V7 Power Problem
#76
Member
Ok, so the working hypothesis is that the V7 file itself is intact, but something about it is being too aggressive with the timing, causing the knock sensors to retard the timing.
I wonder if the V7 map that's being sent out is tuned for ethanol? Or some other 'option' that would normally be turned off? Accidentally left on?
Also - I saw in another Dyno thread on V7 in this forum that the AFR was rich beyond 4500 rpm compared to V6 or Stock maps. I wonder if this extra fuelling was an attempt to prevent knocking? https://mbworld.org/forums/c63-amg-w...-thread-p.html
Interesting indeed... I'm holding back loading up V7 until a few more people chime in. Especially those running it without problems,
Last edited by Wiggis; 09-05-2017 at 05:10 PM.
#77
Member
#78
Senior Member
Ok, so the working hypothesis is that the V7 file itself is intact, but something about it is being too aggressive with the timing, causing the knock sensors to retard the timing.
I wonder if the V7 map that's being sent out is tuned for ethanol? Or some other 'option' that would normally be turned off? Accidentally left on?
Also - I saw in another Dyno thread on V7 in this forum that the AFR was rich beyond 4500 rpm compared to V6 or Stock maps. I wonder if this extra fuelling was an attempt to prevent knocking?
Interesting indeed... I'm holding back loading up V7 until a few more people chime in. Especially those running it without problems,
I wonder if the V7 map that's being sent out is tuned for ethanol? Or some other 'option' that would normally be turned off? Accidentally left on?
Also - I saw in another Dyno thread on V7 in this forum that the AFR was rich beyond 4500 rpm compared to V6 or Stock maps. I wonder if this extra fuelling was an attempt to prevent knocking?
Interesting indeed... I'm holding back loading up V7 until a few more people chime in. Especially those running it without problems,
All the good news/experiences you have heard about the tune(v7) have been on the " beta" file, I don't know if anything even got changed when it was officially released to the everyone else. Maybe something was tweaked or like you said turned off or on.
Anyways this is something that im sure is not to difficult to look into once its in front of jerrys eyes .
#80
Super Member
93 Sunoco always...No problems here
And yes, v7 runs a few degrees more timing and a bit leaner then v6 and all previous versions.....thus resulting in the power increase. Its likely that the problamatic cars are knocking and the feeling of a power loss is the retard in the timing.
Download the torque app, pay 3.99 or whatever to get the pro version, get a bluetooth obd2 connector from amazon for 20$ and data log your timing advance in the graphing section. Do some WOT pulls in whatever gear you experience the flat power and lets see what happens
And yes, v7 runs a few degrees more timing and a bit leaner then v6 and all previous versions.....thus resulting in the power increase. Its likely that the problamatic cars are knocking and the feeling of a power loss is the retard in the timing.
Download the torque app, pay 3.99 or whatever to get the pro version, get a bluetooth obd2 connector from amazon for 20$ and data log your timing advance in the graphing section. Do some WOT pulls in whatever gear you experience the flat power and lets see what happens
#81
Super Member
a small test to see if the problem goes away is buy a bottle of octane booster from walmart or wherever and see if it still happens.
The higher octane should stop the pinging
The higher octane should stop the pinging
#82
Super Member
Also - I saw in another Dyno thread on V7 in this forum that the AFR was rich beyond 4500 rpm compared to V6 or Stock maps. I wonder if this extra fuelling was an attempt to prevent knocking? https://mbworld.org/forums/c63-amg-w...-thread-p.html
I was told by EC that after the car adapts to the tune the a/f will level off to where it is supposed to be.
Cant comment on the truth to that since I havent been back on the dyno since uploading the v7 tune but Ive done atleast 500 miles since then and my car still feels strong. So idk what the a/f is at this point.
#83
Senior Member
Thread Starter
I have heard from Eurocharged and they have suggested that the reported fix is to reflash the car back to stock, then flash V7.
I'm not with the car right now, and when I did this I admittedly didn't flash right back to V7, but perhaps one of you other guys can try it.
I'm not with the car right now, and when I did this I admittedly didn't flash right back to V7, but perhaps one of you other guys can try it.
#84
Member
I went from stock to V7 and the thing does fly. Just one problem in that on cold start, the revs hold at about 1500 and don't drop until I touch the throttle. No issues at 4000 rpm or beyond.
The following users liked this post:
Cozy (09-07-2017)
#85
Junior Member
I have the v7 beta on 2012 c63 from eurocharged out in Georgetown tx an I'm not having any issues as of yet.. my car is running hotter temps .. other then that I'm running alot more aggressive an way more responsive with this tune. I am also running the E85 flex fuel kit.
The following users liked this post:
Cozy (09-07-2017)
#86
Senior Member
in for results let us know!
#88
Senior Member
#89
Member
Having upgraded from V5 to V7, I am having similar issues as described by Cozy. It is as though the revs is too high, ie car seems to revs hard with V7 but somehow the speedometer is lagging behind.
All I get is seeing the revs goes up to redline, but you don't seem to get thrust back unto the seat as it does with V5 map.
Have done the disconnect battery overnight step, and also flashing back to stock map step then V7 as advised by Jerry but no difference.
V7 seems to not suit the car well.
Currently awaiting to hear from Jerry as he investigate.
All I get is seeing the revs goes up to redline, but you don't seem to get thrust back unto the seat as it does with V5 map.
Have done the disconnect battery overnight step, and also flashing back to stock map step then V7 as advised by Jerry but no difference.
V7 seems to not suit the car well.
Currently awaiting to hear from Jerry as he investigate.
#90
Senior Member
Having upgraded from V5 to V7, I am having similar issues as described by Cozy. It is as though the revs is too high, ie car seems to revs hard with V7 but somehow the speedometer is lagging behind.
All I get is seeing the revs goes up to redline, but you don't seem to get thrust back unto the seat as it does with V5 map.
Have done the disconnect battery overnight step, and also flashing back to stock map step then V7 as advised by Jerry but no difference.
V7 seems to not suit the car well.
Currently awaiting to hear from Jerry as he investigate.
All I get is seeing the revs goes up to redline, but you don't seem to get thrust back unto the seat as it does with V5 map.
Have done the disconnect battery overnight step, and also flashing back to stock map step then V7 as advised by Jerry but no difference.
V7 seems to not suit the car well.
Currently awaiting to hear from Jerry as he investigate.
#91
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 8,063
Received 2,845 Likes
on
1,678 Posts
2012 P31 C63 Coupe Trackrat, 2019 GLE63S Coupe Beast
Did you guys try removing your pistons and cleaning off the carbon deposits? Get them nice and shiny, I bet that fixes everything!
- Dave
- Dave
The following users liked this post:
Ludedude (09-12-2017)
#92
Member
#94
Former Vendor of MBWorld
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Georgetown, TX
Posts: 541
Received 129 Likes
on
96 Posts
93' 500E, 95' Corolla
If you have the engine apart you might as well
Not sure it would fix this issue though... What I would be interested to see what the cams are actually doing, are they adjusting? Possibly try to re-teach the cams with SDS.
REDROKT can go pound some sand along with his circus friends who are slow and don't make powwaahhhh
Thanks
Dave
Dave
#96
Former Vendor of MBWorld
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Georgetown, TX
Posts: 541
Received 129 Likes
on
96 Posts
93' 500E, 95' Corolla
A person can do anything they want, any way they want. doesn't make it the right way, or even a way that will last.
I don't get comebacks on my work, it's always done right.
I fix *A LOT* of things that DIY'ers screw up on a pretty regular bi-weekly basis.
So to answer your question. Yes, I have told many customers that they should pull the engine to do ARP studs, or factory headbolts.
I just knocked one out this weekend, snapped a couple pics
Thanks
Dave
Nice n' clean, did these for REDRKT, V7 is gonna beast it up now... I'm predicting eleventy trillion horsepowers...
New Tappets
Cammers
#98
SPONSOR
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Worldwide
Posts: 3,633
Received 801 Likes
on
571 Posts
2007 Mercedes E63 AMG
i hope you're also replacing the o-ring for the oil cooler thermostat while your at it. i had a huge leak there, had my head studs, and oil pans resealed at the same time. had small leaks there too.
Last edited by hachiroku; 09-12-2017 at 04:46 PM.
#99
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Silicon Valley, CA
Posts: 3,314
Received 170 Likes
on
145 Posts
C63 AMG, P30
I prefer to pull the engine out of the car... I have done many, and only because I can get the entire powertrain out of the car in a little over an hour. At that time, everything is super easy to access. I work standing up, not leaning over. I can ensure absolute cleanliness, every hole gets cleaned out and Q-tipped... I can easily walk around the engine, check everything, see everything. Shoot - even maneuvering the torque wrench in the engine compartment can be a major pain in the butt... No obstructions when it's on the table... I do also clean the piston tops and combustion chambers/valves whenever I have the heads off, so that's a super easy task when the engine is out of the car. Good time to reseal the oil filter housing too, or replace anything on the belt drive. If you have done a little work yourself you know that it's pretty tight in there. With the engine out there is zero struggle, everything is easy. That is the way I recommend people do it.
A person can do anything they want, any way they want. doesn't make it the right way, or even a way that will last.
I don't get comebacks on my work, it's always done right.
I fix *A LOT* of things that DIY'ers screw up on a pretty regular bi-weekly basis.
So to answer your question. Yes, I have told many customers that they should pull the engine to do ARP studs, or factory headbolts.
I just knocked one out this weekend, snapped a couple pics
Thanks
Dave
A person can do anything they want, any way they want. doesn't make it the right way, or even a way that will last.
I don't get comebacks on my work, it's always done right.
I fix *A LOT* of things that DIY'ers screw up on a pretty regular bi-weekly basis.
So to answer your question. Yes, I have told many customers that they should pull the engine to do ARP studs, or factory headbolts.
I just knocked one out this weekend, snapped a couple pics
Thanks
Dave
So what do you charge to pull an M156? What's your hourly shop rate? Can't be more than $200 then right?
#100
MBWorld Fanatic!
If I could supply a skid to drop it down on and have my DT yanked for $200. I'd just drop my car off and pick it up with a trailer for that steal of a deal!