Factory Warranty Voided
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From: Palatine, IL
Speedriven
You don't need a Speedriven tune to make use of the Speedriven Block Tuner, in other words.
^ a bit off-topic, though. We can discuss in Block Tuner thread?
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MB
^ seems expensive and a PITA, and you risk bent pins, etc. and damage to the car and ECU.
Also totally self-serving, but a Block Tuner from Speedriven or OE Tuning is the way to go.
https://mbworld.org/forums/s55-amg-s...r-s63-amg.html
Also totally self-serving, but a Block Tuner from Speedriven or OE Tuning is the way to go.
https://mbworld.org/forums/s55-amg-s...r-s63-amg.html
If you didn't do this, could the dealership know that your ECU has different than stock firmware?
Edit: btw, I posted a question in the thead that you linked.
Last edited by SonnyakaPig; Mar 3, 2011 at 03:34 PM.
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2013 f250 6.7 diesel
I would just do this...
"I dont know why it was opened up." "Whats an ECU?"
Chances are if the file comes up stock they will have no reason to check if it was opened...
who knows... who cares... when I start seeing people say their warranty got voided from a tune ill worry.
"I dont know why it was opened up." "Whats an ECU?" Chances are if the file comes up stock they will have no reason to check if it was opened...
who knows... who cares... when I start seeing people say their warranty got voided from a tune ill worry.
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Yes
I can easily admit that I had no idea they had a timestamp on when the ECU was opened, that is really valuable information thanks. Whether a dealer does it or not, to know they have the capability at any time to check it and pursue a warranty denial is something good for the community to know vs just assuming you can flash back to stock and be a-ok.
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Speedriven
I can easily admit that I had no idea they had a timestamp on when the ECU was opened, that is really valuable information thanks. Whether a dealer does it or not, to know they have the capability at any time to check it and pursue a warranty denial is something good for the community to know vs just assuming you can flash back to stock and be a-ok.
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2. your dealer won't know with our tune, unless they line up a showroom-fresh car with yours and drag race ... at which point, they've lost the moral high ground on any and all claims.
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Thats probably the bigger picture. If these engines were prone to failure it would worry us a lot more. They are really built to last to having any issues *knock on wood* is not likely.
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I can easily admit that I had no idea they had a timestamp on when the ECU was opened, that is really valuable information thanks. Whether a dealer does it or not, to know they have the capability at any time to check it and pursue a warranty denial is something good for the community to know vs just assuming you can flash back to stock and be a-ok.
I was curious about something related to my transmission and coming from a previously modified car, I asked the shop foreman -- who is very knowledgeable about MB -- whether he could run some checks to ensure that my C63 was not previously tuned by the former owner.
He said there is no way that he could check to see if the car was tuned. He said the only way would be if the car's rev limiter (for example) was raised and the car experienced some problem at a rpm that by factory standards could not occur, because the OEM tune had a lower rpm limiter.
If the car's rev limiter was raised and the engine blew at the higher than OEM rev limit, the ECU would take a snap shot of that and that's how it could be identified that the ECU was tuned.
But, he said there are no markers or counters or anything like that.
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1. you can do the flashing with the Block Tuner on the fly, in a matter of 2-3 minutes (if that). That is the point of it.
2. your dealer won't know with our tune, unless they line up a showroom-fresh car with yours and drag race ... at which point, they've lost the moral high ground on any and all claims.
2. your dealer won't know with our tune, unless they line up a showroom-fresh car with yours and drag race ... at which point, they've lost the moral high ground on any and all claims.
Thanks for the response.
But, if you plan on taking your car in for service and you want to see if the dealership has any updates, in order for them to flash new updates, your car has to have dealer-compatible firmware, and once your ECU has been opened by a tuner and the firmware changed to accomodate the new tune, the firmware would have to be flashed back to OE firmware, and I was under the impression that the programmer cannot do that.
Plus, if you have a tune, your ECU has been opened, and the firmware changed from OEM firmware to a different firmware. So, even if you flash your tune back to stock with the programmer before you go into the dealership, if you don't tell the dealership to avoid flashing your ECU, if they did flash your ECU, wouldn't that change your firmware back to OEM firmware, thus necessitating another round of having your ECU flashed back to a non-OEM firmware to accept the aftermarket tunes, and the programmer cannot do this.
Seems pretty confusing actually. But I'm very interested in learning more from you.
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But, our cars have some issues that are not concretely understood. For example, gas cap issues, purge valve issues, throttle/pedal issues, and they all seem to cause similar problems: chugging, complete power loss, random and numerous error messages.
These issues may have nothing to do with engine life, but they do usually require a trip to the dealer. And dealership's don't seem to know exactly what's causing these problems. And tuners don't seem to know either.
So, even though our seemingly bomb-proof engines will likely survive all of our lingering questions, the customer still doesn't have a solid understanding about these issues (i.e., whether they stem from manufacturing defect or slight issues with tunes).
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LOL! nice
Thanks for the response.
But, if you plan on taking your car in for service and you want to see if the dealership has any updates, in order for them to flash new updates, your car has to have dealer-compatible firmware, and once your ECU has been opened by a tuner and the firmware changed to accomodate the new tune, the firmware would have to be flashed back to OE firmware, and I was under the impression that the programmer cannot do that.
Plus, if you have a tune, your ECU has been opened, and the firmware changed from OEM firmware to a different firmware. So, even if you flash your tune back to stock with the programmer before you go into the dealership, if you don't tell the dealership to avoid flashing your ECU, if they did flash your ECU, wouldn't that change your firmware back to OEM firmware, thus necessitating another round of having your ECU flashed back to a non-OEM firmware to accept the aftermarket tunes, and the programmer cannot do this.
Seems pretty confusing actually. But I'm very interested in learning more from you.
Thanks for the response.
But, if you plan on taking your car in for service and you want to see if the dealership has any updates, in order for them to flash new updates, your car has to have dealer-compatible firmware, and once your ECU has been opened by a tuner and the firmware changed to accomodate the new tune, the firmware would have to be flashed back to OE firmware, and I was under the impression that the programmer cannot do that.
Plus, if you have a tune, your ECU has been opened, and the firmware changed from OEM firmware to a different firmware. So, even if you flash your tune back to stock with the programmer before you go into the dealership, if you don't tell the dealership to avoid flashing your ECU, if they did flash your ECU, wouldn't that change your firmware back to OEM firmware, thus necessitating another round of having your ECU flashed back to a non-OEM firmware to accept the aftermarket tunes, and the programmer cannot do this.
Seems pretty confusing actually. But I'm very interested in learning more from you.
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MB
That's true. However, a MB owner can probably open his ECU every day if he wants and still maintain a factory warranty on his powertrain.
Perhaps he may damage his ECU in the process, therein voiding the warranty on the physical ECU, but unless the tune is altered and that tune causes a problem, opening the ECU itself probably doesn't show whether the ECU has been tuned.
Thoughts?
Perhaps he may damage his ECU in the process, therein voiding the warranty on the physical ECU, but unless the tune is altered and that tune causes a problem, opening the ECU itself probably doesn't show whether the ECU has been tuned.
Thoughts?
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Speedriven
^ no such thing.
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Its my understanding that when they "Crack" your ECU it opens the ability to have files written though the OBDii port. Without having the car tuned this process wouldnt be possible. So even if they flash your tune you can overwrite that tune using the "Block" back to either the factory on the "Block" or the tune you have on it.
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Speedriven
Its my understanding that when they "Crack" your ECU it opens the ability to have files written though the OBDii port. Without having the car tuned this process wouldnt be possible. So even if they flash your tune you can overwrite that tune using the "Block" back to either the factory on the "Block" or the tune you have on it.
If that does happen, you may (50/50) need to send your ECU back to the tuner again.
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So true.
But, our cars have some issues that are not concretely understood. For example, gas cap issues, purge valve issues, throttle/pedal issues, and they all seem to cause similar problems: chugging, complete power loss, random and numerous error messages.
These issues may have nothing to do with engine life, but they do usually require a trip to the dealer. And dealership's don't seem to know exactly what's causing these problems. And tuners don't seem to know either.
So, even though our seemingly bomb-proof engines will likely survive all of our lingering questions, the customer still doesn't have a solid understanding about these issues (i.e., whether they stem from manufacturing defect or slight issues with tunes).
But, our cars have some issues that are not concretely understood. For example, gas cap issues, purge valve issues, throttle/pedal issues, and they all seem to cause similar problems: chugging, complete power loss, random and numerous error messages.
These issues may have nothing to do with engine life, but they do usually require a trip to the dealer. And dealership's don't seem to know exactly what's causing these problems. And tuners don't seem to know either.
So, even though our seemingly bomb-proof engines will likely survive all of our lingering questions, the customer still doesn't have a solid understanding about these issues (i.e., whether they stem from manufacturing defect or slight issues with tunes).
I had a purge value problem on my 2009. I never tuned it.
My biggest fear bring my car in for some minor fix like a purge valve or other minor problems is having the dealer flash over my tune back to OEM because there is a new version or just because he wants to. Jeremy said he would reflash my ECU for free if this happened "Once" but id rather have the other option.
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Speedriven
On a 500, 55 AMG, 55K AMG, 600, or 65 AMG (etc.) the dealer can do whatever they want, and you can load a tune file from the OBD.
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Some tunes allow the ECU to be re-flashed by OBD, but the dealer flashing the car back to stock (which almost never happens, btw - just something I've read about here on MBWorld) can whack the ability to just "load a tuned file" over the OBD on a 63AMG. It depends on what they flash - if they just load an update, then it won't. If it's an emissions update recall, then it won't. If it's a complete override after a major service, it might.
If that does happen, you may (50/50) need to send your ECU back to the tuner again.
If that does happen, you may (50/50) need to send your ECU back to the tuner again.
Just addressed this, below. One more time, though: what you're saying is true, but not always the case. It depends on what the dealer flashes, and even then: you're talking about a 63AMG.
On a 500, 55 AMG, 55K AMG, 600, or 65 AMG (etc.) the dealer can do whatever they want, and you can load a tune file from the OBD.
On a 500, 55 AMG, 55K AMG, 600, or 65 AMG (etc.) the dealer can do whatever they want, and you can load a tune file from the OBD.
Its threads like these that make me love this forum. Learn something new! Thanks!
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Problem with this though is that if the dealer physically inspects the ECU, they will definitely able to tell it's been opened and tampered with. This is why some go the safer, more expensive route of purchasing a spare stock ECU. But even then I wonder if the dealer could still tell that the stock ECU had only been in the car for a short period of time before the service visit, through some timestamp or counter mechanism.
Last edited by xtyper; Mar 3, 2011 at 05:17 PM.
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Just addressed this, below. One more time, though: what you're saying is true, but not always the case. It depends on what the dealer flashes, and even then: you're talking about a 63AMG.
On a 500, 55 AMG, 55K AMG, 600, or 65 AMG (etc.) the dealer can do whatever they want, and you can load a tune file from the OBD.
On a 500, 55 AMG, 55K AMG, 600, or 65 AMG (etc.) the dealer can do whatever they want, and you can load a tune file from the OBD.
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I had a purge value problem on my 2009. I never tuned it.
My biggest fear bring my car in for some minor fix like a purge valve or other minor problems is having the dealer flash over my tune back to OEM because there is a new version or just because he wants to. Jeremy said he would reflash my ECU for free if this happened "Once" but id rather have the other option.
My biggest fear bring my car in for some minor fix like a purge valve or other minor problems is having the dealer flash over my tune back to OEM because there is a new version or just because he wants to. Jeremy said he would reflash my ECU for free if this happened "Once" but id rather have the other option.
Well, mines fixed, so no worries now.
