BMW M4 owned by the old C63...
06-02-2014, 02:59 PM
#26
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you missed the point... My point was that they built the car, put an exhaust on it, and put the car on the market. AMG tunes every part of the car... Including the exhaust note.
Guess what?!? People who buy M3/C63s don't go to the track every day, but they start their car and floor it on a daily basis. I can guarantee you that 90% of M3/C63 buyers only care about how great the car beats up a track a couple times of the year... If at all.
Perhaps the ///M division should tune the exhaust instead of the speakers. <----- get my drift (pun intended)
Guess what?!? People who buy M3/C63s don't go to the track every day, but they start their car and floor it on a daily basis. I can guarantee you that 90% of M3/C63 buyers only care about how great the car beats up a track a couple times of the year... If at all.
Perhaps the ///M division should tune the exhaust instead of the speakers. <----- get my drift (pun intended)
I also have a feeling that in real life (not iphone videos), in Sport Plus Mode (with the exhaust flaps open), the engines sound on the mew M3/4 will not be much worse then the 6T that will be found on the next C63. No way the 205's 6T will sound as mean as the 204's V8...I dont care how much they "tune" the exhaust, not going to happen.
I admire your love for AMG and I love them too. Don't mean to get on your nerves, but we are entering a new era where this class of car (M3, C63, RS5) will not sound as good as the previous generations.
I have a hard time watching two guys battle in F1 these days without any engine sound...just seems strange, but it is what it is.
06-02-2014, 09:21 PM
#27
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2013 C250 , 2012 SLK350 , 2014 GL450 Designo currently owned
Listen, both cars are great and both attract a slightly different buyer. I did track my M3 and can tell you that the track days were full of other M3's but I rarely saw a C63 show up. I think you are underestimating how much the M division "tunes" their cars. In fact, I think for the past few years (prior to the new turbocharged era), AMG has slapped on the same engine (that I agree sounds great) and transmission to all their cars while the M division has purposely built and "tuned" engines for each specific model. I love AMG, and think they really got it right with the C204 Coupe (I purchased one). But I'm not so blind to knock the M division. Despite them getting a tad soft lately, they still role out great cars that give us another option when shopping.
I also have a feeling that in real life (not iphone videos), in Sport Plus Mode (with the exhaust flaps open), the engines sound on the mew M3/4 will not be much worse then the 6T that will be found on the next C63. No way the 205's 6T will sound as mean as the 204's V8...I dont care how much they "tune" the exhaust, not going to happen.
I admire your love for AMG and I love them too. Don't mean to get on your nerves, but we are entering a new era where this class of car (M3, C63, RS5) will not sound as good as the previous generations.
I have a hard time watching two guys battle in F1 these days without any engine sound...just seems strange, but it is what it is.
I also have a feeling that in real life (not iphone videos), in Sport Plus Mode (with the exhaust flaps open), the engines sound on the mew M3/4 will not be much worse then the 6T that will be found on the next C63. No way the 205's 6T will sound as mean as the 204's V8...I dont care how much they "tune" the exhaust, not going to happen.
I admire your love for AMG and I love them too. Don't mean to get on your nerves, but we are entering a new era where this class of car (M3, C63, RS5) will not sound as good as the previous generations.
I have a hard time watching two guys battle in F1 these days without any engine sound...just seems strange, but it is what it is.
- 2.0 i4 355hp 332lb.ft (most powerful 4 cylinder production engine in world history.)
- 5.5 NA V8 (SLK55) 400+ HP
- 6.2 NA V8 (C63,SLS has a heavily modified version but whatever etc.) (SLS black
Engine is "most powerful naturally aspirated production V8 ever made as well)
- 5.5 liter Biturbo V8 (585hp , 664lb. Ft. Of torque on all 2014 models.)
- 6.0 Biturbo V12 (630 horsepower, 740 lb.Ft. Of torque)
New engines in development for the next C63 and AMG GT:
4.0 Liter V8 twin turbo (450-620 hp are the estimated outputs ranging from regular to black series models)
Not trying to be condescending. It just angers me when people make bold and, (man I'm a mean person ), uneducated statements.
M also just used the same engine from the 235i,335i, and 435i but tuned them to make them M-cars. That is not developing a new engine, agreed, the cars are different from their regular beginnings, but it's just a tuned 435i, much better, but same engine man. I mean you can't deny that, come on...:/
06-02-2014, 10:38 PM
#28
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The new C63 is going to have a Twin Turbo V8, my friend. Where do you get your information, you seem to be much more blind. They tune their cars similarly, M does not just tune a car and slap an exhaust on. However, AMG does not either. Where does "AMG use the same engine on every model." You don't own a C63 buddy, wake up! Different AMG motors out right now (handcrafted by the way, not much M can say to that..)
- 2.0 i4 355hp 332lb.ft (most powerful 4 cylinder production engine in world history.)
- 5.5 NA V8 (SLK55) 400+ HP
- 6.2 NA V8 (C63,SLS has a heavily modified version but whatever etc.) (SLS black
Engine is "most powerful naturally aspirated production V8 ever made as well)
- 5.5 liter Biturbo V8 (585hp , 664lb. Ft. Of torque on all 2014 models.)
- 6.0 Biturbo V12 (630 horsepower, 740 lb.Ft. Of torque)
New engines in development for the next C63 and AMG GT:
4.0 Liter V8 twin turbo (450-620 hp are the estimated outputs ranging from regular to black series models)
Not trying to be condescending. It just angers me when people make bold and, (man I'm a mean person ), uneducated statements.
M also just used the same engine from the 235i,335i, and 435i but tuned them to make them M-cars. That is not developing a new engine, agreed, the cars are different from their regular beginnings, but it's just a tuned 435i, much better, but same engine man. I mean you can't deny that, come on...:/
- 2.0 i4 355hp 332lb.ft (most powerful 4 cylinder production engine in world history.)
- 5.5 NA V8 (SLK55) 400+ HP
- 6.2 NA V8 (C63,SLS has a heavily modified version but whatever etc.) (SLS black
Engine is "most powerful naturally aspirated production V8 ever made as well)
- 5.5 liter Biturbo V8 (585hp , 664lb. Ft. Of torque on all 2014 models.)
- 6.0 Biturbo V12 (630 horsepower, 740 lb.Ft. Of torque)
New engines in development for the next C63 and AMG GT:
4.0 Liter V8 twin turbo (450-620 hp are the estimated outputs ranging from regular to black series models)
Not trying to be condescending. It just angers me when people make bold and, (man I'm a mean person ), uneducated statements.
M also just used the same engine from the 235i,335i, and 435i but tuned them to make them M-cars. That is not developing a new engine, agreed, the cars are different from their regular beginnings, but it's just a tuned 435i, much better, but same engine man. I mean you can't deny that, come on...:/
Last edited by bobbyzcar; 06-02-2014 at 10:52 PM.
06-03-2014, 08:25 AM
#29
Senior Member
The new C63 is going to have a Twin Turbo V8, my friend. Where do you get your information, you seem to be much more blind. They tune their cars similarly, M does not just tune a car and slap an exhaust on. However, AMG does not either. Where does "AMG use the same engine on every model." You don't own a C63 buddy, wake up! Different AMG motors out right now (handcrafted by the way, not much M can say to that..)
- 2.0 i4 355hp 332lb.ft (most powerful 4 cylinder production engine in world history.)
- 5.5 NA V8 (SLK55) 400+ HP
- 6.2 NA V8 (C63,SLS has a heavily modified version but whatever etc.) (SLS black
Engine is "most powerful naturally aspirated production V8 ever made as well)
- 5.5 liter Biturbo V8 (585hp , 664lb. Ft. Of torque on all 2014 models.)
- 6.0 Biturbo V12 (630 horsepower, 740 lb.Ft. Of torque)
New engines in development for the next C63 and AMG GT:
4.0 Liter V8 twin turbo (450-620 hp are the estimated outputs ranging from regular to black series models)
Not trying to be condescending. It just angers me when people make bold and, (man I'm a mean person ), uneducated statements.
M also just used the same engine from the 235i,335i, and 435i but tuned them to make them M-cars. That is not developing a new engine, agreed, the cars are different from their regular beginnings, but it's just a tuned 435i, much better, but same engine man. I mean you can't deny that, come on...:/
- 2.0 i4 355hp 332lb.ft (most powerful 4 cylinder production engine in world history.)
- 5.5 NA V8 (SLK55) 400+ HP
- 6.2 NA V8 (C63,SLS has a heavily modified version but whatever etc.) (SLS black
Engine is "most powerful naturally aspirated production V8 ever made as well)
- 5.5 liter Biturbo V8 (585hp , 664lb. Ft. Of torque on all 2014 models.)
- 6.0 Biturbo V12 (630 horsepower, 740 lb.Ft. Of torque)
New engines in development for the next C63 and AMG GT:
4.0 Liter V8 twin turbo (450-620 hp are the estimated outputs ranging from regular to black series models)
Not trying to be condescending. It just angers me when people make bold and, (man I'm a mean person ), uneducated statements.
M also just used the same engine from the 235i,335i, and 435i but tuned them to make them M-cars. That is not developing a new engine, agreed, the cars are different from their regular beginnings, but it's just a tuned 435i, much better, but same engine man. I mean you can't deny that, come on...:/
C63, CLK63, CLS63, E63 etc. all had basically the same engine.
I always praised that move from Merc because it gave all of us a great engine while saving costs for them.
BMW has now opted for the same strategy and now we are shooting them down?
I also agree that BMW really puts the effort into developing their cars. They have taken a massive step backwards with the F10 M5 and all their other turbocharged cars, but the E60 M5 with that V10 engine was just world class! And they really went all out with the V8 m3 engine as well, so let's not shoot them down, rather just praise Merc for what they are currently doing.
06-03-2014, 08:59 AM
#30
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Agree. I am very impressed with AMG lately. AMG is getting more hardcore and sporty while M has been a bit soft lately (F10). Might be a matter of where BMW and Merc decided to put their funds. When BMW developed the E60 M5 and E90 M3, they were engine manufacturers in F1...now they are out and Merc. is an engine manufacturer in F1 and THEY seem to be stepping up their game.
07-22-2014, 09:51 PM
#32
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2014 E63S; AMS 100 octane ecu tune; edok tcu tune; BB intakes; dyno tuned
07-24-2014, 06:06 AM
#37
MBWorld Fanatic!
07-26-2014, 03:07 PM
#38
MBWorld Fanatic!
Just drove the new M3.
Bottom line - if you are a P31/507 owner it's not going to blow you away. Looks great, sounds good too (much better inside the car although outside isn't bad just not as attractive as the AMG). Acceleration, handling etc very similar to the C63 but feels tighter and more planted. Low end was average, car comes alive 5500+. Overall, not enough to seriously consider it unless I just wanted to replace the C63 w something new.
Bottom line - if you are a P31/507 owner it's not going to blow you away. Looks great, sounds good too (much better inside the car although outside isn't bad just not as attractive as the AMG). Acceleration, handling etc very similar to the C63 but feels tighter and more planted. Low end was average, car comes alive 5500+. Overall, not enough to seriously consider it unless I just wanted to replace the C63 w something new.
07-26-2014, 09:24 PM
#39
MBWorld Fanatic!
That's interesting. I've driven both the F80 and the F82 now and I drew the exact opposite conclusion (not arguing, just stating).
The F80/F82, in my opinion, had gobs of torque down low (traction control always flickering) but felt dead at 5,500 rpm and beyond (in comparison to the C63, which pulls like a freight train at that point; especially when tuned).
The F80/F82, in my opinion, had gobs of torque down low (traction control always flickering) but felt dead at 5,500 rpm and beyond (in comparison to the C63, which pulls like a freight train at that point; especially when tuned).
07-26-2014, 10:36 PM
#40
MBWorld Fanatic!
Just drove the new M3.
Bottom line - if you are a P31/507 owner it's not going to blow you away. Looks great, sounds good too (much better inside the car although outside isn't bad just not as attractive as the AMG). Acceleration, handling etc very similar to the C63 but feels tighter and more planted. Low end was average, car comes alive 5500+. Overall, not enough to seriously consider it unless I just wanted to replace the C63 w something new.
Bottom line - if you are a P31/507 owner it's not going to blow you away. Looks great, sounds good too (much better inside the car although outside isn't bad just not as attractive as the AMG). Acceleration, handling etc very similar to the C63 but feels tighter and more planted. Low end was average, car comes alive 5500+. Overall, not enough to seriously consider it unless I just wanted to replace the C63 w something new.
07-27-2014, 08:19 AM
#41
MBWorld Fanatic!
That's interesting. I've driven both the F80 and the F82 now and I drew the exact opposite conclusion (not arguing, just stating).
The F80/F82, in my opinion, had gobs of torque down low (traction control always flickering) but felt dead at 5,500 rpm and beyond (in comparison to the C63, which pulls like a freight train at that point; especially when tuned).
The F80/F82, in my opinion, had gobs of torque down low (traction control always flickering) but felt dead at 5,500 rpm and beyond (in comparison to the C63, which pulls like a freight train at that point; especially when tuned).
On the sound front, yes the piped in exhaust is lame, in the M5 your ears clearly pick up that it's coming from the speakers. Both cars do make some pretty exciting sounds though on downshifts and upshifts. Not C63 like but different, interesting, and enjoyable.
My gut says I'll get back in the E63S and the decision will be made. I'd like to hold out for the new C but not sure it'll be worth the wait over what the E offers now.
07-27-2014, 01:35 PM
#42
MBWorld Fanatic!
Funny, man. In comparison to previous M3's I would agree, much improved on the low end. But in comparison to any 63 car or the M5, you can really feel the low end torque from the big motor. Throttle response is much better and the power feels much more linear/effortless in the M5 and 63s through the powerband. It felt nearly as quick as my P31 minus a little fun factor. Interesting how different butt dynos pick up different things.
On the sound front, yes the piped in exhaust is lame, in the M5 your ears clearly pick up that it's coming from the speakers. Both cars do make some pretty exciting sounds though on downshifts and upshifts. Not C63 like but different, interesting, and enjoyable.
My gut says I'll get back in the E63S and the decision will be made. I'd like to hold out for the new C but not sure it'll be worth the wait over what the E offers now.
On the sound front, yes the piped in exhaust is lame, in the M5 your ears clearly pick up that it's coming from the speakers. Both cars do make some pretty exciting sounds though on downshifts and upshifts. Not C63 like but different, interesting, and enjoyable.
My gut says I'll get back in the E63S and the decision will be made. I'd like to hold out for the new C but not sure it'll be worth the wait over what the E offers now.
I do agree regarding the throttle response. The C63's throttle feel is very linear.
01-10-2015, 01:29 AM
#44
Super Member
since m3 and m5 have always won most comparo's VS. ///AMG as it is !
and i completely agree that amg exhaust sound better than ///M's.
01-26-2015, 12:48 PM
#46
It sucks how Mercedes never has wider rear fenders on the C-AMG's compared to regular C-Classes.
01-26-2015, 09:53 PM
#47
