removedCFGaccount

Yeah, Hung Lo had a team that did it. They work in North Korea, now.

l3it3r

Nope, I was one of the first, and I got mine SUPER quick

removedCFGaccount

Me, too!

Mr. J

I would recommend against buying this product. If you do purchase it make sure to use a cc with a good dispute resolution system. Dinan is either unconcerned with customer service and support for their consumer models or their customer service department is ineffective.


https://mbworld.org/forums/c450-c43-...ml#post7242030

removedCFGaccount

Well, I've been so busy overreaching folks I hadn't noticed. That is sad, and may affect my decision on the Elite.

subzero05

I would be really surprised if this were the case. I have had overwhelming support on the couple occasions I have reached out to them . Not taking anything away from your experience but it is possible there is another reason?. Did you try contacting their guy on here who posts from time to time?

removedCFGaccount

Well, that guy did strongly imply not to expect something commensurate with an Elite level product....

DinanCars

Sorry to hear you had a problematic experience and I am glad Golan took care of you up front. We contacted Golan and the other parties on Friday to get an idea of what was actually going on that caused the problem. What it comes down to is the issue you were experiencing in communication is unfortunately a byproduct of utilizing an expanded distribution network. Auto Talent is 2 steps removed from Dinan and the returns/paperwork process needs to go up through those channels to be properly handled. Each step takes some time and if there is a delay in any of those steps then it snowballs down through no fault of your own. As a result, we are brainstorming to see if there are ways in which we can streamline that process in these cases for the future.

Full on Distribution is a bit new to us so there are some growing pains. =(

removedCFGaccount

Well, please hurry along the Elite!

Mr. J

I understand this, but a simple RMA should be an easy, well-defined process. In my case it was even simpler because I got stuck with the shipping. Dinan did not even need to generate the shipping label.

Basically, I beta tested the product and wasted a day getting a CEL cleared by my dealer since I didn't have a code reader handy. All the while, I got to pay for the privilege while Dinan ghosted my vendor.

Word to the wise, upgrade your CRM and ERP systems and train your Customer Service team; or outsource your CS and distribution to another company that understands how to manage these interactions. If you try to go mass-market with this current level of customer service you are in for a rough ride.

removedCFGaccount

I say buy some goodwill and give the guy a steep discount on an elite. Come to think of it, me, too!

subzero05

I may be reading into this from the post Dinan made, but it sounds like a "simple RMA" as you request really had nothing to do with Dinan since "auto talent" whom you got the product from isn't direct with Dinan?. That said, Im guessing they (auto talent) buys from a distributor (of Dinan) who in turns then sells it to Auto talent, then ultimately to you . So an RMA would be requested by you to auto talent, who them needs to request it from the "distributo" and then to Dinan. That's pretty common in the distribution networking game. Again, I am speculating here, but if this is actually the case its a bit understandable that someone below Dinan, I.e. the distributor or auto talent could;'ve dropped the ball and didn't relay the detail to Dinan in a timely manner, thus causing a delay. not to say the process in itself could and should be improved, but this could be a possible reason as to what happened. I would highly doubt a company as reputable as Dinan has been for 35+ years would still be operating if their customer service was severely lacking, just my 2 cents. maybe they will do something to make it better for ya?.

removedCFGaccount

Here are my two cents: directly or indirectly blaming the consumer, in any wise, is always a mistake for a manufacturer or retail seller. It sounds ill in their mouth and is calculated to inflame, or create negative good will in the consumer and many, many potential customers.

A true story: years ago, before I fled to a profession, I was in the retail business with my father and uncle.

I HATED returns.

My uncle, a very pragmatic guy, pulled me aside one day and said, "There are no perfect customers, only customers. Either you want them, or you don't."

Think about it, Dinan, do you want "us" or not? (Yes, I understand you aren't in privity....)

I suggest you be Johnny at the rathole to give this guy a full refund or an elite discount and don't wait on intermediaries.

Just my two cents, at the twilight of a long life.

removedCFGaccount

And, as I recall, Dinan expressly warranted the product, so if it didn't, why hasn't it provided a DIRECT means of warranty claims, as is customary with such warranties, which would have obviate this?

subzero05

No disrespect here by any stretch, but it would be no different if you bought a pair of levi's from say kohls and they had a defect or something ?. You would return them to Kohls, not Levis. he returned it to Auto Talent, which makes sense. Then unfortunately they had to go to "their" supplier who in turn had to go to Dinan. I would agree as a warranty claim for a "manufacturer defect" if that was the case, a better process might need to be put in place

removedCFGaccount

O.K., schmegegge, and I mean no disrespect, this appears to be a layman' form over substance understanding of substantive contracts principles, either under the common law or as displaced by statutes like Magnuson-Moss.

First, Dinan made an express one year warranty on its packaging, and neither limited it to wholesalers or retail sellers, nor disclaimed enforcement by retailer purchasers, nor made a warranty claim to one's retailer seller a condition precedent.

Secondly, that Dinan, without regard to the legal rights or duties of all parties, provided no administrative procedure to make warranty claims is a fact of no consequence to its liability.

And, third, by custom and usage in Dinan's industry, manufacturers, as in many industries, expressly warranted and reasonably contemplated warranty claims by those with whom they are not in privity.

Please note the attached photo, which is completely silent except for the express, albeit patently ambiguous, warranty.

removedCFGaccount

And, then, there is the following website content which, of course, leads to a classic battle over the forms, and whether or which governs:

DINANTRONICS SPORT PRODUCT WARRANTY
DINANTRONICS Sport products are warranted against material and workmanship defects for a 1-year, unlimited mileage period from the date of original purchase. This warranty does not cover any consequential damages (neither parts nor labor) that may be caused as a result of the installation or use of this product.
To obtain service under this warranty, Dinan tech support must be made aware of the malfunction or defect in materials and/or workmanship of the DINANTRONICS Sport module upon discovery, via an Authorized Independent Dinan Dealer or directly to Dinan during normal business hours. In the event of a valid warranty claim, Dinan will repair or replace, at its sole discretion, any defective Dinan component upon receipt of the item and proof of the original purchase in the form of a lawful invoice. In the event of a defect the defective unit must be returned to Dinan for verification of the defect before any reimbursements will be issued. A reasonable period of time must be allowed for warranty replacement, shipping and/or repairs to be completed after the product is received by an Authorized Dinan Dealer or Dinan’s facility.

Interesting, the website warns buyers of Magnuson-Moss.

At the very least, this is an admission that the express warranty runs to any remote purchaser, and maybe any remote consumer.

removedCFGaccount

Well, there are no perfect customers, just customers...you either want them or you don't.

Were it my product, I'd offer to kiss J's butt on Main Street, regardless of the procedure he did or did not follow. But, that's just me, hearing the distant voice of my long dead uncle.

Where did I put those jeans?

Hang on, I've got some hosers to cheat. Back in an hour or so.

subzero05

well all of that was far to much for me to try and digest, let alone interpret. End of the day if there is a warranty claim and Dinan is now aware of it, regardless of how they became aware of it I suspect it would get resolved. If it were me, I would offer Mr J some sort of a smokin' deal to run the elite and turn lemons into lemonade but that is for them to decide together.

removedCFGaccount

I'm going out on a limb here, assuming this isn't willful disregard.

It simply means that J, either as a matter of substantive law or the terms of the underlying sale contract with someone, had enforceable rights under it (intended, third party, creditor beneficiary), and could elect his remedy to go after one, or anyone in his chain of distribution, so it is form over substance to say he had to go to his seller rather than the source. If the source says anything but that, the source needs a new lawyer.

Again, were I Dinan, I'd offer to kiss the guy's butt on Main Street.

There are no perfect customers....(though self-evident, it means if you have walking around sense, the customer is always right.)

That there are two sides is irrelevant as inattention invites something like this: http://www.benzworld.org/forums/w211...or-2-year.html

Mr. J

Rather than continue to focus on the negative here, I'd like to share a couple stories that illustrate excellent customer service I've received and truly represent the "gold standard" for responsive and attentive customer care.

I recently ordered a pair of these dash cams on Amazon:

It's a great piece of kit, I highly recommend it.
The camera comes with a little BT remote button that when pressed will push snapshots of either still images or short video clips direct to your phone so you don't have to bother downloading it.

Well, one of my cameras had a button that would not link, so I contacted the seller. The seller (who's based in China BTW) responded within the hour and had a replacement button en route via expedited shipping the following morning. All the correspondence was cordial and I was left with the feeling that this company really wanted my business and was working hard to earn my trust. They succeeded. I will definitely buy DDPai products in the future.


I don't know if any of you guys carry pocket knives regularly but I often do unless professional attire prevents it. I've carried Spyderco knives for years because I'm a fan of the functionality, quality, and durability of their product. Awhile back, I broke a pocket clip on a 6 year old Endura. I called up Spyderco and a replacement was in the mail the next morning. It showed up free of charge and they even threw in new screws and a tiny tube of blue locktite. Spyderco is simply a great company to deal with and their products are superior. Chances are, I'll be a customer for life. I've never broken one of their knives but I have an unfortunate habit of losing one every few years.

I've had similarly great experiences with many other companies. Lee Precision and Cor-bon are two other stand-outs that were concerned not just with satisfying me as a customer, but also in analyzing the defect and tracking is back to it's source.

I've built a career in manufacturing operations and supply chain management. I have a pretty good understanding of the complexities of multi-channel distribution. There are two ways to successfully manage this part of your business. You can either become great at customer service or you can outsource it to another outfit who is. All other options lead to failures and lost sales.

removedCFGaccount

Le Creuset sent me a free replacement knob for a 40 year old pot when I called hoping to buy one. This was last year. Same observation.

I say they should offer to kiss....