mistersir

Hi.

I'm currently contemplating a new car. I've narrowed it down to either the 2010 C300 or 2010 Audi A4.

One question I had was how does the C300 RWD handle in snow with snow tires? I live in Canada so this is important to me. I currently drive a 2003 A4 quattro and it handles like a champ with all-seasons on. I don't really want to get the 4Matic because I don't want the automatic transmission.

I've had experience with RWD's before. The BMW 3-series was ok. The Lexus IS300 was absolute garbage in the snow.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

eminnet

Go for 1.quatro or 2.4matic.

jstaneff

Buy the C and keep your old A4 as a snow-car/beater. That way you have the advantages of both, and you can have a cool manual setup with the C300.

Sportstick

Personal experience here! My 2009 C300 rwd 6 speed was awful in the snow when I first received it. Then, I got Blizzak WS60 tires, which are their most aggressive tire for places where actual studs are not permitted, and the car was transformed. It sliced through snow and ice, up and down some of the hilly areas we have in southeast Michigan. We also have a E350 4MATIC, which obviously has an edge, but its nowhere near the difference I would have thought with these tires aboard.

If you want the maximum possible snow capability, 4MATIC with Blizzaks is the answer, but I wanted the reduced weight, overall feel, and manual trans which only came with rwd, for the rest of the year, and I did just fine last winter once the Blizzaks arrived.

BTW, my sig shows a Jeep, which was mostly for our boat and dogs and the occasional ridiculous blizzard with uncleared roads when I wouldn't take out any car!

mistersir

Thanks. So with the Blizzaks, have you had any issues going up a hill? I don't want to be one of those people that holds up traffic behind me because I can't get up the hill.

Sportstick

I have not, but I am sure at some degree of elevation, eventually I would. I haven't tried to climb Whistler, but I must admit to being more than delighted with the Blizzak WS60 here in SE Michigan (Blizzaks are offered in different models, so choose carefully.) Keep in mind rwd has a relative advantage over fwd going up a hill, as weight transfer unloads the front wheels and loads the rear. Eventually, though, gravity will always win.

Again, rwd is not the same as 4MATIC for low traction surfaces, but given the lack of bad experiences by using Blizzak WS60s, I would not sacrifice the rest of the year for this issue.

mistersir

Hmmm, thanks. I'm definitely considering the C300 now. I'm in Toronto so we get very good snow removal relatively quickly after a snowstorm. I've been a bit shy of getting a RWD car after my experience with the Lexus IS300.

vcruiser

i'd get a 4matic if i were you

Sportstick

If you make the leap, welcome aboard!! Whatever you get, stay off the 401 from London to Windsor in the snow...not even the 18 wheelers survive Damnation Alley over there!

As for the Lexus, I would be most suspicious of the tires, rather than the rest of the car.

Sportstick

Maybe if it came with a stick, I'd agree...but that's an awful lot of fun to give up all year when "good enough" in the snow could be good enough...

FraKctured

I white-knuckled it through quite a few Michigan winters with a RWD C230, with good snow tires and a few sandbags in the back. It was generally ok for light snow, but in any really bad weather, or on hills, it was scary.
My wife drove it once in some moderately bad weather, and she came home freaked out saying "I cannot believe you've been driving in the winter with that all these years." [She drives an ML320, which is great in the snow and ice.] She said "I really think you need to get a 4Matic this year."
I traded it in on a 4Matic, and am very happy I did. Last year, the 4Matic and the ESP allowed me to speed ahead on ice covered roads to avoid a pileup I saw heading my way in the rear-view mirror. All I got was a scratch on the corner of my bumper as the lead car bounced off the rail and just barely nicked me. Another 1/2 second, and I would have avoided it completely. Had I been in the RWD, I would have gotten creamed.

Yea, there are some tradeoffs with the 4Matic, but if you live in a heavy snow area like Toronto (I'm from Windsor originally) and you want to drive it as your daily driver year round, I think the 4Matic is not optional.

Sportstick

Well, like with most things on this forum, there are a variety of opinions. But, just two thoughts:

- The rwd W204 also has ESP
- There may be quite a difference between "good snow tires" and what are probably the best snow tires ever made...Blizzaks WS60

The single most important variable is the tire contact with the ground (compound, tread) enhanced by prevention of slippage (ESP), versus how many wheels are driven.

mistersir

In worst case scenarios (ie. crazy snowfall), I'll just take my wife's X3. On another note, I'm assuming you got winter wheels/tire package. Did you have to install tire pressure monitor sensors in your winter wheel package?

Sportstick

I probably did not have to, although I would have faced a TPMS warning in the cluster all winter. But, I bought these tires (and a few other sets for other purposes/vehicles) through tirerack.com . The wheels and tires were mounted and balanced with TPMS sensors already installed before shipping. Upon receipt at one of their authorized local installers, it was just show up, jack the car, and they installed!

mistersir

Good stuff. Thanks again for your help!

eminnet

Master (and inventor) of 4 weel drive is ......?

Peabody

I've driven a stick my whole life (though I've rented/borrowed dozens of automatics), and I finally gave it up for a C350.. and I'm really impressed with the performance of their automatic. There's some things to nitpick about it, but I would test drive the 4matic before writing it off completely.

Krytech

I live in Minnesota which gets it's fair share of snow and slush for a good 5 months of the year, and I have no regrets with my RWD C350 with Blizzak snow tires. And coming from an AWD SUV, I have been pleasantly surprised by how well the car handles in the snow.

Sportstick

Peabody, I agree with everything you said, although I am not ready to give up on the stick (not sure I ever will be...the Peter Pan syndrome, I guess. ) But, the 4MATIC and auto trans are an excellent combination, as we experience in my wife's E350. If our new friend in Ontario wanted an automatic, the question would be easily answered. I'm just trying to reassure him that if he truly still wants the stick, he need not give up on his preference nor worry about being stranded in winter if he properly equips a rwd car.

InTheBenz0

Who wins in the winter?

C300 4matic with all-seasons

C300 RWD with snow tires

Sportstick

The question is a bit non-specific as I would like to know which tires....really great A/S and low quality snows?

Assuming best all season and best snows.....rwd with best snows wins. The best all seasons don't handle freezing temperatures, snow, and ice well enough to challenge Blizzaks....I have them both. It doesn't matter if 4 wheels are spinning if the traction at each/all is mediocre.

Peabody

I haven't given up on the stick.. I'm looking for a vintage SL55 manual for a new weekend car. I'm just saying the automatic 4matic could be a fun daily driver year round.

Peabody

I live in Germany and I've got a C350 RWD with all-seasons so I'm going to see how that goes. If it gets hairy I'll either rent chains or swap on some snow tires + rims from the dealership about a mile from my house.

vpdfan

Hey Sportstick:

I am also in the SE Michigan area and have a C350 RWD. It sounds like you answered my questions on your choice of tire. My other question is what size rims and tires are you running? I have the 18" AMGs and am thinking of getting a bolt-on winter set with seperate rims in 17" with 225/45/17. What are you running?

Krytech

That's what I do. I have a set of 18's for the summer and in the winter I put back on my stock 17" wheels with my Blizzak LM-25 tires sized at 225/24/17 all around. The narrower rear tire gives me a slightly smaller contact patch for better snow/ice traction. (more weight per sq. inch) Plus I can rotate my tires too for more even wear.