Should i follow the mercedes break-in method or not?
07-26-2009, 10:59 AM
#51
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Well go ahead and put diesel in your car, everyone knows it those evil lawyers that wrote the manual are in league with the oil companies. Don't ever change your oil either. Infact to the opposite of the manual, its just a joke.
OliverK, doesn't even own an AMG, so of course we should take his advise over the MB manual.
OliverK, doesn't even own an AMG, so of course we should take his advise over the MB manual.
07-26-2009, 12:19 PM
#52
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96 and 08 911 turbos
Well go ahead and put diesel in your car, everyone knows it those evil lawyers that wrote the manual are in league with the oil companies. Don't ever change your oil either. Infact to the opposite of the manual, its just a joke.
OliverK, doesn't even own an AMG, so of course we should take his advise over the MB manual.
OliverK, doesn't even own an AMG, so of course we should take his advise over the MB manual.
If I wanted an AMG, I would have bought one. I don't think mercedes makes a very good performance car. But then, I've assembled a 700rwhp 4.6 DOHC all aluminum V8, so obviously I have clue about performance engines.
what a joke.
07-26-2009, 12:22 PM
#53
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96 and 08 911 turbos
Oliverk has a point about mods and the manual..After I get mine in a month, I'll follow the following break in to the T and then pop the car on a dyno. That's probably about the only thing that will settle this. I think part of the reason MB and all manufacturers have a "baby it" break in policy is that most people simply don't know how to drive properly. They don't allow the motor/tranny and all fluids to warm up properly before hammering it. Also, a proper break-in procedure can be a PITA to follow, hence the broad stroke of "take it easy" for the first thousand miles.
From what I've been able to discern, this is what I plan to do:
1. For the first 100 miles, in the same day, after allowing for a full warm up period, smoothly vary the RPMs across the entire range in as many gears as possible, no hard starts or kickdowns. Then change the oil.
2. Pop the car on a dyno then get the other gears worked like above that coudn't get due to risk of a speeding ticket. Change oil again.
3. Same as number 1 but up to 500 miles. Change oil.
4. Back on dyno for a few more pulls, then should be good to go, change oil at 1000.
After passing 1000 miles, then all shift modes are OK.
Even after a proper break-in, the car still needs ample time to warm up. Then just be smooth with the throttle and shifting..
Thoughts?? Should I put my fire suit on??
From what I've been able to discern, this is what I plan to do:
1. For the first 100 miles, in the same day, after allowing for a full warm up period, smoothly vary the RPMs across the entire range in as many gears as possible, no hard starts or kickdowns. Then change the oil.
2. Pop the car on a dyno then get the other gears worked like above that coudn't get due to risk of a speeding ticket. Change oil again.
3. Same as number 1 but up to 500 miles. Change oil.
4. Back on dyno for a few more pulls, then should be good to go, change oil at 1000.
After passing 1000 miles, then all shift modes are OK.
Even after a proper break-in, the car still needs ample time to warm up. Then just be smooth with the throttle and shifting..
Thoughts?? Should I put my fire suit on??
If you haven't, read through www.mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm.
Also remember to do all your pulls in manual mode so you can engine brake.
07-26-2009, 12:56 PM
#54
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my wife wild, but she loves every minute of it.
The lady doth protest too much, methinks. (Hamlet Act 3, scene 2, 222–230)
07-26-2009, 01:07 PM
#55
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96 and 08 911 turbos
The lady doth protest too much, methinks. (Hamlet Act 3, scene 2, 222–230)
Oh, and if you do further reading on the mototune website, he concurs that the manuals are written to avoid liability:
Cognitive Dissonance is the biggest barrier to this, because we'll never get to the point of understanding, if we can't get past thinking:
"That's the way it's always been done ... "
Or Especially:
" The manufacturers must know best "
How much time ...
... do you think the motorcycle manufacturers spend thinking of ways to avoid
unfair lawsuits that take large chunks out of their hard earned profits?
One of the best ways to avoid lawsuits is to avoid accidents in the first place ! It stands to reason that the first miles on a new and unfamiliar bike are the most likely to produce an accident.
Conveniently, this same period of time is also known as the "break in period"
"Connecting The Dots"
Nowadays, "Break-in according to the manual" has nothing to do with the engine !!
Think: It's all about avoiding lawsuits from riders who have crashed their new bikes !! (The motorcycle manufacturers simply don't trust you to use your own judgment.)
By using the threat of severe engine damage, new riders are scared into riding slower as they get used to their new bike. Fear is a powerful motivator. More people have their thoughts and actions controlled by fear than by any other source.
Ironically, leaky rings cause combustion blow-by, which is high in acid content. These acids contaminate the oil, and are harmful to all internal engine parts. "The owner's manual break in" actually increases the amount of acid circulating throughout the engine !! "
http://mototuneusa.com/future_horsepower.htm
07-26-2009, 03:56 PM
#56
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now you're just being ridiculous because your argument is based on one crutch You have no real details about who wrote the manual, why they recommend those break in instructions, etc.
If I wanted an AMG, I would have bought one. I don't think mercedes makes a very good performance car. But then, I've assembled a 700rwhp 4.6 DOHC all aluminum V8, so obviously I have clue about performance engines.
what a joke.
If I wanted an AMG, I would have bought one. I don't think mercedes makes a very good performance car. But then, I've assembled a 700rwhp 4.6 DOHC all aluminum V8, so obviously I have clue about performance engines.
what a joke.
07-26-2009, 04:47 PM
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96 and 08 911 turbos
Are you this closed minded about everything in life?
I hope you have the manual memorized because I wouldn't want you to ever do something that it recommends you shouldn't.
That includes burnouts, donuts, racing, modifications, etc.
oh, I just remembered. The manual states that you should not exceed the posted speed limits. Obviously the engineers at AMG don't feel its prudent to exceed posted speed limits. I guess you don't speed either.
I hope you have the manual memorized because I wouldn't want you to ever do something that it recommends you shouldn't.
That includes burnouts, donuts, racing, modifications, etc.
oh, I just remembered. The manual states that you should not exceed the posted speed limits. Obviously the engineers at AMG don't feel its prudent to exceed posted speed limits. I guess you don't speed either.
07-26-2009, 04:58 PM
#58
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C63
Are you this closed minded about everything in life?
I hope you have the manual memorized because I wouldn't want you to ever do something that it recommends you shouldn't.
That includes burnouts, donuts, racing, modifications, etc.
oh, I just remembered. The manual states that you should not exceed the posted speed limits. Obviously the engineers at AMG don't feel its prudent to exceed posted speed limits. I guess you don't speed either.
I hope you have the manual memorized because I wouldn't want you to ever do something that it recommends you shouldn't.
That includes burnouts, donuts, racing, modifications, etc.
oh, I just remembered. The manual states that you should not exceed the posted speed limits. Obviously the engineers at AMG don't feel its prudent to exceed posted speed limits. I guess you don't speed either.
You're the one making the judgement that EVERYTHING in the manual is BS just because you found a few things (regarding speed limit, modding with aftermarket products, etc) to be false.
07-26-2009, 05:04 PM
#59
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96 and 08 911 turbos
Interesting.
Now some things in the manual are false, but the engine break in section isn't. How do you know this? That begs the question, if the lawyers wrote some sections, how do we know they didn't write the others?
Now some things in the manual are false, but the engine break in section isn't. How do you know this? That begs the question, if the lawyers wrote some sections, how do we know they didn't write the others?
07-26-2009, 05:07 PM
#60
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IBL! 
On a more serious note, I would be some what cautious to the break-in period. I kept the car is Comfort mode and tried not to race anyone, although I did floor it from a couple stop lights
On a more serious note, I would be some what cautious to the break-in period. I kept the car is Comfort mode and tried not to race anyone, although I did floor it from a couple stop lights
07-26-2009, 05:08 PM
#61
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The manual clearly has to be written for the LCD. As I stated earlier, most people don't know how to drive a car with this much performance. I was actually surprised at how cheap my insurance quote was..Also, most people do not have the time/patience/desire to properly break in the car for maximum power and longevity. There's no debate that properly sealed piston rings provide more power, and prevent blow by therefore increasing longevity.
This is why I would almost never buy a used C63 or any similar car. I simply don't trust that it was treated in the best way.
It's not to say that the "break in" prescribed by the manual doesn't work, it's likely not the best method if you want the best performance, longevity.
This is why I would almost never buy a used C63 or any similar car. I simply don't trust that it was treated in the best way.
It's not to say that the "break in" prescribed by the manual doesn't work, it's likely not the best method if you want the best performance, longevity.
07-26-2009, 05:15 PM
#62
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C63
Now driving more aggressively than the manual's advice results better performance AND longetivity? Now damn, who should even follow the manual?
07-26-2009, 05:20 PM
#63
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96 and 08 911 turbos
performance and longevity go hand in hand.
performance is generated from the best possible compression from the engine combination.
The way to get this compression is to get the best ring seal possible. I believe that the best way to do this is a hard break in.
The best ring seal also eliminates piston scoring, oil contamination/fuel dillution, blowby, oil burning, etc.
These result in superior longevity.
performance is generated from the best possible compression from the engine combination.
The way to get this compression is to get the best ring seal possible. I believe that the best way to do this is a hard break in.
The best ring seal also eliminates piston scoring, oil contamination/fuel dillution, blowby, oil burning, etc.
These result in superior longevity.
07-26-2009, 05:32 PM
#64
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My previous car was an '06 STi. It only came with a manual, so you had to know what you were doing to get the most out of the car. I think most people that get an auto, simply stand on the gas and don't pay much attention to the tach. Also, they are not smooth with the power application. That's primarily why you would never see in an owner's manual the steps that have been described as a "hard break in" or "aggressive driving"
Again, the owner's manual will work great for a break in. Clearly it has to. BUT, if you want the most out of a car, then that's probably not the way to go.
Again, the owner's manual will work great for a break in. Clearly it has to. BUT, if you want the most out of a car, then that's probably not the way to go.
07-26-2009, 07:54 PM
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my wife wild, but she loves every minute of it.
This video demonstrates break-in, but does not show the disassembly that follows this procedure.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26X_s28ilYs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26X_s28ilYs
07-26-2009, 09:19 PM
#66
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Are you this closed minded about everything in life?
I hope you have the manual memorized because I wouldn't want you to ever do something that it recommends you shouldn't.
That includes burnouts, donuts, racing, modifications, etc.
oh, I just remembered. The manual states that you should not exceed the posted speed limits. Obviously the engineers at AMG don't feel its prudent to exceed posted speed limits. I guess you don't speed either.
I hope you have the manual memorized because I wouldn't want you to ever do something that it recommends you shouldn't.
That includes burnouts, donuts, racing, modifications, etc.
oh, I just remembered. The manual states that you should not exceed the posted speed limits. Obviously the engineers at AMG don't feel its prudent to exceed posted speed limits. I guess you don't speed either.
I hope you don't ever get a prescription from your doctor, because you probably won't take it as prescribed, by you know, the professional that prescribed it.
07-26-2009, 09:29 PM
#67
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96 and 08 911 turbos
Well since you don't actually own an AMG C63, how do you know what's in the manual? Arm chair engineer. Poser engineer. Internet hack engineer. Internet PhD engineer. You're hilarious!
I hope you don't ever get a prescription from your doctor, because you probably won't take it as prescribed, by you know, the professional that prescribed it.
I hope you don't ever get a prescription from your doctor, because you probably won't take it as prescribed, by you know, the professional that prescribed it.
2) Every manual written in the past 15 years recommends that you don't exceed posted limits
3) I'm not an engineer, nor do I claim to be one, internet or otherwise. I'm assuming since you've resulted to this nonsense that you've basically run out of things to say that are relevent. I mean, how many times can you say, "but the engineers say XYZ in the manual" and not provide any support for it.
4) Yeah, I'd follow a doctor's recommendation. But if a well respected internet source suggested that the dosage/prescription was incorrect and explained why, I'd certainly ask my doctor about it.
5) Did you really compare the healing of human life to breaking in an engine? If so, you may want to work on your priorities.
07-26-2009, 09:56 PM
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'09 C63 AMG
IDK...I just took delivery of my '09 C63 AMG yesterday (23 mi. on her), and I removed the MB break-in schedule sticker. I can't say I will redline it everyday for 1,000mi. (in fact, I haven't come close to redline yet; kept it under 5k rpm so far), but I may not completely stick to the suggested break-in parameters either. I've always been told that it's best to vary rpms during break-in and while I don't think you need to "beat on it," I don't necessarily think it's bad to see what she can do either as long as you don't go crazy all the time for the first 1,000mi.
A friend of mine has always driven his cars hard right from the get-go, and never had a problem. In fcat, his cars are usually the fastest among similar cars in the area. This held true for his BMW 335i vs. my BMW 335i. Although I don't always have to be the fastest around, I do think it's cool to have a "factory freak."
Sometimes, I wonder if that's really just a matter of how the car is broken-in. 
A friend of mine has always driven his cars hard right from the get-go, and never had a problem. In fcat, his cars are usually the fastest among similar cars in the area. This held true for his BMW 335i vs. my BMW 335i. Although I don't always have to be the fastest around, I do think it's cool to have a "factory freak."
Sometimes, I wonder if that's really just a matter of how the car is broken-in.
07-27-2009, 10:22 AM
#69
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Well I opened up my manual, since I have one, and on page 252, it says:
The more cautiously you treat your vehicle during the break-in period, the more satisfied you will be with its performance later on.
Drive your vehicle during the first 1000 miles at varying but moderate vehicle and engine speeds.
Additional instructions for AMG Vehicles.
* During the first 1000 miles do not exceed a speed of 85mph
* During this period, avoid engine speeds above 4500 rpm in each gear
* Shift gears in a timely manner
Then at the bottom it says to obey applicable speed limits.
What part of this is confusing? Would you real expect a manual to tell you to disobey the laws? You're hopeless.
