Tracking C32 - Advice
06-30-2009, 10:19 PM
#1
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 200
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
2003 C32
Tracking C32 - Advice
I'll be tracking my C32 at the Mosport Driver Development Centre July 31st. I'll be flushing the brake fluid and planning to fill with Motul RBF600. How much fluid will I need to buy? Also I need guidance on tire pressures. I have the Goodyear F1 Asymmetrics on stock rims. I'm thinking 38 lbs. front and 30 lbs. back.
TIA.
Wayne
TIA.
Wayne
07-01-2009, 08:07 AM
#3
MBWorld Fanatic!
If you like to understeer, which is safe, in a stcok C32 then yes. Otherwise go with your 38F and 30 R.
For my BEST lap times iat beaverun was with 39 LF, 38RF, 33LR and 32RR.
Good luck and have some fun
Mosport is a great track that I used to drive on back in the mid 90's with forumla fords
See yeah
PS: Don't be afraid to experiment my friend. EVERYONE'S driving style is different so what works for me, might not be as good for you.
For my BEST lap times iat beaverun was with 39 LF, 38RF, 33LR and 32RR.
Good luck and have some fun
Mosport is a great track that I used to drive on back in the mid 90's with forumla fordsSee yeah
PS: Don't be afraid to experiment my friend. EVERYONE'S driving style is different so what works for me, might not be as good for you.
07-01-2009, 09:53 AM
#4
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,598
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hahah. My car is so beyond stock I forget that my settings don't apply. Currently, my setup is almost completely neutral with a bit of oversteer right now haha.
You can mimmic the clk63bs which people like to run 38/33. Try that cold and work from there. The first thing anyone needs for theses cars is the 22mm eibach rear sway.
What size tires are you running on the stock rims also? Next time get yourself either some Dunlop z stars or re11r's.
You can mimmic the clk63bs which people like to run 38/33. Try that cold and work from there. The first thing anyone needs for theses cars is the 22mm eibach rear sway.
What size tires are you running on the stock rims also? Next time get yourself either some Dunlop z stars or re11r's.
07-01-2009, 04:32 PM
#5
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 200
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
2003 C32
MRAMG1-If you like to understeer, which is safe, in a stcok C32 then yes. Otherwise go with your 38F and 30 R.
For my BEST lap times iat beaverun was with 39 LF, 38RF, 33LR and 32RR.
For my BEST lap times iat beaverun was with 39 LF, 38RF, 33LR and 32RR.
SPR-The first thing anyone needs for theses cars is the 22mm eibach rear sway.
What size tires are you running on the stock rims also? Next time get yourself either some Dunlop z stars or re11r's.
What size tires are you running on the stock rims also? Next time get yourself either some Dunlop z stars or re11r's.
07-01-2009, 04:43 PM
#6
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Morehead, KY USA
Posts: 396
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes
on
2 Posts
SLK55 AMG, E320 BlueTec, ML350, (formerly) C32 AMG, MR2 Turbo, HD-FLH-FSE, BMW R100RS, Ducati M900
Tracking
I ran 40 fr and 34 r at bluegrass and was OK with that. I'll admit that 40 may have been a lb or two, too much as I did not wear the tire to the edge arrows, but I was also not running that hard. At Deals Gap (not a track, but close, lol), I ran 42 fr and 35 r with really good results. Balanced (more or less) with just a hint of oversteer on the slower exits on the power. This was with stock rims shod with Bridgestone Re050PP's. The previous post to start with 38-39 fr and 32-34 rear and adjust from there is a good place to start that should keep just a bit of understeer. Then adjust to suit your car, tires and style.
Irish
Irish
07-01-2009, 04:50 PM
#7
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,598
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I would get the eibach rear for sure and whatever is adjustable front. I have an H&R that is unused for the front if you or anyone is interested btw as they are different for the c32 and c55. (It's for a c32).
Irish's front pressures seem wayy to high unless they're hot, which they appear cold. They'll be greasy in the front in no time the way I drive (professional licensure) but whatever.
I am really not a good source for this info because of the extensive mods and how I drive. Play around with what you like as you're really not competing.
I can say that changing to 8.5/9.5 makes a huge difference with almost R compounds as aforementioned above. My car is basically a black series now, so again, I can't comment further on stock stuff as I had a gt3 basically track car for that at that time.
Irish's front pressures seem wayy to high unless they're hot, which they appear cold. They'll be greasy in the front in no time the way I drive (professional licensure) but whatever.
I am really not a good source for this info because of the extensive mods and how I drive. Play around with what you like as you're really not competing.
I can say that changing to 8.5/9.5 makes a huge difference with almost R compounds as aforementioned above. My car is basically a black series now, so again, I can't comment further on stock stuff as I had a gt3 basically track car for that at that time.
Trending Topics
07-01-2009, 04:59 PM
#8
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 200
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
2003 C32
I have an H&R that is unused for the front if you or anyone is interested btw as they are different for the c32 and c55. (It's for a c32).
SPR, how much do you want for the H&R front sway? Willing to ship to Canada?
Wayne
SPR, how much do you want for the H&R front sway? Willing to ship to Canada?
Wayne
07-01-2009, 05:50 PM
#9
Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 130
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
2 bottles - 1L of Motul should be ok. But I would buy 3 bottles. To thoroughly flush the system you might need just a tad more than 1L. It will suck to ran out in the middle of the flush. Besides you’ll need some for bleeding later.
Generally speaking – do not worry about psi. You will not be driving anywhere close to a level where few psi will make a deference. Chances are you will not feel or understand which way to adjust your tires. Chances are that for many years to come you will need a pyrometer to determine ultimate pressure. Also do not worry about R-comps. You are about 20+ track days away from those concerns. Just get a goodnight sleep, drink water and listen to your instructor. Relax and enjoy.
Sorry if I sound preachy, but most people that have not track yet have a tuff time understanding that it’s all about the driver, NOT the car.
BTW, cold pressure is of marginal importance. I would be more curious about hot pressure. Since I track S4 and never used the tires you are running - I am of limited help, but I would guess that you’ll be fine if you run 40/38 f/r hot. Mosport is an open fast track. So your pressure should not spike too far from cold.
Generally speaking – do not worry about psi. You will not be driving anywhere close to a level where few psi will make a deference. Chances are you will not feel or understand which way to adjust your tires. Chances are that for many years to come you will need a pyrometer to determine ultimate pressure. Also do not worry about R-comps. You are about 20+ track days away from those concerns. Just get a goodnight sleep, drink water and listen to your instructor. Relax and enjoy.
Sorry if I sound preachy, but most people that have not track yet have a tuff time understanding that it’s all about the driver, NOT the car.
BTW, cold pressure is of marginal importance. I would be more curious about hot pressure. Since I track S4 and never used the tires you are running - I am of limited help, but I would guess that you’ll be fine if you run 40/38 f/r hot. Mosport is an open fast track. So your pressure should not spike too far from cold.
07-01-2009, 06:08 PM
#10
MBWorld Fanatic!
I ran 40 fr and 34 r at bluegrass and was OK with that. I'll admit that 40 may have been a lb or two, too much as I did not wear the tire to the edge arrows, but I was also not running that hard. At Deals Gap (not a track, but close, lol), I ran 42 fr and 35 r with really good results. Balanced (more or less) with just a hint of oversteer on the slower exits on the power. This was with stock rims shod with Bridgestone Re050PP'sGreat choice in tire my friend. The previous post to start with 38-39 fr and 32-34 rear and adjust from there is a good place to start that should keep just a bit of understeer. Then adjust to suit your car, tires and style.
Irish
Irish
See
yeah
07-01-2009, 08:44 PM
#12
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 200
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
2003 C32
2 bottles - 1L of Motul should be ok. But I would buy 3 bottles. To thoroughly flush the system you might need just a tad more than 1L. It will suck to ran out in the middle of the flush. Besides you’ll need some for bleeding later.
07-01-2009, 11:50 PM
#13
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,064
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
C55 AMG, 135i, 911 GT3, GLE43 AMG
I echo OPM's suggestions. If this is your first time on a track, I suggest to leave your car stock and don't worry about adding mods.
The biggest factor is driver skill/technique, NOT your equipment. Stay on street tires as they are far better to learn on than R-compounds.
1) Learn the racing line of the particular track. For this, you need to learn the quickest way around each corner by identifying the proper turn in point, hitting the apex, and corner exit path.
2) Brake/slow down enough prior to each turn. The most common newbie mistake is not braking enough and then understeering off the track. Adopting a "slow in, fast out" approach is always a good way to start. As you get more experienced, you can try to brake later and later before each corner.
3) Gradually add more and more throttle after you hit the apex of each turn to maximize exit speed, while maintaining control.
From the sounds of your first post, you will be driving on the Mosport DDT (driver development track), NOT the full Mosport Grand Prix track, right??.......the two are VERY different. The DDT is a slow, very technical track, while the full Grand Prix track is a high speed fast flowing track.
The outer edge of the front tires on my C55 always gets worn after track days. I expect the tires on your C32 to be similar. The appropriate cold tire pressure will depend on the type of track and how you drive. I think aiming for a hot pressure in the low 40's is reasonable.
The biggest factor is driver skill/technique, NOT your equipment. Stay on street tires as they are far better to learn on than R-compounds.
1) Learn the racing line of the particular track. For this, you need to learn the quickest way around each corner by identifying the proper turn in point, hitting the apex, and corner exit path.
2) Brake/slow down enough prior to each turn. The most common newbie mistake is not braking enough and then understeering off the track. Adopting a "slow in, fast out" approach is always a good way to start. As you get more experienced, you can try to brake later and later before each corner.
3) Gradually add more and more throttle after you hit the apex of each turn to maximize exit speed, while maintaining control.
From the sounds of your first post, you will be driving on the Mosport DDT (driver development track), NOT the full Mosport Grand Prix track, right??.......the two are VERY different. The DDT is a slow, very technical track, while the full Grand Prix track is a high speed fast flowing track.
The outer edge of the front tires on my C55 always gets worn after track days. I expect the tires on your C32 to be similar. The appropriate cold tire pressure will depend on the type of track and how you drive. I think aiming for a hot pressure in the low 40's is reasonable.
07-02-2009, 06:35 AM
#14
MBWorld Fanatic!
I echo OPM's suggestions. If this is your first time on a track, I suggest to leave your car stock and don't worry about adding mods.
The biggest factor is driver skill/technique, NOT your equipment. Stay on street tires as they are far better to learn on than R-compounds.
1) Learn the racing line of the particular track. For this, you need to learn the quickest way around each corner by identifying the proper turn in point, hitting the apex, and corner exit path.
2) Brake/slow down enough prior to each turn. The most common newbie mistake is not braking enough and then understeering off the track. Adopting a "slow in, fast out" approach is always a good way to start. As you get more experienced, you can try to brake later and later before each corner.
Not only is this GRAET advise, but it also safer and a good way to learn the track/experiance
3) Gradually add more and more throttle after you hit the apex of each turn to maximize exit speed, while maintaining control.
From the sounds of your first post, you will be driving on the Mosport DDT (driver development track), NOT the full Mosport Grand Prix track, right??.......the two are VERY different. The DDT is a slow, very technical track, while the full Grand Prix track is a high speed fast flowing track.
The outer edge of the front tires on my C55 always gets worn after track days. I expect the tires on your C32 to be similar. The appropriate cold tire pressure will depend on the type of track and how you drive. I think aiming for a hot pressure in the low 40's is reasonable.
The biggest factor is driver skill/technique, NOT your equipment. Stay on street tires as they are far better to learn on than R-compounds.
1) Learn the racing line of the particular track. For this, you need to learn the quickest way around each corner by identifying the proper turn in point, hitting the apex, and corner exit path.
2) Brake/slow down enough prior to each turn. The most common newbie mistake is not braking enough and then understeering off the track. Adopting a "slow in, fast out" approach is always a good way to start. As you get more experienced, you can try to brake later and later before each corner.
Not only is this GRAET advise, but it also safer and a good way to learn the track/experiance
3) Gradually add more and more throttle after you hit the apex of each turn to maximize exit speed, while maintaining control.
From the sounds of your first post, you will be driving on the Mosport DDT (driver development track), NOT the full Mosport Grand Prix track, right??.......the two are VERY different. The DDT is a slow, very technical track, while the full Grand Prix track is a high speed fast flowing track.
The outer edge of the front tires on my C55 always gets worn after track days. I expect the tires on your C32 to be similar. The appropriate cold tire pressure will depend on the type of track and how you drive. I think aiming for a hot pressure in the low 40's is reasonable.
See yeah
07-02-2009, 07:47 AM
#15
MBWorld Fanatic!
I'll be tracking my C32 at the Mosport Driver Development Centre July 31st. I'll be flushing the brake fluid and planning to fill with Motul RBF600. How much fluid will I need to buy? Also I need guidance on tire pressures. I have the Goodyear F1 Asymmetrics on stock rims. I'm thinking 38 lbs. front and 30 lbs. back.
TIA.
Wayne
TIA.
Wayne
Diff fluid?
Transmission fluid?
Radiator flush?
Fresh Mobil 1?
07-02-2009, 08:07 AM
#16
MBWorld Fanatic!
In addition to your brake fluid, other fluids may need attention too. It's cheap insurance.
Diff fluid?Waste of money, you will never get it hot enough to do any damage in a 20 minute session
Transmission fluid?I personally never did this, but not a bad idea
Radiator flush?Only if its been over a year, or if you over heat the car. Never happened to me
Fresh Mobil 1? After the day of tracking
Diff fluid?Waste of money, you will never get it hot enough to do any damage in a 20 minute session
Transmission fluid?I personally never did this, but not a bad idea
Radiator flush?Only if its been over a year, or if you over heat the car. Never happened to me
Fresh Mobil 1? After the day of tracking
Good advise
See yeah
07-02-2009, 08:52 AM
#17
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 200
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
2003 C32
I echo OPM's suggestions. If this is your first time on a track, I suggest to leave your car stock and don't worry about adding mods.
The biggest factor is driver skill/technique, NOT your equipment. Stay on street tires as they are far better to learn on than R-compounds.
1) Learn the racing line of the particular track. For this, you need to learn the quickest way around each corner by identifying the proper turn in point, hitting the apex, and corner exit path.
2) Brake/slow down enough prior to each turn. The most common newbie mistake is not braking enough and then understeering off the track. Adopting a "slow in, fast out" approach is always a good way to start. As you get more experienced, you can try to brake later and later before each corner.
3) Gradually add more and more throttle after you hit the apex of each turn to maximize exit speed, while maintaining control.
From the sounds of your first post, you will be driving on the Mosport DDT (driver development track), NOT the full Mosport Grand Prix track, right??.......the two are VERY different. The DDT is a slow, very technical track, while the full Grand Prix track is a high speed fast flowing track.
The outer edge of the front tires on my C55 always gets worn after track days. I expect the tires on your C32 to be similar. The appropriate cold tire pressure will depend on the type of track and how you drive. I think aiming for a hot pressure in the low 40's is reasonable.
The biggest factor is driver skill/technique, NOT your equipment. Stay on street tires as they are far better to learn on than R-compounds.
1) Learn the racing line of the particular track. For this, you need to learn the quickest way around each corner by identifying the proper turn in point, hitting the apex, and corner exit path.
2) Brake/slow down enough prior to each turn. The most common newbie mistake is not braking enough and then understeering off the track. Adopting a "slow in, fast out" approach is always a good way to start. As you get more experienced, you can try to brake later and later before each corner.
3) Gradually add more and more throttle after you hit the apex of each turn to maximize exit speed, while maintaining control.
From the sounds of your first post, you will be driving on the Mosport DDT (driver development track), NOT the full Mosport Grand Prix track, right??.......the two are VERY different. The DDT is a slow, very technical track, while the full Grand Prix track is a high speed fast flowing track.
The outer edge of the front tires on my C55 always gets worn after track days. I expect the tires on your C32 to be similar. The appropriate cold tire pressure will depend on the type of track and how you drive. I think aiming for a hot pressure in the low 40's is reasonable.
07-02-2009, 08:58 AM
#18
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 200
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
2003 C32
Transmission and filter was done a year ago
Rad flushed 3 years ago ( MB claims 7 years 140KM
Oil has 7KM on it. Will make sure its topped up and changing it after the event.
Car relatively young with 72KM.
07-02-2009, 09:07 AM
#19
Super Member
hi
68 & stopped counting sold my 99/210 e55 last week now have C55 love it ride a bit hard on crap roads in queensland australia did i say i love my C55.
regards
george
68 & stopped counting sold my 99/210 e55 last week now have C55 love it ride a bit hard on crap roads in queensland australia did i say i love my C55.
regards
george
07-02-2009, 11:16 AM
#20
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 200
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
2003 C32
Hi Geroge,
Welcome to this forum. Glad to hear you are still enjoying your motoring. I've found the people on this forum extremely knowlegeable and helpful.
Regards,
Wayne
07-02-2009, 11:24 AM
#21
MBWorld Fanatic!
07-02-2009, 12:04 PM
#22
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,598
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
You don't know what I've done to the car. Do you know anyone who has gone so far to run a black series steering rack which costs over 3k? I added it. Just because I don't gush about every little mod I've done doesn't mean I haven't done them all. There is no black series part that will bolt up that I can add left without sheetmetal mods. Don't be a hater.
For the flush you can get by with 2 bottles 1L but you'll be close. I use the motul bleeder and had some left, but not too much. Considering you're doing the flush get 3. Cheap Insurance. Just remember not to turn the key on or anything when you bleed! Only use a line wrech for the caipers also. You can pick up a set or just the one for cheap. I think the stocks use the same size f/r My clk63 brakes have different sizes f/r. Don't be ghetto and round the nut!
The other guy is right hot pressures are all that matter. See if someone has a pyrometer when you're at the track and hit them in 3 sections across the tire left middle outside temps. You'll get an idea where the car is setup and press etc. If the car is feeling greazyyyy bleed down!
For the flush you can get by with 2 bottles 1L but you'll be close. I use the motul bleeder and had some left, but not too much. Considering you're doing the flush get 3. Cheap Insurance. Just remember not to turn the key on or anything when you bleed! Only use a line wrech for the caipers also. You can pick up a set or just the one for cheap. I think the stocks use the same size f/r My clk63 brakes have different sizes f/r. Don't be ghetto and round the nut!
The other guy is right hot pressures are all that matter. See if someone has a pyrometer when you're at the track and hit them in 3 sections across the tire left middle outside temps. You'll get an idea where the car is setup and press etc. If the car is feeling greazyyyy bleed down!
07-02-2009, 01:12 PM
#23
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 200
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
2003 C32
For the flush you can get by with 2 bottles 1L but you'll be close. I use the motul bleeder and had some left, but not too much. Considering you're doing the flush get 3. Cheap Insurance. Just remember not to turn the key on or anything when you bleed! Only use a line wrech for the caipers also. You can pick up a set or just the one for cheap. I think the stocks use the same size f/r My clk63 brakes have different sizes f/r. Don't be ghetto and round the nut!
The other guy is right hot pressures are all that matter. See if someone has a pyrometer when you're at the track and hit them in 3 sections across the tire left middle outside temps. You'll get an idea where the car is setup and press etc. If the car is feeling greazyyyy bleed down!
The other guy is right hot pressures are all that matter. See if someone has a pyrometer when you're at the track and hit them in 3 sections across the tire left middle outside temps. You'll get an idea where the car is setup and press etc. If the car is feeling greazyyyy bleed down!
I'll pickup an extra bottle. I'm using the Motive Products bleeder. I'll pickup a line wrench as you suggest.
Since PC Valkyrie is familiar with the DDC course I'll be running on and my inexperience, I don't believe it will be critical to monitor tire temp across the tread. Main concern is rolling over the shoulder too much and wearing the edges down.
07-02-2009, 01:20 PM
#24
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,598
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Heheh. You should be fine. Line wrenches are key. I forget what size the stockers are 9mm? You may do a search on that so you have the right size. The motul bleeder is great. Just make sure you don't go past 25 psi. I keep it at 20-25. Remember to go from longest to shortest also e.g. rr, lr, rf, lf.
07-02-2009, 02:23 PM
#25
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 200
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
2003 C32
Heheh. You should be fine. Line wrenches are key. I forget what size the stockers are 9mm? You may do a search on that so you have the right size. The motul bleeder is great. Just make sure you don't go past 25 psi. I keep it at 20-25. Remember to go from longest to shortest also e.g. rr, lr, rf, lf.
