C63 AMG Stainless Steel Header on SALE!!
12-13-2010, 01:15 AM
#27
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SLK 55 AMG
Currently, we don't have the SAE numbers but as soon as I get them I'll post it. We have not dyno with headers on the motor with stock tune... I didn't think ppl would do header only mod. If this is something you would like to see, I'll try to get this information as well. I'll post it up as soon as get them.
12-13-2010, 01:40 PM
#28
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SLK 55 AMG
Sorry we missed your call and yes we are not open on the weekends. We are online shop only. However, all calls are forwarded to my cell phone over the weekend but I was out of town and I guess not in the service area.
12-14-2010, 08:27 PM
#29
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2010 c63 amg
I m gonna post sounds clip soon...great sound ever ...^^
Last edited by joo; 12-14-2010 at 08:31 PM.
12-14-2010, 10:53 PM
#30
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SLK 55 AMG
12-15-2010, 08:11 AM
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slk55, 530i, z4
I met my friend who installed this headers and I saw when his car was on dyno.
Would you please explaine me why it is not possible? This dyno does not show headers only. It is ecu tuned with headers. Not stock car with headers.
12-15-2010, 08:21 AM
#32
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slk55, 530i, z4
The Kleemann exhaust headers would be referred to here (NA) as log style manifolds. They are essentially the same as stock manifolds with very slight improvements and perhaps a 0-15 hp advantage. They will maintain very similar driving and power characteristics to stock exhaust manifolds.
Next step up are short-tube headers as in this thread. After that are mid-length headers and then long-tube headers.
It depends on your goals and how much compromise you are willing to accept, in terms of HP and Drive-ability, which you should choose. Long-tube headers will generally give the maximum HP increase at the cost of low rpm torque and loudness.
Next step up are short-tube headers as in this thread. After that are mid-length headers and then long-tube headers.
It depends on your goals and how much compromise you are willing to accept, in terms of HP and Drive-ability, which you should choose. Long-tube headers will generally give the maximum HP increase at the cost of low rpm torque and loudness.
Disagree with your opinion. Have you ever installed kleemann headers on your car? I felt a lot differences. Maybe you didnt. If it gives slight improvements, kleemann would not good business.
12-15-2010, 05:42 PM
#33
Why it is not possible? Is this just your opinion or based on some fact?
I met my friend who installed this headers and I saw when his car was on dyno.
Would you please explaine me why it is not possible? This dyno does not show headers only. It is ecu tuned with headers. Not stock car with headers.
I met my friend who installed this headers and I saw when his car was on dyno.
Would you please explaine me why it is not possible? This dyno does not show headers only. It is ecu tuned with headers. Not stock car with headers.
I would even say that SAE is the norm and is the more commonly accepted measurement in everyday discussion.
So, when people look at a dyno graph and they see STD, they say, "okay, now lets see the real number, i.e., the one that will most closely reflect the engine's power potential that will manifest in driving situations."
STD numbers don't translate to the road simply because they're not relevant in everyday SAE dyno discussion.
What's odd, (and I'm not suggesting anything), it's just odd, is that the baseline run on this dyno reads right in line with what a stock C63 on 91 octane would read in SAE. So, was the baseline run measured in SAE?
Edit: And respectfully, my opinion, since it's not based on scientific fact, you can't increase the M156 engine's efficiency to such an extent that it would be able to increase it's max power by 127.37 rwhp (SAE) with the addition of shorty headers and a tune.
Last edited by SonnyakaPig; 12-15-2010 at 05:53 PM.
12-15-2010, 11:07 PM
#35
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^ It's all dependent on temp, humidity, and possibly pressure, i.e., not a linear relationship. A standard, STD, day is about 59 degrees...forget what the humidity is. So, if it's in Arizona in the summertime, then the correction factor will be rather large.
12-16-2010, 12:08 AM
#36
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I think the STD vs SAE is kinda irrelevant in this discussion (unless you are just debating final hp) because you have an increase from a baseline run to a modified run on the same dyno with the same vehicle.
I totaly get that each format (STD vs SAE) can show different outputs but the point of the graph is the measurabe increase from base, on the same machine with the same car.
I totaly get that each format (STD vs SAE) can show different outputs but the point of the graph is the measurabe increase from base, on the same machine with the same car.
Last edited by callmiro; 12-16-2010 at 12:14 AM.
12-16-2010, 01:48 AM
#37
I think the STD vs SAE is kinda irrelevant in this discussion (unless you are just debating final hp) because you have an increase from a baseline run to a modified run on the same dyno with the same vehicle.
I totaly get that each format (STD vs SAE) can show different outputs but the point of the graph is the measurabe increase from base, on the same machine with the same car.
I totaly get that each format (STD vs SAE) can show different outputs but the point of the graph is the measurabe increase from base, on the same machine with the same car.
Was the baseline run done in SAE? If so, and the subsequent runs -- the ones with the headers and tune -- were in STD, then the graph would not show accurately measured increases.
But, even still, you hardly ever see vendors/tuners posting dyno results in STD, for the reasons I described above.
12-16-2010, 01:49 AM
#38
12-16-2010, 02:21 AM
#39
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You are correct. But I asked a question that hasn't been answered yet.
Was the baseline run done in SAE? If so, and the subsequent runs -- the ones with the headers and tune -- were in STD, then the graph would not show accurately measured increases.
But, even still, you hardly ever see vendors/tuners posting dyno results in STD, for the reasons I described above.
Was the baseline run done in SAE? If so, and the subsequent runs -- the ones with the headers and tune -- were in STD, then the graph would not show accurately measured increases.
But, even still, you hardly ever see vendors/tuners posting dyno results in STD, for the reasons I described above.
12-16-2010, 03:09 PM
#40
Dynos are not "run" in a Correction Factor. Correction Factors are applied after the actual (uncorrected) data is collected. If you see a dyno graph from a Dynojet with a Correction Factor listed, that Correction Factor applies to all of the runs in the graph. This is the only way WinPEP software allows you to display results.
I should have been more specific.
Thanks for the clarification.
12-16-2010, 03:41 PM
#41
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Dynos are not "run" in a Correction Factor. Correction Factors are applied after the actual (uncorrected) data is collected. If you see a dyno graph from a Dynojet with a Correction Factor listed, that Correction Factor applies to all of the runs in the graph. This is the only way WinPEP software allows you to display results.
12-16-2010, 03:50 PM
#42
Do most people care about STD corrected numbers over SAE numbers? No. The point of posting STD corrected numbers is to show a high, peak hp number. It's for advertisement.
Of course, if the baseline run was corrected in STD, then we're just talking a gain here, not what the actual peak hp number that we all look to when we wonder how fast it will go.
Will you gain 127.37 rwhp (SAE), with these mods? I will go out on a very short limb and say, "no."
Plus, I would be concerned with the vastly different lengths of the primaries. How can that be a good thing?
To compare, long tube headers and a tune can net you around 100 rwhp gain. That is possible on the M156 engine.
I'm actually surprised that a manufacturer of headers would not be up-to-speed on the performance gains that long tube headers and a tune provide for our cars. If they were, they might add a section in their post that explains how astonished they were to find gains that exceeded the gains that can be found with LT's and a tune.
Last edited by SonnyakaPig; 12-16-2010 at 03:53 PM.
12-16-2010, 05:03 PM
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12-16-2010, 05:42 PM
#47
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They don't look awful, but I'm not sure I'd throw "really good" and "great craftsmanship" into any descriptions of what we can see in the pictures. The flanges are monstrous, the welds appear thick and at times uneven, and the angles at which some of the pipes fit together really don't appear to be providing optimal flow into the collector.
To each his own I suppose... they are, after all, subjective opinions. What I would expect, possibly, is that they may be a decent relative value for C63 shorty headers.
Last edited by c32AMG-DTM; 12-16-2010 at 07:10 PM. Reason: typo
12-16-2010, 06:35 PM
#49
Really?
They don't look awful, but I'm not sure I'd throw "really good" and "great craftsmanship" into any descriptions of what we can see in the pictures. The flanges are monstrous, the welds appear think and at times uneven, and the angles at which some of the pipes fit together really don't appear to be providing optimal flow into the collector.
To each his own I suppose... they are, after all, subjective opinions. What I would expect, possibly, is that they may be a decent relative value for C63 shorty headers.
They don't look awful, but I'm not sure I'd throw "really good" and "great craftsmanship" into any descriptions of what we can see in the pictures. The flanges are monstrous, the welds appear think and at times uneven, and the angles at which some of the pipes fit together really don't appear to be providing optimal flow into the collector.
To each his own I suppose... they are, after all, subjective opinions. What I would expect, possibly, is that they may be a decent relative value for C63 shorty headers.
