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Lets not be childish and resort to name calling, to be quite honestly its irrelevant whether he has a 507, as the advertisement did not state anywhere about a stock C63, the numbers provided could be for a C63BS, E63, SL63 etc.
Don't even know where to begin. What exactly is this "very obvious" explanation? That the owner has a 507? How about a E63 which also comes with 507hp, would this customer also not expect to gain between 155-255hp along with 162-228lb tq?
Again I still don't understand how your failing to grasp this basic concept as a "reputable" tuner. Every single M133 engine in every car its built into is exactly the same...the only difference, especially for the lower end range of those cars is simply the ECU remapping which allows for higher power gains (and reworked internals to support those gains).
It does not matter which car you put the kleeman supercharger kit into, the ECU remapping is the same across the board whether its in a C63 E63 or what have you. This is exactly why Kleeman sells their kits BY ENGINE not by CAR.
What you SHOULD be asking kleeman for is a more aggressive tune on their stock supercharger tune for the 507 C63, since that engine has forged internals that can support an extra 50HP gain on top of the stock gains....then you will see the numbers you want to see.
Well I could tell you some personal stories about my own cars and my own C63 supercharger from Weistec that ACG messed up that might have you thinking differently. I wouldnt trust them to install floor mats.
It does not matter which car you put the kleeman supercharger kit into, the ECU remapping is the same across the board whether its in a C63 E63 or what have you. This is exactly why Kleeman sells their kits BY ENGINE not by CAR.
Then ESPECIALLY per Kleeman's advertisement, it doesn't live up to expectations.
You're digging your own hole here. If the tune is the sole performance difference(I doubt that, but I'm not educated enough to say either way) then when the motors range from 450hp-510hp, if Kleeman claims says the gains are(hypothetically)150-210hp along with providing one set S/C tune, one should assume
A) a 450hp C63 gains 210hp, to 660hp, and
B) a 510hp C63 gains 150hp, to 660hp
Either way, a 100bhp gain is less then the advertised gain no matter how you slice it.
According to this, up to 680hp can be expected with their SC. ALSO according to this, up to 715hp can be expected with a full exhaust. So no, the OP's S/C fell well short of expectations.
Do I still think OP jumped the gun and may never update this? Yes
Is his specific S/C seemingly a dud? Without question.
Last edited by ///AchMeinGott; 01-20-2015 at 07:05 PM.
I would disagree with JCart although I thought that too, until I was forced to make my own detailed thread about how they left microfibers in my M5's shock tower, improperly installed wheels on my C63 which resulted in lug bolts flying off on the freeway, ripping the paint of my M5's front bumper when they were trying to remove 3M tape...
Grabbed this car yesterday to retest per Brandon's request and here is where we ended up...
The car is right about where it was when it left... Makes the 6psi that Kleemann advertises and a very safe clean 11.7:1 AFR. This dyno session shows a gain of 85 whp and 97 wtq.
My personal impressions of the car. It is a blast to drive. Comparing it to my own personal car, a 2012 C63 PP with an ecu tune, it rightfully so blows it away in comparison. The 507 in itself is the perfect platform to start a build like this on.
The power is great, though it will just eat through the stock rubber in no time. The responsiveness of the car in very nice, almost instant torque and gratification when you part throttle. Mash the gas though and you're going now where fast...
I doesn't seem to fall off on the top end in a single gear but going through 2 or 3 gears at WOT the heat soak becomes extremely evident. Back to back runs on the dyno you can see how the heat soak effects power output as the car will drop about 10-15 whp easy. I would certainly like to see what a good trunk system or bigger pump / HE would do to keep the pulls consistent.
That's just my feedback, pretty common for any blower installed on these motors. Thanks for following
Again I still don't understand how your failing to grasp this basic concept as a "reputable" tuner. Every single M133 engine in every car its built into is exactly the same...the only difference, especially for the lower end range of those cars is simply the ECU remapping which allows for higher power gains (and reworked internals to support those gains).
It does not matter which car you put the kleeman supercharger kit into, the ECU remapping is the same across the board whether its in a C63 E63 or what have you. This is exactly why Kleeman sells their kits BY ENGINE not by CAR.
What you SHOULD be asking kleeman for is a more aggressive tune on their stock supercharger tune for the 507 C63, since that engine has forged internals that can support an extra 50HP gain on top of the stock gains....then you will see the numbers you want to see.
Easy now big fella, let's calm that e-boner down. I was simply showing that there was something about ACG that had you coming back. In your thread you have 9-10 issues mentioned, yet you kept going back... If I was cruising down the highway and had lugs go "flying" off my car I would not go back to that shop.
You live in SoCal, which is basically a mecca for the aftermarket world so saying there are no other shops is no argument. So what was it? Why keep letting a shop mess up your collective car collection worth about $250k? That's all I'm getting at.
I read where you state why you kept going back. The whole "nobody is perfect" and doctor/attorney idea blah blah whatever. Again, there are plenty of other options out there but you insisted on dropping $100k into ACG.
Trying to keep the name calling and jabs at a minimum here but clearly my post had you lace up the gloves from some reason...
It pulls all the way to 6500rpm's. Why did you shut it down then?
SAE. I calibrate a speed based RPM instead of splicing into the car to get an RPM read so that's about as high as the vehicle will test on the dyno before hitting the rev limiter in the car. Hope that makes sense.
Easy now big fella, let's calm that e-boner down. I was simply showing that there was something about ACG that had you coming back. In your thread you have 9-10 issues mentioned, yet you kept going back... If I was cruising down the highway and had lugs go "flying" off my car I would not go back to that shop.
You live in SoCal, which is basically a mecca for the aftermarket world so saying there are no other shops is no argument. So what was it? Why keep letting a shop mess up your collective car collection worth about $250k? That's all I'm getting at.
I read where you state why you kept going back. The whole "nobody is perfect" and doctor/attorney idea blah blah whatever. Again, there are plenty of other options out there but you insisted on dropping $100k into ACG.
Trying to keep the name calling and jabs at a minimum here but clearly my post had you lace up the gloves from some reason...
My bad...you're right. For some reason I thought you were the one guy I went at it with when I originally made those posts, but remember he lived in Nevada, so my apologies.
I went back because in San Diego, there arent that many shops and because ACG was (and I assume still are) nice guys and kept apologizing that these were one-time mistakes, I went back. I was an idiot for doing that, clearly. I played a role in allowing my cars to get repeatedly screwed up by ACG.
I after I sold my C63 back to fletcher jones, the person who bought it from the auction house they sold it to said the Weistec supercharger was all installed incorrectly. And he was a MBZ master tech and could never get ACG on the phone to try and help him resolve the issue so he had to call Weistec directly.
Another in my person in my firm took my -- now regrettable advice -- to go to ACG and have downpipes and a tune installed on his C63. And what happened, car went into limp mode, issues with the O2 sensors, and the story goes on.
ACG has a notorious reputation by many down here as being inept. It's not that they arent nice guys, but time after time people have brought their cars to them and many have had issues that always seem to point back to the install. That's not to say they dont have any happy customers. But after dealing with them for 4 years and seeing the ineptitude I constantly, and stupidly overlooked, I am no longer surprised by what I hear.
SAE. I calibrate a speed based RPM instead of splicing into the car to get an RPM read so that's about as high as the vehicle will test on the dyno before hitting the rev limiter in the car. Hope that makes sense.
I think I follow yeah, you ran it in top gear to the governor, then converted speed to rpm?
That brings up an OUTRAGEOUSLY glaring point then. What if it keeps pulling to redline? If you're not getting an actual rpm readout up to 7200, then how do you know exactly what power it makes. Hell, it may not have cams to optimise the SC, but as long as it's not starving, it may make peak power @7000. NA the 507 is rated @6800. That could be a chunk of missing hp right there.
^ No worries. Just surprised that there aren't many options around.
I've bought things from ACG as well as used them as an avenue to get through to ADV. Success both times, but no experience with their installation services so I cannot comment there. But from my experience with them the customer service is what I'd expect.
Back on topic though, I think the OP here is more at fault. Trying to explain this isn't his first rodeo modifying cars and clearly missing the mark on many many things, such as headers among other things.
I went back because in San Diego, there arent that many shops and because ACG was (and I assume still are) nice guys and kept apologizing that these were one-time mistakes, I went back.
I think I follow yeah, you ran it in top gear to the governor, then converted speed to rpm?
That brings up an OUTRAGEOUSLY glaring point then. What if it keeps pulling to redline? If you're not getting an actual rpm readout up to 7200, then how do you know exactly what power it makes. Hell, it may not have cams to optimise the SC, but as long as it's not starving, it may make peak power @7000. NA the 507 is rated @6800. That could be a chunk of missing hp right there.
Could be, certainly can't rule that out. Just note that both tests, both baseline and stock were stopped at the same RPM. I'm just providing the data collected, simply what the car produces on our mustang dynameter.
Gentlemen, for those that think I am a complete idiot, let me assure you this is not my first rodeo.
says the guy who wants peak performance from a blower setup with stock exhaust .
You should change your screenname to Lardass because you come on here , spew your comments and then sit back and watch everyone else spew their comments and you say nothing .
says the guy who wants peak performance from a blower setup with stock exhaust .
You should change your screenname to Lardass because you come on here , spew your comments and then sit back and watch everyone else spew their comments and you say nothing .
This thread started in the w205 section (yea, not the w204) and got moved. Granted it does say "moved" now or whatever I bet he lost it. Its clear that him and technology dont get along
Steve Mac B is a moron. F'd up that he started off by bashing Kleemann. Well after reading this thread, thanks to the op, I will be ordering my Kleemann supercharger from Cory soon. WARNING! BUY A KLEEMANN SUPERCHARGER IF YOU KNOW HOW TO READ.
Steve Mac B is a moron. F'd up that he started off by bashing Kleemann. Well after reading this thread, thanks to the op, I will be ordering my Kleemann supercharger from Cory soon. WARNING! BUY A KLEEMANN SUPERCHARGER IF YOU KNOW HOW TO READ.
01-20-2015, 03:26 PM
