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BTW just FYI for anyone reading the thread, I forgot to mention that after a long time messing around with the EQ my final tune setup was 90% based on a file created for BMW sedans using the UP 7BMW amplifier. My original tune was in a lot of ways similar to this one except that this one was more refined. I was often still using the radio settings to adjust treble and mids, but with this tune I can keep those at 0 and the overall sound quality is even better than what I originally created. If anyone has the same amp and wants to check out the tune please PM me for the tune file I am using. I tried uploading it to this reply but it's apparently an unsupported file type.
Please post a link to the tune file or pm it to me. I can load it in the helix DSP software in demo mode. I would actually like to see what distance settings you have set.
Please post a link to the tune file or pm it to me. I can load it in the helix DSP software in demo mode. I would actually like to see what distance settings you have set.
You just jogged my memory that I can use Google drive to share it via a link. I never use it, but now I have a reason to. Try this link and let me know if for some reason it isn't working right
EDIT: I just referenced my screenshots and I don't have any distance added to any of the channels. I could add some appropriate amount and test it out, now I want to go back to my car and play with it.
Last edited by BayAreaAMG; 05-23-2020 at 10:44 PM.
You just jogged my memory that I can use Google drive to share it via a link. I never use it, but now I have a reason to. Try this link and let me know if for some reason it isn't working right
Excellent write up and pictures that provide useful information. I'm very happy with my Burmester but I'm sure this will be very useful for anyone thinking about an upgrade.
If I had the Burmester I probably wouldn't upgrade anything in the system since it sounds great already. I had a 2019 C300 loaner car with it for a few days and thought it sounded pretty good. But who knows, I may have ended up modifying it at some point .
You're welcome, try starting out with a distance of 2.58 ms front speakers, and 4.63 ms rear. That's what the BMW tune file for sedans had. It had none for center or subs.
@benzdude I went out to the car and added the distance, since I forgot to do that initially. It sounds so much nicer now thanks for bringing it up.
Last edited by BayAreaAMG; 05-23-2020 at 10:54 PM.
If I had the Burmester I probably wouldn't upgrade anything in the system since it sounds great already. I had a 2019 C300 loaner car with it for a few days and thought it sounded pretty good. But who knows, I may have ended up modifying it at some point .
This all started to fix the crappy footwell sub bass.
I also tried a 2020 c class and it still sound bad to me.
The V Twelve dsp has a new feature which allows you to sum or passthrough the factory tune (one to one channel routing) on the channels you want and tweak just the ones you need.
So i could keep the Burmester tune on all speakers and tweak the footwell subs to sound better.
You're welcome, try starting out with a distance of 2.58 ms front speakers, and 4.63 ms rear. That's what the BMW tune file for sedans had. It had none for center or subs.
@benzdude I went out to the car and added the distance, since I forgot to do that initially. It sounds so much nicer now thanks for bringing it up.
Actually, I plan on using distance mode (time alignment) and measure the distance of all the speakers from the drivers seat. Input that into the Software and let it set the required delays.
Yep I switched it to delay mode to input the delay in time as the BMW file does. I'm going to further experiment with it some more and measure it out, testing it in centimeters. The Match software seems to have the option of either centimeters, inches or milliseconds.
Yep I switched it to delay mode to input the delay in time as the BMW file does. I'm going to further experiment with it some more and measure it out, testing it in centimeters. The Match software seems to have the option of either centimeters, inches or milliseconds.
If you are going to use distance mode you might want to flatten all EQ settings first (all channels). Then input the measurements for each speaker. After that play a few songs (with flat eq) and solo the speakers in groups while you adjust the distance settings to your liking. So only front left and right, then rear left and right, then front and rears, woofers, etc. Mute the other channels.
After you've got the distance and delays where you want then tweak the EQs.
Some people prefer the vocals coming from over the steering wheel or over the center speaker location. Tweaking the L/R time alignment will allow you to choose.
Now includes Automatic Time Alignment measurement!
ATM - The official public beta version of "Automatic Time Measurement" has been added. This is a completely new algorithm and function which allows the user to fully automatically set up the time alignment in a car for all speaker channels independent if these are active or passive speaker systems. The new function can be accessed by pressing "SHIFT" + "t" in any window. To use the function name ALL inputs and outputs correctly, make sure that a full range stereo signal is routed to analog input channels "A & B" or in case of VCP to Virtual Channels "Front Left" and "Front Right" and play the ATM test track from the Sound Files folder. The microphone needs to be mounted in a fixed position at the the centered head position e.g. mounting the mic to the headrest facing upwards or in a 45° angle to the inner roof. At last make sure that the measurement volume is in the green/good marked area of the microphone level bar and click on the "Start" button. If necessary it is possible to select/unselect specific channels in the table of the new window.
You just jogged my memory that I can use Google drive to share it via a link. I never use it, but now I have a reason to. Try this link and let me know if for some reason it isn't working right
EDIT: I just referenced my screenshots and I don't have any distance added to any of the channels. I could add some appropriate amount and test it out, now I want to go back to my car and play with it.
I’m looking into doing the same type of setup, but I would really prefer to not use a passive crossover, I would rather the tweeters get their own channels in the DSP. I can’t tell if the UP 7DSP with this harness would be able to accomplish this. Any ideas?
I’m looking into doing the same type of setup, but I would really prefer to not use a passive crossover, I would rather the tweeters get their own channels in the DSP. I can’t tell if the UP 7DSP with this harness would be able to accomplish this. Any ideas?
The harness or amplifier doesn't have any additional outputs/channels that you could use for that. I can't think of any way to make that work with this setup, except maybe if you sacrificed the rear doors from having their connection to the amp you could use them for the tweeters on their own left and right channels.
But idk to be honest if that's worth the effort and results. You'd have amplified speakers except in the rear, the volume levels will sound louder up front so you may have to play with the fader. But also in comparison to the rest of the speakers, the quality won't be great at all.
Well, if it were me I wouldn't attempt it. I don't think it's worth the effort when it all sounds great and the way it is with how I have it installed.
Thank you for all the pointers! Found the A20 system underwhelming and wanted some more power. Going with a plug-and-play system was my preference. The contenders were between the Match/Eton systems. I chose Match due to local inventory and the amount of online resources.
The Match system was professionally installed in my vehicle. There's a huge difference in comparison to the stock A20 system. The sound is punchier and distortions are no longer heard at high-frequencies. The sub-woofers produce amazing bass.
Only slight drawback is, the sub-woofers are too loud on low volume settings. This could be to the way it was setup. Adjusting the in-car equalizer bass option did not help much. I'm not expert, but believe this could be an easy fix and adjustable through the DSP as a setting. It might make sense to add a remote control to fine-tune sub-woofer volume on the go.
Thank you for all the pointers! Found the A20 system underwhelming and wanted some more power. Going with a plug-and-play system was my preference. The contenders were between the Match/Eton systems. I chose Match due to local inventory and the amount of online resources.
The Match system was professionally installed in my vehicle. There's a huge difference in comparison to the stock A20 system. The sound is punchier and distortions are no longer heard at high-frequencies. The sub-woofers produce amazing bass.
Only slight drawback is, the sub-woofers are too loud on low volume settings. This could be to the way it was setup. Adjusting the in-car equalizer bass option did not help much. I'm not expert, but believe this could be an easy fix and adjustable through the DSP as a setting. It might make sense to add a remote control to fine-tune sub-woofer volume on the go.
It sounds like it has the dynamic bass enhancement enabled, which will increase bass to the sub at lower volume levels, and taper it as it gets louder. You can disable it in the sub fx menu. Adding a remote helps a bunch to control it too.
Just completed my set up today and really happy with the results. Have each of the door speakers replaced with Eton Crossovers on each one. Then I have a JL monoblock amp and 8 inch microsub in the back. However, I'm getting the itch to install a 4 channel JL amp to send 60 watts to each speaker just to see how big of an improvement it would be (already vastly improved as is).
If you have a Burmester amp in the trunk and want to completely delete it from your chain, you can use the NAV-TV ZEN-M MOST 150 interface and retain all factory features.
Audiotec Fischer has now made a well written manual for the ZEN-M and their DSP AMPS.
05-23-2020, 10:03 PM
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