Absolute Disgust With MB/AMG Regarding my C63 BS Order
02-11-2012, 09:42 AM
#101
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 1,021
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
'14 911S (garage queen) '13 X3 (family hauler)
I don't have a problem with dealers selling above MSRP if they can get it. As someone said earlier, it's simple supply and demand. As a businessman I can understand why they would do this--as an enthusiast, I feel the same anger others have mentioned. But remember guys, these are nonessential "luxury" items and we don't need to buy them--if this was done with bread or water, I'd have a problem with it. Over MSRP pricing is done all of the time on limited edition high demand items.
Now, ordering a car for someone at MSRP and then telling them it's not available or available at a higher price is a scumbag thing to do and is wrong, plain and simple. I've got no problem over charging someone up front and if they know about it from day one--I'm a firm believer in letting the market set the price.
There's no shortage of people in this world who think we "overpaid" for our cars, even if we got them under invoice
Now, ordering a car for someone at MSRP and then telling them it's not available or available at a higher price is a scumbag thing to do and is wrong, plain and simple. I've got no problem over charging someone up front and if they know about it from day one--I'm a firm believer in letting the market set the price.
There's no shortage of people in this world who think we "overpaid" for our cars, even if we got them under invoice
02-11-2012, 10:36 AM
#102
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: N.Jersey and New York, stationed in Germany
Posts: 1,291
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
W164 ML500,SMART For two,1994 C280(5speed manual) 1999 C230k station wagon
Good points, as for the basic things such as "bread and water" and things that are needed then perhaps that would be called price gouging, there are many AMG owners outside the U.S. that would say we under paid or recieved great deals for these cars because they pay doubled or maybe tripled the amount.
02-11-2012, 10:44 AM
#103
Makes your first post seem a little too drama laden then, no? Might want to reconsider the "FU's" in the future, as you might just get what you're asking for.
02-11-2012, 05:35 PM
#104
Newbie
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: South Germany
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
C63 AMG Coupe PP/DP and many more
Jrcart: You won't regret the 4.0 - the very last GT car with the Metzger block, bound to become a classic. Speaking from experience - on my 3rd variant of GT3. 
Yes - the BS ordering process has been a debacle. My local GM was 85% - 90% sure of a 2nd car, but MBUSA dropped the ball on him. Then after searching far and wide for an allocation, I finally found one, but was told I couldn't order any of the carbon stuff or the track pack... Excuse me?... Destined to never be an AMG owner. :-P
Yes - the BS ordering process has been a debacle. My local GM was 85% - 90% sure of a 2nd car, but MBUSA dropped the ball on him. Then after searching far and wide for an allocation, I finally found one, but was told I couldn't order any of the carbon stuff or the track pack... Excuse me?... Destined to never be an AMG owner. :-P
Regarding the C63 AMG Coupe BS: I just bought a C63 AMG Coupe PP/DP over here in Germany but the dealer also offered me a BS. This car is actually sold out over here but apparently there are some available. He didn't ask for any mark-up but I preferred the low mileage and fully loaded demo car (Coupe PP) for almost half the money.
I know that the BS is a very special version but if you look closely at the car and what it offers, the non-BS Coupe PP/DP looks like a bargain. Especially since dealers over here in Germany are willing to provide huge rebates. Not so much on the BS version.
As to the next gen 911 Turbo (type 991) some people mentioned: It won't be available before 2013.
If you want a performance Porsche NOW, nothing beats the 997 Turbo S or the 997 GT2 RS. The GT3 RS 4.0 is a very special (and very likely unique) car because of the, probably, last of the kind Mezger engine but performance-wise, even the 997 Turbo S beats it from 0-60 and 0-125 mph. Unless of course you want to track race it, then the GT3 RS 4.0 would be better.
Last edited by RCG; 02-11-2012 at 05:40 PM.
02-11-2012, 06:09 PM
#105
MBWorld Fanatic!
Thread Starter
Why would you say that? Did you have a bad experience with them. They were not the issue in this particular situation. Everyone from my salesman to sales manager up to the GM was working hard to get me a car. They were not yanking my chain and kept me posted with updates at least a couple times a week and I was even copied on several emails. When the wheels came off this thing my salesman starting calling around to other dealers and used the Mercedes Star Net to pin point unsold allocation trying to get me a car even if it meant me buying direct through another dealer and him missing out on the deal and commision all together, therefore I would not say they suck, quite the opposite actually, they went to bat for me on this car more than any dealership ever has in the past. They went above and beyond and I would highly reccomend them to anyone.
02-11-2012, 06:13 PM
#106
MBWorld Fanatic!
Thread Starter
with an earlier post you mentioned buying a Porsche and throwing your money to Stuttgart, fyi, Mercedes Benz is head quartered in Stuttgart also. It always upsets me when cars are limited production because it means A-hole dealers will lie and gouge preying upon our dreams and desires, scum they are who take a deposit and then cal you later demanding more blood money, same with the speculators who buy cars to "flip" Porsche apparently has a "speculator list", I heard dealers will catch grief if they sell to those people, its not a self correcting problem, over MSRP sales overtime weaken brand loyalty and discourage all but those who have more money than sense, so what may work for Ferrari wont for Mercedes and Porsche. To stop this we must stand together and refuse to pay more than MSRP, we must complain about dealers that do it and avoid doing any business with them, I do recall the Mitsubishi guys had a list of dealers who marked up the evos so they wouldn't patronize them. I've seen this ploy many times where you have a deal for MSRP and then the dealership "cant get the car anymore" which means they sold it for more than MSRP to someone else after locking in your order to get the allocation, they incur little risk because if the over MSRP guy flakes they can still sell it to you
02-11-2012, 06:22 PM
#107
MBWorld Fanatic!
Thread Starter
Not sure what you are getting at but the FU's obviously worked just fine. Bottom line is that their (AMG/MB) flawed system of handing out allocations caused my distress that led to anger and the FU's I posted in the first place. I know for a fact that this thread and the one I posted on AMG Private Lounge made it way way up the food chain at AMG in Germany and it along with several other people that posted somewhat similar stories opened up some eyes and might result in some changes that could benefit all of us in the future. Obviously someone saw the error and corrected it because if they didn't care they would not have corrected the problem withing 48 hours of it cropping up.
02-11-2012, 06:31 PM
#108
Senior Member
I don't have a problem with dealers selling above MSRP if they can get it. As someone said earlier, it's simple supply and demand. As a businessman I can understand why they would do this--as an enthusiast, I feel the same anger others have mentioned. But remember guys, these are nonessential "luxury" items and we don't need to buy them--if this was done with bread or water, I'd have a problem with it. Over MSRP pricing is done all of the time on limited edition high demand items.
Now, ordering a car for someone at MSRP and then telling them it's not available or available at a higher price is a scumbag thing to do and is wrong, plain and simple. I've got no problem over charging someone up front and if they know about it from day one--I'm a firm believer in letting the market set the price.
Now, ordering a car for someone at MSRP and then telling them it's not available or available at a higher price is a scumbag thing to do and is wrong, plain and simple. I've got no problem over charging someone up front and if they know about it from day one--I'm a firm believer in letting the market set the price.
02-11-2012, 07:23 PM
#109
MBWorld Fanatic!
My take is that MB builds the black series cars as a "look what we can do." They build a limited run of cars that are guaranteed to sell out. The hope is that this drives more people in general to MB and AMG, thus increasing market share overall.
People had deposits down before there was ever a whiff of a c63 bs being built.
People had deposits down before there was ever a whiff of a c63 bs being built.
02-12-2012, 12:30 AM
#110
Junior Member
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Sunny SoCali
Posts: 20
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
A snail...
Mezger, not Metzger. Just for the book.
Regarding the C63 AMG Coupe BS: I just bought a C63 AMG Coupe PP/DP over here in Germany but the dealer also offered me a BS. This car is actually sold out over here but apparently there are some available. He didn't ask for any mark-up but I preferred the low mileage and fully loaded demo car (Coupe PP) for almost half the money.
I know that the BS is a very special version but if you look closely at the car and what it offers, the non-BS Coupe PP/DP looks like a bargain. Especially since dealers over here in Germany are willing to provide huge rebates. Not so much on the BS version.
As to the next gen 911 Turbo (type 991) some people mentioned: It won't be available before 2013. If you want a performance Porsche NOW, nothing beats the 997 Turbo S or the 997 GT2 RS. The GT3 RS 4.0 is a very special (and very likely unique) car because of the, probably, last of the kind Mezger engine but performance-wise, even the 997 Turbo S beats it from 0-60 and 0-125 mph. Unless of course you want to track race it, then the GT3 RS 4.0 would be better.
Regarding the C63 AMG Coupe BS: I just bought a C63 AMG Coupe PP/DP over here in Germany but the dealer also offered me a BS. This car is actually sold out over here but apparently there are some available. He didn't ask for any mark-up but I preferred the low mileage and fully loaded demo car (Coupe PP) for almost half the money.
I know that the BS is a very special version but if you look closely at the car and what it offers, the non-BS Coupe PP/DP looks like a bargain. Especially since dealers over here in Germany are willing to provide huge rebates. Not so much on the BS version.
As to the next gen 911 Turbo (type 991) some people mentioned: It won't be available before 2013.
If you want a performance Porsche NOW, nothing beats the 997 Turbo S or the 997 GT2 RS. The GT3 RS 4.0 is a very special (and very likely unique) car because of the, probably, last of the kind Mezger engine but performance-wise, even the 997 Turbo S beats it from 0-60 and 0-125 mph. Unless of course you want to track race it, then the GT3 RS 4.0 would be better. Are you "RC" from Rennteam?...
02-12-2012, 11:39 AM
#111
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: OC, SoCal
Posts: 2,318
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
08 S65, 06 M3 CS(stick), 02 BMW X5 4.6iS, 07 R1 Raven, 08 F-450 4x4, 08 CooperS JCW
Mezger, not Metzger. Just for the book.
Regarding the C63 AMG Coupe BS: I just bought a C63 AMG Coupe PP/DP over here in Germany but the dealer also offered me a BS. This car is actually sold out over here but apparently there are some available. He didn't ask for any mark-up but I preferred the low mileage and fully loaded demo car (Coupe PP) for almost half the money.
I know that the BS is a very special version but if you look closely at the car and what it offers, the non-BS Coupe PP/DP looks like a bargain. Especially since dealers over here in Germany are willing to provide huge rebates. Not so much on the BS version.
As to the next gen 911 Turbo (type 991) some people mentioned: It won't be available before 2013. If you want a performance Porsche NOW, nothing beats the 997 Turbo S or the 997 GT2 RS. The GT3 RS 4.0 is a very special (and very likely unique) car because of the, probably, last of the kind Mezger engine but performance-wise, even the 997 Turbo S beats it from 0-60 and 0-125 mph. Unless of course you want to track race it, then the GT3 RS 4.0 would be better.
Regarding the C63 AMG Coupe BS: I just bought a C63 AMG Coupe PP/DP over here in Germany but the dealer also offered me a BS. This car is actually sold out over here but apparently there are some available. He didn't ask for any mark-up but I preferred the low mileage and fully loaded demo car (Coupe PP) for almost half the money.
I know that the BS is a very special version but if you look closely at the car and what it offers, the non-BS Coupe PP/DP looks like a bargain. Especially since dealers over here in Germany are willing to provide huge rebates. Not so much on the BS version.
As to the next gen 911 Turbo (type 991) some people mentioned: It won't be available before 2013.
If you want a performance Porsche NOW, nothing beats the 997 Turbo S or the 997 GT2 RS. The GT3 RS 4.0 is a very special (and very likely unique) car because of the, probably, last of the kind Mezger engine but performance-wise, even the 997 Turbo S beats it from 0-60 and 0-125 mph. Unless of course you want to track race it, then the GT3 RS 4.0 would be better.I can see the appeal of the Black Series AMGs though- they offer good handling along with rarity and good daily usability. But if you can get a non-bs in europe for half the money you are right to jump on it esp if you're modding (which I'm assuming you do
). I buy all my cars new with the exception of the amg's I've owned...the low mile/demo cars make amazing buys especially since my good friend always likes the latest and greatest.jrcart....congrats at winning out over corporate greed and we all look forward to seeing your car progress once you take delivery. The c63 bs sounds like a great car with the trick new trans and all the r&d since your clk was released.
Last edited by transferred; 02-12-2012 at 11:45 AM.
02-12-2012, 12:13 PM
#112
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 2,949
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
2008 A8L, 2002 996TT X50, 2009 X5
100% Agreed 
I am sure they started out in damage control seeing how much negative exposure was generated by your experience. Couple that with the obvious plus side PR that will unfold as you document the new Black for so many to follow........it's a no brainer for MB. So many companies are just starting to understand the impact of social media upon the real world and adjusting their business protocol to take advantage. I would imagine the Facebook IPO announcement will accelerate the changes for many companies even more.
More importantly, I am very excited that this worked out for you and looking forward to follow the journey!
I am sure they started out in damage control seeing how much negative exposure was generated by your experience. Couple that with the obvious plus side PR that will unfold as you document the new Black for so many to follow........it's a no brainer for MB. So many companies are just starting to understand the impact of social media upon the real world and adjusting their business protocol to take advantage. I would imagine the Facebook IPO announcement will accelerate the changes for many companies even more.
More importantly, I am very excited that this worked out for you and looking forward to follow the journey!
And when it comes to social media and getting a more favorable result... traffic is king, as JRCART observes. Glad it worked out for him by venting here, and can't wait to see what he and Weistec do with the C63BS.
02-18-2012, 09:58 AM
#113
Newbie
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 2
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
C55
I didn't take the time to read all the replies so sorry if this is redundant but...even though it was a bummer you filled out all tha papers, gave deposit, etc...MB doesn't have to build the car, nor send it to the dealership. MB dealerships are franchises, not corp owned. You have picked an incredibly low volume car...to custom order is even worse. I thought about ordering, until my dealership told me "realistically, it could be 12 months and you still might not get it". I had a 2009. Just picked up my 2012 yesterday. It took them 3 days to get the dealer that had it to agree to transfer it and my local dealership had to trade them their 2012 coupe.
Bottom line, it's a rediculous car and even more rare by the day (by design). Personally, I'm glad MB chose the fulfillment model they did. I'm willing to bet you can search the big, bad, wide open "innanets" and find the 2012 that is equal or close to your specs and buy it w/o a premium.
As for your joint marketing "offer" with all the "mods"...lol. Save it. MB doesn't need your help creating buzz and mystique...they have done so already...case in point, you're dying for one and can't get one!
Bottom line, it's a rediculous car and even more rare by the day (by design). Personally, I'm glad MB chose the fulfillment model they did. I'm willing to bet you can search the big, bad, wide open "innanets" and find the 2012 that is equal or close to your specs and buy it w/o a premium.
As for your joint marketing "offer" with all the "mods"...lol. Save it. MB doesn't need your help creating buzz and mystique...they have done so already...case in point, you're dying for one and can't get one!
02-18-2012, 10:35 AM
#114
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: MICHIGAN
Posts: 1,073
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
2001 E55 - 2008 CLS63 -2016 F-150
congrats everything is going is back on track for you to have your ride, hopefully u dont have to wait much longer
, Cant wait to see what you do to this thing , Love your 1st BS .
, Cant wait to see what you do to this thing , Love your 1st BS .
02-18-2012, 12:55 PM
#115
Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Hainesport, NJ
Posts: 247
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
2014 CTS-V (6spd, phantom grey), 2010 Cadillac Escalade ESV (black raven)
I didn't take the time to read all the replies so sorry if this is redundant but...even though it was a bummer you filled out all tha papers, gave deposit, etc...MB doesn't have to build the car, nor send it to the dealership. MB dealerships are franchises, not corp owned. You have picked an incredibly low volume car...to custom order is even worse. I thought about ordering, until my dealership told me "realistically, it could be 12 months and you still might not get it"
Bottom line, it's a rediculous car and even more rare by the day (by design). Personally, I'm glad MB chose the fulfillment model they did. I'm willing to bet you can search the big, bad, wide open "innanets" and find the 2012 that is equal or close to your specs and buy it w/o a premium.
As for your joint marketing "offer" with all the "mods"...lol. Save it. MB doesn't need your help creating buzz and mystique...they have done so already...case in point, you're dying for one and can't get one!
Bottom line, it's a rediculous car and even more rare by the day (by design). Personally, I'm glad MB chose the fulfillment model they did. I'm willing to bet you can search the big, bad, wide open "innanets" and find the 2012 that is equal or close to your specs and buy it w/o a premium.
As for your joint marketing "offer" with all the "mods"...lol. Save it. MB doesn't need your help creating buzz and mystique...they have done so already...case in point, you're dying for one and can't get one!
I guess JRCART has a little more pull than you do...
02-18-2012, 01:46 PM
#116
Member
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 98
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Not exactly. The GT-R has the performance to back it up and devastates the likes of the 458,keeps up with a Porsche 997.2TT and even kills the SLS.
Summery: With the GT-R you're getting a Supercar for relatively cheap. With the C63 BS you're just getting a C class on steroids.
Summery: With the GT-R you're getting a Supercar for relatively cheap. With the C63 BS you're just getting a C class on steroids.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b006...ures/powerlaps
Last edited by mei35inted; 04-06-2012 at 01:51 AM.
02-18-2012, 02:32 PM
#117
Senior Member
First of all it is spelt summary and secondly you have no idea what your talking about. The GT-R around an average track (let's say Top Gear) is slower than the new SLS Roadster. The SLS Coupe hasn't even been around the track and it would go around even quicker than a SLS Roadster, so I don't understand why you think a GT-R would kill a SLS in terms of performance because it wouldn't.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b006...ures/powerlaps
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b006...ures/powerlaps
02-18-2012, 02:32 PM
#118
First of all it is spelt summary and secondly you have no idea what your talking about. The GT-R around an average track (let's say Top Gear) is slower than the new SLS Roadster. The SLS Coupe hasn't even been around the track and it would go around even quicker than a SLS Roadster, so I don't understand why you think a GT-R would kill a SLS in terms of performance because it wouldn't.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b006...ures/powerlaps
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b006...ures/powerlaps
Second, I actually think you are the one who is confused. Show me where a 2012 GTR is slower than an SLS around a track... what are the Nurburgring times Ryan? The GTR is almost 14 seconds faster on the Ring (and that's a 2011 version I believe and we know the 2012 is faster). Heck, even a lowly Lexus LFA is faster around the Ring than the SLS (and we all know the Lexus is just a Toyota
). Seems to me the GTR is one of the fastest cars out there at any price... we know you have a hate on for anything not branded Mercedes Benz but why you are so anti GTR is beyond me (other than being a brand elitist). It is faster than the SLS... roadster or coupe... whether you like it or not. I'm not saying it is a better car necessarily but it is faster in almost every way. Anyway, this is off topic.
Last edited by gthal; 02-19-2012 at 05:43 AM.
02-18-2012, 02:44 PM
#119
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 1,521
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes
on
3 Posts
2013 Chevy 427 Torch Red
First of all it is spelt summary and secondly you have no idea what your talking about. The GT-R around an average track (let's say Top Gear) is slower than the new SLS Roadster. The SLS Coupe hasn't even been around the track and it would go around even quicker than a SLS Roadster, so I don't understand why you think a GT-R would kill a SLS in terms of performance because it wouldn't.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b006...ures/powerlaps
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b006...ures/powerlaps
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...ower_Lap_Times
It is interesting that the SLS roadster was faster than the coupe
02-19-2012, 05:03 AM
#120
MBWorld Fanatic!
02-19-2012, 05:18 AM
#121
I knew I didn't correct other people's spelling for a reason I do, however, stand by the rest of my post
Last edited by gthal; 02-19-2012 at 05:41 AM.
02-19-2012, 09:36 AM
#122
Senior Member
That is an incomplete list......try this one
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...ower_Lap_Times
It is interesting that the SLS roadster was faster than the coupe
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...ower_Lap_Times
It is interesting that the SLS roadster was faster than the coupe
02-19-2012, 01:42 PM
#125
and cruise down to the beach today in my 190SL for some lunch and beer 
