Sincity

For me, the quality doesn't have to exceed OEM and wouldn't hurt if it is a permanent solution as long as the price is right. Brian, at least you are forthcoming unlike Renntech and their sticker shock.

sflgator

Well, to quote Sincity...

"Perhaps we don't need the quality of steel better than OEM. I assume your product will be nice and shiny verus the dull/tarnished OEM pipes." IDK...what is the advantage of having 2 small sections of the oem exhaust made from higher quality 304 SS when the rest of the exhaust is the oem steel?

There are many ppl who would argue that messing with the oem stock C63 AMG exhaust is just plain dumb...why ruin such a great thing. However, if legitimate gains and maybe some slightly better sound can be had from a small modification to the exhaust, then that may be worth a few hundred $$.

Brian GT PRO

Well, here is the thing. The AMG OEM is 304 stainless steel. In my mind using the same or better materials is the right thing to do, for uniformity and durability. Nice and shiny, NO no no, the piping is to have the muted look like OEM piping, shiny shiny does not impress me. Also, the "Single X" is not a small section, it is rather large to be honest, and if coupled as a "Double XX" set up, it accounts for more than 1/2 of the exhaust, so in my mind again, must have OEM fit/finish/durability. On the debate of modify or not to modify, obviously it's a personal choice, but I have provided data to support solid HP/TQ gains, as well as an unadulterated review from a board member, so those who are looking for a bolt on item that produces nice gains through the entire power band, this is a product I think worth considering??.

sflgator

Didn't know the oem exhaust is 304 SS, so yes, I agree with you then in that case.

Brian GT PRO

Awesome, again, thank for all of your input and playing "Devils advocate", I am trying to make sure that I/we at GT PRO do is the right thing for the community, while not going to the poor house, or building parts that people label as garbage

clktoc63

Assuming that the $800 Hpipe doesn't replace the resonator, how about a OEM quality or better, straight pipe with the extra joints included to go back to stock? I would think this would be in the $250-$300 range.

I believe this forum has established that the factory resonator acts as an H-Pipe...that the exhaust gases are equalized within the resonator. There would be no benefit to do it a second time right? In fact, it would almost have to be more restrictive doing so...right?

hhughes1

^^^^^^^^Excellent question. For those of us with MHP long tubes which replace the secondary cats as well, is there a benefit from replacing the resonator with an x pipe and what impact will it have on the decibel level?

MikeG_C63_AMG

How come no one asked if this mod will throw a CEL?

Sincity

How true is that? I thought I read something about that. Has anyone cut a factory resonator open or had that fact verified by a Tech in the AMG Lounge? When Brian posted this, I started Googling "X-Pipe" and found that it is beneficial if the X-pipe/H-pipe is mounted further downstream which would make sense if the resonator also had a H-pipe.

Unbreakable1

no CEL

mthis

i think you wont gain much maybe 2-4 rw maybe. the sound would be louder.

mthis

+1 the only way a CEL will pop up is if the primarys are cut of with out a tune.

here you go if you replace the whole exhaust from primarys to muffler tips with str8 pips you WONT get a CEL light just loud as F***

mthis

BTW guys i just check my resonators bc they of the car and they NOT H PIPES they STR8 pips with hole to prevent loud sound. so who know there maybe gain after all.

https://mbworld.org/forums/attachmen...cross-over.jpg

this is a pic of the resonator a member on this forum took this.

clktoc63

Interesting, it appears that there is a conflict of opinion. That hole shown in your picture, evidently, is the equalization tube. It appears to be the same picture from the following thread...where Dads_C63 confirms that the resonator performs the function of the H Pipe.

https://mbworld.org/forums/c63-amg-w...resonator.html

...and until someone passes him while traversing the quarter-mile, I tend to believe him.

BerBer63

This is correct. It's straight pipes with holes surrounded by baffling.

Brian GT PRO

Hi guys, a few tidbits for you all.

I wanted to just shed a little light on myself and our company, so you guys might get a little better understanding of who I/we are, and that we're not just a bunch of "Yahoos" trying to jump into the market. I don't want anyone to think that I am showing off, or trying to "pat" myself on the back, so please forgive me ahead of time as I try to explain my background. I felt the need to share a bit of background on myself and our company, so you can understand a bit more of my madness. I come from the frame of mind, build the best, offer the best parts and service, and they will come. I have built cars for the last 28 years (wow, I'm getting old), and our company is now 14 years old. I have been involved with Indy cars (back in the late 90's), Alcohol funny cars (early 2000), and various other "street cars" and "weekend warriors". I have been involved with breaking a few world records (air cooled Porsche 852rwhp on race fuel (European Car magazine article 2002), Mitsubishi 6G72 1429 awhp on race fuel), I was in charge of the KIA off road race team's engine program (Paris to Dakar). We are the exclusive dyno shop of the Eurotuner GP dyno challenge, and have worked very closely with Greg, Sam and Elliot at Eurotuner, as well as many times with Rob, Les, and Michael at European Car magazine. Also have lots of knowledge when it comes to building things that are "unorthodox", I think outside of the box, that is my mantra. I have built anything from Mitsubishi, to Ferrari's, Bentley's and yes even Mercedes.

I thrive on invention, and innovation, backed by hard data. If I develop a part, and it does not make power, I either figure out why and correct it, and if I exhaust all my energy and resources and it still does not do what I want, it gets killed, simple as that, I will not put my name on something that I don't feel is worthwhile. Now on the other hand if something like an exhaust item does not make power, but makes the car sound really good, as long as we don't lose power, I will state my exact findings as to there being no performance gain. I have had to do that with many manufacturers parts that I have tested, so trust me when I say, I'm not shy when it comes to that.

When I sell an item or suggest something, I believe in full disclosure, no matter how good or not so good the outcome will be, it's just easier that way, but in this market, you'd be surprised at how many people are afraid to "level" with the client.

Anyhow, enough of my ranting and raving, I'm going to be meeting with my vendors today, to see if I can grind them for better pricing, or ways to cut the costs down ion these items, and I will get back on tonight with the results. Wish me luck!

Sincity

Brian, hurry and post pics so we have an understanding visually of what goes into the product.

EDIT: If the OEM resonator has a small tube to act like an H-pipe, do you suppose the gains are from the removal of the secondary CATs? How about producing a set of pipes that remove the secondary CATs w/o the X? I like the idea of reversibility.

Unbreakable1

ok guys...heres a video...nothing spectacular but gives you an idea

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0C7KTFwv7D8

sflgator

Hmmmm...not sure how I feel about the change in sound from stock. The cold startup sounds just ok (almost less of that deep V8 growl...IDK, more Nissan/Infiniti V6 like; like there's a hole in the muffler or something ) but the start from a standstill sounds great. I think it's one of those things that must be heard in person.

Thanks for doing the video and posting it.

Unbreakable1

its definitely louder and has more growl in person...i wish i had a stock video of my own to compare to, but its a noticeable difference...even once the inital bark drops w/ the rpms, the idle sounds meaner to me

sflgator

Cool...thanks! I think I might be willing to do this 15-min DIY X pipe mod...if Brian figures how to significantly drop the price.

Sincity

It didn't even scare the roach walking across.

I like the way it sounds from a stop.

Brian GT PRO

As promised, here is the update. Sat down with the *keys* to this ordeal, and I was able to work out a few things in regards to lowering the price. The general concensus, is that there needs to be a commitment from me for a min. run of 25 units. Also to cut labor costs, I'm going to try and see how feasible it will be to do the piping 100% on the CNC bender as a twin/singular unit, and minimize welding, this will cut costs. So, based on this, it's going to be an investment for our company, however the result will be drastically lower cost to the end user. Sound good so far? Along with this, I will need to remove sending you a tool included, you will be on your own to have a professional install the unit, or DIY guys you can buy a cutting tool yourself or borrow one from AutoZone. Another idea is if you guys want to buy one tool and pass it around for your installs, it's just a thought. The tool alone cuts $45.00 right off the top, I am also going to remove the slip joint sleeve (the piece that allows you to reinstall the factory 2nd cats), if at any point you want to do a reinstall, you can buy a slip joint all by itself at that time for about $30.00. So, now couple this with the quantity buy and we might be getting close to the target price I think everyone is looking for. It is my feeling that if we make these adjustments, we might be able to get close to a $500.00-600.00 target point, this is just preliminary, I asked them all to sharpen up their pencils, so let's see what they come up with in the next few days.

sflgator

Better, but you should show us all the "cutting tool" (pic? brand? product number, etc.?) you are now thinking of removing and still provide detailed DIY instructions; as you've said, this should be an easy 10-15min. DIY install, right...OR now you think it should be installed by a professional at an exhaust shop?

In addition, although I understand the need for a 25+ unit buy, I for one do not do up-front money for GB's...not sure if you have this in mind or not, but I thought I would mention it just in case. Nothing against you or any other vendor, but I feel safe and secure buying with VISA is the best protection for the consumer in these situations, so I always opt out of "pay now for GB and receive product later."

So, if you can do that, then I may be in depending on your final price point for the Single X-pipe.

btw -- we still need to see detailed pics of your X-pipe.

Sincity

That sounds a helluva lot more reasonable. I wish Harbor Freight carried that exhaust pipe cutter but they don't.