ECU Tune
Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 402
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C350
Right, but without dyno numbers I'd take any HP claims with a heaping tablespoon of salt. Especially when saying other companies have "pathetic" tunes. Reality is that nobody really knows who is making more power now.
Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 402
Likes: 6
C350
For a C300 its probably worth the risk, but you gotta remember that there are people with c350's here as well. Making 310hp vs 330hp is a big big difference for them.
Super Member
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 670
Likes: 7
From: Alberta
2014 E63 AMG S
They are claiming 330hp on their m276 page on their website. IIRC OE claims 315 (and different number for various models of m276) I don't doubt that its substantially more for the c300, but without a dyno its just a guess. HP claims without dynos should always be taken skeptically. It not like we're even seeing time slips, etc.
For a C300 its probably worth the risk, but you gotta remember that there are people with c350's here as well. Making 310hp vs 330hp is a big big difference for them.
For a C300 its probably worth the risk, but you gotta remember that there are people with c350's here as well. Making 310hp vs 330hp is a big big difference for them.
https://oetuning.com/oe-tuning-produ...0-3-5-gdi.html
vs.
https://oetuning.com/oe-tuning-produ...0-3-5-gdi.html
OE tuning has two tunes. One for the C350 M276, One for the C300 M276. They only tune to 271hp for the C300 M276.
Member
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 203
Likes: 0
From: Bellevue, WA
'08 C350 Sport
For M272, I would think all the tuners out there would have the same tune, output performance? No? For example, I can go to Kleeman and get an ECU tune, then Eurocharged can read the tune file from my ECU, decode it and tune the same way...
If the above is true, couldn't it be the same case with M276, i.e. all tuners will have same performance/output?
If the above is true, couldn't it be the same case with M276, i.e. all tuners will have same performance/output?
Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 402
Likes: 6
C350
For M272, I would think all the tuners out there would have the same tune, output performance? No? For example, I can go to Kleeman and get an ECU tune, then Eurocharged can read the tune file from my ECU, decode it and tune the same way...
If the above is true, couldn't it be the same case with M276, i.e. all tuners will have same performance/output?
If the above is true, couldn't it be the same case with M276, i.e. all tuners will have same performance/output?
If someone really is taking a dump of someone else's tune and reselling it, I'm sure you're have some very angry legal letters flying aorund.
Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 402
Likes: 6
C350
The reason I said "pathetic" was because of this:
https://oetuning.com/oe-tuning-produ...0-3-5-gdi.html
vs.
https://oetuning.com/oe-tuning-produ...0-3-5-gdi.html
OE tuning has two tunes. One for the C350 M276, One for the C300 M276. They only tune to 271hp for the C300 M276.
https://oetuning.com/oe-tuning-produ...0-3-5-gdi.html
vs.
https://oetuning.com/oe-tuning-produ...0-3-5-gdi.html
OE tuning has two tunes. One for the C350 M276, One for the C300 M276. They only tune to 271hp for the C300 M276.
Super Member
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 670
Likes: 7
From: Alberta
2014 E63 AMG S
It would make no sense if they used RWD and 4matic vehicles at random for benchmarks, as both the C350 and C300 are available in RWD. Cory @ Kleeman confirmed that the engines are 100% mechanically identical, while OE responded to me with "We haven't looked into it". If credibility is in question, I would trust Kleeman. 25 years of exclusive MB tuning vs. OE tuning with a handful of years tuning 20+ makes.
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SPONSOR
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 5,745
Likes: 134
From: Santa Ana, CA
OE Tuning C63 AMG
Just to be clear, there are differences between both 3.5L varients found in the 300 and 350 badged models.
We have updated tunes available to suit both with higher output. Our website claims are very conservative.
We welcome 1 local Southern Californian forum member to come and evaluate our products. Please email sales@oetuning.com directly if you are local and would like to know more.
We have updated tunes available to suit both with higher output. Our website claims are very conservative.
We welcome 1 local Southern Californian forum member to come and evaluate our products. Please email sales@oetuning.com directly if you are local and would like to know more.
Super Member
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 670
Likes: 7
From: Alberta
2014 E63 AMG S
Except this engine has been on the market for 3 years and no one has given any evidence either way. Kleeman claims that the engines are exactly the same, and both Kleeman and a forum member have stated that tuned C300s are pulling on stock C350s and E350s. I'm not fighting for one side or the other, but I'm getting tired of baseless claims on this engine. The only thing close to evidence that we have is that tuned 300s are pulling on their 350 rivals.
Super Member
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 929
Likes: 51
From: Silicon Valley, California
Factory ordered 2012 MB C350 w/Dynamic Handling Package
@JaredP
I'm positive you'll still enjoy the tune regardless, but my primary skepticism I have with the Kleeman tune is they claim the same gains on all M276 platforms regardless of drive train, intake, header & exhaust combinations.
I'm positive you'll still enjoy the tune regardless, but my primary skepticism I have with the Kleeman tune is they claim the same gains on all M276 platforms regardless of drive train, intake, header & exhaust combinations.
Super Member
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 670
Likes: 7
From: Alberta
2014 E63 AMG S
The measurements must be made from the crank, and I'm willing to bet the headers are the same on all M276 engines. Nothing past headers will make a huge difference on power on a NA engine anyways.
This is all really confusing, I half-expected someone with ACTUAL knowledge on the situation to share by this point in the engine's life.
EDIT: And OE has a 54hp difference between the tuned 300 and 350. Assuming both RWD or both measured at the crank, NO difference in exhaust can make 54hp.
This is all really confusing, I half-expected someone with ACTUAL knowledge on the situation to share by this point in the engine's life.
EDIT: And OE has a 54hp difference between the tuned 300 and 350. Assuming both RWD or both measured at the crank, NO difference in exhaust can make 54hp.
Last edited by JaredP; May 7, 2014 at 04:04 PM.
Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 402
Likes: 6
C350
Exactly. Even if the engine is exactly the same there are other variables at work that may lead to different power output. Claiming everything is the same is a big red flag for me as well without dynos to prove it.
Junior Member
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 32
Likes: 2
2022 EQS 450+ until my 580 comes in
Kleemann's M276 tune is not subtle on the C300. It makes a huge difference in performance, and subjectively speaking, their estimates are in the right ballpark. It's definitely putting out over 300 hp, whether its 310 or 330 or somewhere in between, I can't say.
Junior Member
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 32
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2022 EQS 450+ until my 580 comes in
Super Member
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 670
Likes: 7
From: Alberta
2014 E63 AMG S
I wouldn't expect an answer. I've asked on several occassions and they continue to ignore me.
In this thread, they respond to me about the existence of an M276 tune, but then ignore my question about why they have two tunes for the same engine, while continuing to answer questions from others:
https://mbworld.org/forums/c-class-w...ml#post5687634
Then in an email, OE tuning states they have no idea what the differences in the engines are, even though they have had a tune out for them for over a year!
Hi Jared,
There is allot of misinformation floating around about the differences between the 300 and 350 M276. These are a GDi or "Gasoline Direct Injection" powerplant. Some guys say the engines are the same. I do not believe the power difference would be so from tuning alone. Most likely different throttle body sizes and exhaust setups. This has been the case in the past. Without first comparing all hardware, it is too hard to say. Perhaps dynoing cars on the same day, same dyno logging airflow, etc, would give better conclusions. Results we have seen are good solid gains that the customers are happy with. Hopefully we will have information after further testing.
Regards,
There is allot of misinformation floating around about the differences between the 300 and 350 M276. These are a GDi or "Gasoline Direct Injection" powerplant. Some guys say the engines are the same. I do not believe the power difference would be so from tuning alone. Most likely different throttle body sizes and exhaust setups. This has been the case in the past. Without first comparing all hardware, it is too hard to say. Perhaps dynoing cars on the same day, same dyno logging airflow, etc, would give better conclusions. Results we have seen are good solid gains that the customers are happy with. Hopefully we will have information after further testing.
Regards,
SPONSOR
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 5,745
Likes: 134
From: Santa Ana, CA
OE Tuning C63 AMG
I wouldn't expect an answer. I've asked on several occassions and they continue to ignore me.
In this thread, they respond to me about the existence of an M276 tune, but then ignore my question about why they have two tunes for the same engine, while continuing to answer questions from others:
https://mbworld.org/forums/c-class-w...ml#post5687634
Then in an email, OE tuning states they have no idea what the differences in the engines are, even though they have had a tune out for them for over a year!
Shouldn't tuning companies know the engines they are working on? Sounds like OE is pushing "One size fits all" engine tunes out the door as quick as they can, with little regard to the engine they are tuning.
In this thread, they respond to me about the existence of an M276 tune, but then ignore my question about why they have two tunes for the same engine, while continuing to answer questions from others:
https://mbworld.org/forums/c-class-w...ml#post5687634
Then in an email, OE tuning states they have no idea what the differences in the engines are, even though they have had a tune out for them for over a year!
Shouldn't tuning companies know the engines they are working on? Sounds like OE is pushing "One size fits all" engine tunes out the door as quick as they can, with little regard to the engine they are tuning.
We have also offered local owners who own a 3.5L GDi, 300 and 350 to show unbiased test results. Does any other company offer this to dispel any rumors either way? We will not be commenting publicly anymore about this subject.
If you would like your vehicle to be a part of this test, please only contact us directly via email sales@oetuning.com or call 818-574-5075.
Junior Member
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 32
Likes: 2
2022 EQS 450+ until my 580 comes in
From my VIN decode:
M276 V6-GASOLINE ENGINE M276
M013 ENGINE REDUCED PERFORMANCE
This is just circumstantial evidence, but it sounds to me like a factory software detune as opposed to a mechanical difference.
