Originally Posted by macct

It seems a number of posters have cars on order and I am curious on how you got comfortable with ordering the car without driving it. Is it based on past experience with MB? Did you come from a W205 C300 or 400 already? Did you consider the C63?

At this point, I am interested in the C63, C450 amg and Porsche Macan. I already have an order in for BMW M3 with my long time dealer, but they have't been able to secure an allocation. Given that, I started looking elsewhere and the list is now down to the 3 vehicles mentioned above.

C63 - I had a short test drive and the car was amazing. It was a nice balance, being more heavily waited to sport than luxury. This is by the most comparable to the M3. It was hard to guage ride quality on such a short test drive, though. I a not sure if the ride would be fatiguing over time.

C450 - seems to be a nice balance between sport and luxury from what I read. I am not sure if the added awd will reduce the fun factor. I know I would like something more engaging than the C300 sport and 335i M version. In terms of aesthetics, I am also not sure I am sold on the grill or wheel options for this version.

Macan - I thought is was more fun than a 435. Power delivery was great and the handing was surprisingly entertaining for the weight and height of the vehicle. The interior was also very sharp. The Macan maybe a bit too polished for me, though, being very quiet and less visceral than the M3 and C63.

So after a very wordy post, what motivated you to the C450? What other cars did you compare it to? Thank you

Originally Posted by Vipershade

Roger that... but next time, don't be so disparaging towards the rocks

Originally Posted by oldman&theC

Like I said always has to get the last word but has nothing useful to say.He sounds like a teenager whose Daddy bought him a car for graduation.I guess having a C450 on order disqualifies us from commenting.I guess the facts you & I have mentioned in many posts don't count unless he doesn't read any posts except his own.

Originally Posted by rbrylaw

I'm not getting a C450, but given it's really a C400 with about 20 extra horses, why not go test drive a C400? Chances are the few extra pony's won't be a significant difference.

Originally Posted by floridadriver

Not really. I'd wait til they come out and you can test them and pick what you like. The C400 was a short attempt throw throw larger engine in a C300 with the only other consideration for the weight was brakes. C450 and C63 share more in common than c450 to the c400. All still a nice luxury sedan with a killer interior. Hard to lose unless you really wanted a "sports car" but the family needed a sedan.

Originally Posted by c4004matic

Moot point the C400 is not available anymore, unless you find a rare unsold one lying somewhere. I visited 5 dealers in the MN/WI/Chicago area before I got to test drive one, by then I had already ordered one and did it just for the hell of it.
If you want a 6cylinder biturbo C class the C450 is what you are going to get. Any arguments on if it is worth waiting for or not are done.
If you do find that lonely c400 sitting somewhere you may consider it since now its going on fire sale, it will be a 98.9% C450 for hopefully 10K or more less.

Originally Posted by floridadriver

You have a C400 and think it's the bomb..no excuse for some of your posts here. If a new EmT suspension, rear bias, AMG tuning, and multiple other tweaks are 98.9% you should brush also up on your math.

Originally Posted by floridadriver

Not really. I'd wait til they come out and you can test them and pick what you like. The C400 was a short attempt throw throw larger engine in a C300 with the only other consideration for the weight was brakes. C450 and C63 share more in common than c450 to the c400. All still a nice luxury sedan with a killer interior. Hard to lose unless you really wanted a "sports car" but the family needed a sedan.

Originally Posted by rbrylaw

You're right and I shouldn't have categorized the C450 simply as a C400 with some more ponies. My thought was (and now I know better) that if he could get his hands on a 400 to drive, it would likely give him some sense of the 450 as the 450 has to be even nicer.

I've remained quiet since I posted my thought as:

1. I've never driven, or even sat in a C400
2. I can't afford one anyway
3. Until this thread, I wasn't aware of the significant changes coming in the 450

Thanks

Originally Posted by c4004matic

Exactly.
NO one is taking pot shots at the 450 it should be as good if not better than the C 400. However there is a small irascible group around that have been arguing that no one should have ever should bought a 400 because the "superbly much better" C450 was right around the corner, a completely bogus claim. Automakers make incremental improvements on their models all the time however its not like during a model cycle a dog suddenly becomes a stallion using most of the same hardware. The automaker loves to claim new and improved to the high heavens when its all about marketing.

Originally Posted by kellens

This post, and the one about C450 98.9% same car! You're embarrassing yourself. Can you post link where someone told you or anyone they shouldn't have bought a C400 before the C450 came? You've been on a crusade on multiple forums making up data on this and other topics. And now your position, after you swore a C450 would never come, is that it's marketing hype and will be 'as good' or better? As good????

Originally Posted by c4004matic

Exactly.
NO one is taking pot shots at the 450 it should be as good if not better than the C 400. However there is a small irascible group around that have been arguing that no one should have ever should bought a 400 because the "superbly much better" C450 was right around the corner, a completely bogus claim. Automakers make incremental improvements on their models all the time however its not like during a model cycle a dog suddenly becomes a stallion using most of the same hardware. The automaker loves to claim new and improved to the high heavens when its all about marketing.

Originally Posted by Germancar1

You have made a complete fool out of yourself. I mean really. I have never seen anyone so salty about their car purchase. First you said that there was no such thing as a C450. Then you said that the C450 wouldn't replace the C400, now even after reading the changes you think the C450 is just marketing. You have cognitive dissonance like something terrible and you're only making it worse. It is likely you that can't afford to switch from a C400 to a C450, not the other posters here.

M

Originally Posted by dunderhi

Look, he put on a set of decent tires and was amazed by the improvement. He has no concept that the transmission, steering, and suspension improvements in the C450 each provide similiar impacts to the car's performance. So given tires are probably 5%, I would put the C400 at 75% of a C450 in terms of a sport sedan. In terms of an entry-level luxury cruiser, I would say 98.9% is about right.

Originally Posted by HelenR

^^^^^^^^^^^^^Agreed^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Though the Michelin PS well documented to be a good fit for MB and the 2015 C class by reviewers and those with expertise, c4004matics "review" was his typical bias and unreliable.

I'd imagine the Michelin PS on the C450 new suspension and rear bias would further improve it. None are going to put Lamborghini out of business, but it's not their goal. I am excited to drive the C450. Unlikely to make me end the lease on my well balanced C300 early. I might hop out of a C400 for it though. Would have to test the drive the car (and my finances) first.

Originally Posted by c4004matic

WOW that is is an amazing conclusion! No sh%t Sherlock! Using excellent summer tires on the C450 will make it handle better. Now that is an earthshaking discovery!
If and when any of the desktop experts buys a C450 and equips it with high performance tires we will all be very interested on how it goes!

Originally Posted by c4004matic

If and when any of the desktop experts buys a C450 and equips it with high performance tires we will all be very interested on how it goes!

Originally Posted by dunderhi

We already know how it will go based on numerous reviews by professional reviewers. The PSS is the most common performance tire on the market and is an OEM tire for MB. I know the C63 rolls in the PSS (based upon my test drives) and I'm fairly confident that the 19" C450 wheels will wear the PSS.

Just in case anyone is curious. The PSS is not the ultimate summer performance tire, but it is the ultimate high mileage summer performance tire due it being 80% of it is an all-season tire rubber compound. I'm not bashing the tire, since I've nearly worn through two sets of PSS myself. If driven aggressively, so they only last about 20k mi, since the outside shoulders are a true summer compound.

Originally Posted by c4004matic

Having owned many a pair of summer rubber, 20k miles is an excellent treadwear performance. As to the 450 having PSS we will know soon enough, but I doubt it. The previous 19in option was shod with the summer only version of the runflat contis. Since PSS does not come in a run flat version (only a single one for the corvette) I doubt MB will offer it OEM, but, it would be a pleasant surprise if they did. As to which is the ultimate tire, that depends on preference, however, the PSS has never lost an overall comparison test. Furthermore, the price is very competitive. The OEM contis regardless of all season or summer area an astonishing 20% more.

Originally Posted by dunderhi

The C450 will only have MOE tires on the standard 18" wheels per the ordering guide. The 19's will come with standard Summer tires with the PSS as the most likely option as they already use them on the C63.

BTW, the PSS have a 30k treadwear warranty, so 20k is lower than on would expect.

Originally Posted by macct

It seems a number of posters have cars on order and I am curious on how you got comfortable with ordering the car without driving it. Is it based on past experience with MB? Did you come from a W205 C300 or 400 already? Did you consider the C63?

So after a very wordy post, what motivated you to the C450? What other cars did you compare it to? Thank you