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Despite being a 2019 model (soon-to-be) owner, I have to say the results are a little disappointing. We all know that the piggyback tune guys are having problems tuning the new model, but I would have thought that the ecu tune guys who have real access to the ecu parameters would have this down pat. It seems this is not the case.
Owners like me look toward piggyback solutions because in some of our respective regions/markets, dealers particularly look for reflashes of the ecu and they will void your warranty. We accept the limitations of what a piggyback can achieve compared to a full blown ecu tune to circumvent these situations. Often, we wait for the warranty period to elapse and then go for an ecu tune. However, warranty periods can be 5 years in some markets and that's long time to wait.
It seems really odd that the 2019 facelift model doesn't achieve good results with an ecu tune. No wonder the piggyback guys are having problems.
Perhaps it has to do with some other thresholds in the ecu tune that have not yet been identified/recognised and raised/augmented accordingly and is thus holding back the torque. I used to be in the tuning business about a decade ago and had relevant training with Alientech and CMD at the time, but I'll admit I don't know what is what with the technology nowadays, so I'm not an expert.
I am really afraid that if it all has to do with thresholds in the ecu holding back the performance, I don't think the piggyback guys will ever be able to find a solution. I hope I am wrong!
One question, though, does the pre facelift model have a different transmission?
Despite being a 2019 model (soon-to-be) owner, I have to say the results are a little disappointing. We all know that the piggyback tune guys are having problems tuning the new model, but I would have thought that the ecu tune guys who have real access to the ecu parameters would have this down pat. It seems this is not the case.
Owners like me look toward piggyback solutions because in some of our respective regions/markets, dealers particularly look for reflashes of the ecu and they will void your warranty. We accept the limitations of what a piggyback can achieve compared to a full blown ecu tune to circumvent these situations. Often, we wait for the warranty period to elapse and then go for an ecu tune. However, warranty periods can be 5 years in some markets and that's long time to wait.
It seems really odd that the 2019 facelift model doesn't achieve good results with an ecu tune. No wonder the piggyback guys are having problems.
Perhaps it has to do with some other thresholds in the ecu tune that have not yet been identified/recognised and raised/augmented accordingly and is thus holding back the torque. I used to be in the tuning business about a decade ago and had relevant training with Alientech and CMD at the time, but I'll admit I don't know what is what with the technology nowadays, so I'm not an expert.
I am really afraid that if it all has to do with thresholds in the ecu holding back the performance, I don't think the piggyback guys will ever be able to find a solution. I hope I am wrong!
One question, though, does the pre facelift model have a different transmission?
OK let's look at the numbers again closely.
Bear in mind it was only running UK 97 RON not the recommended 98 RON , and it's a dynojet.
We can see gains of 50hp above the original curve and 100 lb ft torque over stock . For torque that was the gain of the peak amount as well.
For power the peak gain at the top was only 13 hp (but up to 50hp lower down) and it peaks for longer.
If you ignore the actual numbers and look shifts in the curve, that's exactly how it feels. There's something at the top end which is stopping the tune make more significantly power than it should compared to a Pre FL. Hopefully when Jerry at Eurocharged receives the logs he will make some changes, and then we'll try a new map ,on 98 RON , and see how it goes.
The pre facelift has the same 9 speed , is it programmed differently, I don't know? In Europe atleast, the FL has a particulate filter so not sure if that has anything to do with it.
Looks like something happens after 3,000rpm and takes a dive down close to stock numbers at 5,000rpm, whereas the preFL continues one healthily from 3,000rpm to 5,000rpm..
I am really afraid that if it all has to do with thresholds in the ecu holding back the performance, I don't think the piggyback guys will ever be able to find a solution. I hope I am wrong!
We are seeing pretty good feedback on 2019 models with JB4 + BCM added. The BCM seems to be the difference maker.
hi, so had another map loaded, and did some new runs.
Overall the most it would make is a PEAK WHP gain of about 26 WHP ( but 50 WHP under the curve).
Torque wise around 102 lb ft gain at the wheels.
You can really feel the huge torque gains and better top end, and obviously pops aggressively on down shifts.
Re top end, it must be something to do with the EPF fitted to EU cars, Jerri from Eurocharged said that's all he could get out of the top end.
This is a bit poor compared to pre FL recaps which I've seen get over 400 whp on stage 1.
Also we still has the torque limit error pop up 1x on fast on and off throttle applications, so he removed those codes and so far it hasn't happened again touchwood, let's see.
Be interested to see what other FL owners are getting wo th see stage 1 in Europe?
2019 C43 AMG Coupe, Mountune Ford Focus RS, Range Rover Sport
I am also in the UK and have a 2019 Coupe with JB4, BMS Intakes and the JB4 Boost Control Module wired in.
Terry and the guys over at BMS have been great and continue to help me achieve the best performance that can be attained from the 2019 model, safely and without significant hardware changes etc.
As per the attached Dragy stats, a 3.77 sec 0-60 and an 11.93 1/4 mile@117.37mph (equates to approx 486hp) isn't too shabby in my book!
I think the answer is simple with regard to extracting the most from the 2019 model, you either wait for the tuning community (Flash and Piggy) to get a handle on the nuances of the 2019 and present you with a nice shiny and well sorted 'plug and play' solution flash etc., which they will of course.
Or, in the meantime have some fun as I am doing (as well as being educated in the process), in working with your preferred tuner and accepting the fact that you are going to have to do some of the heavy lifting.
Each to their own of course but I am really enjoying the latter as am learning things that ordinarily I wouldn't.
Ok, maybe a little knowledge can be a dangerous thing!! Then I will only have myself to blame...
hi, so had another map loaded, and did some new runs.
Overall the most it would make is a PEAK WHP gain of about 26 WHP ( but 50 WHP under the curve).
Torque wise around 102 lb ft gain at the wheels.
You can really feel the huge torque gains and better top end, and obviously pops aggressively on down shifts.
Re top end, it must be something to do with the EPF fitted to EU cars, Jerri from Eurocharged said that's all he could get out of the top end.
This is a bit poor compared to pre FL recaps which I've seen get over 400 whp on stage 1.
Also we still has the torque limit error pop up 1x on fast on and off throttle applications, so he removed those codes and so far it hasn't happened again touchwood, let's see.
Be interested to see what other FL owners are getting wo th see stage 1 in Europe?
I’m FL owner from Malaysia running EC tune as well, haven’t got chance to Dyno. Any idea how EPF looks like underneath the car ? I did delete resonator but I couldn’t see EPF there .
I am also in the UK and have a 2019 Coupe with JB4, BMS Intakes and the JB4 Boost Control Module wired in.
Terry and the guys over at BMS have been great and continue to help me achieve the best performance that can be attained from the 2019 model, safely and without significant hardware changes etc.
As per the attached Dragy stats, a 3.77 sec 0-60 and an 11.93 1/4 mile@117.37mph (equates to approx 486hp) isn't too shabby in my book!
I think the answer is simple with regard to extracting the most from the 2019 model, you either wait for the tuning community (Flash and Piggy) to get a handle on the nuances of the 2019 and present you with a nice shiny and well sorted 'plug and play' solution flash etc., which they will of course.
Or, in the meantime have some fun as I am doing (as well as being educated in the process), in working with your preferred tuner and accepting the fact that you are going to have to do some of the heavy lifting.
Each to their own of course but I am really enjoying the latter as am learning things that ordinarily I wouldn't.
Ok, maybe a little knowledge can be a dangerous thing!! Then I will only have myself to blame...
2019 C43 AMG Coupe, Mountune Ford Focus RS, Range Rover Sport
Unfortunately not and not just a case of using Map 3 which puts it back to stock but with ODBII logging, as I would also have to put the OEM intakes back on for true stock times..
2019 C43 AMG Coupe, Mountune Ford Focus RS, Range Rover Sport
Originally Posted by AhEmGee
hi, so had another map loaded, and did some new runs.
Overall the most it would make is a PEAK WHP gain of about 26 WHP ( but 50 WHP under the curve).
Torque wise around 102 lb ft gain at the wheels.
You can really feel the huge torque gains and better top end, and obviously pops aggressively on down shifts.
Re top end, it must be something to do with the EPF fitted to EU cars, Jerri from Eurocharged said that's all he could get out of the top end.
This is a bit poor compared to pre FL recaps which I've seen get over 400 whp on stage 1.
Also we still has the torque limit error pop up 1x on fast on and off throttle applications, so he removed those codes and so far it hasn't happened again touchwood, let's see.
Be interested to see what other FL owners are getting wo th see stage 1 in Europe?
In messing around with my 19, the only DTC's I have seen are consistently those associated with fuelling, typically fuel rail pressure being too low. Both Terry over at BMS and I believe that at quite high boost requests up the top end (on the more aggressive maps) the 19 cannot supply enough fuel. The stock fuel pump on the 19 doesn't seem to be up to it, at that level
I don't know whether the pre-facelift 43's have the same fuel pump? I ask because I haven't heard of anyone getting such issues on aggressive Maps before?
Don't fancy getting into changing pumps really but do accept from experience that there aren't many instances in squeezing forced induction engines, where you get away without doing so. What's frankly amazing with the C43 is the significant power that can be squeezed without a pump change!
In messing around with my 19, the only DTC's I have seen are consistently those associated with fuelling, typically fuel rail pressure being too low. Both Terry over at BMS and I believe that at quite high boost requests up the top end (on the more aggressive maps) the 19 cannot supply enough fuel. The stock fuel pump on the 19 doesn't seem to be up to it, at that level
I don't know whether the pre-facelift 43's have the same fuel pump? I ask because I haven't heard of anyone getting such issues on aggressive Maps before?
Don't fancy getting into changing pumps really but do accept from experience that there aren't many instances in squeezing forced induction engines, where you get away without doing so. What's frankly amazing with the C43 is the significant power that can be squeezed without a pump change!
On a separate note, how easy did you find the BMS intakes to install & did you notice a tangible improvement in performance/ throttle response?
2019 C43 AMG Coupe, Mountune Ford Focus RS, Range Rover Sport
Originally Posted by AhEmGee
On a separate note, how easy did you find the BMS intakes to install & did you notice a tangible improvement in performance/ throttle response?
Very easy except for the heat shields which needed modding for EU 19's as MB have re-routed the fuel line for each bank to exactly the position where the heat shield is supposed to go. I don't believe anyone, including BMS were aware of this change in fuel line routing.
BMS were great and offered to to either refund me or quickly make some custom shields and ship them to me. Being of the impatient kind, I said I will have a go in my workshop and create a template which BMS now have and I have shields in place as BMS intended:-)
Most noticeable change of course is noise.....you can now very clearly hear the turbos spooling up and the dump valves blowing off. Very, very childish and I cannot imagine why any grown man would want such a thing.........cough, cough
Anyway, the most tangible benefit is throttle response, the intakes really do make a difference on my 19 for both stock and tuned performamce.
If there is an actual small power increase, I couldn't honestly say. I wanted to sharpen up what to me was a dull stock throttle response. It has absolutely succeeded in that regard.
2019 C43 AMG Coupe, Mountune Ford Focus RS, Range Rover Sport
Whatever you do DON'T BUY A DRAGY:-)
I used to be a normal guy with a wife, kids a job and other important responsibilities..........until the day I bought a 'Dragy'.
I now find myself alone on a local track doing dragster type stuff or laying in wait late at night near a favourite piece of appropriate public highway to better the time I did 5 minutes ago!!
Very, very addictive.........rehab for me then, just one more run though before I go.............
I used to be a normal guy with a wife, kids a job and other important responsibilities..........until the day I bought a 'Dragy'.
I now find myself alone on a local track doing dragster type stuff or laying in wait late at night near a favourite piece of appropriate public highway to better the time I did 5 minutes ago!!
Very, very addictive.........rehab for me then, just one more run though before I go.............
Haha re Dragy. As you know too late for that!
Unfortunately for me, the best bit of private half mile road is about 15 miles away, and trust me I've looked in detail.
The Dragy is a very useful tool to compare results for tuned vs stock etc. My acceleration times are vastly improved despite the above map issues.
Any news on the EC tune for facelift 2019 model? Have they made a breakthrough yet.
I have been sent the V4 update ( not sure why I didn't get the EC V4 in the 1st place) which he's also made OPF delete compatible should I want to do that.
Can't feel any difference in the butt dyno yet so will do some Dragy runs soon hopefully.
However I believe the V4 was honed for the prefacelift still.
What's the V4 tune? I can only see V3 on their site which is what I have
Just the latest revision of the software from EC for the M276 engine.
Several of the fastest C43s, tuned by EC Canada have it.
You can't get it via MSL as EC only seem to send them older V3.
06-22-2019, 06:07 PM
