn't choose Lexus because I wouldn't trust it in a serious collision.
That is not to say that a Mercedes is impenetrable, but you sure as hell have a much greater chance of surviving if driving quicker is what you are looking to do. Government mandated tests are for a MAXIMUM closing speed of 40 mph...how often do people get in crashes in a school zone where both vehicles are traveling 20mph?
At the end of the day, physics doesn't care how pretty your vehicle is in a collision - it does despise however, a structure that properly diffuses and diverts energy away from the occupants.
Seems as if the consumer's historical tendency to place emphasis on safety has changed in recent years...
Irrespective of the fact that Toyota has a quote on quote reliable product, structurally speaking, Toyota and Lexus are junk in comparison to MB.
Throw that thing up on a rack when you buy it, or any Lexus for that matter, and you'll see what I'm talking about...bolts sticking out 2 inches from the sheet-metal, Toyota part stamps everywhere...
I'm sorry but you are buying the Lexus brand name and nothing more...
If I had 50K and I wanted something spirited to drive, not only would it never be a Lexus because it's a Lexus, but I wouldn't choose Lexus because I wouldn't trust it in a serious collision.
That is not to say that a Mercedes is impenetrable, but you sure as hell have a much greater chance of surviving if driving quicker is what you are looking to do. Government mandated tests are for a MAXIMUM closing speed of 40 mph...how often do people get in crashes in a school zone where both vehicles are traveling 20mph?
At the end of the day, physics doesn't care how pretty your vehicle is in a collision - it does despise however, a structure that properly diffuses and diverts energy away from the occupants.
Seems as if the consumer's historical tendency to place emphasis on safety has changed in recent years...
IIHS test
http://www.iihs.org/ratings/rating.aspx?id=614
http://www.iihs.org/ratings/rating.aspx?id=915
Euro NCAP
http://www.euroncap.com/tests/merced..._2007/308.aspx
http://www.euroncap.com/tests/lexus_is_2006/271.aspx
as much as I love the German engineered cars always feels more solid and more fun to drive, I cannot agree with you on what you said in the above post. After having a chance to drive the IS350 with the F-sport (basically TRD products) performance parts and also the GS460. It changed my mind on how Toyota/Lexus always perform although at the end of the day I'd still prefer BMW or MB and I'm one of those that used to joke about "it's still a Toyota" guy.BUT with the IS-F, M3, and C63. my ranking's actually M3>IS-F>C63 for oeverall performance and IS-F>M3>C63 in value. Keep in mind that Toyota are now pretty dedicated to the Lexus brand which even in Japan that used to be without the Lexus brand are separated as Toyota or Lexus as well. The previous shared name plates models are all gone from the Toyota line-up as well.
Last edited by FrankW; Apr 27, 2009 at 12:43 AM.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,073
Likes: 85
From: San Francisco, CA
2017 E300
wow id never imagined seeing so many pro lexus guys on here. My family has owned three lexus vehicles, and currently still drive two of them: IS300 and RX330. active member on clublexus.com 
and yes wwmindy, you have a dated opinion on lexus vehicles. they are on par on styling (just about, maybe a dash lower), and on par with technology and safety.
toyota stamps everywhere? who cares? whats wrong with toyota parts? instead of looking at it as cheap toyota products on lexus cars, look at it as durable/reliable/just as good for toyota vehicles.
also, regarding the ISF, the exhausts arent connected for a reason. i mean how hard would it be to connect them? there must be a reason or else farrari wouldnt have done the same thing with the california.
and yes wwmindy, you have a dated opinion on lexus vehicles. they are on par on styling (just about, maybe a dash lower), and on par with technology and safety.
toyota stamps everywhere? who cares? whats wrong with toyota parts? instead of looking at it as cheap toyota products on lexus cars, look at it as durable/reliable/just as good for toyota vehicles.
also, regarding the ISF, the exhausts arent connected for a reason. i mean how hard would it be to connect them? there must be a reason or else farrari wouldnt have done the same thing with the california.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 3,809
Likes: 4
From: Chino Hills, CA
Mercedes C300 Sport, BMW 745Li, VW Mk6 Golf TDI
Ok, back on target. Here are pics of Kurt's new ISF he asked me to take and post for him. If I have time, I'll go back and photoshop clean up the images.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 3,809
Likes: 4
From: Chino Hills, CA
Mercedes C300 Sport, BMW 745Li, VW Mk6 Golf TDI
Super Member
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 593
Likes: 17
From: Orange County
2019 AMG C43
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,029
Likes: 7
From: Orlando, FL
2026 AMG GT63 Pro
I will concede on the styling / technology claims, but definitely won't on the safety aspects, sorry.
How can you say that Lexus is AS safe, or safER than a benz?
Pretty positive that all of their safety equipment is not on the same par as ours. And let's not forget that every manufacturers standard safety features came out of the MB R&D Lab - Deformation zones, crash boxes, esp, abs, airbags, seat belt tensioners and pre-tensioners, pre-safe, brake assist etc...
Even BMW doesn't run the digital Bosch sensors that we have in our cars.
That's all I'm going to say, I'm not here to stir up the dust or knock someone on their purchase or manufacturer, to each their own!
I guess we will just have to agree to disagree, and hope that none of us ever has to test the real world crash performance of either!
Best,
Chris
How can you say that Lexus is AS safe, or safER than a benz?
Pretty positive that all of their safety equipment is not on the same par as ours. And let's not forget that every manufacturers standard safety features came out of the MB R&D Lab - Deformation zones, crash boxes, esp, abs, airbags, seat belt tensioners and pre-tensioners, pre-safe, brake assist etc...
Even BMW doesn't run the digital Bosch sensors that we have in our cars.
That's all I'm going to say, I'm not here to stir up the dust or knock someone on their purchase or manufacturer, to each their own!
I guess we will just have to agree to disagree, and hope that none of us ever has to test the real world crash performance of either!
Best,
Chris
MBworld Guru
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 22,058
Likes: 18
From: Diamond Bar, CA
W206 PHEV AMG
I will concede on the styling / technology claims, but definitely won't on the safety aspects, sorry.
How can you say that Lexus is AS safe, or safER than a benz?
Pretty positive that all of their safety equipment is not on the same par as ours. And let's not forget that every manufacturers standard safety features came out of the MB R&D Lab - Deformation zones, crash boxes, esp, abs, airbags, seat belt tensioners and pre-tensioners, pre-safe, brake assist etc...
Even BMW doesn't run the digital Bosch sensors that we have in our cars.
That's all I'm going to say, I'm not here to stir up the dust or knock someone on their purchase or manufacturer, to each their own!
I guess we will just have to agree to disagree, and hope that none of us ever has to test the real world crash performance of either!
Best,
Chris
How can you say that Lexus is AS safe, or safER than a benz?
Pretty positive that all of their safety equipment is not on the same par as ours. And let's not forget that every manufacturers standard safety features came out of the MB R&D Lab - Deformation zones, crash boxes, esp, abs, airbags, seat belt tensioners and pre-tensioners, pre-safe, brake assist etc...
Even BMW doesn't run the digital Bosch sensors that we have in our cars.
That's all I'm going to say, I'm not here to stir up the dust or knock someone on their purchase or manufacturer, to each their own!
I guess we will just have to agree to disagree, and hope that none of us ever has to test the real world crash performance of either!
Best,
Chris
the link above already showed you on crash test ratings from US and from Europe. we're not talking about who invented what. we're talking about protecting it's occupants. basing occupant safety on brand name is not a very smart move.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,029
Likes: 7
From: Orlando, FL
2026 AMG GT63 Pro
on a serious note, i don't think it's a topic you can agree to disagree on since the facts are there to prove different. if it's the matter of opinion on how the car looks and performs as well as design then yes. if you go around parading about safety of the MB and disowning it's rivals they'll pretty much tell you the same thing i'm telling you. It's the 2009, not 1989 when MB still leads the world in safety for it's occupants. manufacturers around the world have learned much from it.
the link above already showed you on crash test ratings from US and from Europe. we're not talking about who invented what. we're talking about protecting it's occupants. basing occupant safety on brand name is not a very smart move.
the link above already showed you on crash test ratings from US and from Europe. we're not talking about who invented what. we're talking about protecting it's occupants. basing occupant safety on brand name is not a very smart move.
Lexus has the most beautifully designed product on the market, the quality is second to none - almost like it's hand built - the technology puts Apple and IBM to shame, and in terms of crash worthiness, they are built stronger than an Abrams tank!
Hail the Lexus engineers!
End of transmission.
MBworld Guru
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 22,058
Likes: 18
From: Diamond Bar, CA
W206 PHEV AMG
Let's see if your d1ck get's bigger - you're right!
Lexus has the most beautifully designed product on the market, the quality is second to none - almost like it's hand built - the technology puts Apple and IBM to shame, and in terms of crash worthiness, they are built stronger than an Abrams tank!
Hail the Lexus engineers!
End of transmission.
Lexus has the most beautifully designed product on the market, the quality is second to none - almost like it's hand built - the technology puts Apple and IBM to shame, and in terms of crash worthiness, they are built stronger than an Abrams tank!
Hail the Lexus engineers!
End of transmission.
you're welcome.
your quote in the signature sure is ironic to your opinion on lexus vs mb safety.
Last edited by FrankW; Apr 27, 2009 at 09:25 AM.
Member
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 207
Likes: 0
From: Finland
E92 335i
I bought a black Lexus ISF tonight with White interior and white carbon fiber accents. Fully loaded with Nav ETC. I leased my C300 and have to turn it in but before I do I want to sell a few parts and want to see if anyone is interested. Brabus 3 piece spoiler, Brabus mirror covers, Meisterschaft GT exhaust with 65 oval tips, H@R springs, 19 inch MAYA MRS rims with tires!! Anyone interested?! let me know because the ISF beast comes in tomorrow!
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,073
Likes: 85
From: San Francisco, CA
2017 E300
i would like to note that while we do give credit to MB for inventing seat belts, air bags, ESP, its not like they are only found on MB cars. it was big of them to share that technology with the people, and so now we live in a world where KIAs and Hyundais can protect their occupants just as well as an MB.
---------------------------
second picture of the ISF definately isnt flattering. the nose looks soo plumped up.
---------------------------
second picture of the ISF definately isnt flattering. the nose looks soo plumped up.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,029
Likes: 7
From: Orlando, FL
2026 AMG GT63 Pro
BTW, since you feel it necessary to be childish, nice teddy bear in your window...Must look real cute with all your manly mods - I guess we must find equilibrium somewhere.
And I don't know why you typed you're welcome - I never said thank you.
Last edited by AMGTTV8; Apr 27, 2009 at 02:49 PM.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,029
Likes: 7
From: Orlando, FL
2026 AMG GT63 Pro
i would like to note that while we do give credit to MB for inventing seat belts, air bags, ESP, its not like they are only found on MB cars. it was big of them to share that technology with the people, and so now we live in a world where KIAs and Hyundais can protect their occupants just as well as an MB.
And I agree, the sharing of technology has narrowed the gap, but the keyword is narrowed. As of right now, they are not on par.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,029
Likes: 7
From: Orlando, FL
2026 AMG GT63 Pro
To reiterate, just like BMW vs Mercedes - is BMW's rear-view mirror designed to break off during a collision to avoid any extraneous impact to the occupants head? No
Does BMW run digital wheels slip sensors that detect any variance in wheel speed @ 100x's / second? No, they run analog sensors that only detect wheel slip 20-30x's / second depending on the model.
Does that make a big difference? I don't know, I haven't been in the situation yet, but I'd be willing to bet that at 70mph, that extra accuracy and sensitivity will help me be able to marginally better-avoid an obstacle, while maintaining control
It's those little things that make a big difference in a crash above government standards.
I never said that Lexus was a horrible car, I said it wasn't as safe.
Does BMW run digital wheels slip sensors that detect any variance in wheel speed @ 100x's / second? No, they run analog sensors that only detect wheel slip 20-30x's / second depending on the model.
Does that make a big difference? I don't know, I haven't been in the situation yet, but I'd be willing to bet that at 70mph, that extra accuracy and sensitivity will help me be able to marginally better-avoid an obstacle, while maintaining control
It's those little things that make a big difference in a crash above government standards.
I never said that Lexus was a horrible car, I said it wasn't as safe.
Last edited by AMGTTV8; Apr 27, 2009 at 12:44 PM.
