Gabri343

http://www.autozeitung.de/vergleichs...hp?id=874&tb=8

vitaman

Can anyone translate this into English?
Wiedermann we need you!

Gabri343

Handling (min.) M3 1:44,5 S4 1:46,8 C55 1:46,4
0-40 km/h (s) 1.5 1.6 1.9
0-60 km/h (s) 2.4 2.8 2.8
0-80 km/h (s) 3.6 4.3 4.1
0-100 km/h (s) 5 5.8 5.5
0-120 km/h (s) 6.8 7.9 7.2

04E500

I love when the BMW guys come over here to post. I like both the M3 and the S4 but those cars are freaking everywhere. The performance between the three is close enough that its more about personal taste than anything else. I have yet to see another C55, rarely see C32's and see M3's and S4's every day.

Thai

Maybe because it's a better buy?? You see Camrys and Accords around a lot...there's a reason for it.

IdriveFast

M3's look really nice...


























































in my rear view

Bilal

It must be said, that M3 in red/maroon looks really cool. I love how the current M3 looks great in some colours, their Le Mans Blue and red are very attractive. I would love if AMG offered a similar colour to that Blue.

Anyways, I'm a lurker over at M5board, and you NEVER see any MB guys posting SL65 drag racing times and whatnot, surprisngly, its Gustav himself, chief moderator at M5board that brings the M5 guys MB information, he'll post MB video links, MB pictures from dealerships HE TOOK HIMSELF, I'm very surprised by this. That doesn't mean Gabri343 should stop psting what he does, but I'm glad (we) are secure in our beliefs and purchases of AMG's that we haev made the righ decision

That is not to say we don't like hearing what the competition is up to, after all thats what makes AMG to build better faster cars, I'm sure they would be more than happy to offer a 367hp engine for every car they make, they'll save a lot of costs, but its the desire to beat the intense competition that make them who they are. And by intense, I mean it.

The M3 with its "puny" inline 6 of 3.2 dispalcement is as quick, if not faster than AMG's best C-class effort. I know its more about gearing, weight and whatnot but BMW M have done a very good job in making the M3 as fast as it is. I'm slightly disappointed, all the Europeans have 0-60 in 5.-5.5 seconds for the C55 and the Americans have manged to get sub 5 second sprints to 60, can't explain that one.

Moreover, lets be honest there isn't a massive difference in 0-60 in 5 seconds and that in 5.5 seconds, the best thing about AMG's is to catch the opposition drivers unaware. Just roll up discreetly, floor that sucker and be on your way, no messing with paddles or anything, 7G tronic will make the pleasure of doing this even more "fun".

Anyways, I've waffled enough, back to the topic, thanks for posting anyhooo.

FrankW

I'll take a M3 in LSB pls w/ grey interior and a S4 in avus blue inside and out.

always love blue...and then black.

but yeah, it's stupid that guys w/ M3 are always and only posting info when they see their car win some comparison tests. gotta find that German mag video where the M3 came in last compare to the C32 and new S4. :p

reggid

i think this test is quite predictable.

The m3 gets the jump on the C55 to 40km/h but from then on its equal between the c55 and m3 if anything it suggests that the C55 is quicker above 60km/h........and the audi is just too heavy. I think this would translate in the real world pretty well provided the m3 driver can drive (launch cleanly).... if not the c55 will be faster and since most m3 drivers don't want to or don't know how to the C55 will walk slowly into the distance.

Jon200

A black M3 with red interior and 19" is awesome

A Nagaro S4 gets my vote too

cntlaw

We need more colors. I want a unique color for the C55 like they do the wasabi yellow to the M3.

I also need the 7G - there is little time to worry about gears changes on highways.

It will be even nicer to have the C55 with 4valve and 420hp

Perhaps above will come by in the next generation C AMG, it will be the time to trade for. And then, I must admit the 400hp M3 can be a big competitor; especially to the C AMG owmers who do not want a saloon size AMG such as the E55, S55.

s4iscool

You see so many because spoiled kids who cant make a penny for themselves, ONLY know about the M3, and ONLY want to impress their friends who ONLY know about the M3...therefore you see the all too common AUTO M3's. Im usually impressed when I see a kid with the 6MT. The MB offerings are more expensive as well...the M3 is simply more affordable. M3 resale is good for a BMW though.

Thai

With all due respect, if you ACTUALLY believe what you just said, then you're are off on some other planet! (to put it nicely) Sorry, isn't the M3 more expensive than C32 AMG?? Isn't the M3 similar price to C55 AMG??

What makes an M3 owner spoiled while C32 AMG owner not??!! I don't get that logic at all...especially when M3 is slightly more expensive. People who buy M3 can easily buy C32...and vice versa. A spoiled kid can do either...a guy who earns his living can easily do both too.

Auto M3?? You mean SMG, right?! That is far from being an auto...but i "assume" you knew that. And i can use your "logic" on C32/C55 owners...since all of them have automatics...do any of you know how to drive stick?? (rhetorical question to illustrate your flawed logic.) AMG does not even let you turn off ESP...so it is more motherly than M3. I know...my G500 does not let me turn it off either unless i lock the differentials.

Don't bring money into an argument...especially when C32/C55 AMGs cost similar to M3. What you criticize the M3 crowd about can easily be apply to C32/55 AMG crowd too.

Bilal

Cntlaw, could I please have a bigger copy of the middle picture on the top line of your sig?

Thanks.

s4iscool

On average, C32's were more expensive than M3's and the C55 continues that.

I can drive manual and drive it well, but when I got the C32, one reason was for the auto. Kids dont get the MB because its not as "hip" with their "cool" crowds. Ive seen enough college, highschool kids zippin around thinking they are the ***** in their little M3;s/ So, while you may not fit this category, the majority Ive seen do.

Any way you slice it, SMG is still an auto and they always will be.

Thai

So, i assume that ALL C32 AMG owners are mature, highly educated, high-earning corporate leaders??? Somehow, i just don't think so. The fact that you assume the worst for M3 owners (and best for C32 owners) show your ignorance to be totally honest.

From my research a year ago, C32 AMGs are slightly cheaper than a nicely equipped M3...giving similar options/features. C55 is slightly more expensive with similar features.

If "cool" people buy M3's, then what does that make C32 owners??!! Yeah, i think that you answered that one already in your response. Even though i am now a Mercedes owner, i think that you guys are ridiculous in your arguments. Come on...you are now blaming people for owning M3's and categorizing them as poor, uneducated, momma's boy, etc.. Now, i understand if you guys are SL55 AMG owners looking down on M3...but come on, you have a C32 AMG that is in the SAME price bracket as M3 (and same performance)...thus, same prestige factor. With Mercedes going down in quality (as all German brands), i see that Mercedes is gradually losing it's prestige.

Explain to me how SMg is an automatic tranny...please, i am dying to hear this! You claim that it's an automatic tranny...in what way?? Does it have a torque converter (BY DEFINITION)?? No. Does SMG have a clutch just like the 6MT M3?? Yes. Is the SMG tranny EXACTLY like the 6MT counterpart?? Yes. The ONLY difference is the hydraulic system used to depress the manual tranny clutch...there's no power-robbing torque converter (as in C32/C55). BTW, SMG weighs just 18 lbs heavier than 6MT...this cannot be said of auto trannies, including AMG's.

So, why did you get the C32's slushbox, especially when you're criticizing M3 owners for owning SMG?? Isn't that hypocrisy??!! BTW, after playing around with my G500 auto-manual, there's simply no comparison with SMG. Yes, i know that AMG tranny is 35% faster, but the tactile "feel" of the shifts is far superior with SMG.

s4iscool

SMG = auto. You dont push a clutch and you dont move a gear shifter, therefore the car is doing work that a human used to MANUALLY do. You can try to argue your point all day, and Ill never believe that SMG is not an auto.

No, I do not believe that all C32s owners are perfect model citizens, but there is a clear distinction in the owner or a C32 and a M3 in my neck of the woods. Thats all I need to make my decision.

As for the auto, Im not defending the AMG Speedshift, because honestly, I never use it and realize its mainly a gimmick. When I am critical of boy racers in their AUTO M3;s, I only raise that point, because without the auto, they wouldnt be able to drive the 6mt fast enough to compete with the likes of a V6 honda accord. If a kid purchased his own M3 with money he earned, and knows how to properly operate and push a 6mt M3, then Ill have respect for them...till today, I have yet to see that.

Of course Im generalizing...but hey, thats what we all do.

Thai

So, basically, you have no idea what DEFINES A MANUAL TRANNY. Oh well, i guess that you need a lot to learn about cars because you're showing your ignorance on the topic.

So, you bought your C32 because of "speedshift" auto...then turn around and ***** at M3 owners with SMG (a true manual tranny)...does that make sense to anyone else???????!!! That's funny! In my eyes, you're just as bad as the people you criticize...even worst because they drive a manual car, you don't.

So, let me get this straight...you have never seen a M3 with manual tranny before??? I bet you that there are many more M3 owners who EARN THEIR LIVING than M3 owners who use their parent's money. Same applies to C32/55 owners.

I think that i am done on this thread...s4iscool, i hope that you learn more about cars (and the DEFINITION of a manual tranny) and bashing M3 owners is not the way to do it.

s4iscool

I told you, I dont care what you think a manual is, but SMG is not a manual. It may have parts similar to a true manual, but you are not stepping on a clutch and you are not moving a gear shifter...UNDASTAND? You will never get my respect on the track if you are racing a SMG/DSG/F1 type transmission unless I know that you can handle the car just as well with a true manual.

My point about kids getting the SMG in the M3 is that they get it because many CANT drive a 6mt properly, but they still want the M3 for show...therefore the SMG AUTO is a perfect solution. You get the looks, near performance of the 6mt M3, and you can do it all while just pushing the throttle. Dont take any skill there and gets no respect from me.

Next point is, for myself, I know how to drive a manual, yet I chose the C32 for a number of reasons and one was its auto and cruising characteristics. The auto in the C32 wasnt a crtuch for me to buy it. Ive got enough oppourtunities to operate a manual engine whether its racing a bike or tracking my cars, and thats why I didnt want it in the C32...UNDASTAND?

I also know that there probably are competent respectful M3 drivers...but if you can read, you will see Im speaking of only MY experiences with M3 "owners". Dont take it so personal.

cntlaw

ok , will send you a bigger one by email

cntlaw

Hi guys, I wasn't reading the debates in details.
Here are prices and equipment list in Hong Kong.
I paid HK$ 857,000 for the C55 with fully loaded options except mobile phone and NAV. The BMW M3 price is HK$719,950 and based on the 'standard equipment list below, The manual M3 sold at this price is obviously already pretty fully loaded. ( see list below ). Even adding the M3's SMG for HK$50,000

The difference is still HK$ 87050 ~=USD 11,000


I am not coming for the debate ; just I am only curious why in USA the M3 is even more expensive than the C55?
Here we always pay 10-15% more for an MB than its BMW equivalences.

cnt


Hong Kong C55 Equipment List

Below are M3:-

The BMW M3
M for Muscle
M for Magnificent,
M for Mighty.

Total Price: $719,950


Hong Kong BMW M3 Standard Equipment :-
6-speed manual transmission
Nappa leather upholstery
Interior trim. Titanium shadow
Height and reach adjustable steering wheel
Driver's and front passenger airbags, occupation detector
ITS head airbags for driver and front passenger
Side airbags for rear passengers
Electrically glass sliding / tilting sunroof
Sport leather steering wheel with multi function keys and cruise control
Electric foldable and heated outside mirrors
Exterior mirror package
Electric front seats with memory function for driver's seat
Seat with adjustment
Sports seats for driver and front passenger
DSC III Dynamic Stability Control
Variable "M" differential
ASC + T
Cornering brake control (CBC)
BMW "M" light alloy wheels in multiple-spoke
Front: 8J x 18 with 225/45 ZR 18 tyres, rear: 9J x 18 with 255/40 ZR 18 tyres
Tyre pressure Deflation Warning System (DWS)
"M" sports suspension
Power windows
Radio remote control for central locking system
Auto dipping interior mirror
On-board monitor and on board computer
Park distance control (PDC)
Rain sensor
Individual high-gloss Satin chrome
Center front armrest
Xenon headlights
Head light washer system
Velour floor mats
Individual white side indicator lights
Special "M" round fog lights integrated in "M" style front spoiler
"M" rear spoiler lip and side skirts
"M" quad exhaust pipes
Metallic or non-metallic colour
Climate control automatic air-conditioner with automatic air recirculaiton control and micro filter
EWS III anti-theft warning device and electronic immobilizer
Integrated BMW AM/FM Business RDS receiver with auto reverse Dolby cass, trunk mounted BMW 6 CD changer, top quality Hi-Fi loudspeaker system Harman Kardon, rear screen aerial diversity
Manufacturer's warranty for the first 24 months / unlimited mileage and distributor's maintenance service package for the first 12 months / unlimited mileage

Thai

BTW, on a track, SMG M3 will almost always beat 6MT M3...since you've been at the tracks, then i assume you know the advantage of SMG. BTW, at BMW schools, M3's come with SMG because this is where you can take full advantage of SMG.

Also, driving SMG smoothly is not easy...it takes weeks to months to master. Hmm, does that remind you of a manual tranny?? Ask ANY M3 owner who has SMG and they will tell you the same. Fact is, you have no idea what SMG is nor have driven it long enough to appreciate it. Take it from a former M3 SMG owner, it's a beautiful thing to have on the track. "UNDASTAND"?! Track is where M3 are famous for...and this is exactly where SMG flourishes!

The ONLY place where 6MT has the advantage is in 0-60 times.

Again, you ASSUME that all SMG drivers can't drive stick (from your "experience"). From my point of view, you're just as bad. You have a true slushbox because you can't handle MT in your daily driving...that's being a wussy (putting it nicely)! I UNDASTAND completely.

Your opinion on SMG has no basis whatsoever. What does "auto" mean to a true mechanic?? That's what i mean. Your bias assessment is full of holes! It just shows that you're grabbing for straws in your arguments.

s4iscool

Thai, first off, enough with the cheesy english cliches.

Now, let me repeat, I dont care what you or your english dictionary gives as the definition of an auto or manual transmission. You believe what you want, and Ill believe what I want. ok? Ive been around the track enough to know that enthusiasts/experts worth having respect for, would never trade their manual for a SMG/DSG/F1 type gearbox, even if the SMG is faster around the track.

Now, what tranny comes in that MB of yours? An auto, so I guess you are a wussy too? I guess we are all wussies for driving autos, but id be first to call you one if and when you ever take a car or bike to the track and ride with me But im sure you made your decision on the G for comfort, luxury and utility right? Same with me in the C32, ive got other transportation that gives me all the manual satisfaction I need

btw, why did you sell the M3?

Thai

I sold the M3 because i missed off-roading. I used to off-road quite a bit before the M3 with my 4runner. For off-roading, automatic tranny is better for most obstacles (except when going down a steep hill). Thus, i would still pick automatic IF G500 had a choice between manual and auto. But, i would never pick automatic in a sports car...it's either manual or SMG/DSG. As SMG/DSG technology advances, i am leaning towards it in my future sports car. Quite frankly, i will never match SMG/DSG shifting skills as a manual driver...and i doubt anyone could unless you're a professional drag racer.

Here are pics of my recent off-roading in Colorado:

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/showth...&threadid=5881

I do try and use the G-wagen to it's potential.................and going to the mall. :p

Darba

The M3 here in MA goes for $54k preatty much fully loaded, +tax. The final price of my c55 was $60k and with a 2k discount not to mention I did not get the luxury option or the lighting option which would have been well over $62k. Thats almoust $10k difference in price. Besides BMW is comming out with the new 3 series in a matter of months and i did not want to drive a new M3 that looks like and old one in just 6 months. Even though I do miss my clutch. Speedshift and a manual transmision are worlds apart, imo at least. Its an automatic transmission that lets me choose which gear I want. Its not a manual transimssion with a hydrolic clutch like F1 trannys. (thats how it feels at least)