2010 changes confirmed
03-17-2009, 11:34 AM
#26
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W164 ML500,SMART For two,1994 C280(5speed manual) 1999 C230k station wagon
The current "63" powerplant is here to stay at least for the W204 series and I am sure that they will bump up the current platform a few notches in terms of performance and efficiency.
03-17-2009, 11:43 AM
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C63
The article on the S5 was in Autoweek. Said expect Audi to put a DSG in the next gen S5 (which looks sooooo much better in 3D than in print...talk about a sexy coupe...a subtle knock-out). It'll probably mean the end of the manual tranny in the S5, surefire way to make folks hot under the collar. My initial thinking was that the DSG's couldn't handle the V8's power. I know Porsche is putting their PDK in the 911 Turbo so the dual-clutch can definitely handle close to 500hp. And Audi wants DSG in the R8-v10.
I think Merc has too much invested in the 6.3l V8 to abandon and go back to a V6, maybe I should say hoping. Would be great if Merc let the M3 and RS4 step back to V6's while the C63 holds firm. The downside is that they're putting it in the SLS which could mean it's nearing the end of it's lifecycle as they trick it out for the supercar. BMW jumped back into turbos and have a leg up so I'm guessing Merc will go with supercharged V6's???
Any thoughts??
03-17-2009, 11:44 AM
#28
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One with 4 wheels
OP states it is confirmed, you "heard" it isn't.
As of right now, everything seems to be mere hearsay.
03-17-2009, 11:47 AM
#29
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I imagine they keep a V8 in the RS4. I always felt like Audi saturated the A4 line having the S and the RS, especially when both got V8's.
The article on the S5 was in Autoweek. Said expect Audi to put a DSG in the next gen S5 (which looks sooooo much better in 3D than in print...talk about a sexy coupe...a subtle knock-out). It'll probably mean the end of the manual tranny in the S5, surefire way to make folks hot under the collar. My initial thinking was that the DSG's couldn't handle the V8's power. I know Porsche is putting their PDK in the 911 Turbo so the dual-clutch can definitely handle close to 500hp. And Audi wants DSG in the R8-v10.
I think Merc has too much invested in the 6.3l V8 to abandon and go back to a V6, maybe I should say hoping. Would be great if Merc let the M3 and RS4 step back to V6's while the C63 holds firm. The downside is that they're putting it in the SLS which could mean it's nearing the end of it's lifecycle as they trick it out for the supercar. BMW jumped back into turbos and have a leg up so I'm guessing Merc will go with supercharged V6's???
Any thoughts??
The article on the S5 was in Autoweek. Said expect Audi to put a DSG in the next gen S5 (which looks sooooo much better in 3D than in print...talk about a sexy coupe...a subtle knock-out). It'll probably mean the end of the manual tranny in the S5, surefire way to make folks hot under the collar. My initial thinking was that the DSG's couldn't handle the V8's power. I know Porsche is putting their PDK in the 911 Turbo so the dual-clutch can definitely handle close to 500hp. And Audi wants DSG in the R8-v10.
I think Merc has too much invested in the 6.3l V8 to abandon and go back to a V6, maybe I should say hoping. Would be great if Merc let the M3 and RS4 step back to V6's while the C63 holds firm. The downside is that they're putting it in the SLS which could mean it's nearing the end of it's lifecycle as they trick it out for the supercar. BMW jumped back into turbos and have a leg up so I'm guessing Merc will go with supercharged V6's???
Any thoughts??
Merc needs to go either TT, or remain with big block layouts if they want to retain their competitive edge.
03-17-2009, 12:24 PM
#30
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Definitely some incorrect information in this thread regarding engine setups.
First off, a V6 will never sound like cross plane V8. Sound is dictated by harmonics, which is dictated by engine configuration. While there can be differences (Ford sound vs. Chevy sound, etc), it will never be dramatic enough to where one could mistake a V6 for a cross plane V8. I say cross plane, because a flat crank V8 (think Ferrari) does have a unique sound that could be confused for another configuration by someone who is not familiar with that setup.
Secondly, a stock forced induction car (supercharged or turbocharged) is going to be easier and cheaper to modify (at least anything south of full engine rebuilds and standalone engine management) than an N/A set up 95% of the time, even if the N/A set up has 2 more cylinders. It is much easier to make large amounts of power on a V6TT S4 as compared to a V8 S4. This is because cars that receive forced induction from the factory are engineered to handle that type of set up from the get go. Their engine management systems are designed to compensate for above atmospheric pressure conditions and generally the engines have been strengthened to handle the load. There are exceptions to everything, but the E55K is easier to modify than the E63. Look at Supras, Evo's, WRX's, etc. And I urge you to go check out the Audi and VW world and you'll find the same thing. People are making good gains on the BMW 335i for little money.
Now I personally decided to buy an NA V8 car because I wanted the sound and power delivery associated with it. I've worked on and owned turbo cars and there is no denying the ease of modification on that type of set up.
And finally, the C43 was not made in 2001. Not really important, but just a note.
First off, a V6 will never sound like cross plane V8. Sound is dictated by harmonics, which is dictated by engine configuration. While there can be differences (Ford sound vs. Chevy sound, etc), it will never be dramatic enough to where one could mistake a V6 for a cross plane V8. I say cross plane, because a flat crank V8 (think Ferrari) does have a unique sound that could be confused for another configuration by someone who is not familiar with that setup.
Secondly, a stock forced induction car (supercharged or turbocharged) is going to be easier and cheaper to modify (at least anything south of full engine rebuilds and standalone engine management) than an N/A set up 95% of the time, even if the N/A set up has 2 more cylinders. It is much easier to make large amounts of power on a V6TT S4 as compared to a V8 S4. This is because cars that receive forced induction from the factory are engineered to handle that type of set up from the get go. Their engine management systems are designed to compensate for above atmospheric pressure conditions and generally the engines have been strengthened to handle the load. There are exceptions to everything, but the E55K is easier to modify than the E63. Look at Supras, Evo's, WRX's, etc. And I urge you to go check out the Audi and VW world and you'll find the same thing. People are making good gains on the BMW 335i for little money.
Now I personally decided to buy an NA V8 car because I wanted the sound and power delivery associated with it. I've worked on and owned turbo cars and there is no denying the ease of modification on that type of set up.
And finally, the C43 was not made in 2001. Not really important, but just a note.
03-17-2009, 12:30 PM
#31
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Definitely some incorrect information in this thread regarding engine setups.
First off, a V6 will never sound like cross plane V8. Sound is dictated by harmonics, which is dictated by engine configuration. While there can be differences (Ford sound vs. Chevy sound, etc), it will never be dramatic enough to where one could mistake a V6 for a cross plane V8. I say cross plane, because a flat crank V8 (think Ferrari) does have a unique sound that could be confused for another configuration by someone who is not familiar with that setup.
Secondly, a stock forced induction car (supercharged or turbocharged) is going to be easier and cheaper to modify (at least anything south of full engine rebuilds and standalone engine management) than an N/A set up 95% of the time, even if the N/A set up has 2 more cylinders. It is much easier to make large amounts of power on a V6TT S4 as compared to a V8 S4. This is because cars that receive forced induction from the factory are engineered to handle that type of set up from the get go. Their engine management systems are designed to compensate for above atmospheric pressure conditions and generally the engines have been strengthened to handle the load. There are exceptions to everything, but the E55K is easier to modify than the E63. Look at Supras, Evo's, WRX's, etc. And I urge you to go check out the Audi and VW world and you'll find the same thing. People are making good gains on the BMW 335i for little money.
Now I personally decided to buy an NA V8 car because I wanted the sound and power delivery associated with it. I've worked on and owned turbo cars and there is no denying the ease of modification on that type of set up.
And finally, the C43 was not made in 2001. Not really important, but just a note.
First off, a V6 will never sound like cross plane V8. Sound is dictated by harmonics, which is dictated by engine configuration. While there can be differences (Ford sound vs. Chevy sound, etc), it will never be dramatic enough to where one could mistake a V6 for a cross plane V8. I say cross plane, because a flat crank V8 (think Ferrari) does have a unique sound that could be confused for another configuration by someone who is not familiar with that setup.
Secondly, a stock forced induction car (supercharged or turbocharged) is going to be easier and cheaper to modify (at least anything south of full engine rebuilds and standalone engine management) than an N/A set up 95% of the time, even if the N/A set up has 2 more cylinders. It is much easier to make large amounts of power on a V6TT S4 as compared to a V8 S4. This is because cars that receive forced induction from the factory are engineered to handle that type of set up from the get go. Their engine management systems are designed to compensate for above atmospheric pressure conditions and generally the engines have been strengthened to handle the load. There are exceptions to everything, but the E55K is easier to modify than the E63. Look at Supras, Evo's, WRX's, etc. And I urge you to go check out the Audi and VW world and you'll find the same thing. People are making good gains on the BMW 335i for little money.
Now I personally decided to buy an NA V8 car because I wanted the sound and power delivery associated with it. I've worked on and owned turbo cars and there is no denying the ease of modification on that type of set up.
And finally, the C43 was not made in 2001. Not really important, but just a note.
My mistake.
03-17-2009, 06:15 PM
#32
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09' C63 AMG
The 63'S V8 is pure muscle and power, Sure the GTR and Porsche Turbo may be faster, but that doesn’t mean everyone would prefer these cars. If you think the V8 is lazy... than pop on a TT and let’s see what happens
Its almost like cheating, or like comparing a modded car to a stock car...
The V8 engine is naturally a beast, I TT'ed my Infiniti G35 which I sold, it was fun but I love the 63 engine much better, Just my opinion...
Its almost like cheating, or like comparing a modded car to a stock car...
The V8 engine is naturally a beast, I TT'ed my Infiniti G35 which I sold, it was fun but I love the 63 engine much better, Just my opinion...
